ben laidler outlines the fundamentals of the market, and savita subramanian is focused on the bond market. jonathan: it's an upgrade from 3800, but nowhere near some of the price targets out there. into next year, we've heard calls of 5k. so vita -- savita looking for 4600. look at the labor market. i can give you some data that shows you this labor market is tight. i can give you some data that shows this labor market is loose. that debate is going nowhere anytime soon. tom: the distinction on ecb is simple. u.s., maximum stimulus. ecb, far less stimulus. jonathan: capital economics, their line came out a couple of minutes ago that sums up things perfectly. the ecb slows purchases, but will keep policy ultra-loose. the real test for that is in the italian bond market. the italian bond market is rallying. tom: what does that mean for the bundesbank? jonathan: right now, let's see what you've got. can you make sure the flex ability -- the flexibility in this pandemic emergency purchase program does not get folded into the asset purchase program next year? tom: the smartest thing i've heard

savita subramanian making some headlines. an upgrade to her price target of 40 to 50. she sound bearish, or what? tom: the major observation there, to be quick about it, it is less about equity market dynamics and the bank of america call wedded to fed and bond market dynamics. jonathan: pretty constructive on the economy, does not on this market right now. your next stop for this market in about 15 minutes, and ecb decision. what does that mean for the european bond market? how does it bleed into treasuries? yields in about a basis point get curve just a little bit flatter. steve major of hsbc making the call that we might not see a rate hike at the federal reserve through 2023. what about at the ecb? it to euro-dollar. kit juckes over at socgen, maybe we don't see it for this cycle, for a whole generation. euro-dollar right now, $1.1830, positive a little more than 0.1%. we will hear from the ecb and get more about the pace of purchases. then there's going to be this compare and contrast between the ecb and the federal reserve. a taper at the ecb is not the same as a