you have a right to know cash in the treasury comes from the taxes that hard-working americans pay. government is charged with stewardship over use of that cash. withholding information is a shirking of that responsibility, and i don't think there's anybody on this floor believes treasury doesn't know what they are going to do, and i don't believe any senator believes that they should be stopping the information from coming to us, especially at this time. we should not run treasury and manage taxpayer resources the way bernie madoff ran his hedge fund by taking in cash and when asked for information refusing to give it and just saying trust me. i have a simple question. does treasury expect to run out of cash on tuesday, august 2? the president and the treasury eye department must answer this question, which brings me to my second point. it is much more critical we get a deficit reduction package right than that we adhere to this arbitrary august 2 deadline. this is one bill that gets that right from my perspective and that, of course, is cut, cap and balance. so far the only biparti

in the month of august, here's what the treasury finances looked like. they have about $306 billion worth of bills to pay. but only $172 billion with which to pay those bills. since they won't have the authority to borrow any more money, that means some bills get paid, and others don't. every single month, the treasury department writes, get this, $80 million different checks. for everything from big ticket items like social security, veterans benefits, and nondefense contracts, to smaller payouts, to folks who are, for example, victims of black lung disease, or people who are railroad retirement board pensioneers. it's 80 million checks every single month. and, again, only about half the money they'll need to make good on all of those payments. so what does treasury do? who gets paid? who doesn't? laid out a possible scenario in which the treasury department only pays the following bills in august. interest on our debts, social security benefits, medicare and medicaid, defense contracts, and unemployment benefits. just paying those bills, just those, not

the treasury has chosen unwisely. the net effect is that we are not yet paine the real market price -- paying the real market price for this huge debts. -- debt. i do not think that is your intention to facilitate this fiscal irresponsibility, but it is the unintended consequence of these extremely low interest rates. that is just one example. to your testimony, you've raised the possibility that if economic circumstances warranted, you would consider it opened the door to an additional round of securities purchases. my concern is that what is wrong with this economy is not fundamentally monetary policy. it is other things. i would just ask you to comment on what you see that is wrong with our economy that qe3 with six. -- would fix. what is your theory that another round of securities purchases would generate the economic growth that we lack? >> to go back to facilitation issue, our goal is to try to meet our mandate of maximum employment and price stability. that is why we monitor monetary policies. i do not think ou

social security trust fund, then the administration can sell those treasury notice just enough to make up the shortfall and assure that social security checks will go out. they made that a matter of law so that the administration may do that. what i've been proposing that we should make as part of the prioritization bill to bring before the house and pass it, bring before the senate and the same courageous people handled that too, but it would say, not that social security is a group of bills with others that must be paid, because by law, social security is separate. by law, it is paid with social security payroll taxes and by law, if there's not enough cash to do that some month, you may take the treasury notice, sell just enough to make up that shortfall and since the united states bonds and treasury notice are still about the most desirable financial bond note to be purchased in the world, especially when you look at the alternatives, greece, portugal, spain, france, not a lot of good choices, so they're buying our notes. and they would -- that would continue. at least until

the treasury has chosen unwisely. the net effect is that we are not yet paine the real market price -- paying the real market price for this huge debts. i do not think that is your intention to facilitate this fiscal irresponsibility, but it is the unintended consequence of these extremely low interest rates. that is just one example. to your testimony, you've raised the possibility that if economic circumstances warranted, you would consider it opened the door to an additional round of securities purchases. my concern is that what is wrong with this economy is not fundamentally monetary policy. it is other things. i would just ask you to comment on what you see that is wrong with our economy that qe3 with six. what is your theory that another round of securities purchases would generate the economic growth that we lack? >> to go back to facilitation issue, our goal is to try to meet our mandate of maximum employment and price stability. that is why we monitor monetary policies. i do not think our policies would bring

the thing is treasury will always make sure it has enough cash to pay the interest. that will be the highest priority. >> right. >> it won't even be a thought process. that will be the highest priority, i believe, having worked there. so you will make sure to have enough cash to pay that. the problem is, there's another -- it's $39 billion -- $41 billion in total costs that day. so you don't have anywhere near enough money to make all the other payments. that's the day the quarterly refunding auction closes. >> you have to have the ability to pay that. >> that's right. $27 billion worth of new money has to come in and buy a ten-year security and that's the challenge. >> the rising possibility that congress does fail to raise the debt ceiling has resulted in credit rating agencies threatening to review america's sterling aaa credit rating. ben bernanke testified before congress last week. and he said, it doesn't actually matter whether you do some of the juggling that you're talking about. the credit markets will see this as a default one way or the other. if you pay

