you can be thomas jefferson or you can be mike pence. >> all right.d new audio from our next guests' interview with former president trump at mar-a-lago. joining us now is the co-author of the book "i alone can fix it, donald j. trump's final catastrophic year," phillip rucker, senior washington correspondent for "the washington post" and political analyst for msnbc and nbc news. i want to first ask you what you were thinking when he was talking about mike pence and thomas jefferson? i want to know what was going through your head. >> first of all, mika, i was thinking this is not constitutional what president trump wanted pence to do, but it was also a way to talk about a vice president who we all watched for four years as the loyal steadfast sick koe fan tick side kick. one of the reasons that trump picked pence was because he was a statue, he would stand over trump's shoulder, smiling looking adoreingly of everything that trump did. and yet january 6th it seemed to be the breaking point and it's ironic what trump expected him to be a statue when he

then even people that started to think differently about it, someone like thomas jefferson even understoodhe irony within this injustice but knew that another way it could cause problems but they paper themselves to this corner they are scared of the problem that they created. >> so that fear of those that have some reservations about the general concept of slavery you cannot give those people guns because now afraid we will get retribution. >> so you have that skittishness in front of the columnist to look at slavery and say this is an abomination but jefferson said i fear that god is just in the rest of that quotation is heth will come back and get us for this. [laughter] there's nothing we can do about it. so the kicking the can down the street, being unwilling to dismantle slavery being unwilling to even conceptualize that freedom of the quite for black people and a slave that the language and the freedom of democracy and equality coursing through that era would somehow be permeable to the confines into that enslaved community and they have the ideas in their heads but they are ready k

john adams and thomas jefferson, as washington's successors as president, expanded the executive reach further. jefferson, after some uncertainty, authorized the purchase of the louisiana territory from the polian bonaparte in 1803. and like washington, refused congressional demands for documents, pleading executive privilege. while adams and jefferson as president tried dangerously on civil liberties as they enforced the alien and sedition acts under adams and embargo acts under jefferson. so hesitant as the founders were about presidential power, the structure they created has turned out to be a durable one. the restraints posed on the office have insured the control of military affairs remains in civilian hands, the impeachment power has not led to any usurping of the executive branch by congress or the judiciary. but in every significant point of dispute over the president's powers, the resolution has almost invariably gone in the executive's favor. nor is that a new development. as we have seen, it began with the very first president. let me stop there, and having set the table, l

and then even people that i think started to think differently about it, someone like thomas jeffersonven, for example, understood the irony within this injustice but knew that if you went another way, it would cause problems. and because they kind of painted themselves in thisve corner whee now they are scared of the problem that they created. i hadn't ever quite thought of it in exactly those terms and was, you know, that fear may haveve impeded even the people that had some reservations about the general conception of slavery butge like, well, hey, e can't give those people guns because i'm now afraid that we'll get retribution. talk about that a little bit more. >> and so you had kind of skittishness in some of the colonists who were, who look at slavery and said this is an abomination. but you had those, like jefferson, who said i fear that god is just. and the rest of that quote is he will come back and get us for this, basically. [laughter]g there's, like, nothing we can do about it. so that kicking the can down the street, beingwi unwilling to dismantle slavery, being unwilling

even people that think differently about it even like thomas jefferson understood the irony with the injustice but new that they painted themselves into a corner where now they stare at the problems they created a never thought of it in exactly those terms at the theater could have impeded the people that had some reservations about the general concept of slavery. but we cannot give them guns because now i'm afraid we will get retribution so talk about that a little bit more. >> so you have that skittishness in some of the columnist look at slaveryt in said this is an abomination and jefferson said that that there's nothing we can do about it and god will come back and get us so to be unwilling to dismantle slavery an unwilling to even conceptualize what freedom look like for black people and the language of freedom and democracy and equality coursing through that era and to live outside of the white can find into the community and that gets the wrong idea but they already knew what freedom was and what they had was not it that is part of the anxiety and the ink stand fear with a ser

