the data. just like nsa. laughter] >> if you think that is the same, we have more to talk about. >> on the last question on the , meaning of privacy in the digital age, in an age where every time anyone uses easy pass or goes shopping, giving all sorts of information to companies voluntarily. we are comfortable giving away tons of metadata and content of data as everyone who has ever gotten a pop-up ad after they have made an inquiry knows. does this change how we think about these topics at all? >> of course it does. privacy is the line we continually negotiate between ourselves as unique creatures of god and as social animals. and that line changes. i think it is rapidly changing now with the digital, interconnected age. it is a nightmare for security services in a democracy who are sworn to protect reasonable expectations of privacy when the reasonable expectations of privacy when the definition of reasonable is a movable feast within a broader culture. >> there are two things going on legally and conceptua

was listening to the phone calls. >> i think the best way to summarize the nsa surveillance is to quote general al command who runs the agency. he had a motto, when he was in iraq in charges of surveillance against whom the united states, which was collect it all. >> what do you say to the people that are like oh, i don't do anything wrong, i don't care if they hear my calls in. >> first of all, people that say that, they don't actually believe it, they put locks on their bedroom and bathroom doors. every time someone says to me i have nothing to high, i say give me all the pass words to your facebook account, your email, no one has taken up on that, because we know that we crave privacy. and everybody in the country. and everything in the world, really. >> yeah, that was the policy at the time. >> before edward snowden, there was benny who helped develop some of the early technology being used in the collection programs. he says 9/11 was a turning point for the agency. he left his job, and bake a whistle blower. >> with 9/11 everything changed here. and some of them said this is

here is the line between them. nsa goes between them and take in anything and everything it wants from that. even though hundreds of billions of those communications will be u.s. communications. >> let me make sure i understand the premise you are suggesting. you believe that gmail should be a safe haven for legitimate foreign intelligence targets of the united states. >> is that my question? >> that is how i translate your question. wire, i am on that not collecting gmail users. barton said, and this hurts your head, we have spent the whole evening here and have not gotten off of section 215. >> we are now. >> the approach you use in collecting foreign intelligence looks like a funnel. you have access. p isnext stwe collect. the new process. you process. the funnel get smaller. often, people use the number out here that describes moveotential access and that number up the chain to the more sophisticated and narrowly focused activities. i go back to my premise that gmail is not a safe haven. google is an international

the threat? how hard did nsa work to prevent the threat? >> we do have an nsa reporter here who covered the nsa quite a bit. >> i think in terms of the stories i did which tried to get at the policy debates, i think i tried to be fair and honest about what we were hearing and reporting. there has been a legitimate debate about whether having this discussion about prism, section 215 program, encryption methods, cyber offense, whether that harms national security. the extent to which it does i think is difficult to discern. >> there is an extraordinary volume of reporting on threats. north korea missile launches, terrorist plots. there is a huge volume of that and has been at an accelerated rate since 9/11. from the cold war, it has dominated national security matters. the biggest part of news is new. what is new is inside material about the u.s. response and surveillance we did not know before. what i am doing is focusing on that. if you look at the whole package of reporting in the "washington post" and don't think you are seeing threat info

here is the line between them. nsa goes between them and take in anything and everything it wants from that. even though hundreds of billions of those communications will be u.s. communications. >> let me make sure i understand the premise you are suggesting. you believe that gmail should be a safe haven for legitimate foreign intelligence targets of the united states. >> is that my question? >> that is how i translate your question. wire, i am on that not collecting gmail users. barton said, and this hurts your head, we have spent the whole evening here and have not gotten off of section 215. >> we are now. >> the approach you use in collecting foreign intelligence looks like a funnel. you have access. p isnext stwe collect. the new process. you process. the funnel get smaller. often, people use the number out here that describes moveotential access and that number up the chain to the more sophisticated and narrowly focused activities. i go back to my premise that gmail is not a safe haven. google is an international

