and the bush environmental policy. so i mentioned earlier that's theially in the beginning, first bush administration i was concerned about reproductive policy. to start an was abstinence only sex education. which works really great until a dozen. were pretty used to getting criticism. it's a really difficult's time to find anything against the administration. it was a very difficult time to do anything they criticized what the administration did. notlleagues that's necessarily revert with their jobs but they got the feeling that they did do something they criticized bush for alice the that their editor would not like it. there's a really interesting time here. i was indicated. i never had anyone tell me like other could not do. it was a question of the intensity of the reactions that i had to cartoons through e-mails or letters or whatever. this one referred back to the risk era of the 1950's where you were connected in any way communism you are considered anti-american. so i thought that's kind of what we're going thr

and the bush environmental policy. i mentioned earlier initially , in the first bush administration i was concerned about reproductive policies. one of the concerns i had was to start an abstinence only sex ed ucation, which works great until it doesn't. [laughter] 9/11.e had of course, that changed a lot of things. difficult. we are pretty used to getting criticism. it was a really difficult time to criticize anything against the administration. theire americans, tolerance level at that was not very high. people were shocked by what had happened. time to dofficult anything that criticized anything the bush administration did. i had colleagues that not necessarily were threatened with their jobs, but they got the feeling that if they didn't do something that criticized bush for a policy, that their editor would not like it. it was a really interesting time to speak to your colleagues. at that point i was a freelancer . i was on my own, i was syndicated. i never had anyone try to tell me what i could or could not do. it

so, i mentioned earlier that initially in the beginning of the bush, the first bush administration i s concerned about reproductive policies and one of the policies they had was to start an abstinence only act education, which weren't really great until it doesn't. [laughter] >> then we had 911 and, of course, that changed a lot of things. in the editorial cartooning community-- community it was difficult to read we are used to getting criticism, but it was a really difficult time to criticize anything of the ministration because americans, their tolerance level at that point was not high. people were shocked by what had happened and it just was a very difficult time to doti anything that criticized what the ministration did. i had colleagues that not necessarily were threatened with their jobs, but they got the feelingjo that if they did do te something that criticized bush or a policy that their editorlie wouldn't like it.e. so, it was really interesting time to speak to your colleagues. at that point i was a freelance. and was on my own if you're always, but i never had anyone try

demoralizing for the bush campaign staff. i think in a sort of parallel universe in which things were going better for jeb bush, even headlines like that about those drastic cuts inside the bush campaign operation, they could have been spun as something positive about how thrifty jeb bush was being and how lean and mean his operation was and the agility with which he could manage the hard-won money that his donors were entrusting to his campaign. but none of that happened. instead, the payroll cuts led to questions like -- and headlines like these. "can jeb stop the implosion?" "jeb bush expresses despair." and politico.com, this rather devastating one in the foreground here, "bush family gathers in texas to rescue jeb." it also led to some unkind criticism on the campaign trail as to why exactly governor bush was going out of the way to do this event with his brother and his dad and his mom at this particularly difficult point in his campaign. >> think of this. here's a guy, here's a guy wants to run our country, and he can't

just as the bush family and the jeb bush campaign and the republican establishment more broadly is banking president george w. bush being sufficiently political rehabilitated in the public eye, so much so he could potentially be a plus and not a minus for his brother's presidential campaign. just as that is happening, one of the great unresolved scandals of george w. bush's public life has just been acted out on film by robert redford, kate bland chet, elisabeth moss, topher grace, should i go on? and they big movie is freaking out not just the players involved in that old scandal to the point where one broadcast network is turning down millions of dollars. they don't watch the ads for that movie on their air. it's not just freaking people out connected to the scandal, but freaking people out who have anything to do with this story. here it goes. one of the interesting and new things about the last presidential race we had in 2012 is it was the first election since vietnam in which neither major party candidate had any military service at all, neither barack obama nor mitt romney ever serv

