amy: frank snowden, have to got a break. want to ask you about smallpox, about haiti, about native americans.. frank snonowden, professor emeritus of history, medidicinet yale university and author of the book "epidemics and society: from the black death to the present." he is speaking to us from ththe lockdown in rome, italy. stay with us. ♪ [music break] amy: marcella bella. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the e quarante report. we a are spending the e hour wih profesessor frank snowdeden, profesessor emeritus of historyf medicine at yale university and author of the book "epidemics and society: from the black death to the present." he has devoted his life to looking at epidemics and teaching thousands of students. he is now in rome, italy, where he has been for months, coincidentally, with her for another project -- went there for another projecect i got caut in the lockdown, got covid-19, has recovered from that and we are like enough to have him as our guest for the hour. professor snowden, take us to hispanio

a month later, the whistle-blower, edward snowden, revealed that clapper had lied. snowden revealed that clapper and others were using the patriot act to spy on virtually every american. snowden revealed that the secret fisa court was allowing a single court order to command the collection of millions of americans' personal phone data. most members of congress had no idea that this was going on. in fact, one of the authors of the patriot act publicly expressed his shock that such a massive surveillance of americans was occurring with no notification of congress. clapper and others, though, said that's not true. they justified their actions by saying we have been briefing the elite eight congressmen. who are the elite eight and who made them elite? the elite eight are the majority and minority leaders of the house and the senate, and the majority and the minority leader of the intelligence committee in the house and the senate. eight people. when they were quizzed about this program, most of them said they couldn't remember ever being briefed on it, but the real cons

. >> that was from my last interview with ed snowden back in september. he's describing there a service not traditionally offered at the apple store. reporters in contact with ed snowden have also resorted to extreme measures to protect their sources and their classified documents in their possession as they have found themselves under government surveillance. one of those journalists is with us tonight. we are so happy to welcome to the broadcast barton gellman, a pulitzer prize-winning journalist who writes at "the atlantic." notably the author of the new book "dark mirror: edward snowden and the american surveillance state," which goes on sale tomorrow morning. bart, thank you very much for coming on. i remember what we went through to get to ed snowden and interview him early on in moscow, including the two lovely gentlemen with shiny suits at baggage claim in the airport who attached themselves to us. i'm wondering on a much grander scale what it's done to your life to have known ed snowden. >> well, i haven't learned how to take apart a phone, but i

>> frank snowden: i have seen parts of the movie; other parts have changed. the science is very different, but yes the plot is similar. >> wertheim: this semester, while on a research trip in rome, the professor came into contact with his subject matter, quite literally. he contracted covid-19 and was quarantined. he couldn't help but notice that the methods used today to contain the virus were all too familiar-- from the bubonic plague of the 1300s to the cholera pandemic of the 1800s. >> snowden: our public health methods were built on the plague-- precedents. and so they had quarantine. they had social distancing. they had-lockdowns. doctors actually wore p.p.e. and what they had was a mask. we know about that. theirs was differently shaped. it had a long beak. and they put sweet-smelling herbs in it to keep the foul odors away. but in addition, they carried a long rod or verger and the doctor would physically keep people at a distance. >> wertheim: he says there's comfort in history; we've been here before. and the real source of optimism might come from

jay snowden will join us after weluh tus break. por ncrernright after this feed a healthy lifestyle, with pure protein. high protein. low sugar. tastes great! high protein. low sugar. so good. high protein. low sugar. mmm, birthday cake. pure protein. the best combination to help you stay fit. >>> welcome back shares of penn national gaming rising today the company's long term outlook remains positive as it expects a rebound and the regional gaming market to come sooner for some of the more destination other yents -- oriented casinos let's bring in penn national gaming ceo jason snowden along with contessa >> take a look at other stocks mgm up 6%. you have redrock resorts and boyd up 10%. that's because nevada gaming commission announced guidelines to reopen that have patrons wearing masks, distance between the slot machines. no date for reopening. the ceo was hoping for the end of may jay snowden leet's talk to you about penn national. what are going to be the first casinos that you have reopening? >> good to see you lets me start

smith, edward snowden revealed quite a bit and he features in your book as well. was the government stealing microsoft information surreptitiously? brad: well, i would never use the word stealing. and i would be quick to add that even six years after the snowden disclosures, there's a lot that we still don't know. and there's a lot we may never know. and that might even be appropriate in certain respects when it comes to national security and state secrets. but we do talk in the book about the coverage of "the washington post" in october of 2013. we do talk about the reports that suggest that the u.s. government either by itself or with the british government was tapping into cables, potentially under sea or land-based cables to access data, that it may have been happening outside the use of warrants and therefore the rule of law. so we were explicit then that that was something that concerned us. we were explicit with the white house and president obama then in saying look, there needs to be some reform. and there has been some important reform in the six years s