the room. right? or no. here. >> hi. does nsa now know aside from what's been revealed in your stories what snowden took? >> i can't know that for sure. it appears from the the variety of interviews they've done, very recent ones, that they're not sure. i think that they have a very strong picture by now of what he had access to, what he could have touched or did touch. i don't think that they know with any confidence what he actually took. if -- they have claimed that he, at some points that he took 1.7 million documents. if that's the case, and i do not know, that is a much larger number than anything he gave any combination of journalists. >> we have a question up here in the front. >> thank you for taking my question. so you've talked a lot about how much you've sort of self-censored, you know? >> we call it editing, not censor. [laughter] >> censorship for the good, let's say. so you're going to write a story about this aspect of what you know, but you're not going to reveal every aspect of that story. and i get the sense th

what does the nsa have to do with this bug? >> the story that bloomberg broke today indicates that the nsa has not only known about the bug for two years since it was introduced, but it has exploited it for two years to steal information on internet users. this revelation comes in a week where internet companies are scrambled to upgrade their infrastructure to protect against these attacks. there is a lot of animosity about the nsa and the fact that they know about this security bug and kept it themselves. >> what has been the response from lawmakers and from the nsa? hasn't commented on the story. this has generated a lot of interest. the nsa did have a lot of friends to begin with in terms of internet companies. this adds another dimension to the problem. this is a major security bug. this is the thing the industry has scrambled to fix. their exploitation does not sit well with a lot of folks. >> cory johnson. can yous this -- have explain what this bug is? i've are received -- i have already received e-mails to change my pass

the nsa did have a

how bad is the threat and how hard did the nsa work to prevent the threat? >> we do have an nsa reporter who covered the nsa quite a bit. would you like to respond? >> well i think in terms of the stories i did and probably to get at the policy debates, i think i tried -- i tried to be fair, strives to be fair and honest about what we are hearing and reporting. there has been and it's a legitimate debate to have as to whether having this discussion about prism, about section 215 program, encryption methods, cyber offense whether that harms national security. the extent to which it does you know i think is difficult to discern. >> i would just say there is an extraordinary volume of reporting by us and everyone else on threat material. north korea, missile launches and nuclear weapons development and terrorist plots. there is a huge volume of that. it has been at an accelerated place since 9/11 but dating from the cold war it has dominated coverage of national security matters and the biggest part of the word news is new and what has been new is a lot of insid

the threat? how hard did nsa work to prevent the threat? >> we do have an nsa reporter here who covered the nsa quite a bit. terms of the stories i did which tried to get at the policy debates, i think i and honest fair about what we were hearing and reporting. there has been a legitimate about whether having this discussion about prism, section 215 program, encryption methods, cyber offense, whether that harms national security. ie extent to which it does think is difficult to discern. is a next ordinary volume of reporting -- extraordinary volume of reporting on threats. north korea missile launches, terrorist plots. that is a huge volume of and has been at an xl rated pay since 9/11 -- accelerated rate since 9/11. from the cold war, it has dominated national security matters. the biggest part of news is new. what is new is inside material about the u.s. response and surveillance we did not know before. what i am doing is focusing on that. if you look at the whole package of reporting in the "washington post" and don't think you are seeing

and the nsa invoted the nsa act of 1959 -- i'm sorry the nsa invoked the espionage act of 1917 to denyy request. and this is the same act in convicted. >> so professor, whether or not they are going to give these records to ryan, shouldn't these agencies at least be able to confirm or deny whether these records exist? >> the answer is probably twofold. as a general matter agencies are obligated to both identify responsive records and release non-exempt portions of them. there is a major exception, and it is known as glowmarization in which the see can take the position that the abstract existence or non-existence of a document is a classified fact. i'm very familiar with that because i went to court on the first several judgments. it's a legitimate concept in general, but whether it has been properly applied is a different matter. >> our community is tuning in . . . >> public information requests which are a little different -- >> well, that's his comment. and brad tweeted check this out -- >> yeah. obliterated obliterated. here is another one doj information. and joe says . . . horace

in january, the director of national intelligence james clapper described analysts working on the nsa story as a compass is." in february, mike rogers, chair of the house intelligence committee, accused glenn greenwald of selling stolen goods are reporting stories on the nsa documents. greenwald and poitras were accompanied by an aclu attorney,

