new york times investigative reporter, suzanne craig, joins me now., my mind went immediately to you, predicting on this television program that you thought that the punishment here was going to be, did you say 300? i can't -- >> we'll go with that. but i think i did. >> you knew this was going to be a big price tag. but it does beg the question, is he even solvent? does he have this cash? >> does he have the cash is a great question. >> that is the question, because he -- >> it will just push him into bankruptcy. and cash situations are always really tricky. i cover public corporations for a long time. sometimes when they are in trouble they will say that they have 500 million, they have a billion, whatever it is. then the next day they will make it withdrawal, but they will -- it is just a snapshot in time, so we can see from the documents that were filed with the attorney general that there is a lot of paper that went, a lot of banking information, the key was headed into a difficult cash situation as he was entering the white house, and the reason

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suzanne craig, thank you very much for kicking us off this hour. coming up, folks, michael cohen joins us with his reactions to his old boss is extremely expensive day in court, and how he has something to, say all. you're watching the weekend on msnbc. watching the weekend on msnbc. symptom improvement, and reduced flare-ups. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. ask your doctor about breztri. my frequent heartburn had me taking antacid after antacid all day long but with prilosec otc just one pill a day blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours. for one and done heartburn relief, prilosec otc. one pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. we're travelling all across america,

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justice and intelligence correspondent, ken dilanian, "new york times" investigative reporter, suzanne craig, her 2016 reporting focused on donald trump's taxes and earned her a pulitzer prize. also with us, nbc news investigations correspondent, tom winter, and msnbc legal analyst, lisa rubin. everybody welcome. ken, what happened to the trial? why is it not on the schedule any longer in d.c.? >> it's bowing to the reality that this case has been on hold while we wait for the d.c. appeals court to rule on whether mr. trump is subject to any level of presidential immunity against the charges in this case. since it's widely assumed the appeals court will rule against the former president on the score, the next stop would be the supreme court and that's a process that could take several months. the march 4th date is no longer possible and they're now acknowledging that. the first of trump's four criminal trials may be held this spring in manhattan on the new york state charges of business fraud in connection with hush money payments during the 2016 election. that trial was set for march 25th,

and suzanne craig, an investigative reporter for the new york times and msnbc contributor. to have both of you with us. david, talk to us about this order from judge tanya chutkan to delay trump's federal election interference trial. there is concern out there that we have not heard from the -- ex presidents immunity claim yet, give us your thoughts on how we should -- worried we should be at this point? >> we should be worried about what the d.c. court of appeals is likely to say. you can almost cue the music from queen under pressure. everyone feels it when it comes to former president trump. he's a hot potato, no one wants to get burned. they are going to be very cautious before they hand down rulings related to him. with regard to the trial setting, keep in mind i've tried somewhere between 70 and 80 jury trials to a verdict. i've never had one go to trial on the first setting. i don't know if anybody who's ever had a case go to -- that setting was always likely to get moved. the question, is how far back is it going to be moved? because to listen to oral arguments in f

but let's talk about the myth of the guy who, as you just heard suzanne craig say, inherited more from likes to admit. is not a self made as he'd like to admit. it has had a lot of his wealth built on at least some fraud. the myth of donald trump that a lot of people follow is still not broken. for others, it is. what's the sense of it to you? do you have a sense that, you know, the emperor has no clothes? has the real donald trump been exposed now? >> i'd like to think -- i'd like to thank. so i'm not certain of that. absolutely not. because, you know, exposed to whom? to the normal people? intelligent people? thinking people? caring people? no, we do all this before. before he was even accused. but it exposed to his supporters, no, nothing is gonna change his supporters. two kinds of supporters, the one that's walking locks depp with maga guys. and wealthy people, who don't care what happens to that constitution as long as their taxes are low, and there's no regulation. there's no regulation of anything. >> i'm glad you said that, because that's where a lot of people stand right now.

