and tavistock worrying.c is then being going along with ideology agenda. with this ideology agenda. >> i think the mistake that places tavistock places like the tavistock clinic have is that they didn't have made is that they didn't have made is that they didn't have enough resource to properly assess some these young assess some of these young people, there's no people, you know, there's no doubt there are examples doubt that there are examples where route where the appropriate route wasn't problem wasn't taken. but the problem i have is that a lot of people that oppose that clinic are opposed. clinic don't opposed. the clinic don't advocate for more counsellors to be able to deal with these young people. you don't those people. so you don't make those mistakes. also say mistakes. and i would also say that when you talk about parental influence , i think parental influence, i think it is far more certainly is far more common, certainly historically, that parents would have discouraging have been discouragin

you know, there was a joke know, there was a dark joke amongst tavistock staff soon there will be noeft . we've read the case of sonia appleby , the safeguarding lead, appleby, the safeguarding lead, who said the malign influence of mermaids was leading to children being tracked to make being fast tracked to make irreversible medical decisions . irreversible medical decisions. so i don't think i really know the answer to question , the answer to your question, andrew, we're all andrew, because we're all looking thing. it's looking at the same thing. it's almost they're blinded by almost like they're blinded by stonewall briefing sheets because hear continuation of because i hear a continuation of no tactics. won't no debate tactics. they won't brook criticism of what is brook any criticism of what is increasingly shown to be increasingly being shown to be a global medical scandal. >> but is this part of a broader problem in our culture, which is now all sorts of political differences ideological differences and ideological differences seem to be interpreted matter of good interpreted

the track to change the tavistock track to change their the tavistock track to change the they closing should do it. mean, who believe that you shoild do it. mean, who believe that you shoi didn't do it. mean, who believe that you shoi didn't mean do it. mean, who believe that you shoi didn't mean the it. mean, who believe that you shoi didn't mean the people who >> i didn't mean the people who are people who say are doing it, the people who say it's and it's okay mindset. and so there's perverse about there's something perverse about about and the reason that about that. and the reason that we generally don't do that is that children are bad decision makers . that's why we don't let makers. that's why we don't let them vote. that's why we don't let them choose their own bedtimes. why we bedtimes. and that's why we don't own don't let them choose their own diets, i'm diets, more or less. so i'm actually open to actually i'm quite open to whether or not someone wants to try what children try and control what children access online on the basic principle a lot principle that we control a

increased tavistock, and it's increased over.ause of the direct targeting of the youngest children by by activists. so we have around 60 picture books now for little children for the earliest ages, three plus and of course in primary schools now. it's also promoted the idea of gender identity . so parents now are in identity. so parents now are in a position where they think their child has a problem, when actually it's just a normal part of childhood. develop isn't now the nhs trust that runs this service? >> they have said that no three year olds would have received treatment, but there may have been sort of one off discussion . been sort of one off discussion. concerns about their psychological state with the parent and the carers to provide some sort of support and advice. is your concern that that would have included an affirmation that they are, in fact born in the wrong body ? the wrong body? >> well, we know that the tavistock went more and more towards a gender affirmative approach , so we don't actually approach, so we

that drives investigations on a programme, and one might mention the hannah barnes story and the tavistockexample. which was brilliant. and indeed, on the day we announced the changes, there was a really good investigation on newsnight about the culture in the nhs and how it affects patient care. the thing is, we want that sort of investigation to be available to the millions of people who come to us all day, whether whether it's on radio, television or online. so if you look at investigations that we've done away from newsnight, like, for example, whether members of the establishment in the uae are profiting in the oil market from hosting cop or whether it's sexual abuse allegations in abercrombie and fitch, they're done from the middle of bbc news and they're spread through all of our outputs — our podcasts, our linear programmes, ourwebsite. they reach far more people. and in the end, ourjob is to get thatjournalism to the maximum range of audiences we can. former bbc news executive roger mosey was also on newsnight last week, and he said the bbc should be cutting some of the fluff from

the tavistock.de of this question, i suspect. >> well, of course i am. absolutely >> why can't they transition at the age of two? >> uh, so, uh, children under five referred to nhs transition clinic and this is the tavistock and portman, which will close next year. and it had no lower age limit for referrals. so 382 children aged 16, under six and under have been sent to the gender identity development service. >> over the past decade. >> over the past decade. >> and on my show, trigonometry , >> and on my show, trigonometry, we interviewed marcus evans , who we interviewed marcus evans, who was the former head of nursing , was the former head of nursing, and what he actually said was when he was working there, because he was one of the original whistleblowers as well. one of the reasons why he got really worried and actually had to go public with his concerns about the tavistock and portman was because he believed that it was because he believed that it was less to do with patient care and far more

