the formula is to be non-trump without antagonizing the trump base. there are eight or nine candidates on the field going into the primary season. margaret: if there is a winnowing of the field early, is any one of them better than donald trump? charlie: every single one of them is better, but having said that, there is one caveat. we'll donald trump allow anyone else to be the nominee? donald trump has made it clear he never loses. he never loses general elections or primaries, and on the way out the door, he will burn it down. can we afford to move past trump? he is the world's worst loser. margaret: what happens in a general election if it is trump v biden? charlie: then the election becomes a referendum on donald trump. margaret: a referendum on trump? charlie: yes. in normal circumstances, the general election is a referenm on the incumbent president. if it is any other republican, it will be a referendum on joe biden and his record and agenda, but if it is donald trump, it becomes reversed. the election becomes about donald trump, and that will

trump said, you're fired. i love that part. >> truth is there's only one person who can make america great again. >> what a night. we have so very much to talk about. joining me now are jonathan martin, the politics bureau chief at politico, and mark liebovich. first your reaction to the 21 minutes of technical glitches the audience was treated to as part of the desantis launch. >> i thought it was a great and unifying evening for america. i think, first of all, it's very rare that you -- you see donald trump, fox news, so many democrats, i'm guessing so many people who know ron desantis and suspected that maybe he wasn't ready for prime time are enjoying this. you did say, look, there's no trump onsie was seen anywhere. we didn't see what he was wearing, and it does seem like this was a big gift to donald trump, and it seems also he knows exactly what to do with it. so this is rough start for ron desantis. i'm not sure elon musk and his charisma is going to sort of help him get out of this, but obviously ther

then you can see trump panicking, because trump expects the interviewer to move on. you do not move on. as you say, you asked the pointed questions, and then you stick with it. too often on wednesday night, kaitlan collins moved on, or handed the make to an audience member who is, invariably, a trump supporter. nine people spoke from the audience, seven of those people were supporters of trump's 2020 reelection bid. that is a joke. that is not an audience of undecided. the audience was and disaster, and a joke. one last point, you mentioned the ceo cnn chris link said, this morning, on an editorial call, it was a success because we made news. number one, they didn't make that much news, most trump lies were old. number two, it is not our job, lawrence, to make news. in that situation our job is to report the news, educate and inform, and to hold the people in power to account. trump is celebrating, his supporters are celebrating, he was not held to account. >> let's be fair to cnn about this point of the audience. it is common, at the presidential primary stage, for

trump and carroll. that's the difference between the rape and sexual abuse components of battery, but they did find that he touched her in an unwanted way in either her sexual or intimate parts for the purposes of gratifying himself and that is a meaningful, meaningful finding. i can't imagine what carroll's face looks like reegt now and i wish i were there to see it. >> lisa, thank you very much. stick with us because we're going to go over this more. ron allen, you were also covering this trial from the start. at one point, there was a note about a couple of the jurors appears falling asleep during roberta kaplin's closing remarks. the lawyer for carroll. two men, one according to the notes, appeared to have his head on his chest. then again, the jury brought back a majority yes verdict and no on the rape, but yes on the sexual assault. yes on the defamation and quite a large number of damages. what do you make of that as you've been covering this for so long? >> well, perhaps the jury had made up his

trump. carol walked out of the manhattan courthouse just moments ago with her lawyer who said that they're quote, very happy with the jury's decision. carol's lawsuit stemmed from an encounter between her and trump in a new york department store dressing room in 1996. she claims donald trump sexually assaulted her. donald trump reacted on his social media platform, writing in all caps, quote, i have absolutely no idea who this woman is, this verdict is a disgrace, continuation of the greatest witch hunt of all-time, unquote. this all comes as trump is facing another very serious case in new york city, just last month the former president pleaded not guilty to 34 felony charges related to hush money payments to adult film star and director, stormy daniels. not to mention, investigations by the justice department into january 6th and to those classified documents at mar-a-lago. not to mention the investigation where prosecutors in fulton county georgia are looking into his attempt to flip geor

