john: tim miller accused you of having a deadly lack of political imagination. is that the truth, you are limited by conventional thinking? guest: i like to think i see the entire horizon. i have been on the rules committee, worked conventions before. i think setting up a whip operation to achieve something historic like that is really difficult and you do need the leadership from the top. i'm not seeing that either from the leadership of the republican national committee or enough elected leaders that have the influence with you the delegates are. guest: i think ted cruz would be the person who could do it in theory. john: we had a lot of efforts that went around to try to find a third-party independent candidate. now david french is out. where does that stand? is there any renewed interest in trying to go back to the original people or to others and say we need an independent candidate more than ever now? guest: i think there is. speaking on behalf of our principles pack, our effort was always focused on the nomination. they were never really interested in a t

john: tim miller, despite how rude you were to ben ginsberg, it was great to have you. love ben ginsberg. john: actually, probably because of how rude you were, it was great to have you. ben ginsberg, your first time on this set, we love you, and it was great that you were here. coming up, what a donald trump conference call with surrogates this week revealed about his campaign, right after these messages. ♪ ♪ mark: all rise hear ye, hear ye. this show is now in session. donald j trump, billionaire, is hearing objections from all quarters. the presumptive republican nominee is dealing with more reactions, pretty much all negative, to his comments about the mexican heritage of u.s. federal judge gonzalo curiel, who is overseeing that class-action lawsuit against trump university in california. we will go through who has said what lately on this. first, some breaking news from our colleagues at bloomberg politics. kevin cirelli, mike bender, and jennifer jacobs, first report on a red hot conference call that trump held today with some of his top surrogates, during which t

and tim miller, he's also here, jeb bush's former -- ran communications for jeb bush's campaign. how about that? amanda, paul ryan, what do you make of it? >> he needs to get his head screwed on straight. we need to look at the evolution of paul ryan over a short period of time. a few weeks ago he sat down and said he was not ready to endorse donald trump. even though nothing changed, he said he's ready to get on board. yesterday he stood before a press conference and said donald trump committed textbook racism. now he's behind closed doors telling people to get on board with the nominee? no, paul ryan, you are the messaging leader for this party. that's what you wanted to do. we put a legislative agenda on hold so you could teach us how to message. teach people how to message this problem because we are not going to get to a poverty agenda. we're not going to get to any of those items until we get our heads wrapped around donald trump and what we're going do with him. and by all of paul ryan's actions so far, he has no clue. >> tim miller, we should say that among other things y

by two amazing ginsberg and tim miller. gentlemen, good to see you.en on television, rules maestro that feet --and it electoral thief. you have been on television saying this can't happen, won't happen. tell me why you are so pessimistic even as the voices for a dump trump convention it louder. >> this is simply the political reality. itself is notge mechanically difficult. the political will to make history at a convention is much more difficult. >> forget about the political will. just in terms of the rules, and terms of what may be required coming your thing that is not the hard part? >> there are a couple of ways being floated. to me, the easiest way is to take the war you need a majority of delegates and you would make that a super majority of ballot.s for the first delegates would then be about of the second ballot. >> tim, to the question that been just raised about political the pulse on the never trump and the dump trump movement, tony what you think about that? is there a will to change at the convention? >> i think it is unlikely, but there

back with us, tim miller and david corn and so, tim, the dump trump movement is going to court and givement at this hour of how much life, how much possibility there is in dumping trump at the convention. >> look, from the legal standpoint, the facts are on their side. now, this is going to end up being a traditional convention rules fight and obviously, the rnc and the trump campaign are going to do everything they can, pull every lever they have to stop it. the delegates -- they are not bound to support donald trump. all of the delegates based on the rules of the last convention are unbound. if you saw the news today that the trump convention is the id ok kra si come to life with mike tyson and bobby knight and all of couple of prowrestling matchings away from this being a complete nightmare. i think every piece of bad news gives these delegates more mo to win the pr war. the facts are on their side. they're unbound. >> whenever i see mike tyson on a show or invited to something. i always wonder, who couldn't they get. how far down the list did they have to go. >> trump is going there