you know, there was a joke know, there was a dark joke amongst tavistock staff soon there will be no, the safeguarding lead, appleby, the safeguarding lead, who said the malign influence of mermaids was leading to children being tracked to make being fast tracked to make irreversible medical decisions . irreversible medical decisions. so i don't think i really know the answer to question , the answer to your question, andrew, we're all andrew, because we're all looking thing. it's looking at the same thing. it's almost they're blinded by almost like they're blinded by stonewall briefing sheets because hear continuation of because i hear a continuation of no tactics. won't no debate tactics. they won't brook criticism of what is brook any criticism of what is increasingly shown to be increasingly being shown to be a global medical scandal. >> but is this part of a broader problem in our culture, which is now all sorts of political differences ideological differences and ideological differences seem to be interpreted matter of good interpreted as a matter of good versus stonewall come

that's group to the tavistock. that's my understanding. so that's gonna that's under gonna stop.der the new because they're not new people because they're not right head. right in the head. >> is an argument to >> well, there is an argument to suggest there is an suggest pays for it. there is an argument suggest that a lot argument to suggest that a lot of these groups initially came out gay movement, out of the gay rights movement, which people now which i think most people now really would agree was was a good thing. right and then once they'd those things, good thing. right and then once they'then those things, good thing. right and then once they'then felt those things, good thing. right and then once they'then felt as hose things, good thing. right and then once they'then felt as thoughings, good thing. right and then once they'then felt as though that good thing. right and then once they'had| felt as though that good thing. right and then once they'had more as though that good thing. right and then once they'had more to though that good thing. right and then once they'had m

the point about tavistock.n were something were pushed into doing something they ready for or and they weren't ready for or and they weren't ready for or and the whole thing, mean , when it the whole thing, i mean, when it comes something like an comes to something like this, an awful to comes to something like this, an awful into to comes to something like this, an awful into play. to comes to something like this, an awful into play. everything to come into play. everything should be a gradual process. but nigel, do you know that when they were trying to when there were certain children that wanted to change their sex and change their gender, they were saying even had saying that if you even had a conversation about not doing it and that it might be wrong, conversation about not doing it and that it might be wrong , they and that it might be wrong, they were calling it conversion therapy in the way that if, you know, back in the day when if someone was gay, they'd try to put electric electrocute them. >> would

okay, let's rush to the tavistock clinic. >> that's what they did >> and that's what they did here. 70ents, 70 here. and 70 parents, 70 parents. a three year and four year obviously, we're year olds. obviously, we're influenced year olds. obviously, we're influen them and when. and now around them and when. and now the and seen these the question and i've seen these videos from america where you see they're just men , see these, they're just men, parents. and for them you could see it's like a lifestyle choice for have would for them. and they have i would argue they've pushed these children down this path and children into down this path and then it becomes medicalisation . then it becomes medicalisation. and the tragedy is when you see these confused kids and they become teenagers and they've essentially they're medicalized for are infertile. for life. they are infertile. they are unable to have any kind of healthy sexual , uh, life. and of healthy sexual, uh, life. and it's a tragedy. and i think that it's a tragedy. and i think that it absolutely comes from parents and being groome

were referred to the tavistock's controversial gender clinic.hildren this young to be referred for those sorts . with war sorts of consultations. with war raging in the middle east, ukraine has been somewhat forgotten about in recent months. there have been months. but there have been important developments there over christmas period, the over the christmas period, the ukrainians sunk ukrainians have sunk a key russian warship in the black sea, russians have taken sea, and the russians have taken a town in the donbas region . a town in the donbas region. we'll be getting the latest and we're in the middle of a shoplifting epidemic. that's according to a new analysis showing that over 200,000 cases went the year to went unsolved in the year to july. i will speaking to a july. i will be speaking to a former metropol police detective, inspector , who detective, chief inspector, who now runs his own security firm , now runs his own security firm, who's privately prosecuted hundreds of shoplifters. what does he think is behind this epidemic? state o

so i have kind of hit you with a lot of tavistock -- tough stuff. >> my christmas message is a lot ofg out on the panic saying, what am i supposed to do? what happens when i die? i say look at the christ in the major. that is a good place to start to get those answers. >> rachel: that is a beautiful message. merry christmas, father. >> thank you, rachel. merry christmas. >> rachel: swatting, it is a dangerous prank and even members of congress are not safe. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> rachel: radical leftists are targeting republican lawmakers with a new wave of swatting attacks on christmas. just to make sure that the kids are home, too. to congresswoman marjorie taylor greene and near, congressman brandon williams both republicans were both on the receiving end of the bogus emergency calls that could have put their lives at risk. for those who don't know, swatting is when someone makes a false report of a major often violent crime, such as an active kidnapping or a murder suicide. and the hopes of sending armed law enforcement officers to a target purpose homes possibly creating a deadly situation i