according to the daily treasury statement for july 26, treasury has $5 billion sitting idle at the federal reserve. treasury can call up that -- well, they can call up the fed right now and get that $5 billion in cash. treasury has roughly $90 billion in mortgage-backed securities that it bought in the financial crisis to bail out the housing markets. it sold $10.6 billion just last month of those. treasury can go out and sell more next week if it is worried about not having cash to pay seniors. it could raise almost $60 billion -- almost $80 billion. there are many more options for treasury to get cash, and if the administration had any concern for seniors, it would have had its officials working hard since at least may, which was one of the early dates they informed us, although there are even earlier dates than that, to ensure that enough cash is available in august. treasury can easily have $50 billion of cash on august 3 to pay our seniors if it wants to do that. why, then, did the president choose to strike fear into all of our nation's seniors? why would the president say to our sen

so the treasury situation that charlie is talking about is one of the crisis that we could face if we don't resolve it quickly. >> in the fall of 08. congress rejected president bush's first tarp request to rescue the banks. markets led for change and talk at the time. and the bond market . if this doesn't come true . it will form a speedy and faster decision . is that the right way. who knows. starting tomorrow. i got off of the phone with tony . he is a bond genius. and the guy covered the bond markets and when will see cracks. >> tomorrow, early evening and the s&p 500 start to trade and asian markets open hours before ours do. watch for the futures trading and so we might get indthat there is real concern about the lack of decision or a lack of clarity on the debt ceiling issue. >> the only market that was up saudi arabia up five percent and they are in a different world i know it is hotter there than it is here. >> barely . is there a sense, but adam is there a sense that you get that you get that wall street is sort of whistling past the grave yard. we were up with 200 points an

it would basically be almost a pure discretion of the president and the treasury secretary. well, really the president as to where they spent that money. >> yes. but you would want to fund military active duty. you would want to fund veterans program as we continue to watch for speaker boehner on the right side of the screen who is going to be giving a news conference literally seconds from now. you would want to fund unemployment insurance. you would want this 14 million unemployed people out there and we want to continue to give them a helping hand. we would want to continue to fund temporary assistance for needy families. a.k.a. welfare. the welfare program that dates back to the clinton era. there is a lot of things we would want to fund. some as you put it, chris, some things would just have to go unfunded at least for some period of time and those will be painful any way you put it, it could be fbi investigations that don't get funded. it could be any number of really important things but it will likely fall to the president and the treasury secretary to make those deci

the treasury secretary and the president's budget director refusing point blank to say if the socialecks will go out if no debt dole is reached. my guest says not saying anything is the only responsible thing to say. welcome to the program. i say, sir, it is not out irresponsible and it is intimidating and threatening and divisive to hold out that let that social security checks will in the go out when you know that the money will be coming in, in august, to cover at least social security checks and more. >>guest: well, that true for the entire month of august but, remember, checks have to be paid at the date they are due and based on whether there is actual money in the account. the way money flows into august twit not all come in at the start of the month. >>stuart: i understand that, are you saying the treasury secretary cannot move around a couple of billion at the end of july to make sure there is enough money on august 3rd? he could do that. he is not going to do that. and he is holding them. he was pressed very hard and so was mr. lew. will the machine go -- money go out on ti

department which returned the funds to the bank, which sent the money back to the treasury department which gun returned the funds to the bank. -- which again returned the money to the bank. >> chase bank bought washington mutual and nobody could find his money. >> i said let's try 7 on your side. >> we contacted chase bank and they said washington mutual bank issued a check two years ago but no one ever cashed it. so chase issued a new check and finally nathaniel has his tax refund. chase bank says this was complicated involving several third parties but we're glad we resolved the situation to the customers zblafgs i was about to go crazy. i'm glad he got his money. >> 7 on your side was really helpful in getting the process started. >> it shows how important it is to look at a bank's policy before making a deposit. many banks do not accept checks written to a third party. i'm michael finney, 7 on your side. >> 25 years ago, there were very few support groups fighting cancer in the east bay. one of the first celebrated a major milestone. cecilia vega reports the women's cancer resear