joining us now with reaction from washington tim miller, former communications director for the jeb bushmp. you're that pac anti-trump pac and guessing you think there's no way that trump has better voting totals than the polls are showing now. >> d,trump's words, man, sad.ed huh, eric? this is sad he's reduced to this coming up with conspiracy theories. this is a guy, trump, spent primary we had to listen to it, bragging about the poll numbers and now the polls aren't right all of a sudden. well, look. harry enton best poll data guy out there and looked at the primary and if you look at trump's results in the primary in each state on average he came in about 1% lower than his poll numbers so this is just a crazy theory coming up with. >> i love that but nate silver nailed all 50 states election cycle. however, he missed trump. the 538 said trump cannot be the nominee and he is the nominee. polls can be wrong. >> in the primary, they were right! and the trump guys all bragging about the polls. whole primary. and maybe some of the d.c. pundits no doubt they didn't believe it. they didn't

tim miller, thank you both for joining us.is instance, i will give pride a place to proximity rather than appealing this. i'm going to ask you about trump. dump trump, we're headed to cheefld pretty soon. what are the odds that trump will be dumped? >> i think the odds are pretty low, to be honest. it is a real chance and an opportunity to do so. the reality is that the delegates are unbound legally. and i think that there is going to be a legitimate objection to him at the convention and there should be because, look, donald trump is an extreme candidate. outside of the main stream of the republican party and there is a huge minority segment within the party that is not aligned with hill on the issues. he can't beat hillary clinton. >> before i go to kim, if that is the case, why have you failed so miserably at convincing the good people of your party to go ahead and dump this guy? >> well, look. we had a very fragmented field. there were 17 candidates. trump won 47, 48% of the vote. he never did win a majority of the party.

joining us now tim miller former communications direct for a for the jeb bush campaign. you were the pac anti-trump pac. i'm guessing you think there is no way that trump has better voting totals than polls are showing now? >> in trump's words, sad, huh eric. this is sad that he is reduced to this, coming up with conspiracy theories. this is a guy trump has spent the whole primaries bragging about husband poll numbers and now the polls aren't right all of a sudden. look, harrienton who writes at 538, the best poll guy out there examined this. he looked at the primaries and if you look at trumps results in the primary in each state on average he came in about 1% lower than his poll numbers. so this is just a theory he is coming up with. >> nate silver in fact nailed the last election cycle. he nailed all 50 states. however he missed trump. 538 said trump cannot be the nominee and he is the nominee. so polls can be wrong. >> in the primary they were right. he was bragging about the polls the whole primary. it was some of the d. krchltd pundits no doubt, they didn't believe

extent of which they can change the rules to sort of create this conscientious objector is an idea tim miller, who headed up the communications front for the anti-trump pac has been floating and it's interesting because it's really sort of trickling into either. all of these delegates bound to vote for donald trump want some kind of an out if they're not supporting him and it would be fascinating to see whether the rules committee can do something to make that happen. >> so josh, one of the rules committee members, i think, was actually quite. the genesis of something big. is that fair to categorize? >> i don't think it's a real thing. i've been talking to republicans about this. this is a trial balloon in the latest of several trial balloons floated by the never trump movement. and they're floating it to see how much traction it can get but i think there's a consensus amongst party leaders that this would not only be farfetched idea and logistically difficult but just really a doom scenario for the party whereby they would be accused of manipulating the votes of millions of republicans in th