this is a decision i made before working on the nsa material. r me, i don't fell confident i can protect source material in the united states right now. i certainly can cross the border with it or with mike women or anything that appears to be sensitive. my plan is to finish editing and then return. i absolutely plan to return. >> what worries each of you the most about the intelligence court? >> what worries me is the fact it doesn't have any of the asributes that we are taught first-year law students or even as american citizens, to make a court an actual court. it operates in complete secrecy. only one side is allowed to be heard, which is the government. housed in time it was the justice department, indicating what its real purpose is. which is to not be an outside body exerting oversight, but to be an enabler of what the executive branch wants to do. the proof is in the pudding and that there is been 30 years of fisa court decisions in an humiliatingly small number of demands by the u.s. government to be surveilled that every been rejected b

isn't really part of the nsa slide? apply tupolev one. >> is a drawing with a smiley face. >> and i see a lot of government power points one of the things that convinced me it maybe authentic is with the design. [laughter] >> can you walk us through decoding some of these? how does us slide indeed to october 30th title the link to the data worldwide? i will just quickly reid he has sequent the broken in from around the world and interviews with other officials by collecting from at will many belonging to americans. to engineers with close ties to google's yelled with profanity and hope you publish this one of them said. talk about this about this story. >> one thing that was difficult the nsa was extremely cryptic with the secret program names the security or obscurity and go to great planks to hide. on the other hand, it is somewhat attacking technology that we all use like the network architecture or cellphone with these underlying pathologies it will draw the not but the of the things that is interesting is i definite

within days of 9/11, the power of nsa being turned on the united states, full power. sa was supposed to do for intelligence. but apparently, the united states was now a foreign nation for all intents and purposes. my moment of truth occurred three weeks after 9/11 when i confronted a lead attorney in the nsa in the office of general counsel. i said what are we doing? it's the prime directive that you do not spy on americans without a warrant. and now we are just separating ourselves from the fourth amendment? there is an entire directive, a regime in which i was fundamentally accountable and had been ever since i was in the military, flying reconnaissance. there were procedures involved. all of this was tossed out. i wasn't just looking at the wheels coming off this thing called the constitutional republic. i was actually looking at an entirely new vehicle that i did not recognize, an alien form of government. remember, i had taken the oath four times to defend the constitution. now i witnessed a subversion of the constitution and 9/11 was a trigger for billions and bi

should we care more about the nsa? pretty soon after all this stuff came to light, it dawns on me that the distinction is not meaningful. everything that google and yahoo! and facebook are collecting, the nsa is eventually getting their hands on it. certainly they can get their hands on it. the consumer stuff and the government stop lens together to a degree. none of us fully appreciated it until these documents came out. it is interesting what we have seen. there's been a focus over the past 11 months on nsa collection because of these amazing stories. there has been less focused on consumer connection. gmail, they have ads based on what is in your stock. there is a whole host of issues. should you post pictures of your kids on facebook? these are a more prominent part of the conversation and what i was doing. it has been shifted over to try to make sense of what we have learned. i do think that the time is approaching where we will have to wrestle with these questions. what are real giving up to these companies to get

, the review group, you made recommendations how to control the nsa, you just spoke to the nsa and wrote about it and saying there is no doubt that the nsa has thwarted terrorist plots and it has a high degree of integrity. >> one of the things that i was surprised of as a me of the national advisory council and well-known civil libertarian, high degree of integrity and care and does in fact make a very conscientious effort to stay within the bonds of the haw, i think were excessive and inappropriate, with the congress, the president and with the foreign intelligence surveillance court, so attention should really be placed here not on the nsa, a bad guy, my sense is that the nsa is not a bad guy, it is simply exercising the authorities it's been given, i think not sufficiently careful about constraining those authorities. so i came to have a great deal of respect for the nsa and its employees and i think it's important to turn attention to the responsibility where that responsibility really belongs. >> so your concern is that it has too much power and despite those positives you fo