help to sell the treasuries to investors to come in and talk about the situation as the debt ceiling limit looms. it was a regularly scheduled meeting, because on wednesday is normally the day that the treasury would announce the next action of debt, but obviously, that comes after the deadline. from bankers we talked to and senior treasury officials, they didn't really outline any contingency plans about what would happen if the debt ceiling deadline is not extended. a number of bankers have told me they anticipate what would happen is that those debt auctions would likely be postponed. we saw it happen back in 1995 when the government was shutdown. it was postponed for several weeks in terms of the auction, because essentially, if the government doesn't have the authority to increase that, then the treasury can't issue more debt. the bankers we talked to didn't go into any particulars, but they said a number of scenarios discussed and issues discussed, but at this point nobody knows what is going to happen, but the one thing that everybody in the room agreed to is that it is very i

well the treasury secretary pull the plug? if not, don't they have the same problem we have that with the current system? >> that is the risk. but if you have them separated out and you don't have and there isn't confusion with a safety net that has been, then i think their capital standards -- the market will demand more and the market will pay more attention to it because if you subject them to the real bankruptcy laws, then it becomes a greater risk to those creditors that are outside. right now the assumption is, because you are tied to the safety net, the safety net will because the impact on the primary financial institution will be the main concern and can't take any chances of you bail out over here. that is why the one to limit their ability to do it. that is what is behind that. understand, i am not saying crises go away. i am not saying risk of goes away. i am sending it gets better allocated, better price, and therefore we can handle the crisis that will inevitably come, more successfully, without a 10% unemploymen

government doesn't pay its bills, so we're going to start pulling our money out, and the u.s. treasury has to start to raise interest rates in order to attract more money to pay off our bills, that means higher interest rates for businesses, that means higher interest rates for consumers. >> the international monetary fund, the imf, with its new head, christine legarde, says that financial markets would face a "severe shock. "if the u.s. does not move to increase its more borrowing authority. house speaker john boehner says the focus should be more on cutting our massive $14 trillion debt, not making a new borrowing deadline. >> nobody believes the united states will walk away from its obligations. dealing with this debt problem and this deficit problem is far more important than meeting some artificial date created by the treasury secretary. >> question, why has the debt ceiling caused a political impasse? pat buchanan. >> the democrats don't want to give up on their entitlement program and takes cuts and things like medicare. secondly and more important, republicans aren't going to g

this time, the treasury says there is no room for a last- minute deal. as negotiations drag on, credit rating agencies have threatened to downgrade america's credit. if they do, that will increase the cost to borrow money adding even more to the federal debt. whit johnson, cbs news, washington. >> mitchell: for more perspective on the debt talks and the politics behind them, we are joined in washington by our political analyst in washington, john dickerson. good evening. >> good evening. >> mitchell: give us an idea of the dynamics of a meeting like this. >> president obama is making a last pitch for that bigger deal, something close to $4 trillion in deficit reductions, arguing to republicans that if he's willing to take heat from democrats on the idea of trimming entitlements like social security and medicare, they should be open to the idea of raising revenue through doing something in the tax code. he'll say this is a unique moment. it may not be his last shot to make this case, but if in the next day or so he can't make some progress on this bigger d

first the very latest this saturday morning. treasury secretary tim geithner still working on contingency plans, in case, just in case no debt deal is reached and the federal government would have to decide who gets paid and who does not, because he won't have enough money to meet all of our obligations. fears mounting we could be seeing a major market selloff in that event in less than 48 hours, if investors don't like what comes out of this emergency meeting scheduled for less than an hour from now from the white house. credit agencies are threatening to downgrade america's pristine ratings and our charlie gasperino says get this, the downgrade could come as early as monday. and we'll be bringing you live reports on the massacre in norway, it gets worse. police there now are investigating if a second suspect took part in a deadly shooting at a youth camp. the a least 84 confirmed dead. most of them kids and said to be the same person that set off a massive explosion in oslo killing seven there. capitol hill, the house and senate leader

the treasury secretary says that's just not a balanced approach. who control the house to say, sorry, no tax increases, period, even when they're looking at getting potentially $4 trillion in spending cuts? >> david, we don't know what the deal was because we haven't seen the details, but if you look at how we got into this mess and look at the growth of the private economy and you look at the relative growth of government spending versus the growth in tax revenues, the revenues are not what's out of balance. it's the spending that's out of balance. you can't be a fair-minded person and say look at this thing over the last 10, 20 years, and say that it is the revenues that have somehow not kept pace with the private economy. what's happened is government spending has gone up way beyond that. that's how we got in the hole. so, you have to define balance in context. >> all right, but are you saying -- would you be open to any revenue increases if it would help you get a deal on the scale of trillions of dollars of spending cuts? >> the united states

