. >> a casino was supposedly targeted by iranian hackers because of sheldon sheldon adelo you're right. you wouldn't think of them as a natural target. i'm interested in understanding exactly, you explained the difference between a cyber attack and signer espionage. a lot of the work we see from nation-states is cyber espionage. people warn that it is very possible. congress is moving legislation on this. we haven't seen it though. why haven't we seen it if we're so vulnerable, and will we potentially see it because of the vulnerabilities that we have on our power grid currently? >> guest: it's taking things up a level to do that, and so a nation-state would really need to want to take down the power grid and make a statement in order to do that. i think the power grilled -- grilled isn't, some have said it's an imminent threat. i'm not quite sure it's imminent in that way, but it is a major concern. the electric sector has done quite a bit to build up its resiliency and to work in this area. they're improving, but there's still a big risk out there that things can be planted in advanc