when it concerns trump. almost all the charges against trump are so overly and openly in brazenly political and partisan that nobody trusts them. and there's no better example that the fact they're scared to bring a case against trump in a jurisdiction that has conservatives. they only look at the district of columbia or the city of atlanta or the city of new york. they won't look at bringing the case with trump town. jerry pulled their views where he kept hinting at epstein z issues. there's i think, a vanity fair piece that was very favorable. epstein where trump keeps saying, well, he has a reputation for very young girls, worries trying to pull it out there. what's going on? so the, i think so trump was, they tried to connect trump epstein, ultimately it was unsuccessful because cup is one of the few people that kept his distance from epstein over many years. once he found out what he was about. so the but it, they reflects the sad nature of our intel system, but the trump has to be one of the highest in

trump's conduct, answer, yes. dollar amount that would fairly and adequately compensate her for injury, for that injury, or for those injuries. $2 million. question five, mr. trump's conduct was willfully or wantonly negligent, reckless or done with a conscious disregard on the right of miss carroll, or was so reckless as to amount to such disregard. answer, yes. how much, if any, should mr. trump pay to ms. carroll in punitive damages? answer, $20,000. as to defamation, did ms. carroll prove, by a preponderance of the evidence, that questioned six, mr. trump's statement was defamatory? answer, yes. this did miss carroll prove, by clear and convincing evidence, that as to question seven, mr. trump's statement was false. answer, yes. question eight, mr. trump made that statement with actual malice, answer, yes. did miss carroll prove by a preponderance of the evidence that question nine, miss carroll was injured as a result of mr. trump's publication of the october 12th 2022 statement. answer, yes. if yes as to the

of trump? >> look, the doj's theory, at least in the obstruction case, the obstruction strand of this investigation with respect to the subpoena response has long been trying to find out whether trump effectively arranged for boxes of classified documents to be removed from the storage room so that the lawyer would not find them when he was doing the search. i think what the notes kind of snow is a timeline where whether it was nalta or someone else had the means or the ability to take stuff out and conceal them if they so wanted. i think the evidence needed to get to that point is a high threshold. i think to make an obstruction case here, you basically have to show that trump and/or nalta knew they were removing boxes that they knew actually contained classified. and i think that's where the hurdle has been for the counsel. that's certainly been what the special counsel has been asking witnesses when they appeared before the grand jury. we don't know obviously everything on all the evidence t

when it concerns trump. almost all the charges against trump are so overly and openly and brazenly political and partisan that nobody trusts them. and there's no better example that the fact they're scared to bring a case against trump and a jurisdiction that has conservatives. they only look at the district of columbia or the city of atlanta or the city of new york. they won't look at bringing the case with trump zone jury pool because they know that trump's own variable won't accept it as being true. and it's because it's not true typically. now let's talk about the treatment of the other side. and one revelation the surface, the recent fee and the wall street journal is how many american power players continued to meet with convicted sex offender. and peter file, jeffrey f. soon after his conviction, including people like the courtesy, i, a director william burns, a school, and that time was serving as deputy deputy secretary of state. and he had a meeting scheduled with apps to him convicted sex offender

neither president biden or former presidentr trump. i would never vote for trump. my favorite is one of two sitting senators to i'd like to see on the democratic party. i am a democrat. i would like to see senator sherrod brown of ohio, senator chris coons of delaware, or senator sheldon whitehouse of rhode island. i think any one of those three sitting senators would make an excellent candidate for the democratic party, allne right. donald with three senators on his mind. let's hear from marjorie now. marjorie in silver spring, maryland, on the biden line. >> caller: yes, i would definitely vote for president biden. he's had the experience. he's had the talent with foreign countries, with leaders. and he's honest. he doesn't tell lies like president trump. so my vote would definitely go for president biden. >> host: appreciate that call, marjorie.. next up we have wrought in kentucky. you say you are voting for trump. two that's correct. i will gladly vote for president trump again and just had to ask marjorie, i mean, if she doesn't think resident biden lies, i c