and then, even people who started to think differently about it, someone like thomas jefferson for example, understood the irony within this injustice. but new if you went another way it wouldve cause problems in the kind of painted themselves in a corner or they are scared of the problem they created. i had not quite thought of it in those exact terms. that fear may have impeded the people who had some reservations about the general concept of slavery. but we cannot give those people guns because i am now afraid we will get retribution. talk about that ae little bit more. >> and so you had the skittishness and some of the colonists who looked at slavery and said this is an abomination. but youou had those who said i fear god is just. the rest of that quote he will come back and get us for this. but there's like nothing we can do about it. that's kicking the can down the street being able to dismantle slavery being unwilling tod conceptualize what freedom would look like with black people. the language of freedom of democracy and equality that was coursing through that era would somehow be

and then even people that i think started to think differently about it, someone like thomas jefferson even, for example, understood the irony within this injustice, but knew that if he went another way, it would cause problems, and they kind of painted themselves into this corner where now they are scared of the problem that they created, and i hadn't ever quite thought of it in exactly those terms. it was, you know, that fear may have impeded even the people that had some reservations about the general concept of slavery like hey we can't give those people guns because i'm now afraid we will get rhett ri rugs. -- retribution. talk about that a little bit more. >> you had the kind of skittishness in some of the colonists who were -- who looked at slavery and said this is an abomination, but you had those like jefferson who said i fear that god is just. and the rest of that yet is basically he's going to come back and get us for this. but there's like nothing we can do about it. so that kicking the can down the street, being unwilling to dismantle slavery, being unwilling to even conce

so when thomas jefferson says i fear that god is just, that since retribution is there. it's that they're going to do to us what we did to them. but when you really look at what the movement for equality is about, it is to be able to live free. it is to be able to live a life . it's not about retribution. it is about being able to have a job and get paid what you're worth. it's about being able to have quality occasion, access quality healthcare, have your full citizenship rights. >> once again everybody, the book we're speaking about is "the second: race and guns in a fatally unequal america". i'd encourage all of you to get a copy of this book and hopefully discuss it with people in your life but if you have questions for professor anderson please, we will get to some of those in just a minute. i'm curious, move on to the kind of 1950s, 1960s rights era. you have these parallel tracks where you can have the more militant wing of it so this would be kind of the malcom x of the world and you'd have the kind of nonviolent martin luther king cited which was much more brace

and so when thomas jefferson says i fear that god is just. yes. so that sense of retribution is there. it's that they're going to do to us as we did to them. but when you really look at what these movements for equality are about, it is to be able to live free. it is to be able to live a whole life. it is not about retribution. it is about being able to have a job and get paid what you're worth. about being able to have ali education. access to qualityhealthcare, to have your full citizenship rights . >> once again, the book we're speaking about is the second race and guns in a fatally unequal america . we encourage all of you to get a copy of this book, read it and hopefully discuss it with people in your life and ifyou have questions for professor anderson but those in there and we will get to those in just a bit . i'mcurious , let's move on to the 1950s 1960s whole rights era. we do have these parallel tracks where you're going to have the ball more militant wing of it so that would be the malcom x of the world and the nonviolent side of it whi

and the last thing that adam said was thomas jefferson still lives and actually jefferson had died earlier. later monroe dies on july 4th 1831 madison's trying to make it a quartet but he misses he dies on june 28th. 1836 um henry david thoreau decides to really put the clamps on it by going out to walden on july 4th 1845. so it really wasn't the right date, but we've made it the right date and we celebrate this coming forth appropriately because the founders and their own way have decided to make it. okay. what a great story now. which return to the comments that are the questions that are coming in from the from the listeners and i remind you put your questions in the q&a box. we have someone who is asking for you to give a perspective on how do you think about today's supreme court decision that upheld the arizona restrictions on voting? how do you think the founders would have? perceive that um that's going to be difficult to answer. the founders in their original formulation in philadelphia in 1787 didn't believe the supreme court was supreme. that is to say the notion of the supreme