for forcing the treasury to borrow? congress has set how much the executive branch can collect, because congress has that power of the purse. and now we're telling the president, do all that we have told you to do, but without enough money and now don't borrow. well, we all learned in civics class that congress has the power to make laws and the power of the purse. we learned that the president has the solemn obligation to faithfully execute the laws congress has passed. that is the basic structure of american government. outside of a few narrow and specific areas that are assigned to exclusive judicial authority by the our constitution, the constitutional rule is clear: congress instructs the president, by law, what to do, and the president faithfully executes those laws. but what happens if congress won't instruct clearly? what happens under our constitution when faithfully executing one law congress has passed requires the president to fail to faithfully execute other laws? how can the president faithfully execute i a

unless we get a republican president. >> to follow-up on the press -- on a question, do you think the treasury secretary nominee would be the kind of nominee that could be subject to a filibuster? there have been other nominees currently being blocked by senate republicans. is that something washington should gird itself for? >> it's hard to make a prediction on what people do not knowing who the nominee is. what i would argue for is we should try to get someone in as an appreciation of the marketplace and business. the biggest complaint i have had with this administration, and i talk to business people every day, they think this is the most anti-business administration we have had. business is beleaguered. many of the folks in this administration have never run businesses. we would like to see someone with business experience and someone who believes in the free marketplace, who believes in capitalism and who believes in the greatness of what america has produced in the past and could produce in the future. but that is not meeting we need more shovel-ready jobs. we need more relief for the bu

>> listen, at the appropriate point, the treasury department will obviously lay out for the american people how this is going to operate. our focus right now is solving this problem. if we're not able to reach a deal, then treasury's going to have to report to the american people exactly how this is going to happen. >> chairman mullen is in afghanistan. he told our troops fighting there he didn't know the answer to when and where they would get paid. will the president insist that if there's a default, the troops will get paid? >> again, the treasury department -- by the way, whatever admiral mullen talked about, it's outrageous that here we are, 60 hours away from the united states of america potentially defaulting for the first time. and the reason we're here is that, particularly republicans in the house, but republicans generally had been unwilling to compromise. so, at the appropriate point, if we get to that point, the treasury department will lay out clearly for the american people, most importantly for investors, folks around the world, exactly what would happen if we default.

the nation's heartland. here's how. most analysts agree that interest rates on u.s. treasury bonds would quickly rise and that would push all interest rates higher, including new mortgages, credit cards, car and small business loans, eventually affecting prices for everything we buy. meanwhile the bipartisan policy center estimates the government would immediately have to slash spending by 44%. president obama would ultimately have to choose between cutting military salaries, unemployment benefits, student loans, defense contracts, federal law enforcement, courts, civil service jobs, medicare and interest rate payments to u.s. bondholders. despite the social security trust fund, analysts say those checks would still be at risk. the former director of the congressional budget office. >> all the money comes into the treasury and all the money goes out and when you're working in real time dollars are dollars. and so social security is just like everything else. >> reporter: while skeptics disagree over whether august 2 is a true deadline for when the country defaults, most analy

catch more of chris wallace interview with john boehner and he talked to the treasury-secretary geithner. tune in after we go on off the air at 6:00 p.m. right here on the fox news channel. >> heather: a fox news alert, police in norway saying the man who has confessed to killing at least 93 people could be in court as early as monday. investigators now taking a closer look at a nearly 2,000 page man at the time oh that was written by the suspect. part diary, part political ideology, his writings offer on glimpse in the deranged planning that went into this weekend's attack. gregburk is streaming live from oslo, norway. >> reporter: if you are interested in criminal psychology or getting in the mind of a psychopath you have a lot of material to work with all that the suspect in this case left. it really a ton of it out there. police saying today that he claims he was acting alone but they are still checking that out. another thing that police are saying he did have a lot of ammunition with him when he was caught. there is some debate about how long it took police to get him and amplify a

the treasury has money that would last to tend of the week. the folks who have the authority to pass this thing. my guess is you're going to see an 11th hour teal between the senate and the house. they don't want the markets to open on monday with this still really much in limbo. >> all right. luke, we're enjoying looking at your confirmation photograph up now. i don't if you have the television on. you're a handsome sun of a gun who is can quote biggy smalls at 5:30 in the morning. >> happy birthday, willie. god bless you. >> bye. >>> christine lagarde is expressing her concerns about the debt. in a speech in no, yesterday she explained the far-reaching consequences of not just the default but also of the subsequent downgrade. >> the clock is ticking. there has to be sufficient plans in order to address the issue of the sovereign debt, of the debt ceiling because frankly to have a default or to have, you know, a significant downgrading of the united states signature would be a very, very, very serious event, not for the united states alone bu

