this is not saigon. we went to afghanistan 20 years ago, with one mission, and that was to deal with the folks who a tacted us on 9/11? >> isn't that what we are seeing now? even the images are evocative of saigon. >> let's take a step back. this is not saigon. >> nic robertson reporting me now. he's reported extensively on the taliban. good to see you, nic. it may take a long time, you know, to know how history looks on this moment, but right now it looks pretty bad. what do you see as the immediate impact of a full taliban takeover and rule, again, of afghanistan? >> reporter: i think in the initial phase there's going to be uncertainty about how to deal with them. we've heard from boris johnson saying all countries should stand side by side not recognize, not rush to recognize the taliban as a legitimate government because, of course, that was part of the negotiations with them. they would play by a set of international rules, negotiate with the afghan government which they didn't do. they stole power

s. embassy in saigon, they listen. the mitigated disaster enough can install the shameful saigon, like abandonment of cobalt, the brutalization of african women. and the slaughter of our allies is the predictable outcome of the trump biden doctrine of weakness. now, republican senator ben sas also said the united states would regret its actions in afghanistan. and that this would hurt the international community. and it wouldn't weaken the alliances of the united states around the world. however, anthony, blinking the u. s. secretary of state does not agree. he said that he said basically that cobble is not saigon. and that is quite interesting because that famous photograph from saigon and $975.00 to place 29 months after the united states ad folded military out of vietnam. that's how long the 1000 vietnamese government held out. but in this situation, the us military is still on the ground in afghanistan, and they're already evacuating the embassy. so quite a little bit of difference there. it's also important to not

the falling of south vietnam and the capital saigon. joe biden already had to answer questions about the vietnam defeat. flashbacks, you see any parallels between this withdraw and what happened vietnam with some people feeling what? 0 the tale. vaughn is not this out in the north vietnamese army. they're not, they're not remotely comparable in terms of capability. there's going to be no circumstance for you to see people being lifted off the roof of a embassy in the of the united states from afghanistan. this kind of confidence by the president has done little to convince those who have come up with lines that you can see right here. the journalists can smell a replay of saigon, the growing numbers of politicians turned critics of the of ghana send for bob can't help drawing the unfortunate parallels either the latest news or the 3rd, the drop down, and our embassy and a hasty deployment of military forces seem like preparations for the full of couple president biden's decisions have a hurtling toward and even worse, equal to the humil

the journalists can smell a replay of saigon. the growing numbers of politicians turned critics of the of got to send for bob can't help drawing the unfortunate parallels either the latest news or the 3rd, the drop down, and our embassy and a hasty deployment of military forces seem like preparations for the full of couple president biden's decisions have a hurtling toward and even was equal to the humiliating full of saigon in $975.00 were basically gave up on the african government not just now, but all the way back to the start of these talks. what president biden did was to embrace it, he owns it, it was a huge foreign policy failure with general m, if occasions just show up 7 month into this administration, everything points to a complete collapse. anyway, the whole pull out may end up as an immense reputational issue for the biden administration, for the u. s. as a whole, it's very likely to tarnish the entire 20 years of coalition presence. and again, as dan, but take a moment to think of the price which the afghans are pa

> this is not saigon.went to afghanistan with one mission and that mission was to deal with the folks that attacked us on 9/11. we succeeded in that mission. remaining in afghanistan is not in the national interest. >> he says it is not saigon and to that you say what. >> i say boy, there's a lot of choppers flying over kabul right now looking like pictures we have seen from april 1975 in saigon where we had to get our people out in chaotic fashion, as you can see, and it appears that when the going gets tough, the tough hide while on vacation. why haven't we heard from the president of the united states on this? how about the vice president who bragged back in the spring that she played a he key role in this decision. how about the white house press secretary who you apparently will now be out of the office until august 22nd. if this looks cowardly, it's because it is. again, let's replay the president's own words on this. white house reporter asked him just one month ago, mr. president, some vietnamese v