ask thomas jefferson about the declaration of independence. .. .. >> freedom from oppression.we have our constitutional monarchy about to take place. the king will not endorse this until october the 6th of 17899. and this is -- 1789. and this is prompted if by a grand event called the women's march, the march on their side. indeed, there's still a problem with acquireing wheat to feed the people, and many of these heads of household thought they would take action into their own hands. so, thus, they decided to march the 11 miles to versailles, and they brought some weapons with them. and being that lafayette was the head of the paris national guard, to keep order out of this chaos, he escorted them. and soon thousands upon thousands of these women and a few men were with them and the national guard marched to versailles, and they were demanding of the baker and the baker's wife their grain. well, they did march to versailles, and many thought they would storm the palace at versailles and perhaps even kill the king and queen. but lafayette himself, well, he mounted the balcony

ask thomas jefferson about the declaration of independence. .. .. >> freedom from oppression.we have our constitutional monarchy about to take place. the king will not endorse this until october the 6th of 17899. and this is -- 1789. and this is prompted if by a grand event called the women's march, the march on their side. indeed, there's still a problem with acquireing wheat to feed the people, and many of these heads of household thought they would take action into their own hands. so, thus, they decided to march the 11 miles to versailles, and they brought some weapons with them. and being that lafayette was the head of the paris national guard, to keep order out of this chaos, he escorted them. and soon thousands upon thousands of these women and a few men were with them and the national guard marched to versailles, and they were demanding of the baker and the baker's wife their grain. well, they did march to versailles, and many thought they would storm the palace at versailles and perhaps even kill the king and queen. but lafayette himself, well, he mounted the balcony

as thomas jefferson that about the declaration of independence. .. >> about to take place, the king willrse this until october the sixth of 1789. this is prompted by a grand event called the women's march, the march on their side. indeed, there is still a problem with acquiring to feed people and many of these heads of households get tired of this and i thought they would take the action into their own hands. so they decided to mark the 11 miles from paris itself and they brought some weapons with them and being that lafayette was the head of the paris national guard, he was the gatekeeper order of the chaos of this revolution, he has courted them and soon thousands upon thousands of these women in human were with them in the national guard marched on their side and they were demanding of the baker and the baker's wife. they did march and many thought they would storm the palace and perhaps even kill the king and queen lafayette himself, while he mounted the balcony and kissed marie antoinette's hand and so said, averted the chaos and the crisis of the situation and finally the king, lou

as thomas jefferson that about the declaration of independence. .. >> about to take place, the king willrse this until october the sixth of 1789. this is prompted by a grand event called the women's march, the march on their side. indeed, there is still a problem with acquiring to feed people and many of these heads of households get tired of this and i thought they would take the action into their own hands. so they decided to mark the 11 miles from paris itself and they brought some weapons with them and being that lafayette was the head of the paris national guard, he was the gatekeeper order of the chaos of this revolution, he has courted them and soon thousands upon thousands of these women in human were with them in the national guard marched on their side and they were demanding of the baker and the baker's wife. they did march and many thought they would storm the palace and perhaps even kill the king and queen lafayette himself, while he mounted the balcony and kissed marie antoinette's hand and so said, averted the chaos and the crisis of the situation and finally the king, lou

the secretary of state, thomas jefferson, said that a national debt was simply a fraud on future generations. the secretary of treasury, alexander hamilton, said that a national debt was a blessing. i believe it can be either. when this country was founded, there were no roads, bridges, sewers, lighting. if you are improving the lives of the people here in america by building that structure, a debt was a blessing. but in my generation, these wars, for trillions of dollars for these wars in vietnam, iraq, afghanistan and other places, to be borrowing between some of dollars is clearly a fraud on the future generations. i believe we are $28 trillion in debt. if you go back to russia and the united states, the difference in afghanistan with russia, russia went bankrupt in 10 years. it took america 20 years. we spent from 2001 to 2011, george butch said we will smoke out every cape in afghanistan to find bin laden. he was right in the heart of the pakistani military, and we were giving pakistan $10 million a year and they are just making complete full of the american taxpayer. i believe it is sa