trump's business. leading off our discussion tonight, andrew weissmann, former fbi general counsel, and former chief of the criminal division of the eastern district of new york. he's a professor of practice at nyu law school. also with us, bradley moss, a national security attorney and former clerk for the national security archive. andrew, i want to raise this last point, which is the saudi golf tournament. it's kind of a stand-alone item, this island of its own, in the middle of that reporting. the reporting is about donald trump's illegal possession of classified documents. it seems to me, the saudis could be one group that would be very interested in donald trump's possession of classified documents. he's trying to do business with the saudis. he's in possession of classified documents that might be of interest to them. it's not hard to imagine how those lines could cross in this investigation. >> i had the same thought. obviously, this is pure speculation on your part and my part, because it comp

donald trump, however, would not.uld very much like you to remember that 2018 ron desantis add in what it says about the man who is now running against trump. and so trump dropped this video minutes after the epic desantis twitter launch fail. >> trump supporters so powerful, just days after the endorsement, desantis took a commanding lead that propelled him to being elected governor. >> i'd like to thank our president for standing by me when it wasn't necessarily the smart thing to do. >> you are welcome, ron. unfortunately, instead of being grateful, desantis is now attacking the very man who saved his career. isn't it time desantis remembers how he got to where he is? >> make america great again. build a wall. then mr. trump said, you are fired. i love that part. truth is, there's only one person who can make america great again. >> what a night. we have some very much to talk about. joining me now are jonathan martin, the politics bureau chief at politico, and mark leibovich, staff writer at the atlantic and autho

then he quickly endorsed trump and advised him in the 2020 campaign before breaking with trump again.a governor ron desantis also getting sharper elbows by ron desantis in his attacks. >> the former president's now attacking me saying that cuomo did better handling covid than florida did. florida did? first of all that's not what he used to say. thiss new. six months ago he would have never said that. he used to say ow great florida was. hell, his whole family moved to florida under any governorship. are you kidding me? >> all this rhetoric setting the stage for a messy showdown with a crowded field diluting the anti-trump gop vote. the opposite of what some d.c. republicans actually wanted. here to discuss is msnbc political analyst -- and juanita tolliver. always good to have both of you. i'd like to start with you. with mike pence and chris christie preparing to enter the race, the nontrump field that has grown larger, but frankly, are we looking at a repeat of 2016 here? >> more than likely. you have a crowded field, all trying to elbow each other out, but the reality is none of t

and president trump's thinking, well, can say, look at present trump to record where you had to record below unemployment for every community across the board. communities i've, i've spoken about people actually were able to pay their bills. they felt like they're like they're standing as far as their financial standing was getting better . now we've seen 24 months in a row. of earning power of households going down in the us to abide was try cause or their ration because of inflation. but again, that's because they're printing new money, but essentially just out of control spending from the, by the ministration coupled with the uh, i mean, i should add that donald trump editor what 66 and a half trillion dollars to that, to the federal debt. but you'll look at the way the economy. he rebuilt it, the 2nd time, the way the economy was grow, we were getting back on track after global pandemic. and so president trump can say, not only did he build the greatest economy, whatever it had in the us, but he did it twice. but going back to how people are looking at this, what joe biden was tryi

trump, putin, putin, trump. russia's foreign policy out in the open today is to reelect trump.on't go anywhere. really? and your clothes just keep getting more damaged the more times you wash them. downy protects fibers, doing more than detergent alone. see? this one looks brand new. saves me money? i'm starting to like downy. downy saves loads. (man) it's pretty simple. i kinda just want things the way i want them. to like downy. (woman) i want a network that won't let me down. even up here! (woman #2) with an unlimited plan that's truly right for me. (woman #3) with verizon's new myplan, i get exactly what i want. and only pay for what i need. (man #2) now i'm in charge... ...of my plan. (vo) introducing myplan from verizon, the first and only plan where you choose what goes in, from apple music to disney bundle. so you get exactly what you want and only pay for what you need. and it all starts at just $30. on the network you want. because it's your verizon. ♪ limu emu & doug ♪ what do we always say, son? liberty mutual customizes your car insurance... so you only pay for wha

