sec. he served as the ceo and president of the u.s. dairy x or counsel -- expert counsel. he was the 40th government of iowa. a former member of the iowa state senate and a former mayor of his hometown of -- hometown. thank you. a pleasure to have you before the committee and we look forward to your comments. sec. vilsack: thank you, madam chair. i appreciate the opportunity to be here and i appreciate the invitation from you on the ranking member for the opportunity to be in front of this committee. it would be helpful if i could highlight three recent announcements in my opening statement. i will be glad to respond to questions that the committee has. as we all know, we are dealing with a situation involving infant formula thanks to the quick action of congress, you all provided the department of agriculture additional authority in terms of wic that will allow us to work with those who produce formula in this country to create more supply. we just sent a letter to all of the state health

sec. jean-pierre: oh, hey! okay. good afternoon, everybody. okay. i have one thing at the top for everybody. so i know a lot of people have been asking me about the summit of americas. and you probably saw it tonight at 6:00, there will be a background call with some of our experts later today. clearly at 6:00. we will discuss the summit in detail and give you all the information you wished for. i wanted to give a quick preview each day of the summit so you all have it now. it will be arranged around five key areas that president biden will focus on. on wednesday, the focus will be on economic agenda for the region. and promoting health systems and health security. thursday will be responding to the climate crisis. and combating food insecurity. and friday will focus on migration in the western hemisphere. you can expect to see deliverables in those areas announced by the president and other members of his cabinet all three days relating to those focus areas. and one final item of note, la

sec. becerra: good morning. thanks for taking the time. on friday, june 24, five americans decided to use the vast power bestowed on them by our democracy and our constitution to unconscionably put at risk the life and health of millions of our fellow americans. they chose to unconscionably limit americans established freedoms and economy to control their own body, decisions usually made in consultation with their doctor, not a politician. they chose to strip away the fundamental health care protections that every american of childbearing age has known all of their lives. fridays supreme court decision was despicable, but it was not unpredictable. hhs has been preparing for this for some time. that is why earlier this year we launched our hhs reproductive access task force to prepare for every action necessary to protect women's access to reproductive health care. there is no magic bullet, but if there is something we can do we will find it and we will do it at hhs. indeed, that was the in

sec., thank you for taking on the myriad security challenges now facing the nation. moderating the conversation today is vivian, who serves as a national security reporter at "the wall street journal," having covered foreign-policy and national security for two decades and has reported from 70 nations. before i hand it over to secretary wormuth for keynote remarks, i would like to remind everyone that this is a public event and on the record. we encourage our audience on zoom to direct questions to the secretary using the q&a tab that you can find at the bottom of your screen. be sure to identify yourself, please, and your affiliation as you ask your question. we will be collecting them throughout the event and then vivian will pose some questions to our guest at the end. we also encourage our online audience to join the conversation on twitter by following us there and using the hash tag forward defense. thank you all for joining us for what i'm sure will be a stimulating, captivating con

sec. yellen: thank you, chairman, members of the committee, thank you for inviting me to discuss the ministrations budget proposals. this budget prioritizes essential investments in education, medical care and affordable housing alongside tax reforms that enable deficit reduction and prioritize a pharaoh tasks system. over the past year and a half we have experienced a robust recovery characterized by strong economic growth, historically low unemployment and high household saving rates. this rapid, broad-based recovery has been buttressed by the congressional response to the challenges of the pandemic, beginning with the cares act at the beginning of the pandemic and continuing with the consolidated appropriations act in late 2020 and the american rescue plan legislated at the beginning of 2021. as president biden said last week, we are entering a period of transition, from one of historically covering to one that can be marked by a stable and steady growth. making this shift is a central

sec. cardona: thank you, chairman scott and ranking member fox, members of this distinguished committee. good afternoon and thank you. i will attempt to answer questions on the budget, to tell you this proposal will be the best tool to address inequity. the best tool to provide pathways to college and to help our country recover from the pandemic. i would be failing u.s. secretary of education if i did not tell you how ashamed i am we are becoming desensitized to the murder of children. i would be failing you as a secretary of education if i did not use this platform to say students and teachers and school leaders are scared. after columbine, after sandy hook, after parkland, after each of these and many other massacres we as educators did our best to look parents in the eye and assure them we will do everything to protect their babies. after each of these massacres we help staff training, active shooter drills, improved online early detection screening tools, and parameters. that is no ma