and the tavistock. the tavistock is essentially activist group. essentially an activist group. i would argue , looking to push would argue, looking to push children. they would deny this looking to push children in a certain direction. >> they would deny that. yeah. and for rightly so. >> because not necessarily rightly >> because not necessarily rigithere's been massive, massive >> there's been massive, massive controversy it. controversy about it. >> i think a of >> i think there's a lot of people trapped all of people who get trapped in all of this ideology, especially this gender ideology, especially children who just confused this gender ideology, especially ch going who just confused this gender ideology, especially ch going through just confused this gender ideology, especially ch going through pubertyfused this gender ideology, especially ch going through puberty ored or going through puberty or something like that. and in the end, being end, they end up being medicalized in this procedure, some that just some of those clips that we just saw online. some of those clips

and a writer originally from tavistock, ontario, canada... and now here is the host of "jeopardy!"se] thank you, johnny. welcome back to the quarterfinals of this round of "jeopardy!" champions wildcard. at this point, only three spots remain in the semifinals, and one of them is going to go to scott, yungsheng, or robin in just under a half an hour's time. welcome back, champs. good luck. let's show you and the home audience what categories await you in the jeopardy! round. first up... then we have... these responses will begin with the letter "t." then we have... and finally... all responses will be words

and that's why the tavistock centre has been proved to be incredibly dangerous in and of itself. >> wasut affirmation, absolutely incorrect . incorrect. >> if you just push children off an with other issues . an with other issues. >> um, in a lot of autistic children are going down this route as a proportion. if you push them down a route, it's very dangerous for them. and you have seen quite a lot of detransitioners who realise that they took a route because it was put to them that it was what they should do, you know, not because it's what they needed to do or wanted to do still only make up 1% all. make up 1% of all. >> all the people that go through transition, which is still incredibly, incredibly small. i agree small. however i would agree with to with you that we need to obviously approach on obviously approach everything on a case basis, and a case by case basis, and everybody deserves to heard everybody deserves to get heard as individual rather than all as an individual rather than all tarred with exactly the same brush. and i agree that there could be other things that need t

this line by the tavistock clinic, thankfully has now clinic, which thankfully has now closed.s was trying to push children down this line, potentially gay children, potentially gay children, potentially just children who were it very difficult were finding it very difficult to puberty , puberty to cope with puberty, puberty and didn't want their bodies to change. and it's a massive concern. and cammie maddox is absolutely right to highlight it. it's not homophobic. it's not bigoted. children who are uncertain about their bodies or the way their bodies are changing or how they feel need time to be able to think these things through. they need proper professional help and counselling. need to counselling. they do not need to be be on be rushed, to be put on to hormones and dramatic hormones and have dramatic surgery which they can't undo and is going to devastate and which is going to devastate the lives . the rest of their lives. >> yes, because peter, as suzanne then, as kemi suzanne just said, then, as kemi badenoch would obviously badenoch would argue, obviously she's speak

. >> and of course we've seen the problems with that with the tavistock clinic in the uk, which courseing to be closed any moment now. yeah, because cass review found because as the cass review found , this is actually a , this is this is actually a danger to gender non—conforming kids. now, what is kids. absolutely. now, what is it about wales? we've had a lot of pushback in england against gender ideology gender identity, ideology in wales. seems to be completely wales. it seems to be completely embedded . embedded. >> why there is a raft of groups that are trying to talk to the welsh government and a lot not being listened to. right. and those groups include lgb alliance . comfrey, maregwede alliance. comfrey, maregwede cumbrae, who are documenting the impact of this on the ground in schools. so there are reports of boys sharing showers with girls and boys, sharing sleeping accommodation with girls and kids being socially transitioned without their parents knowledge . without their parents knowledge. all this is going on. that's document by mark cameron. >> now this is this is very

, the more likely they are to be seen at the tavistock in time to get puberty blockers , which mermaids actually block the sex hormones that are critical for that stage of growth in puberty , that affect growth in puberty, that affect those sex hormones at puberty, affect every part of the body, not just the secondary sex characteristics. so if you if you're giving advice to parents, like get your kid on the on the waiting list as soon as as early as possible, then you're setting that pathway. you're you know, psychologically, those parents are set on that pathway. and will be communicating that to the child that the child is right in their belief and their feelings. and that the journey, the gender journey as they call it, is on its way. as soon as you tell that first lie, it sets in motion that progression on towards that medical pathway . towards that medical pathway. and stephanie needs . and stephanie needs. >> stephanie, we saw last week new guidance , a new framework new guidance, a new framework was brought in by the government. kemi badenoch speaking very strongly about protect

