he said that's why i've got tom dawnland and jim jones as deputy. i've known tom dawnland all my life and if there's any problems i've got tall here. tom became extremely respected, he knew all the plairdz, he's a workaholic. he's got strong ideas. >> charlie: take us through the evolution of this president in terms of whatever philosophy he had about america's role during his senatorial life a all during the campaign which was a rather short time, to being president in his first two and-a-half years. how it has evolved and where it is now and what shaped it. >> the thing to remember, you always have to remember this about barack obama, in my first meeting with him, he was overseeing a hearing in the spring of 2004 about the danger of a plastic toy called the yo-yo water ball. now this guy's involved in three wars. so how do you get e yo- war ball -- that's basically what the piece is about. and look, he started thinking seriously about foreign policy obviously as a senator and running for the senate. and that was a point in time in the democratic p