, which sets the stairclimbing staircase snowden, which sets the stair climbing goal of 4610 steps tond iris pass, a favourite of hikers. see the instagram for details. anotherfun of hikers. see the instagram for details. another fun augmented reality option to spice up your daily walk is: with this app you can create geotag works of art that other app users can see using the ar viewer. now, if you are locked down with yourfamily at now, if you are locked down with your family at home, now, if you are locked down with yourfamily at home, i think eve ryo ne yourfamily at home, i think everyone getting involved is key to maintaining harmony. a brilliant example of this is the family lockdown boogie related byjack buchanan. and, if you decide to give itago buchanan. and, if you decide to give it a go yourself, make sure you tweet us a link to @bbcclick. i have to be honest, i have really struggled with my motivation during lockdown and i'm just not the kind of person that goes for a run, i'm not a jogger, so for the last week i've been travelling to exotic locations and working out in vi

can see coming because of the nature of the surveillance state we already understood even before snowden came out that we were looking at total surveillance state this is the rollout of you know not only the i phone and the sort of the monitoring platforms like the googles and others but the cap the surveillance cameras the notion that the government had the right to spy on you so i said well what happens if a plague so-called plague virus comes that scares people to the place we surrender all their rights to be consistently monitored what dry why was your mind on plagues when they were in else as was arguably on revelations of what would become edward snowden's revelations obviously didn't songes revelations you mediately focused on the pandemic threat. because pandemics threats have always been here i mean the thing is i don't see it as a pandemic i mean we saw us a sars outbreak in china and 1003 i believe in multiple swine flu and things like this and we've seen outbreaks of so-called you know viruses virus outbreak that ultimately you know the system adapts some people die just like

you could also try taking on one of the many social challenges doing the rounds, like staircase snowden the stair climbing goal of 4,610 steps to reach the summit of mount snowdon via the llanberis path, a favourite of hikers. see the plas why brenin instagram for details. another fun augmented reality option to spice up your daily walk is wallame. with this app you can create geotagged works of art that other app users can see using the ar viewer. now, if you are locked down with your family at home, then i think everyone getting involved is key to maintaining harmony. a brilliant example of this is the family lockdown boogie, created by jack buchanan. and, if you decide to give it a go yourself, make sure you tweet us a link to @bbcclick. # family lockdown boogie # we can't go out, so we are all about # family lockdown boogie. ..# i have to be honest, i have really struggled with my motivation during the lockdown, and i'm just not the kind of person that goes for a run — i'm not a jogger — so for the last week i've been travelling to exotic locations and working out in virtual reality

this year congress is set to debate a trio of intelligence authorities, one of them is the snowden-disclosed phone records, pared down version, but do you have any sense of where you are going to come down? do you think congress should reauthorize these authorities? >> do you think there need to be some reforms and how will that play out particularly given the fact that the program has been shuttered. >> my perspective of this or the response to your question is, any time we're having discussions and debates within the halls of congress, within the media and public spectrum, of the programs that we are authorizing, the programs that we deem acceptable, particularly when it comes to basic privacy issues, i think that's an excellent place to be. i predict that some of these conversations will be heated, that some of the debates will be pretty significant, but i think when we're looking at, you know, our priorities of protecting consumer data, protecting individual data, protecting privacy and civil liberties, and we're also looking at how to combat potential threats particularly in the area of

american could be potentially a spy or a terrorist so we should spy on everyone remember that the snowden revelations about how every american schools were being monitored and browsing history the f.b.i. should not be allowed to use the patriot act to surveil americans on line activity without a warrant internet search and browsing history is extremely revealing in nature and the 4th amendment requires a warrant to obtain this information said it has failed by one vote to limit the sheer scope of these powers so the f.b.i. for example would have had to get a search warrant go through a court before spying on someone as i said that they failed 59 senators voted in favor but 60 votes were needed to pass in the meantime your browsing history is fair game for any f.b.i. agent to even police officer that who have access to f.b.i. data all they need to look at it is a hunch that you did something wrong hunch that seat mr president collecting this information is as close to reading minds as survey length can get. unfortunately the question is not where the you did anything wrong on the question