the polls aren't real. if they were bush's numbers, we would be assuming who is the next candidate pick. it's i done. >> that's not going to help jeb bush. the fact he said that business i can take my ball and go home. unfortunately plays into the whole image of him. like chris christie shouting in the quiet car which played into chris christie's problem. this is the same thing. >> one version was the conductor came by checking the ticket, he pointed out this is the quiet car. the other claim somebody went to the guy. i had problems with the quiet car myself. >> me, too. i admit it. >> anyway, i do love the quiet car when i'm trying to get work done. i like it then. >> i'm guilty. >> you and i have the most obvious supply of free-flowing guilt that ever existed. thank you howard fineman and gene robinson who is guilt-free. >> that's right. >> ben carson is surging ahead of donald trump right now in iowa. donald trump is making it clear he does not like losing. round table will be here next. >>> we have a breaking story. donald

rather the bush campaign. ery desire and need to pull marco rubio down to stay in this race, and the issues that were raised in the memo that was leaked to the press are actually important issues. so i think the bush campaign right now is on its heels, it's trying to survive, and this is a very important way of doing it, and i wouldn't count them out just yet. obviously, people say the campaign's on life support, but there's a really good chance they could survive to iowa, and if they do, it's anyone's game. john mccain, people said he was dying, too, and they were able to pull it out. >> i don't know whose phone is ringing, but that's very true. guys, when you look at the -- and the amount of money jeb bush has, he still has a ton of money, what's interesting to me, ben, this memo that came out also shows the bush camp doesn't expect to win iowa, their focus is new hampshire and south carolina. is it smart to tell people that? >> yeah, well, look, this is a smart political muay to put out this memo. it's also

bush, was partly to blame for the 9/11 attacks. bush's message trump is an actor playing the role of a candidate running for president. and he said he would not want trump to have access to the nuclear code. >> what are you objecting to about mr. trump's remarks about 9/11 and your brother? >> look, my brother responded to a crisis, and he did it as you would hope a president would do. he united the country, he organized our country and he kept is safe. and there's no denying that. the great majority of americans believe that. i don't know why he keeps bringing this up. it doesn't show that he's a serious person as it relates to being commander in chief and being the architect of a foreign policy. across the spectrum of foreign policy mr. trump talks about things as though he's still on "the "the apprentice." talking about isis should take out assad, and then russia should take out isis. we're under grave threats again. and i think we need a president with a steady hand. >> to play devil's advocate, do you think it's at all possible

bush who put maliki in office in the first place, so does bush bear the blame?larke made a point earlier on in which he tells us what he thinks. >> if it were not for the american invasion of iraq and the subsequent disbanding of the iraqi army by the united states, there would be no isis. isis is a direct outgrowth of the american invasion. >> clark's former colleague douglas feith sticks to his guns. >> if today you knew what we know about what happened in iraq, would you going back have invaded iraq? what's your answer? >> i think that the only meaningful way to approach that is to ask whether president bush, knowing what he knew at the time, made the right decision, and i think he did. >> tony blair, when he was prime minister of the united kingdom, was bush's most public partner on the iraq war. >> of course you can't say that those of us who removed saddam in 2003 bear no responsibility for the situation in 2015. >> but blair still wonders what was the alternative. >> we have tried intervention and putting down troops in iraq. we've tried intervention with

but "the new york times" reports that even bush 91 is openly irritated by the front-runner. bush's performance during wednesday's republican debate could likely serve as a critical turning point for his ailing campaign. joining me live from houston, texas, now is julie bikeo wits, national political reporter for the associated press. a lot of donors who put up a lot of money, have watched as the bush super pac have put a lot of money into the earl states and if you look at the polls, they have gotten nothing for their investment. with what they've heard in the last two days from jeb, from his brother, from the campaign brass, are they leaving this event reassured, or are they just as nervous as when they came in? >> well, what we're hearing so far from donors is that they are sticking with him. it's definitely reality check time for these top donors. these are some of the most faithful bush donors. they've given to 41, they've given to 43. they're definitely backing jeb all the way. but they have to be looking at these poll numbers the way that we are and saying, what's going