were some of trump's lawyers also actively trying to mislead other trump lawyers? with so many lawyers testifying in these investigations, will any of them flip to save their own hides? we might not have to wait that long to find out. bloomberg reported late last week that special counsel smith is poised to announce criminal charges in this investigation in the days or weeks after memorial day, which was yesterday. we have lots to discuss. joining me now is joyce vance, former u.s. attorney for the northern district of alabama and of course co-host of the sisters-in-law podcast. joyce, thanks for being here tonight. i don't have a law degree, but a lot of people do and a lot of them are working for donald trump and also have testified either to federal investigators or in front of the federal grand jury. i want to pull up this graphic we have. i think there are seven trump lawyers by our count who have testified to the grand jury the special counsel's convened or met with the doj investigators on this. that seems like a high number to me, joyce. and do you think th

trump was branded a sex abuser. -- >> -- claimed all along that she had been raped by donald trump. that's what this case was all about. >> that's the shrug for me. trump will be appealing the decision and while today brought an end to this eight -day trial, the verdict finding trump liable for battery and defamation took years of litigation on behalf of e. jean carroll. came carroll forward in 2019 after being inspired by the me too movement. she told her story, knowing full well, she was accusing the president of the united states, the most powerful man in the world of, sexual assault she sudan trump november 2019 in a lengthy gleeful legal battle shielded trump from lawsuit when as he was president when he made those remarks. finally e. jean carroll got her day in court, after trump, once again, defamed her, in october when he was no longer president. she filed a second lawsuit which went to trial. she initiated all of that. i think it's worth taking a step back to acknowledge this incredible active real persistence of e. jean carroll, who against all odds, and a tremendous amoun

trump.[cheering] oh, you heard about it. y'all heard about it? ok, i thought it was just a little-- you know, little-- yesterday was a momentous day for donald j. trump. he was indicted for 34 counts of falsifying business records and also one count of clogging the courthouse toilet. they added that one at the last minute. [laughter] so old trumpy went down to the courthouse, looked around stupid for a couple of minutes, and then fled on his private jet to florida. because, as you all know, florida does not have an extradition treaty with the united states. [laughter] he rode up mar-a-lago, and then he waved to his supporters, and then offered to put his thumb up they butt. [laughter] what is this? seriously. who adds motion to a thumbs up? it's simple. just lock the elbow. trump got to be the first person to add the jerkoff motion to a thumbs up. thanks so much for coming out. i really appreciate it. [groans] [applause] so then, after all of that, it was time for trump to give his big speec

did not under president trump . and i think people saw the americans that much stronger standing on the world stage. what we see now is people in this weakness, and once biden completely botched, the withdrawal of american troops from afghanistan, every leader, every adversary in the world had our number. so let's take a look at this week, for example, rather than picking a fight. i'm speaking to the president biden right now. he's going to have to pop a new guinea in ally, by the way. what fights are you picking a pop? a new guinea? when we have these issues at the southern border, latasha 42 and the expiration there inflation be out of control. certainly the word ukraine is not getting any better. that's the only 2 in decimal prices and he's off to new guinea. so that shows a certain tone, deafness, a certain disconnect, i think, with the american public, regardless of your, your party affiliation. and this is why i think by it is going to have problems. if you're to see if you're an african american vote or latin

trump said that. to think it isn't impacting a number of these hardline conservatives is, i think, a mistake to think it wouldn't impact him. they are essentially saying they don't think a default would always have the catastrophic impact that all these economists are warning it would have. and what it would do is mean medicare cuts, cuts to veterans, social security paychecks don't go out. that's something the president has been trying to stress over and over again and thinks the public would be on his side. >> that's where the math gets interesting. the speaker want says we want to increase spending. because many hawks, this is a debate among republicans, they want to increase defense spending you increase defense spending, but then you have to take it from somewhere else. progress i-s are telling the white house, don't you dare. >> what's the white house's point. i'm told a big part of the meeting really focused on the politics of this and the count. because the white house is trying to telegraph t