there's no parallels to the events in saigon. let's take a step back. this is manifestly not saigon. we're working to make sure that our personnel are safe and secure. we're relocating the minimum of our embassy to a location at the airport. it's why the president sent in a number of forces to make sure that as we continue to draw down our diplomatic presence, we do it in a safe and orderly fashion. we discussed the ongoing situation that i've got to start with former u. s. navy intelligence officer, steven rogers, he says he can't help but draw parallels with what happened in vietnam. the goal was to ensure that the app in government was strong, that it was a nation where the people were free. it was a nation, ruled by a constitution and not ruled by any dictator or a terrorist organization. so the goal was never achieve. 20 years of work was put into that we have seen as a cast her feet. how do you leave all these people behind the talk about the citizens to, to, to be met with the baby, torture and murder. this reminds me of saigon. i was in the air

this reminds me of saigon. i was in the air force during the time saigon fell. and when i see helicopters in trouble landing on rooftops in an airport and giant u. s. air force planes having refugees, board, those planes reminds me of saigon. and when we see its history repeating itself, so there is no bright future, obviously for again a spam. but until we make a change in our nation with regard to our foreign policy, we don't have a much of a bright future. even the present button broke his silence on the crisis mold in the day after the taliban took control. he claimed the us mission in afghanistan was never about nation building. our mission ab gaston was never supposed to been nation building. it was never supposed to be created a unified, centralized democracy or only by last interest. and again, stan remains today. what has always been preventing a terrorist attack on american homeland. but his statement came in contrast to previous comments, like in 2002 by and said, the failing to establish a solid national government in afghanistan might create a lawle

host: you mentioned you were there for the fall of saigon. how close were you to this famous picture when it comes to the fall of saigon of the rooftop of the embassy? caller: 50, 60 foot at one time. i was sergeant major in the marine corps. i know the trustees and stuff that took place over there. the stuff that is going on in afghanistan is a takeover and abusive, but it was nothing as bad as some of the things we saw in vietnam when we got there. host: how did you eventually get out? did you get out on one of those helicopters? caller: i got out thanks to some boys that my -- the boys that saved us out of saigon took us out in a little boat and got is out. host: was that the 30th? caller: it was the day before they -- the day before most of us got out. it was -- i am not a very scary type person, but i was scared to death and everybody around me was, whether they claimed to be or not. it was vital to get out. it was vital to save as many people as you could. vietnam gets a wrap it deserves and it is not a good one. it is a bad one. none o

. >> president biden is intent on avoiding a saigon moment. that is the humiliating exit from vietnam. with the troop surge, are not we already in the midst of a saigon moment? >> no. we're not. remember, this is not saigon. we went to afghanistan 20 years a ago with one mission. that was to attack the people who attacked us on 9/11. >> even the images are evocative of what happened in vietnam. >> let's take a step back. this is manifestly not saigon. >> but look at these pictures. on the left you see the famous picture of the helicopter fleeing the sim in saigon. on the right. another helicopter, another u.s. embassy but that's this morning in kabul. is blinken wrong or right here? >> i think blinken is wrong. anybody would think of saigon at a certain age. we had operation frequent wind back then. we were able to not just get americans out but we brought 6,000 vietnamese into america. if you go to houston, long beach, new orleans, if you go to vietnamese communities, president ford overriding henry kissinger in his own national security appa

remember, this is not saigon. we went to afghanistan 20 years ago with one mission. and that was to deal with the folks who attacked us on 9/11. and we have succeeded in that mission. the objective that we set, bringing those who attacked us to justice, making sure that they couldn't attack us again from afghanistan, we've succeeded in that mission. and in fact we succeeded a while ago. and at the same time, remaining in afghanistan for another one, five, ten years is not in the national interest. you know, the british were there for a long time in the 19th century. the russians were there for a long time in the 20th century. we've now been there twice as long as the russians, and how that's in our national interest, i don't see. >> cnn's anna coren has reported extensively from afghanistan, including a recent trip there. she joins me now from hong kong for the latest on the taliban takeover. anna, what do we know about what's happening at street level right now in kabul and, importantly, what the next few days might bring? >> reporter: michael, from the people that

