. >> caller: hi, i wonder if our guest has ever lived economic basic economics by thomas o. walther ribbon and as far as i'm concerned the federal reserve is keynesian and also the thing that he criticized about the drug deals is keynesian and i would like to ask a question, does he think economics is an art or science? i think it is a science. the same way the court of engineers can determine how water will flow when they determine where to put a dam. human nature is in the absolute that can be used to determine what economics this. >> host: in all your years in economics have you figured out whether it is an art or science? >> guest: is clearly more an art than science, it's not really very scientific at all except in the superstructure. we've got mathematics that look scientific. but when you peel away all the layers like on an onion in get down to the middle, with a lot of it is just pure judgment calls, people make their theories fit what ever they happen to believe forever philosophical reasons they believe in big government, smaller government, libertarians, socialist whateve