--trump.ed of rape, and you know what happens to people who have gone to jail for that, they are not the most popular person in the population. if you know what i mean. i don't know how people can vote for him. it is ridiculous. host: let's go to coatesville, pennsylvania. susan on the biden lne. --line. caller: i will vote for biden again. he will be our candidate. he is beat and commit president. i as a democrat, i will vote for and these people who claim their independence or -- independent or don't know, like the last two elections, there is so much on the line but if you look at where the republican party is going, it does not matter if trump is running or anyone else. you vote for fascism. look what is happening in florida and republican-led states. you have to be careful. joe biden is my boat. --vote. host: thank you. jack is next up, calling from pennsylvania. trump is your preferred candidate. caller: thank you for having. --me. i will support president trump as of now. i think he is

joe kasatkina, donald trump's lawyer, showed part of the deposition where trump got angry, saying it a disgusting, ridiculous story, he said it never happened, that rape is one of the worst things that someone could get accused of, and he set at an upscale department store, they would have heard it happen. joe kasatkina also in his closing arguments address this attack by the plaintiff, e. jean carroll, that donald trump never even showed up, never called any witnesses. he said there were no witnesses for him to call, because the attack never happened, and because e. jean carroll had not provided a specific date, that it had robbed donald trump of an alibi. so joe tacopina was fierce, attackg e. jean carroll's credibility cared we will have to see, christian, if that is enough to overcome evidence that e. jean carroll's attorney has provided. christian: there was a supposition that it would take some time to come to a verdict, because, as you rightly say, they have to come through unanimous verdict. does the fact that they have come to a conclusion within a few hours, what does that

the scale, the sheer amount of classified documents trump had, the thing that makes trump's documents investigation such a stark contrast from president biden's, or even vice president pence's investigations? is the appearance of obstruction. all signs indicate that biden and pence immediately, and fully, cooperate with authorities after being informed that classified documents in their possession. the same simply cannot be said for trump. the investigation into trump here is a criminal investigation. the bar for proving obstruction, it is high. and we're gonna get some expert legal help unpacking all of this in just a second. the events of june 2nd, they weren't the only thing we learned about today. no, we also learned that jack smith's office has gathered evidence that even before trump received the subpoena in may, he had lots of officials have dubbed, a dress rehearsal. moving government documents that he did not want to relinquish. we learned that smith's office had been told, by more than one witness, that trump at times kept classified documents out in the open in his florida

g hearing against donald trump. on hearing against donald trump. o hearing against donald trump. hearing against donald trump (vo) tepezza is the only medicine that treats t.e.d. at the source not just the symptoms. in a clinical study more than 8 out of 10 patients taking tepezza had less eye bulging. tepezza is an infusion. patients taking tepezza may have infusion reactions. tell your doctor right away if you experience high blood pressure, fast heartbeat, shortness of breath or muscle pain. before getting tepezza, tell your doctor if you have diabetes, ibd, or are pregnant, or planning to become pregnant. tepezza may raise blood sugar even if you don't have diabetes and may worsen ibd such as crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis. now, i'm ready to be seen again. visit mytepezza.com to find a ted eye specialist and to see bridget's before and after photos. when it comes to your hair, ingredients matter. that's why herbal essences is packed with naturally derived plant ingredients you love, and none of the stuff you don't. our sulfate-free collections smell incredible... ♪ and

trump still out in front. but look how much that lead has widened for form ir president trump to now. this is what the last several months have been for ron desantis. he's not been an official candidate and trump has been hammering away at him. this is what occurred. today ron desantis tries to change this equation. >> david schalian, thank you fo kicking us off. dana bash, phil mattingly and teeth a ya mitchell join us. is the glass half full or half empty in the sense that he's by far the leading alternative to trump? he's just not where he was at the begin ning of the year wher he was just after the election. people were blaming trump in the rear view mirror, he had not been indicted in new york. on launch day, where are we? >> glass is half full and half empty. if possible. ron desantis has been absolutely pounded, as david just mentioned, by the former president. the money that he's spent in ads, the way that he has attacked ron desantis on social media and in other opportunities that he's had even on the

tough week to be donald trump., an end to the nation's longest government shutdown, providing no new money for a border wall. [kevin] the president made four different offers. it was speaker pelosi who said, "i wouldn't talk about anything." and the president finally said, "this is too much." [abby] he dragged it out until, at the end of the day, the deal that he had to land to end the shutdown was a way worse deal than he would've gotten if he had just caved at the beginning. basically, he gets absolutely nothing out of this other than a lesson about messing with nancy pelosi. [john] you can't go broke betting on nancy pelosi, in general, but in the era of donald trump there was no more sure thing, was that, in a fight between donald trump and nancy pelosi, you knew who was gonna be strutting around the ring at the end. [lester] tonight, robert mueller has completed his investigation and submitted his report. [gayle] it cost more than $25 million and led to criminal charges for a number of people connected to mr.