joining us now tim miller former communications direct for a for the jeb bush campaign.you were .g you think there is no way that trump has better voting totals than polls are showing now? >> in trump's words, sad, huh eric. this is sad that he is reduced to this, coming up with conspiracy theories. this is a guy trump has spent the whole primaries bragging about husband poll numbers and now the polls aren't right all of a sudden. look, harrienton who writes at 538, the best poll guy out there examined this. he looked at the primaries and if you look at trumps results in the primary in each state on average he came in about 1% lower than his poll numbers. so this is just a theory he is coming up with. >> nate silver in fact nailed the last election cycle. he nailed all 50 states. however he missed trump. 538 said trump cannot be the nominee and he is the nominee. so polls can be wrong. >> in the primary they were right. he was bragging about the polls the whole primary. it was some of the d. krchltd pundits no doubt, they didn't believe the polls. but the polls showed it. >> i rem

they basically gave it a date and then -- but we thought, myself, rhett reese, paul wernick, and tim millere last six years. we all thought we were just summarily fired. >> seth: and that -- because otherwise they would have called you and told you. >> yeah, they would have maybe called us first and said, you know, are you available. >> seth: right. [ laughter ] >> or something. but no they just gave us a date off the whim. >> seth: that is fantastic. underneath the mask cause you look like yourself in the movie. >> yeah. >> seth: you're in uniform, and there's also some bad stuff happens to you. >> oh, real bad stuff. >> seth: and i wanna just show a photo because i'm very -- i have a question about this. >> yeah. >> seth: so that's you super ugly face. >> yeah. there's not a lot of detail in that but it's pretty -- yeah, it's pretty -- i look kinda like benjamin franklin, the bloodless ghost of benjamin franklin, maybe. >> seth: yeah. [ laughter ] >> had sex with radiation. >> seth: yeah. >> and then that was me. >> seth: it's a little -- do you mind me saying this, it's a little testicul

joining us now tim miller former communications direct for a for the jeb bush campaign.that trump has better voting totals than polls are showing now? >> in trump's words, sad, huh eric. this is sad that he is reduced to this, coming up with conspiracy theories. this is a guy trump has spent the whole primaries bragging about husband poll numbers and now the polls aren't right all of a sudden. look, harrienton who writes at 538, the best poll guy out there examined this. he looked at the primaries and if you look at trumps results in the primary in each state on average he came in about 1% lower than his poll numbers. so this is just a theory he is coming up with. >> nate silver in fact nailed the last election cycle. he nailed all 50 states. however he missed trump. 538 said trump cannot be the nominee and he is the nominee. so polls can be wrong. >> in the primary they were right. he was bragging about the polls the whole primary. it was some of the d. krchltd pundits no doubt, they didn't believe the polls. but the polls showed it. >> i remember they had jeb bush neck

i'm joined by cnn political analyst josh rogan, david chalian and tim miller.avid, clearly elizabeth warren is trying to bait donald trump. in light of the recent controversy over judge curiel, how might mr. trump respond? >> well, you know, who knows how mr. trump might respond to anything, but one would imagine it will follow a pattern here where he clearly cares a lot about this case, carol. he's made it quite clear that he wants to fight against what he feels is mistreatment in this case, but it is also clear that he heard his fellow republicans from his party have extreme concern about the way he was prosecuting that case with the comments about his mexican heritage. he backed off that tuesday night and we'll continue to see if he does. i think one of the more important parts of what elizabeth warren is saying is not just baiting donald trump, but she is clearly now demonstrating what the democratic playbook is going to be and this is what has a lot of republicans concerned here which is to tie mitch mcconnell, paul ryan, and every other republican down ba

ned ryan, founder of american majority and tim miller, former communications drek forfor the jeb bush campaign. i want to start with you, ned. i want to get your reaction to this analogy that's been drawn. if you look at the themes of people reasserting the right to control their government, the right of the free people to say we will be in charge of the government. rejecting an unresponsive class, there are some overall themes where you could see this taking place. in u.s. politics, we'you've bee seeing some of this since the tea party in 2009 where people are beginning to realize that there is a ruling class here in the u.s. and they want to reassert more influence and more control over their government, so, if you look at at it on those levels, you begin to see some themes in both brexit and are w the trump and this movement. >> all right, tim, i want to get your reaction. we heard ned there bring up the tea party and then fighting elite iists, but ark, do you ag or disagree and brk, is dlts the right person for that movement? >> yeah, a, i think there are some parallel, but in a t

