so they're taking bigger risks and ey're makingigger profit now, what ugman says, i tnk there's sometng to i right. we're not reforming at the te thate are callin back on some of these things but keep in nd what happenedfter the great depression. the securities actsware reign in 193 and 1934. great depression starts ou of therash in 1929. so that's four t five years after thoccurrence. thers something to be sai for taking a little bit of time d making an enghtened decision with a bit of hindsight because i think we saw in sarbanes-oxley in 2002 a quick rush for companies to report iormation and i thi e result o that has en pretty nic >> charlie: ty should wait and the should think carefully abt what they're going to do. they shouldn't hav a sense of urgency aboureform. >> therehould be an urgency but i don'think wehould necearily have a complete plan in place less tha a yearince the lehman blow . but there is no doubt in my mind that there neeto be major reform and i don't think yone -- >> charl: what would that major reform entai >> well, the capital risks taken by banks. is actually i

people stay stimulus and maybe krug ugman is argui for stimulus now. >> charlie: he is. >> on the earth edge of the precipice with fear tha it's going to grow to a terrible proportion of th gdp people won't want to lend to us. >> charlie that's the issue -- >> we're down -- have suspicion that' a loer termssue. thetimulus plan when they signed it, it was fairly clr at they didn't do it very well. >> chaie: they being the congress. >> they being the congrs. they putork intot, they put prograthat weren't going to spend money quickly into it. so as a result, a lot of it hasn't come in, but i continue think theeally portant issue is getting the financial system fixedhich th haven't. onceou're goi to do that, you aren'toing to get rapid growth away. this masse overload of debt that many of us have is going to take time to work off. and stimulus won't change that. >> charlie: so no one expects anything good to happen in 2010. >>h, people think we'll have growth in 2010. charlie: at level of grth? >> not high. >> higher than we'reaving now. >> charlie: china is reporting 8%. >> china reporte a