washington, watch your step as pats around the title based on the flags stately memorials to thomas jefferson, f d r. martin luther king junior, could be muddy or under water. and what's happening has become a threat to our national security. we've characterized climate change as a threat multiplier for instability in fragile regions of the world. and now we see that even a new ocean in the arctic has opened up with geo political competition. potentially on the rise as access to resources and shipping lanes. a new trade route become more and more accessible in a new region of the world. and then we see extreme weather hitting all around the world, including our military bases right here at home, that have suffered devastating consequences just in the last few years, costing billions of dollars now of the american taxpayer money to repair in alaska . we see now permafrost is sinking infrastructure there collapsing infrastructure, including the some of the new infrastructure we're building in order to be able to defend against missile threat from russia, china, or north korea. if you feel at wi

and i'm speaking of course of thomas jefferson. the selected in 1900 with the support of revolutionary on the populace program to drain the washington swamp and replace the federalist judges and trace the national government and return power to the states. there was a situation that john marshall faced when john adams a lame-duck president. in his final months in office, appoints john marshall chief justice of the supreme court. and marshall did not really want this job. but each of you because no one else would. and with all the respect my host, the u.s. supreme court was professional dead and. in 1800, the court averaged six cases a year. mostly cases of little consequence. just a spent most of their time writing in the country carrying circuit cases and having to share beds with strangers. the supreme court was so insignificant at the design of the capitol they forgot to go to the courthouse. in a nondescript senate office, set of committee rooms, on the ground floor of the capitol building. which they had to share with the dist

special ownership of the separation of power because we think it was inspired -- an inspiration to thomas jefferson when he visited italy when he was an ambassador. so apart from everything else -- [laughter] apart from everything else, the exquisite, as i said, exquisite beauty of our institution is that no -- the separation of power just is a remarkable feature of a democracy. not only led by america but copied by other countries. we must protect it. and in doing so, protect our democracy. congratulations to all of you for bringing this forward now, and hopefully soon to the floor. thank you, mr. -- i yield the floor now to the distinguished chair of the intelligence committee, chairman adam schiff. mr. schiff: thank you, madam speaker. and we'd be pleased to take your questions. yes. reporter: the bill reads a rap sheet of trump-era abuses. republicans cite rebukes of trump as to not vote for certain legislation. so do you think this can pass the senate or the filibuster requirement 10 to pass legislation? mr. schiff: well, one step at a time. i hope we will be taking this up in the house this f

let's talk about tonight's main topic. 1815 john adams wrote to thomas jefferson and argue that the revolution is in the heart and mind of the people that 15 years before drop of blood was spilled in lexington and concorde and argues the war of independence and the revolution were two different things but was it really cracks our guest this evening is the assistant professor at north dakota state university former washington library research fellow and author of a brand-new book occupied america british military rule and the experience of revolution published 2020 university of pennsylvania press if you'd like to purchase a copy of that will drop a link in the comments at this time it's my distinct privilege to welcome doctor johnson to the screen. >> it's a great honor thank you for joining us in my correct assuming you come to us from fargo? >> i am. >> what is the temperature. >> this morning it was 5 degrees. >> and you have a heated garage. >> yes. [laughter] thank you very much i am excited to talk with you about this book. i was fascinated by refining in your discussion of the experienc

. >> i have two it has been to the thomas jefferson foundation and the

. >> thank you andrew i have also it is wonderful and thank you to the thomas jefferson for the wholee and thank you for participating i appreciate it. >> good evening everyone. welcome to our book club i have from the avon library and from the avonhe historical society in cosponsoring the program tonight if you have any questions at any point pop

>> george washington, thomas jefferson -- >> what else did you learn? ears. >> i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> a goal of america, half dream and half nightmare. ♪ when i die don't bury me at all ♪ ♪ hang me up on a spool next to a bobbin, so i can keep on working ♪ ♪ because i got the blues of the promised land ♪ ♪ i got the cotton mill blues ♪ ♪ got to work like hell ♪♪ >> 2 million children in the mills and the mines. 6 million grown-ups unemployed. >> why hire a man for a dollar when you can hire a kid for a dime? >> i was taught in my youth that it was the height of vulgarity to discuss money. a professor in chicago came up with a few statistics. an american family cannot adequately survive on less than $900 a year. the average working man earns about $400. ♪ when the union's inspiration through the worker's blood shall run ♪ ♪ there can be no power greater anywhere beneath the sun ♪ ♪ but the force on the earth is wea