hear the bush name area -- bush name. bush has been up massively on this show. even though they have spent twice as much as hillary, they are getting less than half the impact in terms of advertising. remains forth in iowa and new hampshire. we have not seen movement there. have not had a lot of incredible polls in iowa and new hampshire. i think we will see more coming out of the next week. it will be interesting to see if this massive buy buy right to rise has move in the numbers for governor bush at all. mark: the group supporting rubio is on the air. i want to ask about governor kasich. there are other factors in media. not just the volume of the ads but the content, what is your sense about how those ads are doing given his numbers in new hampshire ticking down as of late? ken: k-6 went up early in the summer. he was the only person up with a significant buy in new hampshire. then he got into that conversation, that 10 percentage point range. they have just recently made another $3 million by. we have not seen his nu

we showed the bush ad and the clinton ad. it's compelling and if we end others are going to air 32nd snippets of interviews, he doesn't have to spend his money on advertising yet. the other person is carly fiorina, who has it also spend any money on advertising. -- who also hasn't spent any money on advertising. mark: nothing gets our viewers -- ♪ mark: nothing gets our viewers fired up then these two words, tax policy. john kasich put out his tax plan. he cut taxes for businesses and the wealthiest bracket, eliminated the state tax, and balanced the budget within eight years. here is how he framed it at a national community college and new hampshire. john kasich: i will immediately put us on a path to a balanced budget and i will get it done within eight years. within the first 100 days we will have that plan to balance the budget. and to keep it balanced i will start the process to amend our constitution to require washington to balance its budget every single year, like states and families in america. mark: we're going to

when we look at the -- the front of the cover of the book here and you see bush and obama, both of them actually looking pretty serious and grim. >> they are. >> they had walked out the blue room where they had traditional coffee where the president elect and first -- first lady to be come in to be hosted by the sitting president and the vice president from both sides too. and so while they were there discussing whatever the day's activity ahead, they were talking about in the situation room, there was a meeting about a threat on the inauguration that had come over the weekend. there was a threat of a terrorist attack on the inauguration. probably not close to the podium itself, but farther back and the assumption that it was possibly people killed. so it was something of great concern. >> host: very serious. >> guest: to the community. so what they did was bring everyone together who was involved in security so you had the cabinet secretary outgoing, homeland security and state and defense and -- and then national security adviser and the incoming terrorism adviser for president obama

a bush fund-raiser told the "washington post" that "it feels very much like a death spiral." and while george w. bush insisted today that his brother is "going to win because he's a fierce competitor," their father, george h.w. bush, is reportedly so exasperated at a gop electorate currently rejecting his son and embracing donald trump he's telling friends, "i'm getting old at just the right time." on friday jeb bush ordered major cutbacks to save campaign cash including cutting his campaign payroll by 40%. and over the weekend a candidate who once described himself as "a joyful tortoise" in a long race sure didn't sound very joyful. >> if this election is about how we're going to fight to get nothing done, then i don't want anything -- i don't want any part of it. i don't want to be elected president to sit around and see gridlock just become so dominant that people are literally going to decline in their lives. that is not my motivation. i've got a lot of really cool things that i could do other than sit around being miserable listening to people demonize me and me feeling c

no, the other george bush. no, the other george. i am talking about george w. bush. there we go. york times" says they have asked national campaign officials to employ w on the campaign trail, but using him is complicated. the former president is popular with republicans which could help him in the short-term, but not the broader elector rete if he wins the gop nomination. they say jeb is a legacy candidate when voters really want change. kt, why is this a caw nun drum for jeb? is it time to pull out w? >> jeb's problem is more than ambition. the best presidents match the mood of the country. the mood of the country, they don't want same old, same old. they want something new and fresh. jeb bush's problem is that, a, he is a bush and b when he talks it sounds like typical washington speak. it is almost like i listen to him and i say oh that's right he is taking an oral exam and he got the answer right, but he hasn't got anybody excited about that. >> why is that? >> i think that's the way way he is. >> george w. bush could excite people. he has a swagger. >> it turns out he was a