saying because donald trump _ donald trump is saying because donald trump is _ donald trump is sayingair trial, about government being corrupt. _ a fair trial, about government being corrupt. about — a fair trial, about government being corrupt, about the _ a fair trial, about government being corrupt, about the big _ a fair trial, about government being corrupt, about the big lie _ a fair trial, about government being corrupt, about the big lie that - a fair trial, about government being corrupt, about the big lie that he i corrupt, about the big lie that he won the — corrupt, about the big lie that he won the election _ corrupt, about the big lie that he won the election in _ corrupt, about the big lie that he won the election in 2020, - corrupt, about the big lie that he won the election in 2020, the i won the election in 2020, the insurrection _ won the election in 2020, the insurrection that— won the election in 2020, the insurrection that he _ won the election in 2020, the insurrection that he allegedlyj insurrection that he allegedly spurred — insurrection that he allegedly spu

trump's legal trouble is that times 250 million. trump's lie, is the big lie. the conspiracy that the 2020 election was somehow stolen, and among other things, led to an insurrection. tonight, at a town hall, in new hampshire, trump was asked if he had any regrets about his actions on january 6th. people were there that day, quote, because they thought the election was rigged. they were proud. they were there with a love in their heart. it was an unbelievable, and it was a beautiful day. that is what he said to the audience that appeared to be, mostly, filled with trump supporters. the president was asked about his promise to pardon january 6th defendants. >> will you pardon the january 6th rioters who were convicted of federal offenses? >> i am inclined to pardon many of them. i can't say for every single one, because a couple of them, probably, got out of control. what they have done to these people's pews occurred at these people. the answer is, i am most likely, if i get in, i would say, it would be a large portion of them. it would be very early on. and th

they know exactly who trump is, just as democrats know exactly who trump is.f they believe he is their -- path to power, their path to their reactionary agenda, like repealing reproductive freedom, they will embrace it even if it means the end of our constitutional democracy. to me, that's unforgivable. but you can't look away from the proof. >> here is the acid test for me. i will ask you this question. you don't have a say in who will be the republican nominee. you could have interests or views. even if it were the case that he was the weakest candidate in a general election, versus other folks in that field, do you still think -- do you still hope he does not secure the nomination simply because of the unique danger he poses? >> absolutely. you are right, there are two schools of thought on this. one that says he's easier to beat and therefore we should want him on the democratic side be as the nominee. i've never subscribed to that view because i think he's a uniquely talented grifter and arsonists. should he ever get the chance to govern again, the countr

former president trump _ against donald trump? sure.n called i president trump has been called teflon don for many years now because it seems that he still enjoys great support from today's a publican party, writ large, but that is not entirely true. that is always said, but when you look at these midterms from just this past year, we got the empirical evidence that trump is essentially the kiss of death for candidates. we are talking but congressional races. so many of his hand—picked candidates, those he endorsed out of mega world, trump world, whatever you call it, they want to lose any primaries because they were so extreme. there is this whole crop of republicans out there that really wants anyone but trump, because the maga faction is quite smart. it is the after trumper to hold the power, that people who mebude who voted for trump in 2016 as well as in 2020 but one some of else now and are frustrated with the biden administration. and desantis has a real opportunity to snag their votes as time goes on for we are still very early

he was not bought. >> i like trump. i voted for trump.e. i think that this is going to push ron desantis to the forefront. >> i voted for trump on the last one and thought he did a lot of things, but it was constant criticism. all through the whole thing. and i just feel like maybe another president in there can work across the lines. >> you do see there some openness there to i like trump, but i'm going to look around a little bit. that's the question in the early primary states. do we see that. >> there's an argument that the republican presidential candidates are making right now to remind them of exactly what you were seeing in the last election, his candidates lost. he recruited candidates could potential ly cost us the senate as well. and i think you'll start to hear more of that argument like you did after the midterm election. one interesting position that trump has taken with respect to abortion rights is to say that ron desantis's position is too extreme. six weeks is too extreme because you have a number of women who were sayin

