>> sally hemmings we don't know robert hemmings knew how to read a key was under the statute hene would have had to ask the governor and council to contribute a meritorious service it's been reproduced in lots of places. we have new writing from her but it would strike me as odd that her brothers knew how to read and write and no one, she didn't know how to add all but no we don't have any record of her but we have record from her older brothers being able to read it differently at a proficient level but they knew how to read and write. >> this is the final question that there will be an opportunity and will be happy to take questions afterwards. so many didn't have lost things. when did they acquire the names and get others during their time in servitude? >> they talked very much about these last names. with the histories of their family is that they had names the owners did not use them but did not put people's less means like the gillett family made this point with jefferson that appears as part of the gillett family slaves had last names but the orders did not know that our chose no

there's a karma there. >> there's another story about louisa and sally hemmings. jefferson at one point invites native american chiefs to the white house. typically that had happened before but he did something different. he invited the wives. many of the women in washington were insulted by that, the white women, because it put them on par with them. louisa is writing in her diary and says, what next, maybe the magnificent sally will make her appearance. >> oh. >> so there was a lot of bad blood between the two of them. >> wow. let me ask this question, and anybody jump in. can you tell us stories of first ladies who strongly influenced the flow of history, who had a huge impact on her husband's presidency and the direction that the country moved in her time? >> well, i could start with an influence that's a very interesting influence, elizaon son, the wife of andrew johnson, who is periodically listed as the worst -- or next to the worst president who ever lived. in the year that i wrote the little biography about him, he actually made it to being the worst, you

for decades, they denied the possibility that sally hemming and thomas jefferson had children.nks to dna evidence, they couldn't deny it any longer. now they could have been bitter enders. they could have said, i don't have 100% certainty, but they decided and they understood that history evolves. so, they changed not just their public statements but they're exhibits, and they welcomed shannon's family. what i'm adding today -- what we need today is more of that. >> that's what i wanted -- yes. you're reading my mind. >> it's about educating people and i think that's what's being a missed component. people aren't being educated about the full history of this story. it's a complicated history that this country has come through, and we need to start educating people about all of it, the good, the bad, the ugly. >> i feel like this reunion at monticello, it's a special place, the good and the ugly and everything in between, and this reunion of descendants of martha and thomas jefferson and sally hemming came together in the wake of the dna and it was -- i mean, i've heard you spea

was sally hemmings ever freed from slavery? >> she was informally freed. she moved in after jefferson died. if he had freed her a couple of things. she was over 45. she was at this point 53 years old. if you freed them you have to petition the legislature and you also had to say how you were going to take care of that person for the rest of their lives. you sort of imagined her putting that in a document allowing her to stay in the state and then saying here is how -- it was that they had been living together. she moves into charlottesville. she listed on a census in 1830 as a free white woman. in 1833 they do a special census to ask free blacks if they want to go back to africa. she says no. she is listed there as a free negro woman at that point. so it was informal freedom. she lives with her sons and dies in 1835. >> i have two question that is are virtually identical. who is good on this? >> i think she was very influenti influential. s he loved her very very much. i think this was a situation. it is a traditional kind of thing. it was not like she was

he not tomorrow was a slaich owner by had sex with sally hemmings for 30 years and some would call thatthe media. i wrote a column entitled. i will quote. journalists never imagined trump would be elected president. they will persist in predicting trump's imminent demise and assert their own intellectual and moral superiority. >> you are right on target on that. on this show last week i said i hope the president does not backtrack on charlottesville. he hand that perfectly. when you listen to those comments, the only people who would have a problem with the balances way the president handled charlottesville would be those who are racist, weak or i will logical on the issue. you are right on gregg. gregg: that will do it tonight. thanks for joining us. cheryl: breaking news this morning. hurricane harvey has strengthened overnight. expected to be a cat 3 storm and expected to hit texas and louisiana, could be the strongest hurricane to hit the u.s. lauren: oil refineries shutting down. gas prices expected to spike. crude oil 47.81, up almost 1%. cheryl: we are watching the storm at the n

