we're joined here in flagstaff, arizona by the groups energy director, taylor mckinnon.me to democracy now! we have heard of tar sands in alberta, canada. can you explain what is going on in utah? vast utah, we have deposits of oil shale and tar sands, up to 20 billion barrels worth of oil in the tar sands deposits. the united states geological survey estimates up to one trillion barrels of developable oil in the oil shale. these are unconventional fuels. melteded to be mined, before their turn into a liquid hydrocarbon. the energy investment on the front end of their development far exceeds that of conventional oil and as a result, the resulting carbon emissions and developing these fuels also far exceeds that of conventional oil. when we are facing climate change and the ip cc saying we have a carbon budget within which to work in coming decades, this is the exact wrong policy direction from a matter of energy and climate. >> differed so much about tar sands in alberta. why do we hear so little about hat is going on in utah? eastern talking about utah in western colora