joining us now for the interview tonight is scott heinz. heinz was a distinguished graduate of the air force academy in 1992. by his senior year, he was commanding a third of the cadet force. he was gay, and of course he had to be closeted. the air force academy referred him as a cadet to ted haggard's new life church in colorado springs, for him to undergo therapy designed to turn him into a straight man. it didn't take. mr. heinz is now a city council member in rancho mirage california. mr. heinz, thank you for being with us. >> thank you, rachel. thanks for having me. >> i've got to ask your, let me ask you, if anything about having been there as a gay cadet strikes you wrong? if any of that doesn't resonate with you in terms of your experience. and also your reaction to this news about the counseling program. >> well, i think you're very accurate in painting what is really a decades-long history. and the academy has been working very hard, particularly in the last five to six years, to really overcome this culture that's really develope