. >> who's the famous catholic teacher, thomas keating? >> thomas keating, basil pennington. >> this is a very popular kind of technique that works within the roman catholic faith. so we have - when you think of the belief style, i mean, the best - the one that jumps right to mind might be the great institution of the roman catholic faith. but here, within that, we see the constant pressuring of the seeker style and thomas keating - >> and merton obviously did it - >> merton too. to get something that really, actually works. yeah. >> we're going to spend a week at darkowty in july at the clearing, and we're going to study the cloister walk by kathleen norris - >> isn't that a new book out, her new- >> she's got a new book, but it's not her book. okay. >> that's another great one. >> yeah. and it's very much in the same vein. she's not even catholic - she goes to a benedictine monastery - and her writings and her discoveries of her inner world are so incredible, just because of where she is, and the routine she has to follow as oblate. >> w