saddleback church. it's a large evangelical church.nk what he is getting at, too, is the theology that most americans want to share which is that somehow pain is always progress. i do not believe that anymore. i mean, think i really thought that life was a series of ladders and if i just kept trying and climbing that it was always go to lead to something. brian: because you have had a lot of pain. kate: the pain just leveled me. part of it was coming to grips with me not being able to cure my own cancer and assume that i will always have the time i want with my family and be able to imagine the future for myself that i had expected. while i think all kinds of beautiful things can happen in our dark seasons, i think it is a beautiful lie to say that pain will always be rewarded. brian: here's a name that certainly people my name will remember. he's still alive. 82 years old. this goes back to 1988 when he got himself into a little trouble. let's watch. [video clip] >> i have sinned against you, my lord. i would ask that your precious bl