the same in saigon. she did not cover the fancy city. she went to the slums.-- and she wrote this in longform. she could put all the nuances in and not just do a short, so what paragraph. she wrote, this is why the united states will lose this war. host: and what -- well, let's listen to her and we will come back and talk a little more about her work. this is from 1999, the only one of the three still with us, and this was from our archives, 1999 talking about the relationship between u.s. officials and journalists covering the war. [video clip] >> there was an antagonism between reporters and the higher officials all throughout the war because they were essentially trying to say we are doing fine, we are winning, there is nothing going wrong at all, and, therefore, you found that you had to examine every single statement that was made practically to see whether it was really the case or not. it made reporting very difficult, i tell you. you kept having to go to the captain to find what they were saying or not. this antagonism created perhaps more of a sense t

you are in saigon during the fall and were -- you were in saigon during the fall responsible for evacuating tens of thousands of vietnamese. how much does this resonate with the experience we had before? are there a couple of lessons we can still absorb before how successful evacuation then could help us improve the situation now? ambassador armitage: thank you. the similarities between vietnam and afghanistan begin with the fact that in both cases they were rodeos. they were not planned well. everyone was making things up on the fly. that appears to be the case we face now. in both cases, we were perceived as cutting and running. the decision in afghanistan, i personally think, was the right decision. but the timing and the manner of the evacuation. the third similarity i see between vietnam and afghanistan is the fact that we have the same issue. it was not that vietnamese or afghans could not fight. it is all they do from the time they show -- they are children. god knows, they know how to shoot. the question has to do with whether the corrupt governments in kabul and saigon were worth t

nixon arrived in saigon. were among the first the welcome them. ♪ ♪ >> also gathered to greet the personal representatives of president eisenhower were important chinese government officials and members of the diplomatic corps. ♪ ♪ >> the vice president's visit was tremendously heartening to the capital of nationalist china. the next day he conferred with president chang kai-shek after giving him a letter from president eisenhower that strongly reassured china's leader and its people. the two statesmen posed for news cameramen. ♪♪ >> mr. nixon summed up the content of their talks in a brief statement. >> i just had a conference with the president with regard to the relations between the government of the united states and the government of the republic of china, and in this conference we discussed the mutual problems and the mutual dangers which we confront in the world. the government of the united states and the people of the united states stand firmly with the government of the republic of china and the pe

fell and that the government should arrange to send the refugees back to saigon. in a town close to niceville, anxiety about refugees reflected anxiety about economic issues. the stag gnatting economy and weakening social safety net. we have enough of our own problems to take care of said a local barber. one of his customers agreed, they don't have enough money to take care of social security now and they want to bring in more people. these economic concerns were also in keeping with national sentiment. many americans believed that southeast asian refugees posed an economic burden on the u.s. a survey in june 1975 found that 62% of americans believed that immigrants take jobs away from americans. only 28% believed otherwise. then there were issues other than economic issues. for one, there was concern about security, about communists slipping in with the refugees. this sounds familiar. doesn't it? robert carr, a realtor in nearby valparaiso feared vietnamese refugees would bring communist infiltrators. how do you know we're not going to get the bad guys, he said?

i was sitting _ the evacuation of saigon in 1975.itting at _ the evacuation of saigon in 1975. i was sitting at home _ the evacuation of saigon in 1975. i was sitting at home this _ the evacuation of saigon in 1975. i | was sitting at home this afternoon and my brother sent me this picture on what's up. the peerless are struggling —— this picture on whatsapp. the swiftness of the fall of afghanistan, just weeks ago, biden and premingerjohnson were both saying a taliban takeover was highly unlikely —— prime minister johnson. and here we are today, just nine days after their offences began, the taliban have taken over the whole country and the us is scrambling to evacuate 4000 staff, one of the biggest embassies it has in the world, and embarrassment for us and the americans. find in the world, and embarrassment for us and the americans.— in the world, and embarrassment for us and the americans. and rachel, if an one us and the americans. and rachel, if anyone was — us and the americans. and rachel, if anyone was in _ us and the america