suzanne craig, thank you as well. >>> up next, everybody, a moving tribute at a texas mega church, oneek after a shooter opened fire at a sunday service. >>> plus, more extreme weather headed for the west coast. the new system that could bring flooding and mudslides to an area already drenched with rain this year. you're watching "josÉ diaz-balart reports." we'll be right back. rts. we'll be right back. want luxury hair repair that doesn't cost $50? pantene's pro-vitamin formula repairs hair. as well as the leading luxury bonding treatment. for softness and resilience, without the price tag. if you know... you know it's pantene. known for following your dreams. known for keeping with tradition. known for discovering new places. no one wants to be known for cancer, but a treatment can be. keytruda is known to treat cancer. fda-approved for 16 types of cancer, including certain early-stage and advanced cancers. one of those cancers is early-stage non—small cell lung cancer. keytruda may be used with certain chemotherapies before surgery when you have early-stage lung cancer, which can be

that judge engoron decided, same new york civil fraud case, but also to our friend and colleague, suzanne craigand other financial information to show that his financial picture was not what he portrayed it to be to the american public. >> they also quote suzanne craig's investigative work, saying trump maintained a long history of attempting to skirt his debts, adding between 1990 and 2009 his company declared bankruptcy six times, and trump's motion should be denied because he has not established the requisite strong likelihood of success in reducing the jury award. is part of his argument, hold on, i'm going to try and get this jury award reduced and in the meantime, let's put this all on hold. and she's saying that's essentially, they're saying it's a joke. >> let me take this apart for you. in the ordinary course, in order to obtain a stay, one of the factors is you have to show you're likely to succeed on the merits of your argument. trump saying you should stay this indefinitely while i pursue post trial motions including a motion to reduce the judgment, unlikely to win, the case law is

joining me now suzanne craig, "the new york times" investigative reporter focused like a hawk on the taxes of donald trump, and voice vance professor at the university alabama school of law. thank you for being here tonight. sue, apart from the most trumpy perjury ever of course it comes back to donald trump's penthouse size. first -- first, i get -- if you could, help me understand allen weisselberg, who is so involved in this like, valuation of the trump penthouse, is on the phone to reporters, he's e-mailing them, he's really trying to say this thing is really worth a lot of money and then goes and stands under oath and says that was never my thing, i was never concerned about the valuation of that, it diminished his valuation portfolio. >> that's a hard one. maybe he had apnesia when he got up that day. i want to say to start off with shout out to forbes and involved in that reporting able to bring it immediately to light and also to "the times" tonight for my colleagues for this great story. it was masterfully done with a lot of different pieces about allen weisselberg, who we h

joining me now is suzanne craig, new york times investigative reporter, focused like a hawk on the finances and joyce vance, former district attorney and professor at the university of alabama school of law. it is great to see you both, thank you for being here tonight. apart from the most trumpy potential perjury ever, of course it comes back to donald trump penthouse size. first, if you could, how do you understand allen weisselberg, who is so involved in this valuation of the trump penthouse, is on the phone to reporters, emailing them, really trying, this thing is worth a lot of money, and then he goes and says under oath, that was never my thing. i wasn't really that concerned about the valuation of that. >> absolutely that is a hard one. maybe they had amnesia when they got up there that day. i just want to say, to start out with, shout out to the reporter involved in that reporting who was able to almost immediately bring it to light, and also to the times, from my colleagues for that, this great story, it was masterfully done with a lot -- allen weisselberg who we have not talked ab

and, suzanne craig, pulitzer prize-winning investigative reporter for the new york times. suzanne, you reminded me -- i left out of this well over 500 million dollar burden that donald trump is facing, he owes you some money, doesn't he? >> i almost forgot about it in all the hubbub today. but he owes the new york times legal fees for suing us over a story that ran in 2018 that won the pulitzer prize. our portion of the lawsuit was tossed out and he's been ordered to pay our legal fees and we're still waiting. >> which runs about $400,000? >> 400,000. >> and he hasn't paid. i don't get it? >> he's got other appeal it, put the money up -- >> so are you worried about the new york times and getting its $400,000 now that there is more than half a billion in front of him that they're trying to collect? >> there is a lot narrow, it's incredible. >> what does donald trump have to do to get the money he needs just to mop the appeal? >> we don't know quite yet because we don't know exactly how much cash she has on hand. that is a snapshot of any divot given day of how many could hav