what should the jeb bush campaign do to reassure folks on the fence? previous campaigns, i think john mccain, you know, he said i'm going to new hampshire, i remember al gore moved his campaign to nashville. john kerry fired a campaign manage somewhere restarted things. reagan fired a campaign manager after losing iowa. do you think jeb needs to do a public sacrifice or something to calm donors down? >> i think jeb needs to do what he's doing. frankly, i think he can perform better. i think he's going to work at that. sounds like a renewed commit nont do better in the performances which is part of the game. but i think beyond that, there's a tremendous depth of loyalty to jeb bush from the donor clasp people misread that. this isn't someone they picked up on. they know as a governor, did a great job for the state, someone who can govern, substantive and someone they trust and can do the job. on the other hand, you know, i just don't think they have the same level of comfort and confidence that a president rubio would be anywhere as good as a competent

it's a matter, the bush administration didn't see this in any shape or form. the very first cabinet meeting that the bush administration had when it came into office is about iraq. that shows the priorities. it took them 32 more feelings that took place a week before 9/11. again -- >> let's also remember iraq was shooting at the united states aircraft and forcing the no fly zone on behalf of the entire western world. there was a shooting war that should have taken the attention of the administration. nothing to do with what happened in 2003 with iraq but 2001 the air force was being fired on. >> three months earlier, al qaeda bombers blew up an american ship killing 17 american soldiers. that's a real shooting war just before the bush administration -- >> in the year 2000. >> right. >> so al qaeda was already clearly a serious threat. iraq, as we know, wasn't. so anyway, i mean, you know, historians will continue to judge this issue but i think donald trump put it into the public domain. it's a debate worth having. and -- >> ari, let me ask you the politics of

there are people in the bush camp to go after marco, and spend some money in the super pac to go after say, governor bush, make your case, and it is not maybe your year, and go down with dignity. >> but, bill, what would he gain going after rubio, if he is not going to be the nominee? >> well, the candidates believe they have a chance, and the advisers definitely appear to believe they have a chance, because they depend on the candidate for the economy, but though they may think that things may turn around, but i believe it is not going to at this point. >> and angela, before iowa, if he gets out of the race who is to blame? >> well, he is to blame. the problem is not jeb bush's money, but it is jeb bush the candidate. we saw him after the debate s saying, i'm a great worker, and if they are not inspired, vote for somebody else. he has been using the rhetoric, but it is not working well, and i don't know who is advise hg imon them ka parngs but it is not inspiring or motivational, and that is what he needs to do to turn the vote out. money is not the problem, and i don't believe that j

i mean, this is the heart and soul of any george w. bush legacy is he kept the country safe after 9/11. created homeland security and we didn't have another attack on his watch. trump is muddying the waters here. i think jeb is passive towards donald trump, it's going to look terrible. so he has to, i think, rachet it up even more and have the argument that he's starting to have that donald trump knows nothing about foreign policy. we can go back into history and blame every president for anything that happened on their watch. it's not helpful for how we go forward right now. trump i think is going to alienate some republicans on taking this stance on 9/11 where he doesn't alienate them when he criticizes george w. bush for the iraq war. >> all right. doug, bernie, kurt, thank you very much. a reminder, donald trump will be on cnn's new day tomorrow morning which starts at 67 o'clock a.m. eastern. when we come back, is joe biden about to up end this whole race? we'll talk to a man who knows everything there is to know about the white house.

the most striking was how many said bush had the worst debate. o, despite his strong very views for his performance, he is still sitting there in single digits for our poll. yeah, he did a lot of damage to bush in that debate wednesday. still no sign of a imagine surge in traction for rubio, though. >> one problem that marco rubio has, he hasn't impressed in the grand campaign. in iowa, new hampshire, even south carolina we haven't seen that organizational network. besides that organizational network, the time, the meet and greet -- iowa and new hampshire are about-face time, hanging out with the kids, going to church functions. rubio, if he wants to really build on this momentum, take the poll numbers and pretty much go and camp out in iowa and new hampshire and south carolina. because order matters. we know this in primaries. if he really wants to have a shot to get to texas, the super tuesday states, he needs to pick one. i don't know which one. he needs to pick it and invest a ton of time, energy, and organizati organizational resources there.