, or a book called decent interval by a cia operative in saigon at the time of the fall of saigon.ost: what does this mean for afghanistan? caller: well, the situation is similar. i don't think there is much that can be done to help the afghans. president biden has said the afghan army has more soldiers than the taliban and yet the taliban seems to be winning. it just reminds me of saigon and i think they are going to be pictures in the future -- there are going to be pictures in the future of americans who were left behind. there will be calls to get them out and there will be other pictures of the abuse of the afghan women. it is just a sad situation. host: that is bill in new jersey. our final call, this is earl, in georgia. saying we have trained and armed and we still have troops in harm's way. to all of you who have participated in this hour, thank you. our first guest will talk about congress. you have heard a lot of debate, infrastructure debate. the topic of cryptocurrency, kristin smith of the blockchain association will join us, not only to talk about what congress talke

embassy in saigon in 1975. and on the right, the same scene today in kabul. jiust a month ago president biden said was unthinkable. >> some vietnamese veterans see echos of their experience in this withdrawal in afghanistan. do you see any parallels between this withdrawal and what happened in vietnam with some people feeling -- >> none whatsoever. zero. >> will the united states be responsible for the loss of afghan civilian lives that could happen -- >> no. >> -- after the military exit? >> no, no, no. it's up to the people of afghanistan to decide on what government they want. >> joining me now is cnn global affairs analyst and veteran foreign correspondent kimberly dozier. she reported from afghanistan during the 2001 u.s. invasion, also spent a lot of time covering the war in iraq. kim, let's start with these pictures of the chaotic u.s. exit that we're all watching right now. what do you make of this comparison between what's happening in kabul and saigon in 1975? put them side by side, it does appear to be a just comparison. >> well, the biden administ

, and yet here we are and this is president biden's saigon moment. >> this is manifestly not saigon. >> reporter: with the secretary of state push back insisting the u.s. has achieved its objective. >> we went there 20 years ago with one mission in mind to deal with the people who attacked us on 9/11 that mission has been successful. >> reporter: the released a photo of the president meeting virtually with his national security team sunday and aus official tell cbs news that sending more combat troops to the airport is on the table. cbs news. >> a defense official also told us that the pentagon is sending and another thousand troops to the airport in kabul. >>> and emotional celebration of life was held today in memory of the cofounder of san francisco's memorial church in the eight-year-old passed away last month. the mayor was there along with congresswoman jackie s and the former mayor willie brown. >> janice holds a special place in the pantheon of courageous champions for equity bringing voice to the voiceless and shiny light on the human condition and always a truth teller and

the vietnam war and saigon. jon, thank ou, of the vietnam war and saigon. jon, thank you.saigon. jon, thank you, jon sopel reporting there. well, the taliban have taken back control of afghanistan 20 years after being ousted from power by the us, and one of the big questions about the country's future is whether other international players will now move to try to fill the gap once us and other foreign forces leave. our diplomatic correspondent caroline hawley has more. operation enduring freedom is what the americans called it. at its height, there were more than 130,000 troops from more than 50 countries. their fight against the taliban brought freedoms for many afghans but will not now endure. the west's presence in afghanistan had already shrunk dramatically before the pull—out that led to the taliban takeover. the united states now only controls the airport, with nearly 6000 troops. it also runs the air—traffic control for flights in and out of kabul, while us fighterjets from a nearby aircraft carrier patrol the skies. britain has more than 1000 troops on the ground —

those planes reminds me of saigon. and when we see its history repeating itself, so there is no bright future, obviously for our ganesh them. but until we make a change in our nation with regard to our foreign policy, we don't have much of a bright future either. the while sister john last year, they expect to mohammed name from the telephone political office. the group is still class by most countries in the world as a terrorist organization. so i think the answer to this question is really obvious. the world can see that the territory of afghan austin is now under the control of the islamic state, the islamic emerett waste war against the occupation in order to create an independent islamic state. it was claimed that there were 20 different terrorist groups, happy, more or less operating in afghanistan. but when he is land make emory announced to see far a few years ago, not a single shot was fired. and then the islamic emirates struck an agreement with the u. s, there were rumors in the media and reports that differ