sec. kendall: close to a year. col. venable: when you have been up against and waited into is quite significant. i would love to hear your thoughts on where the service is right now and what you are thinking. sec. kendall: sure. he mentioned my cold war experience. it is relevant to why i am back again. i came back for one fundamental reason, china, china, china. i became concerned about china's military modernization program in 2010 when i came back to work. what i saw that china was doing was involving capability to attempt to defeat american power in the region. i was in the pentagon in the earlier tour for the first gulf war. the united states demonstrated a dramatic improvement in conventional war fighting capability, unlike anything anybody has seen before, frankly unlike what we expected in the first gulf war. we were talking about 10,000 or 20,000 and had a few hundred. we demonstrated through a mix of precision munitions, systems, network capabilities that we had a profound advant

sec. kendall: i'm on number four, then there are three to go. that family of systems is number four. our tactical air force is dependent on runways. those are all very targetable. with a mix of cruise missiles, the mix of hardening, defense, what we need to optimally defend those bases and create alternative bases. if we can't get that one to work, we have a problem with tactical air forces in general. the next one on the list is a similar concept. we are introducing the b 21 enter production. -- into production. it's doing reasonably well and we are headed to production on that. it's an expensive aircraft. one of the problems is all the things that we are trying to buy right now are very expensive. the f-35 costs about the same. and so to have unaffordable air force, we have to introduce some lower-cost platforms. as well as a combat aircraft that would be through the b 21 and the family systems approach. in the last thing on my list is pay attention to the folks that come out here. this

sec. vilsack: thank you very much. chuck, i appreciate that introduction. i want to tell you folks, there are very few people in the united states who have had more of a positive impact on american agriculture in the last several decades than chuck conner. i am honored to have you here today. morgan, there is a spot open for you at the usda. [laughter] sec. vilsack: jenny, make sure the application gets in her hand. we need bright young folks and i will finish my marks directed at folks like morgan. it is good to be back on campus at georgetown university where my two grandfathers met at law school. their meeting led to their son and daughter meeting and that meeting led to those two people meeting me at an orphanage in pittsburgh where they decided to make me part of their family. so in a sense for me it all started here and i'm glad to be back. it's great to be back on campus. a campus that is committed to helping grow and expand opportunity in rural america. my good friend has worked wi

sec. blinken: good morning everyone. it is a pleasure to welcome the nato secretary general jens stoltenberg a friend and colleague to the city and to washington. we have seen each other quite a bit over the last 15 months. mostly in brussels. we did a calculation, it turns out i spent more time in brussels and any other city other than washington dc. that is a coincidence. it's because nato is there, our friends of the european union as well. but it has been a center of our engagement, a center of our activity, and that has been made all the better by the exceptional partnership we have had with secretary-general stolt enberg. indeed, around the world in being grateful to the secretary-general for his strong and steady leadership during such a consequential period for the alliance and for the world. we are very, very glad he agreed to extend his tenure, their next fall. -- through next fall. today was the opportunity to touch base on the nato summit which will take place in madrid in a fe

sec. vilsack: it's my view that it is a crisis that could result in a number of small it midsize farming operations that are not able to sustain activities,, particularly in the dairy industry. there is a need for stability and a need for a fix. there is a need for courage, political courage to pass immigration reform. it is a bill that both the industry and the labor has agreed upon, we should make it relatively simple to be for it. it is -- people are puzzled as to why this has not passed. when i travel and talk to farmers, they go, we need to do something about labor, why can't they get 60 votes in the senate? i don't have an answer for that. >> any of you, anybody who would like to try to be part of getting this over the finish line here, in helping partner with me and my crapo we would deeply appreciate it -- mike crapo we would appreciate it. sen. stabenow: this is the moment where we have that opportunity than ever before. frankly i would call and everyone, the agriculture industry,

sec. smith: of course tribal nations are sovereign nations and they decide for themselves. and while they should, according to treaties on power on tribal land. that is the situation. health care is available for people who receive health care through the veterans administration and they want to thank my colleague who has worked so hard on that. it is very important for us to consider. the other thing i'm very focused on is what can we do to shore up access to abortion care in states where it is still legal, including on federal land like my state of minnesota, where the governor who is running for reelection made an executive order clarifying he will use his power to preserve abortion care for people who live in minnesota and will come to minnesota from other places. president is talking about this as well, freedom to travel is one of the fundamental freedoms in this country and we should not allow state legislatures to infringe upon it. what other thing, administration has also been clea

