penalties will be. is there a pretty good possibility that the trump organization's going to be shut down in new york state i think so. i mean, this judge as you said has made clear what his view of the evidence is, which is, you know, as he said in his opinion the other day that the evidence of fraud is clear, period, and, in fact, sanction the lawyers from making arguments that they had made previously that were in his words -- >> just bad faith. >> exactly. so he doesn't even think they're good faith arguments and he cites stark examples about the valuation and the apartment in new york city and the square footage, and so really what's left for him to decide is the penalty. now i think, you know, this judge -- i mean, trump of course, and his lawyers and his defenders are doing their thing of saying, this is a biased judge, but the judge didn't just come out and say, i don't like donald trump. he made very specific findings based on the evidence. >> when you overestimate the square footage in your residency, you live in by 19,000 square feet, i think it's safe to say, well, i've said that about my 21-th