sear the journalist who broke the story of the reach of nsa surveillance returns to us today for the first time since they began reporting on documents leaked by former contractor adverts noted glenn greenwald and mark waitress arrives in new york this morning to receive the prestigious george polk award for journalism. they said the national security reporting award with fellow reporters. elaine in a cask ale and washington post partum down. it is an ss teacher and mentor greenwald at the event and joins us now with more. this aussies spoke with the pre op this morning the first time since he stepped foot onto us soil after the nsa revelations what's the significance of this return. there were concerns he may have trouble getting back into the us that's right when yemeni significance of this guy is pretty cute because the june will mark exactly one year since the odd mind blowing revelations were made that with the help of the word snow and this mass surveillance conducted by what the government by the nsa. certainly this was the huge scandal in one year onwards deemed after rats ar

the nsa denies they know about this until it was made in private sector reports. the national security council saying the nsa or other parts of the government were aware of the one ability before 2014 of april is wrong. it.nsa denying bloomberg news sticking with the story. we will keep digging into that. >> what is this bug?

. >> the nsa may have known about heartbleed virus for years. we will look at whether the selloff will give some company second thoughts about going public. first, a check of your top headlines. leave half ofl the office space under construction here in san francisco. the 61 story skyscraper is scheduled to be completed in 2017 and we the tallest building in san francisco. aliese e-commerce giant ata, the takeover valued $1.5 billion. it allows them to expand into another internet area as it tries to broaden its customer base. sony is telling consumers to viofitsing the new laptop. the battery may overheat. >> first to our lead story, the nsa may have known about the heart bleed security bug for two years according to people familiar with the matter. this is one of our bloomberg reports we are standing by even though the nsa has denied this. twice it is shocking. -- >> it is shocking. despite the risk of hacking, they made the decision to keep it a secret. have their statement. the nsa was not aware of the vulnerability. the so-called heart bleed

the nsa, what is it and what does it do? it was hard to answer these questions before edward snowden leaked thousands of detailed classified documents to the public. these documents show the full extent of the nsa surveillance on americans. >> the nsa is doing bulk data collection on american e-mails. it is not limited in scope to terrorists, two spies, two people they have probable cause to believe that they are committing some type of crime. it is a bulk collection of data of americans e-mails. >> that is just one side of the story. many people believe the nsa is doing the right thing under a law calledfisa. doing ishe nsa is trying to implement something called the foreign intelligence surveillance act, fisa, which is designed to try to capture communications and information from foreigners who are believed to be trying to do harm to americans or the united states. has a lot ofsa problems. i have repeatedly, during my tenure in congress, voted to fisa in and redefine the courts and responsibilities. i think we have more wo

in shining a light on the nsa black budget. we will go to capitol hill to speak with commerce member peter welch is sponsoring the bill to force the president to include the total dollar amount requested for each of the 16 intelligence agencies. then, a federal judge has dismissed a lawsuit challenging u.s. governments killing of three americans in yemen in drone strikes. we will get reaction from attorney maria lahood. >> the constitution clearly applies to our awlaki because he is u.s. citizen, so he is guaranteed due process. if the us government can kill a u.s. citizen in yemen, that not only expands the global war, but also means a u.s. citizen can be killed anywhere by our government. >> all of that and more coming up. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. ukraine said they have regained control over regional administration building , one ofity of kharkiv three eastern cities were pro-russian demonstrators have seized government sites. authorities are men in a standoff of demo

. >> on c-span this morning, the discussion reporters broke the nsa leak. as 7:00, washington journal. the house returns at noon eastern for general speeches. at 2:00, members take up a bill to provide aid to ukraine. morning, discussing global economic inequality. he is speaking at the council on foreign relations. it is live starting at 8:30 a.m. eastern time on c-span2. general motors ceo mary barra testifies about the ignition switch recall today. you can see her testimony before house energy and commerce subcommittee live at 2:00 p.m. eastern on c-span3. >> the car spun in the circle. the driver wanted to know where her phone was because it got knocked out of her hand. she was looking for her phone. she was in the backseat and alive for about 35 minutes before they cut her out. >> hello, i am at lynn bowne. driving.ready to start i am eager been scared. many drivers are focusing on their cell phones rather than on the road. statistics show distracted driving is incredibly dangerous and cell phones should have no place by the wheel. something needs to be

