in decision points 2-chapter 2, ii, section d for david, subsection 2. that and chapter 3, iii, section b, subsection 2 differ in setting the majority threshold. majority vote threshold to determine whether a respondent violated the sunshine ordinance. 2, ii d2 states three votes would be required to declare that the respondent did not violate the ordinance. 3, iii b declares three votes are required to declare that the respondent did violate the ordinance. consistency this language is really always the better option. in decision point 2, ii e, and 3 iii c they do not address what would happen if a respondent failed to comply with an order from the commission or if the respondent's employing entity refused to pay a commission-imposed fine and, by the way,, i will add that i do not believe in fining a respondent's employing entity a good idea. if there is a fine, it should go to the respondent. >> david pillpa, again. to the extent it makes sense i think chapters and 3 should have parallel language where there are differences in burdens and what not, and

i think they really only apply in subsection b. i mean it's difficult to read 16-18 and imports 19 and 20 in, that the "order to support" language. it just gets a little circular, but i do agree that support should include actions or statements whether public or non-public. that are trying to urge or encourage a particular outcome. i think that is the point of "support." and i'm also trying to think through if you have got a committee under state law that you have a primarily formed committee. i know. right. that this is creating a new animal only under scintilla, but is requiring that animal to file reports. all right, i will just keep thinking about it. if we haven't figured out the definitions we should try to get that right. it's dangerous to have a definition here that is complicated and interconnected and say that the commission may further adopt presto clarify this. i think we should get it right and not rely on having to go back later and define by regwhere we already have a definition that is intended to be comprehensive.

2d3 and make that subsection 2d2 and flip it with what currently exists as 2d? >> i'm lost. >> commission renne's suggestion and to add email language to subsection 2c2. other amendments that were proposed? is there a motion to adopt decision point subject to those changes? >> so moved? >> second. >> all in favor? >> aye. >> opposed? hearing none, the motion passes. decision point 3 has do with chapter 3. any comments from the commissioners on decision point 3? >> i think we might want to make the same change that commissioner renne suggested earlier in 3b, reversing 2 and 3. >> agreed. >> b2 would become b3 and b3 would become b2. >> right. >> any other issues? i had a couple of questions. do we have any provision for the situation where something comes to us originally, we dismiss it, and then the same complaint goes to sunshine and comes through their process? >> we have not addressed that. >> okay. or visa versa, if it comes through sunshine and they don't like that and they come directly to us. it would be, i think, helpful to have language that would preve

that is not a comment on the subsection 37.9. point of order, point of information. could i have a comment, please? >> please continue your testimony and we'll address it

pilpa's concern was subsection 1 refers to qualification or election. in subsection 2, if we just leave it alone, only refers to declarations of candidates and those are potentially distinct actions or things, but i mean i don't have a strong feeling that we need to revisit that. >> okay. i don't either. >> that is to the commissions ' discretion. >> do the commissioners have any objection to decision point 2? is there a motion to adopt decision point 2 as amended? >> how is it amended? what is the language? it was as mr. shen just stated >> is there a motion to auto prove decision point 2 as amended. >> so moved. >> second. >> all in favor? >> aye. >> opposed? okay that passes. >> can i just suggest one minor clarification, if you don't want to do it, i can understand on line 6. where it says, "for city elective office, the committee shall continue to file." might you insert so it says, "the draft committee," so it's specific referring to the draft committee. >> i think it's clear. we used it six words previous? >> all right. >> i will make the offer f

oches, by here's the thing that gives us pause it's in business and professions code friction 12 subsections 22 and it says no pro vision of any ordinance enacted by a city, county or city and county that is in effect before the effective date of this chafter and it requires a licenses permit or other authorization for compensation will be enforced to an vivid certified as chapter or massage business or massage established establishment that employs or uses only persons solved to this chapter to provide massage. the way that language is drafted that certainly races the reasonable argument that the moment the establishment becomes certified the city is deprived of the authority to close the doors of this establishment and that is what need to happen in this case. >> this is a farrell new pro vision of the law and this has not been lit gated. >> are you associated in any way in this case? >>> zero. and as i stated. >> so you are saying that you are not prepare to go forward today? >>> i would try william anything but it's very very difficult the brief is extensive as you know. >> is your answe

that is not a comment on the subsection 37.9. point of order, point of information. could i have a comment, please? >> please continue your testimony and we'll address it afterwards. please continue. >> i was the only unpaid tenant rep in the tender loin sro mismanaged by the john stewart company episcopal community services and financed by trent ward. i said under oath, with a 42 1/2 million dollar budget to manage our building why don't we have an elevator 30 out of 36 months having to crawl up 5 1/2 stories to her unit. i went from having bronchitis to pulmonary disease and controlled diabetes to uncontrolled diabetes because of lack of an elevator. when i said i was getting retaliatory behavior by the john stewart staff, they said that's not our job. i am still paying for that. i found out 2 years after the staff they claim i owe them rent when my retaliatory eviction was not about nonpayment of rent. i am having problems getting housing because of this. i want property management companies to be included in subsection 37.9 and let's have some sun shine laws appl