and tim miller with us, too. former jeb bush spokesman who does not support donald trump.>> happy monday to you both. >> good morning, brooke. >> let me set it up. you just heard, carl, begin with you, mr. trump responding to newt gingrich from over the weekend. in case you haven't heard this, here is newt gingrich asked about donald trump's comments pertaining to this judge. >> this is one of the worst mistakes trump has made and i think it's inexcusable. first of all, this judge was born in indiana. he is an american, period. if a liberal were to attack justice clarence thomas on the grounds that he's black, we would all go crazy. >> so, carl, add to the list of very prominent republicans, newt gingrich, bob corker, paul ryan last week, mitch mcconnell, all repudiating what your guy has said about this judge. >> but also look at the fact these prominent republicans weren't always onboard with trump. >> but they are now. >> they are now, but, look -- trump does things in a very unique way. no doubt about it, but it's working, it's winning. people are excited to see somebo

also tim miller, former jeb bush spokesman, who does not support donald trump.. what about what you just heard from some of those top republicans that say donald trump as president would certainly need muslims. he needs muslims to be able to sort of point out radicals orator orrists in their midst. he should not be alienating them. >> well, we have a big problem. i think we all can understand that. the question is, what do we do to solve the problem. donald trump is the only one offering substantive solutions. president obama keeps going on tv and mis-identifying the problem. radical islamic terrorism has grown from 3,000 deaths per year, caused by it, to over 28,000 deaths per year in the last five years. it's growing. it is a bigger and bigger problem. president obama keeps focusing on iraq and the head of the beast is in syria. when people get radicalized or recruited to join isis, it is coming from syria. so we have to do something more to solve the problem. our currents leadership is not doing that. the problem is getting worst. we have to do something. >>

and back with me tim o'brien, william cohahn and stephen miller. think he can do it. he had a fund-raiser in new york city. you got caught in traffic. he said he's planning to match dollar for dollar over the next 48 hours up to $2 million for donations. in this primary season though, do you think he should have been building, you know, a network of smaller donors like bernie sanders has been building, or has he actually been doing that and we don't know about it? >> we put together a pretty robust fund-raising operation and selected an amazing finance chair to head the whole operation who is one of the brightest financial minds in the country so i think we'll see some amazing results, but the great luxury that i have is that i get to focus on policy and i think most of the american people are interested in the policy issues-ins this race and fund-raising is rather dry details and i hope that the decision that we make in this country, in fact i know the decision we'll make in this country -- >> i don't disagree. people should be more concerned abou

miller, despite how rude you were to ben ginsberg, it's always great to have you. tim ben ginsberg. john: it's great having you on the set. coming up, the great katie couric is standing by. ♪ mark: as we said, today donald trump met with top gop butlers to discuss fundraising efforts. here to tell us about that meeting and all things trump, our correspondent katie turner, who joins us from outside trump worn awhere she has groove into the ground because she stands there a lot. katie: it's cold. mark: cold in june. i have heard mixed things about the meeting, but one person who is pretty reliable suggested the donors were upbeat. they like to schedule coming together. they liked trump's seeming enthusiasm about raising money. same thingard the from two sources who were inside the meeting who felt donald trump had a pretty warm reception from those donors. certainly, the trump campaign was positive about it. they talked about how they are going to raise the amount of money they need to raise. they also told us how good the chicken was at the four seasons, but with a big

miller. he's one of the most popular players in san francisco history. we take a look back at the giants career of timcecum. >> i probably should have worked out before i came. >> and he's no stranger to performing under pressure, but can he handle boot camp? we take you inside jeremy affeldt's day as a nav