thank you mr sec.. the president - you mr sec.. the president references— you mr sec..are used by election workers? they are standard ballot _ that are used by election workers? they are standard ballot carriers . they are standard ballot carriers that allowed for seals to be put on them _ that allowed for seals to be put on them so _ that allowed for seals to be put on them so they are tamperproof. and finall the them so they are tamperproof. and finally the president claims it was a minimum — finally the president claims it was a minimum of— finally the president claims it was a minimum of 18,000 _ finally the president claims it was a minimum of 18,000 ballots - finally the president claims it was - a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggted _ a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggted in _ a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggted in att— a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggted in all for— a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggled in all for biden. _ a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow smuggled in all for biden. i— a minimum of 18,000 ballots somehow

sec. blinken: thank you for bringing us together for this conversation. thank you for convening this. it is great to meet virtually with everyone at the council and all of the readers of "foreign affairs," which i in fact, we include myself in. in fact, we have one huge problem is that despite the world we live in, we continue to get "foreign affairs" in hard copy. this presents a challenge when it comes to user base because when i have been a subscriber, it builds up. but we are trying to figure that out. we had planned to have this conversation some months ago, and february 24 was the original date. we all know it happened on that date. as dan said, the second time, i wound up on the ukraine. when a look at this morning, i wondered what was going to happen. i am really glad that nothing has happened and we can have this conversation. i want to thank you for bearing with me as we get this get-together back on the books. i am glad we are finally able to do it. in fact, the world has change

sec., the report that we had administration like this one, that is decimated title ix allike you guys are, do believe that biological boys can compete against girls in sports it's a simple question. >> i think all students should have access to sports. >> it like you do support biological boys competing is girls in sports. >> i believe answer the question. >> know you have not come a simple answer the question, the administration either supports or you don't. >> up i'm saying the transgender girls to have access to sports and yes, i do. >> it so you support biological boys competing against girls in sports and for b the one, you don't believe the direct conflict title ix. >> it i see real questions are going and when be very clear with you, the transgender student need to feel supported included and seen and your line of questioning is even by describing it the way you're doing it, shows me that you don't believe that all students should have access to the extra curricular activities that

what's at stake today is ripple 's motion to get documents out of the sec.would say somewhat controversial, but very confidential documents, about the innerworkings of the sec and how they deliberated on making xrp a security specifically how they relate to the speech of a guy named bill hinman, former head of corporation finance at the sec. he's the guy that first said ether and bitcoin are okay, they don't come under sec regulation but everybody else is suspect and not long after that, xrp and ripple faced an sec investigation, and two years after that, essentially, they filed their case, seeking billions of dollars in damages, so if ripple believes if it could get these documents, which again, the sec hates giving out documents, they like keeping everything confidential, they believe they can show that sec was picking winners and losers, that there was wide disagreement at the sec over whether xrp should be considered a security, and they think that they could essentially win the case, and maybe even force the sec into a potential favorable settlement wit

joe: everything is blowing up, citadel and capital, and they recognize the sec [inaudible] the sec'srotect the individual investor. [inaudible] does that make sense? alix: go ahead, joe. joe: [inaudible] the market maker has a good --, and creates a price, the best price for the broker. they keep a piece of that for themselves. now, the brokerage firm then decides how much of that, how much of that payment they give to the client and how much they keep for themselves. most of the time, they get the biggest chunk, but at schwab, 95% of all -- our [inaudible] by the way, this is for free. this is for free. that's how incredible this deal is. now let's look behind the scenes. [inaudible] that cost an enormous amount of money. that allows the brokerage firm to charge zero commission to the investor. the individual investor, if they mess with payment for order flow, they might offset that and brokerage firms will have to start to charge fees. guy: what could be the next best model? joe: this model works pretty well. i know you are talking about an option model. depending on how that works