was a dome on top of the house and he climbed up to the top of the dome and in that dome was sally hemming's bedroom. it was high above everything else. it was only accessible to jefferson. and for me that's an architectural symbol of some of the contradictions that he seems to have harbored at the same time. he took pleasure from the flesh of african-americans, both carnal pleasure and economic pleasure, but he would not allow that african-americans had intelligence or had -- or had righ rights. so for me his attitude, his dismissive attitude toward phyllis wheatley is not really a surpris surprise. >> i just want to thank you. i'm a very big fan of phyllis wheatley. apologies because i have laryngitis. but i wanted to ask about -- it was something i read in grain in salt because it was on wikipedia about an inquiry that phyllis wheatley was subjected to prior to the publication of her book. i know a number of -- i think maybe benjamin franklin was there, she was subject to the inquiry by john hancock, signer of the declaration of independence. i was wondering if you could talk more about t

sally hemmings, the young child. i mean, we look at our history, there's too much there. and in regards to the president making a comment, i feel like he should have, but, of course, he didn't in time, and then what is he really doing? after the fact, so many days later, it's things like that that kind of feel wrong. and i feel if we continue the role, and frankly, i just question why all of a sudden now, with this particular batch, is there such an outcry for it to stop, because it's been going on for such a long time. host: juanita in kentucky, line for those under 30. go ahead. caller: hi. it's onita. all the itas were calling in, i thought i should just put kentucky in there. i'm under 30. nd i moved to rural kentucky because my town that i grew up in has always been racially charged, and it's really sad, nd i wanted to give props to juanita in alabama, because she hit it on the head. it's all about what the lord wants us to be, and it's all about what the lord has said about what's coming. host: mike, pittsburgh, pennsylvania, those 30 to 50 years old. ood morning. c

hemming of monticello and americans family. she is professor of law of the new york law school and professor of history at rutgers university. she is the author of thomas jefferson sally henning, which remains most influential study of the subject. she has written numerous articles on jefferson and edited forthcoming reader on jefferson and rates which will be published by princeton university press. she also had had time to complete a short biography of andrew johnson which will be published in the fall of 2009. please join me in welcoming a net cord in reeves. [applause] >> thank you, very much for that introduction i love how he says that. [laughter] say it again. say it again. it is great to be here among some many people that i know. such a familiar place to me i came back to monticello and many times and it is always good to be here i've never been here when is raining. so, this is an interesting thing for me. a day that began at 4:00 a.m. this morning trying to get there quickly and taking off at 1:00 so i am just here and i am very happy to be here with you. i thought that i would talk a little bit about how i came to write this book. what the book is about an

there's a book they distributed i very interested in reading next dealing with thomas jefferson and sally hemmings. it talks about that relationship and what it was. i wanted to read the intricacies of what the relationship was and how they move forward. thomas jefferson was one of our founding fathers. as an african-american, his beliefs in either freeing sally or his relationship with slaves of the time. so that is a book of particular interest to me. if i have the time, i would like booky to read a third called "in the black: history of african-americans on wall street " which i sit on the financial services committee and i am from new york. so it is important, i think him and you think about the investments and what is taking the becomell street tremendously important. there had been some kind years, many of which no one talks about and no one knows. i wanted to make sure i became familiar with who they are, what sacrifices they made. so i am looking to do this book from gregory s. bell. i think that will do me for the month of august. finish one, get into two, and then back to washington, d.c

and there's a book that they distributed that i was very interested in with thomas jefferson and sally hemming spread it talks about that relationship than what it was so i want to read the intricacies of what the relationship was and thomas jefferson was one of our founding fathers and an african-american. his relationship with slaves at the time so that is a book of particular interest to me. if i have the time i would like to talk about the third book whatever with me and it's a history of african-americans on wall street which is i serve on the financial services committee and i'm from new york. it's important i think when you think about the investment and what's taking place on wall street. that becomes very important in their been pioneers many of which no one talks about a no one knows and even myself so i wanted to become familiar familiar with who they are and what sacrifices they made. in the black by gregory f. pell. that will get me through the month of august. i will finish one, get into two and then back to washington d.c. >> congressman meeks think your different analysis of hi