right now the republican race for president, specifically. jeb bushtor marco rubio, they're running neck and neck in most of the polls, although both of them fell behind the republican front-runners, donald trump and dr. ben carson. their past friendship, their current rivalry has ruffled some feathers and sparked talk of the trail on rubio's part. our special correspondent, jamie gangel, caught up with senator rubio out there on the campaign trail in south carolina for a cnn exclusive. >> let's talk about jeb. the two of you both say you're friends. we went back and looked at your victory night, november 2nd, 2010, when he introduced you. he said that you were the man for our time. >> bushes get emotional, so i'm going to try my hardest. my wife has told me, don't cry, don't cry. but marco rubio makes me cry for joy. >> i'm not sure anyone quite believes the friendship is so warm anymore. >> not on our part it isn't. i mean, i'm running for president. i'm not running against jeb or anybody else in this race. >> so, some might say, look, jeb was your

clearlyof the hour was marco rubio. bush'sremeditated attack about his record and turned it on his head. now the front runner? mark: he is not that he has put himself in a position to be the establishment choice. he will raise more money. will he catch on with voters? you wrote that his poll numbers will go up, but let's see if it goes up in a sustained way. but states will he win? john: when we did our focus groups, voters who are impressed with his performance in cb valley. they talked about -- in simi valley. his numbers did not move much but this moment is going to get 100 times more attention. everybody has seen it. areink his poll numbers going to go up and he was already on her role going into it. i don't necessarily think he will be the nominee, i think donald trump is more likely, that he is in the best position to consolidate the establishment vote. criticized foras his spending habits, which is , heof his vulnerabilities likened it to a criticism in the media. he is going to go to the conservative base and say this

i think he will take the george w. bush approach to get out of the way and let everybody else take the heat. maybe he comments here and there. for a guy who was never given a shot he did all he could do. >> we talk about the patience, talk about dealing with sort of intransigent members on the right when it comes to cooperating with republican leadership. if the government shutdown is off the table, are there specific trip wires you can identify where paul ryan is likely to run into trouble? >> one of the things very striking to me is as he was weighing whether or not he would run for this position he made a promise that he was not going to bring up immigration reform. we have to remember that 2016 is going to be a year of political fireworks. there are going to be all kinds of issues where members are want toog make their stake on the floor about where they are on certain issues. i think that could trip up paul ryan very easily. a lut ot of members will have te proving something to constituents. that is something to be wat

if the logic of the bush campaign is to be the last to establishment candidate, the question is will super pac go after rubio? that will be risky, but some people think it is inevitable. there was another shining star, ted cruz. he wins special brownie points for elbowing the mainstream media. joke aboutcracking colorado's special brownies. who is positioned better at this point amongst the young senators? john: rubio is better positioned. as we both wanted out, there is no clear establishment alternative. the establishment does not have a front runner. ted cruz has two people in front of him, donald trump and ben carson. in his lane i think ted cruz did , a lot of good last night. but he did not do anything to get rid of trump and carson. maybe trump and carson will fade away, but cruz is still third. that makes him less likely than rubio. mark: let us see. when we talk about rubio getting fundraising, his fundraising last quarter was disappointing. by every measure. i would say cruz's was overwhelming. the other thing about cruz, i will say again, when he does well, is already high

and in the theory this would then give jeb bush the room to run knot primaries without having to tack sharply to the right and tack on positions that might be toxic later to voters in the general election. or as jeb bush himself put it last year, the candidate should also be willing to lose the primary to win the general. but as he struggles in the polls his campaign is considering bringing in the 43rd president and america's most polarizing amateur painter, george w. bush. according to the "new york times," advisers to jeb bush in the early primary state of south carolina have asked national campaign officials to call in w with the idea that bush 43 could help his brother shore up support among conservatives. a "new york times" cbs poll in may found 71% of republicans had a favorable view of george bush. but for a candidate who has thus far tried very hard to distance himself from his brother and whose campaign slogan famously doesn't even use the family name, the question is will this help cement his status as a dynasty candidate running on his brother's record? joining me now micha