you sit big ten sec. we in the big ten and sec think we need a little self-awareness here. people are not from those conferences do not care for us. i did not care for us in the fall and maybe that is too much great care enforcement talk about college football that i'm very confident. somebody outside of these conferences they get the question which you prefer the sec or the big ten, will be something like this, this reminds me of world war ii who would you rather see lose? and that is a hard question. that is the vantage point of the rest of america now. i am not the rest of america this is an easy one. i'm trying think of a polite way to save and passg being polite. i don't see the sec is johnny come lately he's been doing it for centuries you guys were doing it forens decades. i will say if you measured not by decades but by years you have been doing pretty well and must acknowledgeee that. we can think of one game against sec team that went pretty well. maybe the real way to put it in i should remember i am a guest remember i am a guest i did hear a lot of ohio state co

the sec has notoriously not been interested in backing etf's.the goal is to convert into an etf. when i think back to grayscale's earliest days when we launched, we always envisioned it to be an etf. in that time we worked tirelessly and now built into the world largest bitcoin fund. investors have been patient. we know they want this parade we know they deserve this. the lawsuit is intended to challenge the sec's decision here. katie: let's talk about the issue which is -- guy: let's talk about the issue which is the discount. they closed to the net asset value. you and i talk for hours about that. now with etf conversion seemingly off the table for police now, what steps can grayscale take to try and repair that discount? michael: investors know the converting to an etf is ultimately what will remove the discount. in applying for an etf you're essentially getting -- from the fcc to ensure can have simultaneous predation -- creation and redemption which arbitrage way that discount. this is such a missed opportunity. you know this better than an

sec. blinken: no, i think, judy, what we're seeing is a very intense fight in the donbass in eastern and also in southern ukraine. there are significant casualties on both side it's horrific, and it's a result of russia's aggression against ukraine. there is a very intense effort that is ongoing as we speak to make sure that the ukrainians are getting what they need when they need it to deal with the russian aggression. and it's not going to be linear. there are, tragically, ups and downs in this. and, again, there are significant casualties on both sides. but there is a very, very significantly coordinated effort being undertaken to make sure that ukrainians get what they need when they need it. and that will continue. we have said for some time that, unfortunately, this is likely to go on for some time. and this is what we're seeing on the ground, but there's a big difference. the ukrainians are fighting for their country. they're fighting for their future. they're fighting for their fre

sec. gen. stoltenberg: in an alliance of 30 different allied countries there will be differences,here will be discussions but when it comes to the conclusions and our ability to act both on sanctions and on military support to ukraine, nato haseen extremely united and very capable of acting. geoff: and, at the extreme -- persistent drought worsened by climate change causes perilously low water levels at the nation's largest reservoir. all that and more on tonight's "pbs newshour." >> major funding for the "pbs newshour" has been provided by. >> fidelity dedicated advisors are here to help you create a wealth plan. a plan with tax sensitive investing strategi. planning focused on tomorrow, while you focus on today. that's the planning effect, from fidelity. >> the kendeda fund, committed to advancing restorative justice and meaningful work through investments in transformative leaders and ideas. more at kendedafund.org. carnegie corporation of new york, supporting innovations in education, democ

sec. there is no one "biggest kink." as you just heard there are challenges throughout the supply chain. the private sector -- we are -- a lot of the effort we have been putting into it is bringing together suppliers and consumers , including transparency, trying to help producers get an accurate demand signal from industry. we are striving to see improvement there. obviously we in the administration leaned into the port situation. we have seen a lot of improvement with declining congestion. this has been a slow and steady effort. we are going industry by industry figuring out where the government can play a role to unclog and unstick the supply chain. joe: i am glad he said semiconductors because i know that is important to you. the chip shortage. i want to ask you about the innovation in competition at making its way through capitol hill. we have a house version and a senate version and 100 working on this now. lobbyists are getting involved. a meeting with -- i'm even reading about pet

sec. gen. stoltenberg: it is not unusual that allies expressed concerns when we have processes on enlarging the allianc i think we all have to remember the fact that finland and sweden have applied for nato membership is a historic decision, and nato has helped to spread democracy and freedom for decades. then when turkey erases -- raises concerns, as we always do, nato has to sit down and find a way to address those concerns, and find a united way forward to allow finland and sweden to join. nick: turkey is raising concerns about what it calls swedish support for curds and is demanding deportation and removal of political support for those currents. a senior nato official told me today if you cannot find a solution to this by the leader summit at the end of the month, it would be a quote, reprieve for vladimir putin. do you agree? sec. gen. stoltenber we woing how to address the concerns expressed b turkey. and we welcome the fact there are direct contact. and i convened a senior officials fro

