the guys you see that are years and years -- like steve tanger, his father was in it.re the action is. literally it's a feel. i know that sounds weird. but it's a feel. >> talk about some of the existing ones that are popular. but are they building more? are they investing in building more malls? >> now they are. we were overstored for a long time. these guys are pros. they never overextended themselves. their balance sheets are really good. even when things got very tough, federal realty always gave you a dividend. >> here's what i learned about the harsh world of retailing -- >> overextender. >> when most big stores that are sophisticated when they go into a mall, they're going to put a provision into their lease that says they can leave or cut their rent if the mall goes beneath a certain occupancy rate. so let's say, two stores go out of business, the gap might come to you and see, we want a lease cut or we're out of here. it becomes a downward spiral. >> and that very issue happened to sears stores. >> i love this piece you're doing. it's very counterintuitive to