hacker mentality and that's this idea that anything can be improved, like no tmatter what t is, tim ferris has made a career on that premise. >> anything can be hacked as you said. >> what this place loves to do and the walls of silicon valley love to finance is people who disrupt. aren't they looking to you to take on the formula starbucks and we want something different, is that the game here? are they saying james go on and take these guys on head to head? >> it's not about competition. it is about seeing an opportunity, i think. there's a sense that certain large coffee companies are occupying the middle ground instead of a higher groundanymore. enthe higher ground looking at what's happened with the amount of income slowing towards the top of society, the higher ground i think to a lot of people is what's interesting and profitable now. so there's this investment in -- not the modification of luxury but bringing out luxurious thing that cost $5 that makes people happy to more people. >> there's a niche as america gets richer -- >> america is not getting richer. >> areas of san francis