the sec believes their plans aren't robust enough to protect investors from possible fraud. gray scale is saying the sec is okay with etfs based on futures, it should be okay with those that hold actual bitcoin. >> we've worked to turn this into the largest bitcoin fund. it is invested in today by millions of americans in all 50 states so the fact that a u.s. regulator is shunning the opportunity to bring this further into the regulatory perimeter and give investors mortise closure, you know, more protections, this is an unbelievably missed opportunity on their part. >> lot of folks in crypto debating this. cnbc reached out to the sec on this issue, and the agency was not available to comment outside of working hours rejecting more than a dozen proposals now for spot bitcoin etfs over the past year. so gray scale not ahope. melissa? >>> coming up, a new look at the fed's preferred measure of nation, that's on the way at the bottom of the hour, but next we'll talk about the toll inflation is taking on americans and pain at the pump this july 4th weekend with new jersey govern

it's much smaller than the sec.bill accounts for that by giving it a self-funding mechanism so that the cryptocurrency that will be regulated by the ftc will be given a fee structure. they can hire more lawyers, hire cyber security experts and build their office. i sit on the agricultural committee. i asked the very questions. can you do oversight and account ability given the resources? he says yes. they're doing the futures market. he's prepared to do this work. it doesn't leave the sec out because there's a lot of industry players specifically those in new york city that want to be regulated by the sec -- >> neil: there's other potential policemen to this. >> for sure. >> neil: let me ask this, senator lummis. the odds of getting this through seem to be uphill maybe because of the scheduling and the views of republicans and democrats that are far from the same page, so is this even going to happen? do you think senator lummis that you can convince your republican colleagues that this is a step in the right direct

but the largest number of cryptocurrencies will probably fall under the sec.d yet there is no real broad agreement on whether cryptocurrencies are commodities or securities. senator gillibrand, i am so curious, which do you think are commodities, which do you think our securities? sen. gillibrand: i think senator lummis just answered that question perfectly. the way we have structured this oversight is by purpose. what is the purpose of your digital asset? you meet the tally test? are you a company offering a stock to raise money for your company to fund your company? if that is what you are doing with your digital asset, you are therefore a security. and so, is there an issue work? is the issuer giving you something of value? is it based on the expertise of the issuer? those are all characteristics of securities. so it is not the name cryptocurrency that decides where you go, it is the purpose of the digital asset that you are offering to the public for sale that's going. to affect who is your regulator. . emily: it is wonderful to see two people from differe

sec. granholm: and one of the reasons why it is such a challenge is because during the pandemic, nobody drove so the oil and gas companies really cut back on production. it is hard to flip the switch and increase production to get back up to where demand is. that is part of the challenge. there is a lag between the amount of supply you can bring on and increasing demand. we are seeing it right now as we go through the summer driving season entering into the fourth of july weekend. that is one of the reasons the president has called for congress to pass a gas tax holiday. i know governor newsom has proposed putting out a sort of rebate to consumers for the amount of money they are spending on gas. kristen: you mentioned supply should be increasing pretty soon due to those agreements and i know you met with oil refiners and producers recently. did they also agreed to pullback prices in the meantime? sec. granholm: no peer they definitely don't agree to that. the problem for us as consumers i

then things that are securities would be at the sec.require sec disclosures in order to to protect consumers by disclosing information behind that cryptocurrency. charles: taxes, how would tax policy apply? >> taxes would be primarily capital-gains taxes. we want to take care of some accounting snafus that exist today through our bill and, our bill covers those issues as well. charles: stablecoin issues gone on here recently, i think, have allowed the cynics and critics those who are simply opposed to this, to, sort of go on the offensive. how does this bill potentially address that, make this a smoother, more orderly market? >> i think our bill solveses the stablecoin issue. the stablecoin that failed was algorithmic stablecoin. -- algorithmic stable coins that are not 100% hard asset theft. it would only allow payment of stable coins backed by 100% hard assets, or, that are issued by financial institutions that are insured by the fdic. so that way you are, having a dollar-denominated and dollar asset backed issuer, issuing the stablec