i'm speaking of course of thomas jefferson. who was elected in 1800 with the support of revolutionary tribes on a populist program to drain washington swap, replace the federalistjudges, trick the national government and return power to the state . that was the situation that john marshall faced when john adams appointed their lame-duck president in his final months in office points john marshall chief justice of the supreme court. marshall did not really want this job. but he took it because no one else would . with all due respect to my hosts, the us supreme court was a professional dead-end. in 1800, the court heard an average of six cases a year. mostly cases of little consequence. justices spent most of their time riding around the country hearing circuit cases in taverns and having to share a bed with strangers. the supreme court was so insignificant that the designers at the capital forgot to build a courthouse. though marshall court met in a nondescript senate office, a set of committee rooms on the ground floor of the

. >> thank you andrew i have to it is wonderful and thank you to the thomas jefferson foundation andeam there and thank you to everybody for participating i appreciate it. good evening everyone we are with author terry

it's been wonderful and thank you to the thomas jefferson foundation and the whole team there and thankserybody for participating. really appreciate it. >> weekends on c-span2 are an intellectual feast. every saturday american history tv documents america's stories, and on sundays booktv brings you the latest in nonfiction books and authors. funding for c-span2 come from these television companies and more including mediacom. >> the world changed in an instant but mediacom was ready. internet traffic soared and we never slow down. schools and businesses when virtual and with power a new reality because at mediacom we are built to keep you ahead. >> mediacom along with these television companies supports c-span2 as a public service. >> sunday night on q&a jessica delong was chief engineer of the historic fire boat john jay harvey on september 11 when he was called back into service to eight firefighters following the attacks on the 20 hours in her book saved at the seawall she tells a story of the community of mariners who came to the rescue of thousands. >> the maritime evacuation delive

so when thomas jefferson says i fear that god is just, that since retribution is there. it's that they're going to do to us what we did to them. but when you really look at what the movement for equality is about, it is to be able to live free. it is to be able to live a life . it's not about retribution. it is about being able to have a job and get paid what you're worth. it's about being able to have quality occasion, access quality healthcare, have your full citizenship rights. >> once again everybody, the book we're speaking about is "the second: race and guns in a fatally unequal america". i'd encourage all of you to get a copy of this book and hopefully discuss it with people in your life but if you have questions for professor anderson please, we will get to some of those in just a minute. i'm curious, move on to the kind of 1950s, 1960s rights era. you have these parallel tracks where you can have the more militant wing of it so this would be kind of the malcom x of the world and you'd have the kind of nonviolent martin luther king cited which was much more brace

i have two and it's a wonderful event and thank you to the thomas jefferson foundation and the whole team there and thanks everybody for participating today. >> clearly his people who don't like democratic policies on the right. there's a well-known idea that if you are at -- and you wish to compel others to follow those that's what makes you an authoritarian but there's a lesser-known phenomenon. for a very long time social science suggested there was no such thing as left-wing authoritarianism and no people on the left. you might say yourself that doesn't make any sense. there are plenty of authoritarians and because there are so many social scientists sciences that lean to the left there is an attempt to avoid finding authoritarianism broadly enough to allow for the possibility of it. after several decades there was a political scientist who gave it three basic components. one was this idea that everybody who is not -- is inferior and the ideas if you don't believe like many members of the left you are a sexist they a given homophobe and just a jerk and you are not fit company for

it's been wonderful, and thank you to the thomas jefferson foundation and the whole team there, and thanks, everybody, for participating. really appreciate it. >> weakens on c-span2 range of the best in american history and nonfiction books. this weekend marks the 20th anniversary of the 9/11 terrorist attacks. saturday at 19 a.m. eastern on american history evs american artifacts we will tour the flight 93 national memorial near shanksville, pennsylvania hearing the story behind the hijacking and passengers attempted to take control of the plane from terrorists who are heading to washington, d.c. .. >> his book "the only plane in the sky", an oral history of 9/11. at 4:15 p.m. eastern, pulitzer prize winning author "the looming tower, al qaeda and the road to 9/11" watch american history and book tv every weekend on c-span2 and find a full schedule on your program guide or visit c-span.org. >> 20 years ago september the 11th, 2001, two large commercial airliners flew into the world trade center buildings in new york city, 2, 763 people lost their lives. a few minutes later american airlin