we are just talking about the nsa. here are so many there, and they are so technical, i would be really surprised if the high-level people know the details more than a small number of the most major of programs. >> i think you could be wrong about that. i think so. many could not describe the engineering details, but i would be surprised if there were more than a handful of programs -- >> i suspect a handful, you are right. but impossible to count how many programs there are in the nsa. we could save thousands and probably more than that. i just imagine it is beyond the capacity of any individual to have significant knowledge about more than a handful of the thousands of programs. >> i agree with bob dietz, and i agree with you, but the answer is, work the low-level to mid-level, and then the top, if you can. then you get a total universe portrait. we have a couple of minutes here before there is a coffee and martini break. maybe not martinis. dietz, you are the historian of this. what is going on here. when historians

the nsa is like ibm. been for the had punchcards, hitler would not have assassinated so many dues and pole locks and everything else. gm built the first nuclear plant in russia. internationalic corporate fascism. it is population control. people are feeling vulnerable. 86% of american adults use the internet. they depend on in their lives. it is the saurian singh and scary when lots of vulnerabilities come to light. -- it is disorienting and scary when lots of him abilities come to light. you thought that you were operating in a safe manner. now it no longer works for you. it is a scary things. there are global actors who are the purchase of guns on the internet. one of the other things about this media is you do not have to ask permission. you get an independent software writer, like tim berners-lee, who creates a program that essentially gives you the world wide web. he did not ask anybody's permission to release the code that gave us this amazingly powerful and beneficial resource that all of us use in

the nsa big brother and democracy. we ha i am the editor and chief of the san antonio current. and before we get started, i want to remind you all these books, great books. spying on democracy and the family jewels will be for sale and heidi and john bill signing them after the session. i would introtruce heidi and john. heidi boghosia is the executive director of the national lawyers guild, a progressive bar ass association and cohost law and disorder which is a radio show and airs on 50 national affiliate stations. she has published articles on policing, the first amendment for the national lawyers guild, missouri law river and north river press. she lives in new york city so thank you for making the trip down here. to my right to is john prados which is a director for the national security archive which is a great resource. it is located in washington, d.c. he helps bring newly declassified secret records to public attention. he is an award-winning author of 21 counts. i hope the number is accurate? >> it is 23 now. >> oh, okay. war veterans, american friends, service commit

. >> the nsa and others have argued a lot of what is in our cell phone we post online and in the cloudso in a sense they argue that we have already surrendered a the lot privacy rights that would be afternooned by the fourth amendment. >> that is true and the court has bought that argument. in the context we are talking about here, in the two cases in front of the supreme court the police are not going to a third party or to the cloud they are actually searching through the defendant's own cell phone. in another kind of case where the police go through the cloud to get this information, then we might see the court coming up in favor of -- more likely see the court coming up in favor of the government. >> i need only mention one name and that is edward snowden with, that as a backdrop, how closely will the nsa be watching these arguments that are before the court? >> i think very closely, these two cases involve an issue that's somewhat different than the nsa surveillance we have been hearing about from edward snowden. but certainly if the court comes out in favor of the defendants in th

within days of 9/11, the power of nsa being turned on the united states, full power. sa was supposed to do for intelligence. -- foreign intelligence but apparently, the united states was now a foreign nation for all intents and purposes. my moment of truth occurred three weeks after 9/11 when i confronted a lead attorney in the nsa in the office of general counsel. i said what are we doing? it's the prime directive that you do not spy on americans without a warrant. and now we are just separating ourselves from the fourth amendment? there is an entire directive, a regime in which i was fundamentally accountable and had been ever since i was in the military, flying reconnaissance. there were procedures involved. all of this was tossed out. i wasn't just looking at the wheels coming off this thing called the constitutional republic. i was actually looking at an entirely new vehicle that i did not recognize, an alien form of government. remember, i had taken the oath four times to defend the constitution. now i witnessed a subversion of now i witnessed a subversion of the

the contents of an email to think of health course he knows mommy took me by the nsa vocals by august such email accounts that you keep switching the fact that they have passed for two to keep it secure. not so secure the congress of american continent directed to me and is a good heavens what you've mentioned before i head out the next eight years on record that whoever controls the engine has the power and twenty first century. they said that this persistent act nineteen ninety six after reading through the snow in documents youth director warren and certainly many of us out. i would read and essays level of sophistication on the internet who lives and let them speak for themselves they needed to be sufficiently to be built in shelf of salacious of internet time is probably the best books i work as they could have and what they could achieve. they've been doing a great off from the perspective from the moment or one one millionth time targets every day they ask of them every day nine million possible new targets. they quietly today fell from six billion people every day from the six