the fall of saigon was the biggest u.s. military embarrassment since the bay of pigs. 1975. this is from correspondent don oliver. >> the crowd outside the embassy wall finally got so large that marine reinforcements that were sent to protect the gates. all the time the helicopters were shuffling in and out. the people were wandering around in the embassy compound. one helicopter was hit by ground fire, but it made it to the carrier safely. in saigon's last hours, nearly 1,000 americans and several thousand vietnamese were airlifted out. some waited hours for their turn to board the helicopters. they said that was the worst part. the waiting. not knowing if the troops might launch an attack that would force an end to the evacuation attempts. that did not happen. for 19 hours, they shuttled back and forth. one of the last to leave was u.s. ambassador martin. don oliver, nbc news, reporting. >> the fall of saigon to take us off the air tonight as our conversation is dominated by the fall of afghanistan. that is indeed our broadcast for this monday night as we start a new

now, you know, president biden said in july this is not going to be a saigon.am. guess what? when i talked to ambassador crocker, we think it is going to be worse than saigon. when they raise the black flag of the taliban over our united states embassy, think about that visual. >> president biden released a statement yesterday defending his decision saying, quote, one more year or five more years of u.s. military presence would not have made a difference if the afghan military cannot or will not hold its own country and an endless american presence in the middle of another country's civil conflict was not acceptable to me. what do you make of that argument if after 20 years the taliban could take over so easily, the afghan military would fold so easily, that no amount of time would have solved the problem? >> well, i think history is repeating itself. remember it was obama and the vice president at that time biden who decided to withdraw completely out of iraq. look what happened. isis reared its ugly head. you know, i persuaded president trump to keep a residu

the evacuation of saigon | scenario. it isn't.aigon occurred, the planning for it occurred within a matter of days, the execution was a matter of weeks and when the real power is there, when the presidential imperative and resources are provided, the united states can accomplish amazing things, i know, having served on all three branches of government at some point. joe biden has the same resources at his disposal, in fact he is in a better position. we know more about our afghan allies than we did about our vietnamese allies, we have control of the airport, we have control of the airport, we have the ability to keep forces on the ground, we have the ability every wanted to do bring our vietnamese, for our afghan allies out every wanted to. ., ., ., ~' afghan allies out every wanted to. ., ., ., ~ ., afghan allies out every wanted to. ., ., .w ., , afghan allies out every wanted to. ., ., ., ,~ ., to. you are making a very clear oint to. you are making a very clear point about _ to. you are making a very clear point about the _ to

this reminds me of saigon. i was in the air force during the time saigon fell. and when i see helicopters in bul landing on rooftops in an airport and giant us air force planes, having a refugees board, those planes reminds me of saigon and when we see its history repeating itself. so there is no bright future, obviously for again it's spam, but until we make a change in our nation with regard to our foreign policy, we don't have a much of a bright future either. still had this silence from cherry fight and over what's happening in afghanistan as a found the broker. he's giving a speech a bit later on around 15 minutes scheduled off to attending to the white house from his weekend retreat will be following. not on many more updates off the shall bring the oh, i use what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy plantation. let it be an arms race is on often very dramatic development. only personally, i'm going to resist. i don't see how that strategy.