congress is set of a debate over a trio of surveillance authorities, what of which is section 315, the snowden disclosed phone records, the pared down version. do you have any sense of where you're going to come down? you think there needs to be, do you think congress should reauthorize these authorities? d think there needs to be some reforms and how do you think it will play out particularly given we know the fact that these programs have been shuttered? >> guest: i think my 30,000-foot perspective view of this or response to question is anytime with discussions in the base within also congress, within the needy, within the public sector, spectrum of, of the programs we are authorizing, the programs we do acceptable, particularly comes to basic privacy issues, i think that's an excellent place to be. i predict some of these conversations will be heated, that some of the debates will be pretty significant. but i think when we are looking at our priorities of protecting consumer data, protecting individual data, protecting privacy and civil liberties and also looking at how to combat potential

as edward snowden said 5 years later the coronavirus is gone this data is available to them they start looking for new things they already know what you're looking at on the internet they already know where your phone is moving now they know what your heart rate is what happens when they start to intermix cities and apply artificial intelligence to them think about that if the government and big tech knows someone's web searches just their standard travel behavior their heart rate ai systems can basically figure out everything about them they can know who you are what you want when you misbehave insists i get all terms they can know that your heart races every time you have a cinnabon for god's sakes they can know that you have a gambling problem or an alcohol problem or a coke problem they can know your pulse doesn't race when you see your wife in fact on a list of things that grab your attention the most why isn't even on the same page as cinnabon cinnabon what why wife your wife is blokes in a bunch sharks a good pass in the n.f.l. wife is just below partially warmed up gas station

one of them is briton cassandra snowden. royal caribbean ship voyager of the seas. she hasn't set foot on land for two months and has spent most of that time in self—isolation in her cabin. we've just been floating around the ocean — like, turned away from ports, ordered to ger out of waters. we are still doing strict social distancing. considering we disembarked our guests seven weeks ago, we haven't got off since. the philippine government had been allowing foreign nationals to leave through the country's main airport but, at the weekend, suspended all flights into the country for a week to reduce numbers in their quarantine centres. cassandra says the not knowing when they will be allowed home is taking its toll on her health. i think it's getting to a point where our basic human rights are forgotten about. you know, we talk about this virus and how it kills people, but mental health does — and people want to go back to their mothers, their fathers, their husbands, wives, children. just... something needs to be done. and

her a tsunami and what did hillary clinton why was she very angry with julian assange anjan edward snowden what did you even sometimes reveal he revealed what she said member bernie sanders said you must be given some great speeches for 3 quarters of a $1000000.00 you know 20 minute speeches each and and we now know thanks to a claim is that julian assange gave us that material through wiki leaks to learn sitting there with lloyd blankfein one of the architects of the whole wall street us all she says you guys are so smart you have to come with me to washington to fix these economic problems and that's what was revealed that's set the heart of russia that is it you know what were the big c. rist a big influence had nothing to do with numbers in that provinces and screwing around the internet and had to do with real it revealing up to desk that who was up to his eyeballs in all this stuff was out to attack bernie and undermine him and not reveal the content of hillary clinton's shameless speeches to wall street where she defended and she said you had a smart guy ask you how to fix this prob

you could also try taking on one of the many social challenges doing the rounds, like staircase snowdeneach the summit of mount snowdon via the llanberis path, a favourite of hikers. see the plas brenin instagram for details. another fun augmented reality option to spice up your daily walk is wallame. with this app you can create geotagged works of art that other app users can see using the ar viewer. now, if you are locked down with your family at home, then i think everyone getting involved is key to maintaining harmony. a brilliant example of this is the family lockdown boogie, created by jack buchanan. and, if you decide to give it a go yourself, make sure you tweet us a link to @bbcclick. # family lockdown boogie # we can't go out, so we are all about # family lockdown boogie. ..# i have to be honest, i have really struggled with my motivation during the lockdown, and i'm just not the kind of person that goes for a run — i'm not a jogger — so for the last week i've been travelling to exotic locations and working out in virtual reality. this is supernatural, a vr fitness experience,