the information described in this subsection with respect to a congressional district is, one, the number of medicare beneficiaries in such district, the number of medicaid beneficiaries in such district and the number of children's health insurance program beneficiaries in such district. two, at any time during the 10-year period beginning on the first day of the first fiscal year will, a, lose coverage under the medicare program under title 18 of the social security act, under a state plan or waiver under the medicaid program under title 19 of such act or under a state child health plan under the children's health insurance program under title 21 of such act. and as a result of the implementation of this act or b, experience an increase in premiums, cost sharing or other occupy costs as a result of the implementation of this act and two, the name and location of each hospital and nursing facility that would experience a reduction in payments under the medicare program, a state plan or waiver under the medicaid program or a state child health plan under the children's health insurance pr

urgency i would submit if it was a sense of urgency that the health department would have gone with subsections c which they would have the right do for a semi proceeding. now, on that point. i know there was a companion case that was going to be heard tonight and i understand it's been continued to february 20th is that correct? and it would be appropriate to continue this case, if the opportunity produced more evidence on this and i would need that extra time to submit one brief there are some errors here and i would like to correct them and not all of the attorneys swallow and there are some things that can be corrected easy lie by a breech and just go to the next hearing when the companion case is also scheduled to be held and i do want to do it pro confessionally just of hemmed overwhelmed doing it all in one day. >> there was another case a massage parlor operator and petitioner and the petitioner has a different attorney and the parties have mutually agreed to continue that case to a later date because they are close to settling and they need additional time to file the settlement the ca

if i could, for a moment, on your last comment on subsection i in section 4 chapter 4. in the event that there is a complaint that alleges both a sunshine violation and other improper activities of other sorts, i would hope that the staff-initiated complaint pursuant to the last section doesn't reveal any more or less than necessary for the processing of the sunshine-related complaint, because the regular complaint wouldn't be disclosed under current provisions in the event it's dismissed or doesn't get tie problem cause report, et cetera. i'm not sure that you want to reveal any more than you would otherwise, just because someone added a sunshine allegation to a complaint. >> where do we discuss disclosing the contents of the investigative? >> it doesn't, but where it says, "staff shall initiate a complaint of the alleged violations." then staff could be initiating the complaint, but they would have to import the allegation facts, whatever, from the complaint presumably filed by another. unless the original complaint was staff-initiated. if someone hypothetically compl

if i could, for a moment, on your last comment on subsection i in section 4 chapter 4. in the event that there is a complaint that alleges both a sunshine violation and other improper activities of other sorts, i would hope that the staff-initiated complaint pursuant to the last section doesn't reveal any more or less than necessary for the processing of the sunshine-related complaint, because the regular complaint wouldn't be disclosed under current provisions in the event it's dismissed or doesn't get tie problem cause report, et cetera.

i would also just point out subsection 4 does allow the ethics commission to propose regulations and i think the reason that we put that in there, we know that to the extent there is any potential ambiguity or loophole, people will try to go there. that is just how things go. >> this whole issue came up because of a loophole, because someone found a leap hole. >> right. so i think to some extent the ethics commission has the ability to address leap hole lope holes. the only downside if we don't define "support" at all there will be the chance of zero gay and lesbian as of what "support means." >> if we had "support" i would define it as public action or statement or actions encouraging or urging -- i will concede that i'm hoping that my hypothetic is ridiculous and it would be interpreted in the way that we have all think it should be. >> you just built them their loophole. >> i was thinking that election makes it more restrictive. >> that was my reaction when you said that. >> the big problem we had last time, the committees kept saying we are not a campaign. we don't have a candida

because close very clearly, very early became my attraction -- clothes became nmy attraction, a subsection. as more attractive to addressing people than addressing myself. it was not my objective desire, my own person. so i think that if i looked, the market inspire me. people different in it the streets or inspiring me. not what was fashion. maybe i was a finding something to were very inspiring. laurant. i like the ones that are different and have their own style. i like the ones that are different. they have style. i love them. so everyone that was different, i'd love it. i was not inspired by the jet set. at that time in 1960's, it was like very -- [unintelligible] for example, when i started to work, i am not all in the quatorze address. that is where some young girl -- among the young, i find more creativity, more interesting fashion in paris than in london. the sense of humor makes them to play more with the clothes and everything. in paris, i could see what was chic in what was not. one time i was working and was arriving at an industry job, and i was wearing boots. they looked at