afghanistan is being too the humiliating fall of saigon. we pulled out technically in 73. the secretary of state dispensing such conspiracies. this is not saigon, we went to afghanistan 20 years ago with one mission in that mission was to deal with the folks who attacked us on 9/11. we have succeeded in that mission. but take a look at these two photos. getting a lot of attention on twitter. you saw the other side too. the right showing kabul and afghanistan today. many people are saying this tha saigon was a lot better than we're witnessing now because this isn't quite overpaid what we're seeing right now as the president of the united states to his immense credit. he would've said 15 years ago o 20 years ago, don't tell me he tell me someone that's exactly what he believes. if you hear about any interaction. we have to pullouts of afghanistan, we went over the horizon with all the defense apparatus. the choice was to become back i or he is not being candid. that is not the choice he had. to say al qaeda was not a threa in that region is not right, it's to say the war on

sage saigon all over again? it's not clear to me -- they do not have the ability the taliban can bring new le released prisoners to bear on the airport. they can interdict the airspace at any time probably in the next 48 hours. >> that will mean no of the afghan civilians will be allowed to get into kabul, unless the taliban would allow that. they may start selling them back as hosages. we have to focus on how to get the americans out of there. we are in a potential totally vulnerable military situation on the ground at kabul airport. the turkish battalion there is with us, who knows whether they'll defend their 3ri789. there are afghan soldiers at the airport who mobile need to be disarmed if they haven't already run for it. it's frightfully vulnerable for the u.s. military and americans still in country. >>> jamil, the taliban is currently emptiy the prisons. what happens next? and what can we and what should we expect from that? >> well, morgan, it's a huge issue. we just saw, as the taliban took bagram airpo

this is not saigon. we went to afghanistan 20 years ago with one mission. that was to deal with the folks who attacked us on 9/11. isn't that what we're seeing now? even the images are evocative of what happened in vietnam. >> this is manifestly not saigon. >> despite those attempts to fend off criticism, the biden administration is facing swift back lash over the chotwick drawl. on sunday hundreds of americans gathered outside the white house expressing fear and grief over the taliban takeover and holding signs that read, evacuate afghans now. america betrayed us. in congress, the republican lawmakers are certainly going on the offensive and slamming the departure as a shameful failure. >> it is completely preventible, completely predictable, too. and there was no effort at all to mitigate the disaster. not at all. no planning at all in this. >> this president had the integrity to tell a hard truth to the american body politic and to the afghans that this failed forever war must end. >> i think that the failure here is the lack of the fighting, the will to

and eerily reminiscent of the fall of saigon. >> this is manifestly not saigon. the fact of the matter is this, we went to afghanistan 20 years ago with one mission in mind, and that was to deal with the people who attacked us on 9/11, and that mission has been successful. >> reportehe biden administration defending the u.s. withdrawal from the country, but clearly caught off vance. just today president biden evuan some afghan visa applicants. today, the flag removed, the doors shuttered, the u.s. ambassador and all operations transferred to the airport for safety. embassy staff told to destroy sensitive equipment and documents, especially those containing images of the american flag that could be used as propaganda. and on the streets of kabul fear and despair. long lines as residents scramble to withdraw their life's savings, many saying the banks simply running out of cash. and a desperate crush at the pakistan border crossing as people try to flee. and chaos at the airport as thousands of afghans desperate to get out. just five weeks ago this was president bi

when saigon fell in 1975. been any other word from the white house about wallace? well, president biden is at present at camp david's. den the white house to tweak a photograph of the president holding a video conference early on in the morning, visible on the rack of screens in front of him were among others, the vice president, some of his national security advises. and interestingly, the us representative who is in doha, at present, but president biden continuing to hold a dialogue with various members of his government. his government is turned in touch with various elements, particularly in doha. so the bite in administration, those well is trying to push off criticism and not only about the decision to withdraw troops, but also about the way in which it is going to bout but degree to which the administration appeared unprepared for that rapid advance of, of the taliban, now you mentioned that the secretary of state, he did make a comment in the course of the morning, rejecting the comparisons to that eme

plus republican ben sasse is comparing the fall of afghanistan's government to the fall of saigon while others are fund-raising off the situation there. "morning joe" will be right back. there. "morning joe" will be right back