so this is a very complicated area and it's going to be hard for the sec to prove. the second thing is he's going to face a ton of backlash from congress, the republicans in congress, who again, believe that these sort of competing markets are the way to go, and the republicans are going to run in congress and number three we should point out that gary gensler, everybody knows it, he's said it, he wants to be treasury secretary. the person that he answers to the most is not the president but it's elizabeth warren so if any tv commentator, if anybody, any investor thinks this is a good plan, you have to remember one thing. this is a plan that's being endorsed by the bank-hating, wall street-hating, investor cynic known as elizabeth warren. just keep that in mind. back to you, liz. liz: charlie thank you very much look this issue comes down to one critical question. are you, the investor, getting the best possible price of the stock each time you execute a trade? because that's what chair gensler is scrutinizing the most so let's bring in teddy weisberg and dutch mast

they criticized the strategy of regulating for one off decisions and lawsuits others tell me the sec ruling was expected. the crypto hedge fund three arrows is rliquidated and r reinfrastructuring jpmorgan bringing bit of optimism saying the worst may be over strategist say failures shouldn't be surprised atdeclin. the current deleveraging cycle may not be very protracted all of this hitting the crypto related stocks coin base really bearing the br brunt of it. shares are down this month back to you. >>> we talked yesterday about jim chenos the realize company that house all that equipment, that networking two companies he cites are in focus. we have the ceo of digital realty coming up the response to chenos responding to us on twitter saying can't wait. some dlr numbers 2016 versus 2021, ebit margin 23.2 coming down vacancy rate, 11 to 16 this is serious deterioration over the past veeafi yrs we'll have the company's take on all of that in a moment. "tech check" is back real soon machin as a business owner, your bottom line is always top of mind. so start saving by switching to the

sec. chapman: thank you chairwoman, ranking member, and other esteemed members of the senate rules committee for allowing me to offer remarks regarding the state of election and the commonwealth of pennsylvania. i am lee chapman, acting secretary of state for pennsylvania and i was appointed to this role by governor tom wolf on january 8 of this year. as pennsylvania's chief election officer, my role is to ensure that elections are secure and accessible and that every eligible voter in pennsylvania can register, cast their ballot and have it counted. i was asked today to speak to you regarding the current elections landscape in my state. first, i will provide a brief update on tuesdays primary election. after that, i will share three concerns that are front of mind, at the department of state in pennsylvania. and those three concerns are one of the time for pre-canvassing mail ballots, misinformation and disinformation surrounding elections and three the need for a robust confronting of el

i'm very concerned that gary gensler is pushing the limits of the sec's authority.n climate disclosure is wildly beyond what has ever been contemplated at the sec, as their responsibility. regulation by enforcement is a terrible approach. it was actually the latter part he's talking about crypto, so he's getting a lot of pushback on this. now, what could the republicans do? not much now, okay? because they are in the minority , but once they get in the majority, i think you're going to see gary gensler become a target of the particularly if they have both the house and the senate, they are holding hearings on all the stuff. we should point out something really interesting and this is kind of percolating through the grapevine. this stuff on climate is getting so much blowback, even getting blowback, from what i understand from esg advocates on wall street. the way we're hearing through the grapevine none other than larry fink thinks the sec and he is the ceo of blackrock, we've had him on the show to talk about esg, he thinks they are going too far. blackrock has alw

. >>> later, why i told you so, not enough for sec chief gary genzer talking about the crypto crash. it is all happening on this wednesday, june 15th, and this is "worldwide exchange." >>>well, good morning, good afternoon or good evening. welcome from wherever in the world you are watching i am brian sullivan. great to be back with you folks. we know there are a lot of tough head leans to hear out there we promise the sun will come up today, that's a promise. actually, futures, they are also up right now not a whole bunch but there is some green on your screen. futures higher across the board. dow futures up just over 100 points all of this coming though on another down day for most stocks the s&p 500 falling deeper into bear markets losing nearly half a percent and closing at its lowest level since january 29th, 2021 your scorecard the dow is now off more than 17% from the recent high the s&p 500 is 22.5% there ease your bear market. the nasdaq off more than 33% it's been in a bear market for a while and continues to fall. the dow not quite there. bonds really have been the bigger