prosecutors have also issued several subpoenas to trump's company. the trump organization. seeking additional surveillance footage from mar-a-lago. a major focus for prosecutors, what trump did or did not tell his own lawyers. "times" reports this about testimony given to a grand jury by trump's attorney, evan corcoran. quote, during his appearance before the grand jury in march, corcoran testified that several trump employees had told him that the mar-a-lago storage room was the only place where the document were kept. the employees turned out to be wrong. when fbi agents searched mar-a-lago in august, they found classified documents in trump's office and residence. but at the time, that was a common belief within trump's inner circle. although corcoran testified that trump did not personally convey that false information, this testimony hardly absolved the former president. corcoran also recounted to the grand jury how trump did not tell his lawyers of any other locations where the documents were stored. which may have effectively misled the legal team. special counsel ja

as trump?y good, he's not as bad. he has to be absolutely worse. >> so, i don't know where he's going. i think we do know where if there's a line at fox, it's around the sadistic new things of killing of an antifa guy that was allegedly the straw breaking the camel's back with tucker carlson. it's easy to say i'm sure the pentagon has a picture of him stacking up iraqi bodies in a baghdad prison cell. it seems people that want to be for ron desantis can't come up with anything pro-ron desantis to say? >> yeah, i'm going to assume that means there is a fear that ron desantis could not beat joe biden. and they're trying to disparage him and try to put an end to this before it starts. i think that's an extreme version of what's going on within the republican party from the grassroots up. you know, you have people, including donors who are incredibly important, so we're not sure that ron desantis' stance on things like abortion are going to fly in a primary, let alone a general election. he has a l

they rejected the trump campaign's appeals to challenge biden's -- to challenge trump -- trump's challenges to biden's election victory. i think what's also been lost really in this conversation, there's been some criticisms from the right of the kinds of questions that were being asked to trump. but these very basic questions about sexual assault, about believing in free and fair elections, about publicly acknowledging that you fairly lost the 2020 election are pivotal and important to long-term democratic norms, without, you know, confidence in free and fair elections. that long term democratic development is threatened and imperilled and has global implications. so, you know, it's definitely a snapshot of what we're going to see going forward, of what base voters want to see from the republican nominee. and a pretty good, i think, case study for democratic candidates, for joe biden going forward in the next two years leading up to november 2024. >> yeah, tough,fair questions, will you respect the outcome of the 2024 election? he wouldn't do that either. jen palmieri, forgive me for trigg

amy: " trump said in the videotape.ng the videotape deposition, seen by the jury, trump defended his comments in the "access hollywood" tape. >> very famous in this video, "i just are kissing them. like a magnet. i don't even wait. when you are a star, they let you do it. you can do anything. grab them by the [beep]" pres. trump: historically, that is true with stars. you look over the last million years, largely true. not always, but largely true. unfortunately or fortunately. >> you consider yourself to be a star? pres. trump: i think you can say that, yeah. amy: that was donald trump in the videotaped deposition that was shown in court and yet he refused to be there live to testify, which is extremely significant. if you can talk about this? he was golfing in ireland at his golf course and said that he would be challenging e. jean carroll, whoever she is, and the judge in court. and when the judge took him up on the offer, said this was, what, last thursday, that he had until sunday -- even though his lawyer had rest

trump was always pro-choice. he stumbled on this one way back in 2016 with chris matthews when he said we should criminalize the mothers and even pro-lifers are like, whoa, not even many of us are for that, and then he had to backtrack. the thing is trump's new york, he's pro-choice, and i think the people in his circles are generally pro-choice, so he worries about the political impact of this. trump actually there were reports behind the scenes in 2020 he was trying to say -- excuse me, 2022. republicans didn't lose because of the election denialism, they lost because of overturning of roe. he can be extreme on the issues of immigration, democracy, et cetera but carve a different path on the other social issues, this is kind of this reptilian strategic, you know, effort that he tries to put forth where he sees these issues as the places where he can moderate. >> i'm just going to say it again, if you're in favor of protecting bodily autonomy perhaps you should be in favor of women not getting sexually assaulted

