joining us is seth kleinman. great to have you with us. >> hi there. >> there's a number of factors there. confluence of factors, in fact. give us a reason for this bull run. >> we liked when we were facing a shutdown of three coast refineries. now looks like valero could be shutting. basically there's not going to be that much gasoline. they're going to have a prolonged maintenance season going into the spring. they're going to compete to is the barrels. we think that's the scarcest molecule in the complex. we think the best way to play it is be long gasoline and short wti. coming out of north dakota, out of texas. you're really seeing the demise of the crude oil hypothesis. it's keeping wti suppress. >> what do you make of demand being at the lowest level since 2001. and if you look at gasoline and the refiners, does this go back to the mid-continent being the best play? >> yes to the mid-continent because i think ti is toward 20 bucks and is going to be there awhile. if you look down the curve, the odds are st