payne, i mean, dagen raised a very good point here about the separate things that are hard to make untemporary. so this things happens, and i'm wondering where we go from here? because, if as charlie gasperino pointed out. little resolve to cut spending and we're going to get into that a little bit more in the show. we're in some deep doo-doo here. >> we are, dagen made the fantastic point and we're going to see the continuing resolution, what about the debt ceiling, the first time that was raised was a few decades ago. >> 1970. >> listen, the mid term election was supposed to be a turning points. a mandate given to make the tough choices if it's not made now, i suppose the 2012 election will be there ultimately. if there is he' no political will to do the chump change as charlie calls it we're in trouble. >> and ben stein is shaking his head. >> there's no political will to do anything meaningful about defense, iran or education, anything, there's no political will period. >> when you here and feel the americans are upset and hand on spending and concerned about the spending, not my spending,