trump's statement was false? yes. was ms. carroll injured as a result of mr. trump's statement? yes. did mr. trump acts maliciously out of hatred, ill will, spite, our wanton, reckless, or disregard of the rights of a another? yes. and then a the jury lists three more dollar amounts for damages. $1 million, $1.7 million, and $280,000. for those of you doing the math at home, that brings trump's tab here up to $5 million. now, trump's lawyer has vowed to appeal this verdict, but today is clearly a landmark moment in american history, so what does all of this mean now? what does it mean for trump's future? what does it mean legally? what does it mean culturally? we have a lot to unpack. joining us now is lisa rubin. thanks for joining me on this very, very big day. lisa, you've been through it all, andve i've got to say when you're a lawyert for a defenda and you have to say they didn't get him on the rape thing, that seems like a thin defense given everything else they got him on. >> otyes, it is a very thin defense. and he knows what the impact of this liability finding is becau

bill trump is at the helm. all riaht, trump is at the helm. all right. that _ trump is at the helm. insides, breaking down the hour—long tunnel session, i'm sure we will have you back in a gram very soon. thank you and good evening to you. thank you and good evening to ou. ., ~' thank you and good evening to ou. ., ~ , ., thank you and good evening to yon-_ thank - thank you and good evening to you._ thank you. . after that town hall with former president trump, president biden, who recently announced his campaign for reelection, sent out his response on twitter. saying: the controversial congressman george santos has pleaded not guilty to a 13—count federal indictment. the charges against him include money laundering and the theft of public funds. santos turned himself into authorities in new york earlier in the day. before we get into the details of the case, let's step back and look at who is george santos is. the 34—year—old republican was elected in last year's mid—term elections to new york's third congressional district. that's usually a safely democratic seat. he billed hims

and donald trump still declined.ere is no cross examining, standing there, ready to cross examine donald trump under oath, he is free to say all these things. but i hope the american people who still care about equality and fairness, and due process. we'll see that it was an absolute act of cowardice what trump did. when he had a chance to look the jury in the eye, to put his hand on the bible, to testify in an ethical and responsible way, he declined. but what did he do once that case was over? he whined that an unfair trial. and now he says that the absolute protection where no one is pushing back against him, including cnn, he says what he has to say. it's absolutely despicable. >> and, michelle, cnn did ask him why didn't you testify at the trial? and he said, my lawyers told me it will be a waste of time, that it's ridiculous. but cnn did not say, why did you lie last week when you were standing on a golf course in ireland, and telling those reporters, you were going to rush back to new york, leave early, fly ba

and it's just trump being trump? >> well, it's trump being trump because trump is an authoritarian. from the very start, he has not only gone after the typical enemies of all of these people go after, the courts. journalists, prosecutors, anybody who can harm them and expose their corruption. but he's also made lawlessness his brand. so in every instance, he has to boast that he's above the law, no matter what the consequences are. the other thing is that he is a very damaged individual. that plays into. when you have that cnn town hall, which we are discussing, because it's where he repeated his defamation of e. jean carroll. he needed psychologically to undo his humiliation at the hands of the court. he hated. he had to get people to mark, to applaud him mocking her. so this, again, is this being lawless and misogynists and getting away with that. >> so jill, we also learned this week that trump's trial will begin, i guess, in what, march of 2024? how lucky, right? the hush money trial, criminal case, taking place at that time. that's right in the middle of the gop primary. how sh

or is it turning into just trump? >> so it's always been trump and always will be trump.er what else is on the menu, you're going to get the response, we're out of that. so, it's trump. that's the problem for desantis and tim scott is looking at this. nikki haley is already in. asa hutchinson is already in. how do they get on the menu for those republican primary voters? when the menu only has one item on it. that's largely because the way the party has written the menu, the way the continue to write the menu, and up to recently, how the donors pay for the menu. >> may i make a quick point? i agree with this. here is the fascinating thing. desantis turns out to probably not be the right guy. if trump were convicted of all kinds of things tomorrow, there's a real primary. desantis is nasty and authoritarian, and he comes across as a whiney bully, frankly. if it's not trump, it probably won't be desantis. a lot of people irsick of trump, including reps who don't have the spine to stand up and say so. i don't think they said a trump mini me. i think we want to try to find fu