what are your sources telling you about the future of jeb bush's campaign tonight? i spoke to one of the top advisers and the conversation is that it's tok particular right now amongst national reporters but his adviser says and rightfully so, we saw jeb bush in new hampshire today but the adviser tells many he that they need to refocus the campaign. they need to grind it out and do need to do better in the upcoming debate. and with the bush campaign, who thought jeb bush was going to walk away with the nomination. this republican told me a short time ago that this is the first time i think that jeb bush may not actually win the gop nomination. >> a lot of people asking so many questions. thank you very much. joining me is a jeb bush supporter. good to have both of you. rick, let me start with you. george w. bush coming to the rescue tonight trying to moments ago reach with donors. here he is. >> thank you. god bless you. >> thank you. >> don't put that on ebay. >> all right. a light moment. he's signing autographs. saying don't put this on ebay. the question is, th

jenna: better not be. >> would be thrilled to run against the bushes. if it is a backer is looking election which is rare in life, the clintons but these people look back on the clinton years better than the bush years. they are rushing that with the clintons would hate to run against marco rubio. i look at what jeb bush is saying right now, this is not the guy, education and former in florida was upbeat, this is anything but a joyful and joyous campaign. when he talked to you yesterday and said we are not on life support, that is a joke. he didn't smile, he didn't laugh about it. this is a campaign that is by rubbing downward. he is seeing someone he groomed in florida surpassing him. it is hard to watch. jenna: what the you think about marco rubio's side of the equation as we finish up? despite marco rubio coming out and trying to be above the fray, if there is one catch phrase that has been repeated all over the media, it is is marco rubio the gop's obama? that was also leaked earlier this week by a the jeb bush campaign. everyone has access to is tha

for example, the bush administration andrew card worked as secretary to new that. and then a knowledge of a washington community. with these news organizations so when you come in as president with the press staff what are those your genes? you cannot just do what you want with everything on your terms because you have to understand the dynamics. >> you're speaking to someone a number of years now but that highlighted their in constituencies when they come to office the most important groupon the block that is the of press and he is not well known as the governor ran not a senator obama had some exposure but you have leaders the you have to be very attuned a and respectful with campaign staff to help you to get elected and bring you to the dance there is seldom did things to do in such a short period of time to make the point the first 100 days is your window of opportunity for the best prepared time to take a vantage as you start early on the transition how did obama do? >> he did well. he had to deal with the american recovery act to make early statements to do ex

the governor was jeb bush. >> more disappointing for the bush team, a multimillion dollar ad campaign by a pro-bush political action committee as well as bush's own ads, attacking trump's lack of service in the military. >> draft deferments during vietnam. >> none of them have moved that into bush's camp. while the governor has only $10 million of cash in hand, right to rise, a superpack superpac h0 million. >> i'm all in, in all the primaries including virginia. every dollar we can save in overhead is a dollar that goes on television, goes on radio, goes on media, goes oon voter outreach. >> bush hopes that during the tough time will bring more support. high ranking staff member of the dnc had this to say from bush's reshuffling. quoting now, i hope he will end up being the nominee. eight more years of bush which was terrible or eight more years of clinton, good for the nation. wung democrat'one democrat's op. >> a principal with quir squiret patton boggs, joins us. lean and mean, some say he hasn't been lean or mean and unable to adapt. what do you say? >> i think he has a chance to