>> schieffer: today on "face the nation," no big deal but maybe a smaller one on cutting the deficit. treasury secretary tim geithner is in the studio this morning to talk about the impact on jobs and the economy if congress and the white house can't come up with a plan to raise the debt ceiling. but as negotiators head back to the white house tonight to try to hammer out a deal, the outlook for agreement is uncertain. >> this is a rubic's cube that we haven't quite worked out yet. >> schieffer: the president urged republicans to work toward a grand bargain, a budget plan to save $4 trillion over the next 10 years. >> both sides are going to have to step outside of their comfort zones and make political sacrifices. >> schieffer: last night, speaker boehner said the president's grand plan was too much. they'd have to settle for something less. but what? we'll ask senate republican jeff sessions of alabama and florida's democratic senator bill nelson. it's all ahead on "face the nation." captioning sponsored by cbs "face the nation" with cbs news chief washington correspondent bob schieffer. and

who the country since the 1870's were on the cold so they kept all of the golden the treasury and if you wanted to redeem you're gold certificates, you could. in the 18 eighties and nineties new states came into the union montana, colorado, nevada, a silver mining states. and they began to clamor for silver to be a unit of currency. they have all-out -- a lot of clout and congress that came in quickly and in 1819 a past of bill hof that require the treasury 2 x 4 point* 5 million ounces of silver every month. >> but this cause rapid inflation as the currency poured into the markets. but those in the west tour gold mining states did not mind because they could sell to the treasury in the farmers in the south in the midwest to rich and dads, is still recovering from the civil war, but that is how you pay off your debts which is cheaper than the money that you borrowed. they needed a lot of money in their pockets. back east, the bankers and industrialists to were lending the money did not think about the inflation because it devalue their money that they had. it set up a sectional battle

that's how investors across the globe have viewed u.s. treasury bonds. is that about to change? and what, if anything, should you do about it? with the u.s. credit rating under review, we thought now was a good time to take a hard look at the role treasuries should play in your portfolio. for answers, darren gersh spoke with kathleen gaffney, the co- manager of the $20 billion loomis sayles bond fund. >> you have zero invested in the treasury market right now. >> zero. >> $20 billion bond fund. >> yes. >> what does that say about the treasury market? >> it says we don't think it's very attractive. we don't think it's attractive in the short term because of the potential volatility. why take the risk? i'd rather be in a u.s. corporate bond, because corporate balance sheets are in good shape. i'd rather be invested in canadian government for good liquidity and a little bit of additional yield for a company that is practicing fiscal discipline. >> for the last 30 years, people have been told, you want safety, you need to have some treasury bonds if your portfolio. you know, they're

the chinese government holds $1.6 trillion in u.s. treasuries. the concern is growing that those investments may not be safe as they once were, and that the country may be forced to slow down its buying if the u.s. loses its triple-a credit rating. the reaction has not been positive to the wrangling in washington over the debt limit. here in new york the stock market was down friday because of uncertainty over what will happen. the dow dropped 97 points and the government starts running out of money on tuesday. >>> earlier i spoke with annie lowery, economic and business reporter for slate to see how the markets are, indeed, reacting. >> they are not freaking out, but they are not happy either. if you look at what happened in the stock market, it was the worst week for the stock market in a year. they're not pleadsed, but they are not panicking either. i think that the stock market beliefs that there is going to be a resolution to this, and we'll see that before the august 2nd or august 10th deadline. whenever it is that treasury would actually ge

president obama today urged lawmakers to achieve a bipartisan extension of the debt limit, which the treasury secretary says will be reached tuesday. house speaker john boehner's third version of a bill to do just that awaits a vote in a matter of moments. all of this happens against the backdrop of new numbers account inning the gross domestic product numbers were much worse. we look at how those numbers may affect the president, but we begin with mike emanuel on the debt ceiling vote. >> moments ago speaker john boehner passionately rallied his republican members on the floor of the house. it's been a challenging week for the speaker as the debt plan has been delayed several times and adjusted. after the vote, in a matter of minutes, the pressure will shift to the senate, and the search for compromise. after fine-tuning his debt plan again to include a balanced budget amendment to secure enough republican votes to pass, speaker john boehner made his final pitch. >> i stuck my neck out a mile to try to get an agreement with the president of the united states -- i stuck my neck out a mile --