many people believe the nsa is doing the right thing under a law called fisa. >> what the nsa is doing trying to implement something called the foreign intelligence surveillance act, fisa, which is designed to try to capture communications and information from foreigners who are believed to be trying to do harm to americans or the united states. >> i thinkfisa has a lot of problems. i have repeatedly, during my tenure in congress, voted to rein in and redefine the fisa courts and responsibilities. i think we have more work to do. if anything, all of the news we have all endured over these last months about the national security agency really tells us in a deep way that there are things we have to do to rein in and provide oversight as members of congress in what the responsibilities of the nsa are. >> the nsa's method is changed over time with the advancement of technology. >> the change in technology, the technology back then [indiscernible] telegrams,ccaional but not much more than that. the nsa is pretty limited on on.they can eavesdrop >> edward snowden released thousands of docume

>> the nsa buys security vulnerabilities. they don't disclose them to companies. if the obama administration says now they are going to require the nsa to disclose vulnerabilities that they find, there is a loophole in the statement which ramsey advocates told me this weekend is so big you could drive a truck through. what qualifies as national security interest? hat qualifies as law enforcement interest? there is no clarity on what they would disclose what they would not disclose. they're not in the business of buying bugs and giving them away. that contradicts their mission. >> then what do you make of this statement from the white house? is this ever going to actually happen? is this trying to appease the masses and put something out there? >> if you look at what happened with a lot of the snowden documents that were released, you have a lot of the organizations that specifically look for these flaws, but also go into different government agencies and do surveillance. i think this is to appease the masses. they are not going to disclose their techniques and what

he had a pretty innocuous job as assistant administrator and he was able to do basically the nsa the snipping we feel that the nsa is doing to us, walked out with flash drives full of the most important secrets in the world and that's the nature of this stuff. the more you collect the more likely it is to reach more and more old. yes i think these revelations have raised certainly alarmed. they haven't really raise understanding. some of the things we have spoken about. it's been revealed that the nsa holds in storage a lot of metadata information particularly telephone metadata information not only foreign citizens which legally they are allowed to do into infinity. we forget this that it's part of the charter to watch and a to watch any foreigner as much as they want whatever signals they can intercept they are allowed by our law but also u.s.. we forget what i talked about at&t, verizon. your carrier has all of this data. they use it to market to you so i would be more comfortable with a private company like at&t and verizon exclusively holding the data in the government exclusive

and now on to the latest revelation involving the nsa. according to documents obtained by readers the u s intelligence agency persuaded a western christian company to develop more vulnerable system making it easier for the nsa to spy on business is rt twenty france has more understanding how a computer network security company pioneered its field in this case rsa would cause him to a government agency bent on mass surveillance might seem a bit confusing. then again you can all be quite simple if you are ninety and two were talking about the same and the widely new security tokens. there is a corporation of the world over for employees to walk into their workstations. it turns out are if they didn't just that one type of easy to crack encryption software in its context. but tool for the government. back in december reuters reported that rsa media specific algorithm dealing with a curved be defiled option is the safe security token which the deliberate flock or back door if they call it that allowed the nsa to cracking trips to the idea was

the nsa buys a vulnerability. they don't disclose the company.f the obama administration is now saying they're going to require the nsa to disclose these, as you pointed out, there is a loophole in the statement. our privacy advocate told me this this weekend, the loophole is so big you can drive a truck through it, what qualifies as national security and law enforcement interest? they pay a lot of money for vulnerability. potentially millions of dollars. this just contradicts their mission. >> david, what do you make of this statement from the white house? is this ever going to actually happen? is this just trying to appease the masses? >> if you look at what happened with a lot of the snowden documents that were released, a lot of organizations specifically look for these flaws and use them not only for intelligence purposes, but for going into different intelligence agencies to gather surveillance. if this is to appease the masses, they won't be disclosing their techniques. it will take something else for us to see what is going on behind the

