know, a very sort of simple man and is not afraid to sort of strip away a lot what he sees as unnegligence things to make him more accessible to people. >> and yet here he is, simple man that he has tried to live in the magnificence of st. peter's basilica, which replaced a basilica built by the emperor -- one of the most audacious things and the pope tore it down. >> considered something of a sacrilege to tear down constant tine's church but then this magnificent renaissance structure was built over it and, you know, when you have michelangelo working together with others you can't argue. >> when the jesuits were taught to be free to be either with the poor or with the wealthy and here he is, you know, sort of freely saying, okay, if this is what's required of me then i will do this with all the pomp and beautiful ceremony. >> speaking of the wealthy, that is another place, terry, you talked about counterculture in terms of personal morality but he has taken on the wealthy culture of argentina particularly in latin america in general and said, you know, the gaps between the haves and have