>> i don't think anyone in the world cares much who's the treasury secretary. people care that the economy is not recovering, and he is the leading representative of it other than the president himself. things were getting better in may. they stopped getting better. this is a problem in substance, and it's a problem politically. shuffling around the boxes doesn't matter, but the lack of a sense that anything is getting better or there's a plan to get things better is a big, big problem. >> jeff, there's absolutely no question you're right and it's a critical observation. people care about the economy, not whose name is in the box, treasury secretary, council of economic advisers. but to the extent the public is looking at the white house and saying you're rudderless. there seems to be a shortage of ideas, there seems to be internal debate about what to do next and now this debate between the president and the republicans, this doesn't help. >> the discussion in washington seems to be entirely about the deficit. that's not the big problem in this country. the big

secretary geithner, secretary of the treasury, has talked about this. he has read the 14th amendment aloud at a press conference and went on to say as part of a negotiating strategy you can't say if things don't go my way i'm going to force the townhouse default not pay the bills pred says tores by congress. not a credible negative yalgt strategy and not going to happen. where do you stand on this idea that the 149 amendment may give the president some staff. >> secretary geithner is mistaken. section 4 of the 14th amendment reads in pertinent part that the debt of the united states as authorized by law shall be held in violet. what that means is not that the secretary of the treasury or the president can unilaterally raise the debt limit, but because it refers to the term authorized by law, as authorized by law, that's referencing congress' power, pursuant to article 1 section 8 clause 2 of the constitution. to incur debt in the name of the united states. what's that's been authorized, it has to be honored. what that actually says is we may not default.

so the treasury would have to decide, do we send social security checks or paychecks? do we give tax returns or send farm subsidies? do we pay the light bill or the gas bill? and they've never had to do this before because every time in the past has come down to the buyer -- has come down to the wire and they always raise it. the republicans have suggested that it's not so hard and the administration has said it is hard, it would be a disaster. and in fact a lot of former republican treasury officials and budget officials are pretty close to the administration on this one. >> how dire is this? we just saw the foot and from what's happening in greece, are we headed toward being another greece? this all could have so many international repercussions. >> right. i think it would be a big deal if the u.s. government couldn't pay its debts but i don't think that's where we're going to end up. we're not greece. greece is a small economy, greece is way, way deeper in hot than we are. people have lots of options where to put money and greece is low on their list because they thi

the thing to concentrate on, though, and it may be important in terms of what the treasury market hasou about the deal is you haven't seen any kind of move there from an anticipation perspective. the fact that the ten-year treasury yield stay around 3% is telling you that the market has felt that we were going to get a deal, and that a downgrade was unlikely and given the news today, it looks like we're getting closer to the point where we can see, the treasury market was right. yes, the risk down the road, not yet reflected in the yields, was that yields would go up dramatically. >> the concern in a scenario of that, everybody feels we'll get closer to the deal when we have optimistic moments like this. what about unexpectedly was a deal cracks apart when it comes to the house of pretives? >> t.a.r.p. might have been a lesson to a lot of political leaders when facing something as dire as we are now. i think thz realization of the implications of default. the impetus is there to get a deal done and there on both sides. >> thank you so much. >> thanks for having me. nation of at&t and

so the treasury would have to decide, do we send social security checks or paychecks? do we give tax returns or send farm subsidies? do we pay the light bill or the gas bill? and they've never had to do this before because every time in the past has come down to the buyer -- has come down to the wire and they always raise it. the republicans have suggested that it's not so hard and the administration has said it is hard, it would be a disaster. and in fact a lot of former republican treasury officials and budget officials are pretty close to the administration on this one. >> how dire is this? we just saw the foot and from what's happening in greece, are we headed toward being another greece? this all could have so many international repercussions. >> right. i think it would be a big deal if the u.s. government couldn't pay its debts but i don't think that's where we're going to end up. we're not greece. greece is a small economy, greece is way, way deeper in hot than we are. people have lots of options where to put money and greece is low on their list because they thi