that's why they've tavistock. they've closed the tavistock. >> not closed yet, >> well, it's not closed before time. >> close. and it's >> it's going to close. and it's because very young, because children, very young, teenage children were being given these drugs. and i think it's important there it's really important that there is giving them until is a ban on giving them until they're after 18. quite right. as said, when they're after 18. quite right. as 15, said, when they're after 18. quite right. as 15, think d, when they're after 18. quite right. as 15, think one hen they're after 18. quite right. as 15, think one thing, you're15, you think one thing, when you think when you're 16, you think another. when you're16, you think another. 80. keira another. when you're 80. keira bell the perfect example. you bell is the perfect example. you know, took these puberty know, she took all these puberty blockers and, know, she blockers and, you know, she now says life been damaged says her life has been damaged forever. breasts. she forever. she has no breasts. she has a very voice. she has

but also, the tavistock clinic.nd of other places, and lots of other places, is that comes along who's that a child comes along who's far too young to understand the implications even implications of what even socially transitioning means. never medical transitioning never mind medical transitioning comes along and says, i'm sally, i to sam whatever, i want to be sam or whatever, and sort of clamours and everybody sort of clamours to say, okay, how can we facilitate and you know , facilitate that? and you know, that's, of quite that's, that's a sort of quite a terrifying prospect when you take into account people like keira who's an incredibly keira bell, who's an incredibly brave young woman who has been through a horrendous ordeal and been extremely mistreated and has come forward and hats off to kemi badenoch for being one of the few ministers who will talk to like keira bell to people like keira bell because it's this someone because it's and this is someone who had believed they were transgender. >> and then sh

. >> it's more that, uh , the way >> it's more that, uh, the way it's being done with the tavistock andd pushed upon people. yes. and, you know , upon people. yes. and, you know, there are people some people do have issues here and they should be looked after, but not the other way around. it's not let's force these issues onto people . force these issues onto people. yeah, it's completely inverse to the way it should be. >> it's very difficult for teachers as well. i mean, i've got a teacher friend who contacted me to say that he was informed there was one, a child informed there was one, a child in his class who to be in his class who wanted to be known of the opposite known by a name of the opposite sex, and he was told to refer to her by the chosen name. but when writing or writing to the parents or filling reports the filling out reports to use the old in other words, to lie old name in other words, to lie to parents. so. so, you to the parents. so. so, you know, guidance is well overdue because a lot of schools just don't know what they're doing in this situation. should this situ

under this scheme at the tavistock, should we talk about clare balding made what clare balding who'squality , which has left women inequality, which has left women underrepresented in the middle ranks broadcastingjobs. ranks of broadcasting jobs. >> russell, can i just turn this around second? imagine around for a second? imagine if i said that was other way i said that it was the other way round, that there were too many women broadcasting , round, that there were too many women broadcasting, and round, that there were too many women broadcasting , and those women in broadcasting, and those that in it are talentless that are in it are talentless and are paid too much. can you imagine how quickly? >> it's not what said . >> well, it's not what she said. >> well, it's not what she said. >> talentless actually what >> talentless is actually what she exactly what she says. no, it's exactly what she says. no, it's exactly what she no, no, it's more nuanced. >> she has said average >> she has said they're average and too and they're effectively paid too much. you much. let me just give yo

the tavistock centre has been closed down because that an down because that was an aberration. started absolutely horrendous. that is a form of child abuse. and now the evidence is there to support the fact that that is a wrong thing to do. and there's the absolute horrible, heart wrenching stories of people who did transition and have now. d transitioned and they are left in an absolute limbo and it's doctors and big pharma that have enabled that. and number pamby social workers and lawyers and everyone else is wanting to jump on the bandwagon , need to feel on the bandwagon, need to feel that they can speak up about it if they if they do feel trapped because just because they don't talk about it doesn't mean they don't feel that they are pip. there's lots of things that go on, this you need the stark on, but this you need the stark reality is there's very, very few people in this world, in this country, this city, who this country, in this city, who actually feel trapped in the wrong body. there's too many of the minority that actually will speak out about this. and the fact that we

that drives investigations on a programme, and one might mention the hannah barnes story and the tavistockinterview and i saw michael couric�*s interview on the programme last week. i think if you had representatives of other parts of the bbc sitting with me today, whether it's daytime or entertainment or comedy or drama or sport or whatever, they would also... we've tightened our belts, too, over the years. there's very little original programming in parts of daytime, now, for example, on bbc two, and other parts of the bbc have taken some very difficult decisions. these decisions are not easy. the focus on the shift to digital, which the bbc is making a big thing of, there is a concern that you risk losing a very big core and a loyal audience who watch news on tv and they listen to the radio. what do you say to them who say, "look, we're not interested in digital." why do you risk throwing them away? you're totally right. that core audience is so important to us. if you look at the numbers of people who are watching, for example, the big programmes on bbc one live — so the figures are in