we have another jam-packed hour of the weekend coming up, including the new york times is suzanne craigat michael cohen, okay. we have former january 6th investigator marcus childress as well as former assistant d.a. catherine christian. you can guess what we are going to talk about. stay with us. that means your priorities are ours too. our retirement tools and advice can help you leave a legacy for the ones you love. that's the value of ownership. when you purchase a pair of bombas socks, tees, or underwear, you also donate one to someone facing homelessness. one purchased equals one donated. 100 million donations and counting. visit bombas.com and get 20% off your first order. there's nothing better than a subway series footlong. except when you add a new footlong sidekick. like the ultimate bmt with the new footlong pretzel. nothing like a sidekick that steps up in crunch time. [laughing] not cool man. every epic footlong deserves the perfect sidekick. if you're living with hiv, imagine being good to go without daily hiv pills. good to go binge-watch. good to go out even later. with

here with us, msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin, and "new york times" investigative reporter suzanne craigovering the trial. okay, lisa, since you were watching all this unfold, what are you looking for in this ruling? >> i'm looking for a number, and i'm looking at the end of the decision for what kind of -- what lawyers call injunctive penalties the defendants are going to be subjected to. >> are you looking for a big number? >> i am, i'm expecting a big number in part because the experts that donald trump put on the stand were not all that successful in rebutting the testimony that the attorney general's office put on. he essentially had an expert in accounting who said that if there had been fraud in his financial statements they would have looked different. it would have screamed out to him. and then he was asked, well, did you ever review the work papers that underlay those financial statements, he never did. he never even asked the question. he was sort of useless as an expert, even though he was very well credentialed, and so i am looking today to see how big that number is and if

furiously checking her phone, and "new york times" investigative reporter and msnbc contributor, suzanne craig. i heard $170 million from my producer, is that correct? >> i don't have the opinion right now, but i'm looking at it on sue's phone. i believe there are multiple awards here. that $127 million that you just referenced. >> 186 million from the other charge that's been posted. >> keep telling me numbers in my ear, and i'll try to keep track of it. >> do you want to read it? >> it looks like there are a number of different, yes, we're up to $186,828,000. but then on top of that there's another $168 million. so we are talking about, i believe, now we're talking about over $300 million. in excess of $300 million because there are at least three increments, i'm going to read them to you. the first one is 168 -- >> trump cannot operate in new york for three years, the boys for two years. that's a major blow. >> and even allen weisselberg is one of the people against whom this disgorgement penalty, the new york attorney general said weisselberg should have to give over he has severance agree

the go-to expert on trump's finances, suzanne craig of the new york times, joins me right after the breakimes, t after the break. subway's tuna is off the hook! it's 100 percent wild-caught. this tuna is fishing for a compliment and i'm taking the bait. alright, i'm all punned out. i'm o-fish-ally finished. get it? try subway's tasty tuna today. it's hard to explain what this feels like. ♪♪ moving piles of earth. towing up to 4,000 lbs. cutting millions of blades of grass. nothing compares to experiencing it for yourself. you just have to get in the seat. ♪3, 4♪ ♪ nothing compares to experiencing it for yourself. ♪hey♪ ♪ ♪are you ready for me♪ ♪are you ready♪ ♪are you ready♪ i work hard, and i want my money to work hard too. so, i use my freedom unlimited card. earning on my favorite soup. aaaaaah. got it. earning on that éclair. don't touch it, don't touch it yet. let me get the big one. nope. -this one? -nope. -this one? -yes. no. what? the big one. they're all the same size. wait! lemme get 'em all. i'm gonna get 'em all! earn big with chase freedom unlimited. how do you cashback? chas

and susanne craig, pulitzer prize-winning investigative reporter for the new york times. suzanne, you reminded me of another -- i left out of this, well over 500 million dollar burden -- >> i almost forgot about, it but he owes the new york times legal fees for suing -- 2008 -- our portion of the lawsuit was tossed out and he's been ordered to pay early go face. we are still waiting. >> which ran about $400,000. >> yes. >> he hasn't paid. i don't get. it >> he's got to either appeal, it put the money up -- >> are you worried about the new york times getting its $400,000 now there is more than half a billion -- >> there is a lot, isn't there, now, it's incredible. >> what does donald trump have to do to get the money he needs trust to mount the appeal? >> we don't know quite yet because we don't know exactly how much cash he has on hand. that's a snapshot of any given day and how much he could. have he's claimed he has $400 million. that was lost. or he could have more or less. now but we do know that during his presidency -- there was lots of as it tails. as he entered the white