you could also try taking on one of the many social challenges doing the rounds, like staircase snowden summit of mount snowdon via the llanberis path, a favourite of hikers. see the plas why brenin instagram for details. another fun augmented reality option to spice up your daily walk is wallame. with this app you can create geotagged works of art that other app users can see using the ar viewer. now, if you are locked down with your family at home, then i think everyone getting involved is key to maintaining harmony. a brilliant example of this is the family lockdown boogie, created by jack buchanan. and, if you decide to give it a go yourself, make sure you tweet us a link to @bbcclick. # family lockdown boogie # we can't go out, so we are all about # family lockdown boogie. ..# i have to be honest, i have really struggled with my motivation during the lockdown, and i'm just not the kind of person that goes for a run — i'm not a jogger — so for the last week i've been travelling to exotic locations and working out in virtual reality. this is supernatural, a vr fitness experience, and

one of them is briton cassandra snowden.on the royal caribbean ship voyager of the seas. she hasn't set foot on land for two months and has spent most of that time in self—isolation in her cabin. we've just been floating around the ocean — like, turned away from ports, ordered to ger out of waters. we are still doing strict social distancing. considering we disembarked our guests seven weeks ago, we haven't got off since. the philippine government had been allowing foreign nationals to leave through the country's main airport but, at the weekend, suspended all flights into the country for a week to reduce numbers in their quarantine centres. cassandra says the not knowing when they will be allowed home is taking its toll on her health. i think it's getting to a point where our basic human rights are forgotten about. you know, we talk about this virus and how it kills people, but mental health does — and people want to go back to their mothers, their fathers, their husbands, wives, children. just... something needs to be done

so i think is a mentioned earlier, the -- we'll just jump right into the snowden example. what snowden revealed, every program he talked about had been approved by the federal -- the foreign intense gel surveillance court, the fisacourt. the obama administration -- it was secret and people didn't understand the extent of it but web web obama was very careful about following guidelines set up in the 70s, and the problem was that he realized that he did not want to get u.s. troops forever in iraq and afghanistan and he embraced drone strikes as a way to protect the country would be very vulnerable politically if there there was another attack in the united states and the felt deadlock inside terms of congress, when he was president, the republicans were seen as an out of control congress that was been obstructionist and carrying out too many investigations of obama. so the republicans a feeling that obama was using more and more executive orders to carry out his policies if he didn't have the votes to carry them out in congress. so each president faced with this kind of dead

focused, obama, on obeying the law, so i think as i mentioned earlier, i will just jump into the snowden example. what snowden revealed every program he talked about had been approved by the federal-- the foreign intelligence surveillance court, the fisa court. the obama administration-- and a lot of it was secret, and people didn't understand the extent of it, but obama was very careful about, you know, following these guidelines that had been set up in the '70s. and the problem was that he realized he did not want to get u.s. troops forever in iraq and afghanistan and so he embraced drone strikes as a way to protect the country. he would be vulnerable politically if there was another attack in the united states and then he felt deadlocked in terms of congress. when he was president the republicans were seen as an out of control congress seen as obstructionist carrying out too many investigating obama. ap if he didn't have the votes to carry in congress. each president faced with this kind of deadlock as we get more and more divided and more and more partisan. they are using executive o

thing on his forehead and wear around glasses and he'd look like harry potter mr mimic a blouse that snowden's e.l.c. harry potter is going to obviously in combat made me realize that there's an acute shortage of dark skinned superheroes so i wrote the song and made a really nice video to go along with it. a musician was with us we. have a 00000000000000000 advice to. come down to. i'm looking down at the way they look at the long haul that. i might as well like i don't like i don't like. a. lot of the last guy. was not a long time that fellow may be long gone sometimes selflessly don't like. much money on the side but i like his rights talk. it's a high i can remember when i was a teen i was into novena and that's when i started going to pot to do stuff and the other kids would say. why you're listening to that anderson be listening to black music i did and i liked it more and then it was the best music scene whatever that means hip hop and r. and b. album it was cool on them it is a c. in the end then all of a sudden yes a black person a part of the majority of i'm up on my own money and i m