[laughter] >> hi, i'm with the thaddeus stevens society. i appreciate your enthusiasm in this lecture. and i noticed early on you had a picture of a great commoner with darth vader. can you expand upon that image and talk about what i see as a propaganda effort against him up through the 1960's and whether or not you think there is hope for resurrecting him as one of our great heroes? >> that is a very good question. and, in fact, you all know that the street down there is named after thaddeus stevens. >> he also helped to found this college. >> he also helped to found this college. the only great person to ever come out of lancaster pennsylvania in the 19th century , -- i might add that as were james buchanan also lived. as i have said often in my class, james buchanan declare that if he came back in another life, he would like to come back as a frog sitting by a quiet mill pond where nothing happened, which shows he doesn't understand trans migration. you have to be good in this life to come back as a higher form of being. sorry, i had to

i think it is progress that thaddeus stevens in that movie, the fellow you see there in his chestnut colored wig, is not being played by lionel barrymore as a warped frustrated old man in a wheelchair as he was in the 1942 movie, a kind of post war mr. potter. though i confess a lot of me wishes keenly that the 1942 movie he had been able to induce andrew johnson to jump off a bridge or that a guardian angel in the form of frederick douglas would have appeared to teach johnson his ways. tommy lee jones is a great step forward. i agree on that. even with his avuncular style closely resembling that of douglas mcarthur in a movie released in the same year and even though he takes a central role than the real stevens would have claimed for himself. but radical sheikh or radical republican sheikh has the same drawback as the predecessor, it meets out merit and blame based on what we have become, not on what americans saw in the context of what they had experienced. and in fact it seems to me that there are problems with that. the problems are not that i oppose what reconstruction was, the

thaddeus stevens. you'll notice i brought him in twice, first as darth vader and the second as the knight fighting the dragon. the good guy and bad guy view of him. thaddeus stevens because of his belief in equality and because of having a non-whitehousekeeper lydia smith who was reputed to be his mistress by democratic slanderers and the like was seen as the epitome of evil all the way up through the dunning school and beyond, a vicious, ferocious, fanatic fueled with hatred and resentment. let me tell you several basic facts. thaddeus stevens well before slavery became an issue on which pennsylvanians cares at all, at least in terms of the slave, was defending fugitive slaves and taking no fee. if i'm mott mistaken in the 1838 constitutional convention when pennsylvania decided to take the right of voting away from blacks who until then had that right, there was only one member who refused to sign that constitution and that was thaddeus stevens. the father of the public school system of pennsylvania,

thaddeus stevens. you'll notice i brought him in twice, first as darth vader and the second as the knight fighting the dragon. the good guy and bad guy view of him. i take the good guy view of him. thaddeus stevens because of his belief in equality and because of having a non-whitehousekeeper lydia smith who was reputed to be his mistress by democratic slanderers and the like was seen as the epitome of evil all the way up through the dunning school and beyond, a vicious, ferocious, fanatic fueled with hatred and resentment. let me tell you several basic facts. thaddeus stevens well before

he first was elected to congress by taking on the dowdy thaddeus stevens who everybody was afraid ofting him and i don't know exactly what his relationship with sumner was but blaine was not a radical republican. he wasn't -- he was a moderate in that regard he still wanted to build the republican party in the south and that's why he was so strongly for suffrage for the freed slaves and that part of reconstruction but he was not for tremendous punishment for the south that some of the radicals were. >> our callers are here for our three guests as we talk about the life and times of james g. blaine, unsuccessful nominee for in the the 1884 election and grover cleveland was the successful candidate but we believe he had an outside influence -- outsized influence on american history and we're learning more about that tonight. woodland hills, california, you are on the air. hello, eric. >> caller: hello, how are you? continuing on about james g. blaine's personalty, i was wondering, he's certainly a larger-than-life character. do you see him embodied in any current politician? thank you.

these were radicals in the house like thaddeus stevens who was chairman of the house ways and means committee and a very powerful leader. also people like henry winter-davis, elihu washburne. in the senate, people like charles sumner and benjamin wade. and they really drove the agenda and pushed the lincoln administration to not only prosecute the war more vigorously but also to have a reconstruction after the war that was one that was not so lenient toward southern states and was going to ensure that political rights were extended to african-americans. >> well, so the war ends in 1865, but how do you get from 1865 to the first african-american members of congress? because it's not -- doesn't happen right that day. >> doesn't happen right away, but the -- the role of radicals, if anything, becomes even more assertive after the end of the war. after lincoln's assassinated president johnson takes over and has an even more lenient view than lincoln of how the southern states are going to be readmitted and he's pushed constantly by the radical republicans. and in a very short period of time, roug

i'm curious about blaine's relation with thaddeus stevens and charles sumner, both radical republicansefore and during and after the civil war. the relation with sumner might be particularly interesting since sumner was chair. senate foreign relations committee. >> thanks so much. is that something you can take us through? >> well, i can take a shot, particularly thaldus stevens because blaine made a name for himself when he was first elected to congress by taking on the doughty thaddeus stevens who everybody was afraid of and contradicting him. and i don't know exactly what his relationship with sumner was, but blaine was not a radical republican. he wasn't. he was a moderate in that regard. he still wanted to build the republican party in the south and that's why he was so strongly for suffrage for the -- for the -- for the slaves and for that part of reconstruction, but he was not for, you know, tremendous punishment for the south that some of the radicals were. >> our callers are here for our three guests as we talk about the life and times of james g. blaine. unsuccessful nominee