matt, are you a bull or a bear on the jeb bush campaign? from the beginning the jeb bush campaign had nothing behind it. the whole rationale was inevitability. we've seen a demonstration project here that money is not determinative in politics. there's nobody out there saying i'm a bush conservative, damn it. that doesn't exist. it was just that i'm going to outspend everyone and make myself look inevitable. he right now has lost to ben carson in every poll for two months. 50% of republican voters, 50, have been behind the combination of trump, fiorina, and carson for two months. there is no establishment. long live the establishment. >> betsy, here's to me the bullish case, none of that hard -- none of those hard dollars count the superpac. superpac donors, he's got a huge well-funded superpac. superpac donors can ride in at any time with a million-dollar check. and we all remember like john mccain was basically down to his last ten cents in 2008. and ended up coming back. so what's your feeling? >> it's not pretty. and i think the new ham

actually planned months ago for the bush. arty and roar into next year ask they hope win the nomination, instead the meeting with bush's team, his family, is a well as big donor from around the country, is more the donors and families they're slashing custs and re-organizing and focus on early voting states. bush used to say he would campaign with joy in his heart put is stuck in singled digits and getting bullied by trump and over the weekend he was clearly ticked off. watch. >> is this election is about how we're going to fight to get nothing done, then i don't want any part of it. i got a lot of really cool things i could do other than sit around, being miserable, listening to people demonize me and me feeling compelled to demonize them. that's a joke. elect trump if you want that. >> that doesn't mean that trump is going -- that jeb is going to stop criticizing trump unless he can find some way to excite voters, which hey hasn't been able to find. he will have virtually no other choice but to go negative to get back in con

, it was a mess for jeb and marco rubio is the bush. >> susan? >> i agreed with what howard is saying, also republicans have some alternatives, mark coe rubio looked crisp and young and eager. and for jeb bush, this was the third disappointing debate in a row, and at some point your money doesn't save you from your weaknesses as a candidate. >> i didn't think fit the costume. the guy came in there saying he wanted to take down the other candidate but he didn't mean it. >> he went after hem in a look here sort of way and rubio was ready and came after him with both barrels and just kind of slapped him with the back of his hand. you saw the body language, you heard the tones of voice, and you said, jeb bush, you can also put a fork in the bush campaign at this point. >> all across this country, we're the one that has the best organization and i'm going to work hard to be able to earn people 's support. i knew this was going to be a long journey, but to suggest that the campaign is terminal, that's funny. >> what about your campaign is on life suppor

well the same can be said about george w. bush- >> there's no comparison whatsoever. >> there's no comparison? if the roles were reversed -- >> we're talking about a decision potentially withholding assistness nesance at benghazi >> but warnings were given to bush administration -- >> responsible for an attack -- >> i'm not saying he's responsible -- >> well, there's a lot of reasons we were attacked, but i'm not going to blame the president of the united states. >> but i think if roles were reversed, you would be. you would be. >> as much as i like him and love him in some ways he's wrong about this. >> you thing a good political move. >> a great political move, but it's absent any fact and it's bankrupt. >> in many ways we are repeating history because i would argue thatanians get their nuclear weapon and use it, obama's going to be long gone. >> exactly. >> and the cost of the weakness comes after you're gone usually. and that happened with clinton. it's probably going to happen with obama. i think what's most objectionable abo

you look at the two sound bites, the trump and the carson -- excuse me, the bush versus the carson. how do you react to personal attacks from donald trump? and you can see why carson is running about three times ahead of where bush is. carson is completely self-contained, and he's very calm. the idea that he's less than energetic is rather a musing for a guy who stands -- has stood for 20 hours operating with complete and total concentration. i've watched surgeons at work, and that is the most grueling activity imaginable. so the idea that shouting and screaming and jess particulgesta sign of energy is absurd. but saying ben carson is an outsider, i believe, is the reason he's been propelled. if you look at the breakdown in a place like iowa, with men they're running about even, carson and trump, but among the women, there is a huge gap. there's about a 2-1 gap. and i think in some sense, people have a sense that if you want to go for an outsider, you might want to try the calm one. >> lauren? >> in south carolina, trump is at 40. in new hampshire he's at 38. i think he's leading car