and what is being called biden's saigon moment. as a reference to the failures, the u. s. suffered in vietnam in the 75. we're going to discuss the long, outspoken critic of the war and get us in congressman and we're going to bring you at the latest comments on the afghan. it's dan from the president following the emergence from vacation. as was the 36 of you on whether or not the biden administration deserves the blame for the expedius class of the african government . considering this was something president trumpet declared. he was going to do as well with the same chain of events have transpired under trust, direction. i'm going to use and you're watching news use use right here on our t america. let's get started. ah, caliber has taken over afghanistan with an unexpected strength and speed that has the bite administration scrambling to evacuate, remaining americans and afghan to help us forces. during the 20 year war. our teacher john hardy, has more tells a tragic story. desperate afghans hopelessly clinging to the side of the u. s. air force, c, 17 gen. some rep

judge jeanine: it's certainly worse than saigon.ition to that we have so much sophisticated equipment, artillery, tanks, and all of our weaponry is in the hands of the taliban. it's as if joe biden says we'll be there for a few years, then we'll give you our weapons. how did that happen? >> the same way it happened in iraq. we spent $48 billion training the afghan army for 20 years. with that came equipment. we turned the equipment over to them for their use. they ran off the battlefield and they were bribed as was the government. the government collapsed. the equipment went with them. it's an extentive amount of weaponry and intelligence equipment. they will be the best equipped military in that region for a long time. but that's what happens when you try to do nation building and you don't pull it off. judge jeanine: you have enough experience, colonel hunt. this is the essence of who you are. how do we get these people out of afghanistan? >> first of all you have to let the commander on the ground to do his job. right now if you

your saigon, your bay of pigs. it get worse. in june biden's secretary of state, this guy is a total idiot, tony blinken the guy who sucked up china and took human rights from them as they are now threatening our military bases day in and day out. they don't say a word. he claimed a quick taliban takeover was not possible. yes, it was. don't we know that now. >> one, we're not withdrawing. we're staying. the embassy is staying. our programs are staying. and whatever happens in afghanistan, if there is a significant deterioration, insecurity, that could well happen, we discussed this before, i don't think it's going to be something that happens from a friday to a monday. so i wouldn't necessarily equate the departure of our forces in july-august or by early september with some kind of immediate deterioration. >> sean: number one, you lied. number two, people will die. number three, you armed the taliban, and you need to be fired, number four. again, the exact opposite happened. now, many are calling biden's ill planned retreat wo

she says -- saigon. he says, they'll do an assault landing. what's that? they won't come in like this, they'll come in like this. [laughter] we did an assault landing. we thought that was pretty cool. and when i got off the plane, there was this army major, looked all spiffy and everything behind the wheel throwing up. [laughter] >> i guess his by finesse -- spiffiness kind of toned down. >> that was my arrival in vietnam. by departure -- i had two departures on r&r. i went to hawaii and flew on that pan-am plane. had a steak, it was great. >> oh, my. [laughter] >> it was a john wayne movie. i don't remember which one, but you talk about remembering names and stuff like that, once you get going, you remember these things. i have a hard time remembering the names of the people i work with. i have a little contingent over at the national guard service, full time esgr people, and i have a hard time remembering some of their names. [inaudible conversations] >> thank you. you were fantastic. >> i think i told sue, if i didn't tell you, i told somebody -- maybe

saigon. given your expertise on vietnam, are there any other similarities you see between afghanistan and vietnam? >> i think there are parallels and in particular, our strategy, our effort in vietnam suffered tremendously from a fundamental misunderstanding about the nature of the conflict and i'd say the same is true isabout afghanistan and in particular, that the afghan war was not a 20 yearlong war, but a one year war fought 20 times over. with inconsistent and fundamentallylawed strategies that artificially lengthened the war and made it more costly. i believe, margaret, we have won. we had a relatively small number of troops there enabling the afghans to bear the brunt of the fight and it's true, afghanistan was not denmark but afghanistan didn't need to be denmark. it just needed to be afghanistan. probably still needed to be a violent place but compare what we're seeing today to the sustained commitment we had to the 2020 capitulation agreement with the taliban. and i think most peopl