it's amazing the amount of data the irs has compared to the nsa or that tsa pre-check has. all is a little bit separate and not always accurate, bet when you look at it is together, it becomes more accurate in the context of itself, all of that data. that's what the process we're seeing play out right now with axiom, they said, please come correct this data, and so doing they revealed, at least you, what they had on you. that part of the revelation process. and you elected not to correct it but eventually, when lots of other people go inspect their data there's a higher chance they'll figure out there's an anomaly in your case, and they'll have a better understanding. but you played a part now in knowing that, and so it's an arms race. right? that's really the future here we're looking at, this constant escalation of intelligence about who is going to do what. what they're going to do to me based on what i know i'm going to do, and the best opportunity we have for moving that in our favor is to become much smarter about our ourselves right now, and the great news is we can a

"washington post" have won the prestigious pulitzer prize for public service for their reports on the nsa. the board said the stories helped spark a debate. in a statement snowden said the award is a vindication. and the "boston globe" was

first of all, there was the extent of nsa surveillance. i think that if that was done within the law and the limitations imposed, that is a legitimate debate in a democratic society. and i think it would be hard to argue that it is stuck within those parameters, but that was not a useful public function. the second element, to go into what you just described, the means and mechanics by which the intelligence services go about their business is extraordinarily irresponsible and damaging. third, going in for the details on the actual names of agents and operatives? that is criminally irresponsible and, in my view, crime. i think it shows a total disregard for the people who were actually involved on the sharp end. the decent, patriotic people who put their lives on the line for our country, to disclose their names in public. we know that that has done a lot of damage in terms of the threats to them and our ability to deploy freely overseas. there are a whole range of areas. clearly, on that second, if you tell the enemies of your country how

the nsa and gchq or google? >> that is difficult to say. i noticed how in the debate people were going crazy about what the nsa were doing, but it did not seem to bother them when they went on to expedia and it somehow magically told you the hotels in the last city you were looking at on a different website, or that what you go shopping they are able to say -- we thought you would like this. people don't seem to regard that as an unwarranted intrusion, but when it comes to security services, giving protection to them and their families, they seem to be outraged by this. am i the only person who finds an odd disconnect in this process? it is all about our sense of proportion and priorities. we depend on security services for our very liberty. what i find deeply perverse about the political debate is it is almost as though there is a charge against our security services that they are the ones who are threat to liberty, democracy, and freedom, when they are the ones who were there to protect it by ensuring that the enemies of those things are k

i asked do they believe the nsa? >> the nsa denies but bloomberg is standing behind the story. what this illustrates is that this is a serious issue. heartbleed is a serious issue in internet encryption. we know that the n.s.a. has been trying many different ways to compromise internet encryption. it is almost irrelevant whether this was the heart lead bug or something else. bloomberg is standing behind the story. >> david, what do you think? >> i think the nsa will say what they need to. their whole purpose is to be a spy agency. they have huge cyber warfare capabilities. their whole purpose is to really go and actively export these types of laws prevented not have to disclose whether or not they discover this previously or not. that is part of the national security thing that they say basically that they had no idea that happened even though they could have been exploiting it for years. they have all of these types of things in their arsenal. they have hundreds if not thousands of different exploits to use everyday to infiltrate different governments, there is a lot of money

this isn't the reports that the nsa all anime called both the government were aware of the so calledhopefully vulnerability. the full april two thousand and fourteen of all roman the statement goes on to say that when the agency loans of one of those he's like this is in the national interest in response a bid to close the vulnerability. roll the polenta for investigated for intelligence purposes that is from the national security council created the us that awful set up like us president obama to uphold the nsa in the light of edmondson is also looking at this vulnerability use you as well. making things easy they washington. this summer fruit will host the twentieth annual united nations framework convention on climate change. the goal of this meeting is to work for developing a new legally binding international treaty that will replace a nineteen ninety seven kyoto protocol which expires in twenty twenty. tuesday's dan collins has more. use rain forests mountains and deserts making one of the most megabytes of those countries in the world that's precisely what makes it so vulnerab