the world. and governor bush said, yes, stuff happens. no, that's an admission of defeat and sur end -- surrendert is killing 33,000 americans. >> among the plan it woe tighten gun show and internet sales loophole and close the charleston loophole and block gun purchases for -- sanders is extending his lead. while clinton is still ahead in iowa beating sanders 47 to 36%. when you add biden to the mix, clinton's support drops to just 33. bernie sanders held a massive rally of about 20,000 of people in boston, double the number who turned out to see barack obama himself at a similar event in 2007. >> what a huge crowd! and let me thank the many thousands of people who are outside who were unable to get in. thank you! >> gun control may be the one issue where clinton can reliably challenge bernie sanders progressive bona fide. he famously voted against the 1993 brady bill requiring, among other things, background checks for gun purchases. and in 2005, he voted for immunity for gun sellers. >> the gun sellers are the only businesses in america

with the former front-runner, brother george, and their father, the 41st president. bush 43 assured the group in houston his brother could be a, quote, fierce competitor during a 45 slide power point presentation the bush campaign reportedly targeted marco rubio. now they pointed out he doesn't have a single endorsement from a fellow senator. and one slide was even titled marco is a gop obama. and a top staffer noted the two have strikingly similar profiles, that include being lawyers, university lecturers, and former state legislators, with, quote, few legislative accomplishments. but just across town, ted cruz visited a gun range with the president in tow and at a news conference beforehand, while he was cordial to the bush family, for whom he once worked, the message seems clear. >> to date our campaign has raised over $10.9 million from the state of texas. far more than any candidate in the field. and part of the strength of the campaign, the campaign altogether has raised over $26.5 million in just over six points. and we finished the last quarter reporting the most

the ultimate undoing of jeb bush is the legacy of the george w. bush era because george w. bush became -- the reason they were willing to fall into line for george w. bush was republicans in 2000 the mindset was we want our own bill clinton. he beat us in the '96 election. he beat us in impeachment. he keeps beating us, we can't figure it out, let's get our own guy. that's what compassionate conservatism was all about, the idea that you can be conservative and still be pro government. and at the end of the bush years when barack obama became government the lesson the conservative movement took was we should never, ever, ever try to be like the other party again. that's what the tea party grew up out of. that's what that anti-establishment mindset came from. now jeb bush comes along and today's republican party says absolutely not. >> peter beinart had a piece today thought was good where he said basically this is kind of a triumph for democracy. it shouldn't be the case that literally the smoke-filled room, right? a bunch of donors get together and say i wrote a check for y

the bush legacy, the w. bush legacy has yet to flesh out.rea: why do you think president bush didn't defend his own legacy? he went after cruz and rubio, and i was a bit surprise. he didn't defend his legacy, and that's the story of the day. why? gillian: my guess, and this is a guess, he's over it. he's written a book, he's done how many millions of media interviews, press, tv, radio. i mean, we're moving on to two terms into somebody else's administration later. i think he's probably ready to let history flush out the rest. >> it's unseemly to defend yourself. you're already out of the picture. i agree with jeb on that. trump can throw that out there and blame bush for 9/11, but the reality is you can know that attacks are going to come and be looking everywhere for them, but all the enemy has to do is find an opening. harris: so why doesn't jeb say that? because you're not even running, and you nailed it, right? why doesn't he say that or say, you know what? asked and answered already. i want to talk about what i would do as president. >>

. >> guest: -- the general procedures of a transition, yes. >> host: let's move to president bush. i think if i would kind of capsulize your themes, it's to start early and stay open with the sitting president. >> guest: right. >> host: tell us holiday and why president bush really focused so much on this transition as early as december 2007. >> guest: in one way, it was something that was comfortable for him because when he became president, he had clay johnson, who was working at his chief of staff -- >> host: in austin. >> guest: in austin in june of '99. he had him thinking separately about transition, and he told him he wanted him to go out and talk to the jim bakers bakers ad george schultzs and get some understanding about how transitions work, and then also think about the recruitment process for personnel. so, planning ahead was something that was natural to him. i think -- >> host: important. >> guest: -- in the transition but he was very affected by the wars, and the need to not just for president obama but for the presidency itself, the institution of the presidency, whi