in 1815, as many of you might know john adams wrote to thomas jefferson and argued that the revolutionrts and minds of the people in the 15 years before a drop of blood was spilt at lexington and concorde. : : : revolution. if you like to copy at this time, the privilege to welcome john mechling owner, thank you for bringing us my correct your coming -- >> yes temperature right now this morning when i drove to work was about 5 degrees above so a little nippy. >> you have a human long as i understand. >> yes. >> thank you, i am really excited to talk to you about this book. i was fascinated find your findings your experience people faced during the revolutionary war. i want to start with a big picture question. a lot of our colleagues have been writing a lot these days about ordinary americans during the revolution at women, slaves escaping and pursuing what was missing from that conversation? >> specifically from the question of loyalists and patriots, what's missing is people who wouldn't have identified either or could have identified as both throughout the world. there's this whole

independence could be achieved only upon a close union and continental confederation so when thomas jeffersonived 1776 he was torn and arguably did not want to be there. the commonwealth of virginia was about to debate the constitution and last of the virginia delegation to arrive in philadelphia now on a fellow delegate left for williamsburg jefferson in tact a copy of his draft constitution and from the preamble but not much else. and with the committee five to prepare the first draft of the declaration of independence jefferson and submit the mother submitted the draft a little more than two weeks after receiving the assignment and drafted that document and only a couple of days but then in 1776 seeing multiple committees of canadian affairs to drop the rules and regulations for congressional debate and participated in other matters. virginia was operating with a skeleton delegation with little opportunity to spread the work around. nevertheless, adam urge jefferson, as busy as he was to pan the draft as it would be better for him are measured rather than a divisive independent mind to tak

federalist cited as the democratic branch more necessary to have representatives in the legislature thomas jeffersoni would call upon to decide whether people should be admitted in the judicial department and then leave them out of the legislative they were very pro- jury that are critical way we check with governmental overreach and the way it is supposed to work until the supreme court allowed it to become a nonentity. i will be clear not just plea bargaining although that is the deathknell that it has undercut to limit what is told about the consequences that is another mistake so jurors still have a pretty good idea of why the punishment will be if they do then they can acquit if they think it's too much in a large proportion of the community has an idea for the going rate for crimes we see rates off acquittal are higher in those places if you are heavily policed community like the district of columbia, detroit and the bronx they have higher rates of acquittal so if you ask prosecutor to decide they will call that jury nullification and to write that is something awful but it is exactly the role

was discovered he was called on by the british and the french during the napoleonic wars and thomas jefferson used his vaccine as a goodwill gesture to send a vaccine to the lewis and clarke exploration in the wilderness with native american groups and the more modern version began with albert saban who many don't realize developed the oral polio vaccine gently with the soviets at the height of the cold war. the ussr got permission from the state department and the soviet counterpart whose son works at the fda and is a friend and colleague and got permission to work together. that's where the vaccine was developed shown to be safe and effective and led to the licensure of the polio vaccine and it happened again for smallpox eradication. we found a way to scale up preproduction of the smallpox version to take into tropical areas so wouldn't be destroyed by heat. americans believe the smallpox eradicate -- eradication campaign. it always relied on international cooperation and cooperation between countries which generally did not agree ideologically and were willing to put aside their ideologie

thomas jefferson said that, whether the people should be in the legislative or the judicial department it is better to leave them out of the legislative. they were very pro jury. it is a very critical way to check against governmental overreach. until the supreme court allowed his become a non-entity. it is not just plea-bargaining that takes jury out of the equation. that was a death nail. the court has undercut the jury in other ways as well. lemons on what the jury was told -- limits on what is told to the jury on the consequences of a case. even without the information jurors still have a pretty good idea what a punishment would be. they can acquit if they think it is too much. while a large proportion of the community has the idea of the going rate for a crime the rate of acquittal is higher. detroit, d.c., bronx have higher rates of acquittal. if you ask for a prosecutor to decide what is happening those cases they will call it jury notification and derided as something unlawful. it is exactly the role juries should be playing. if you cannot take your case to a jury because the t