in a breach like this, millions of consumers are being made unwitting coconspirators in the thefts ofheir own identity. >> but the thing is we base the modern system, don't we, on being willing to surrender these things in return for for exampleless purchase, easy one-click, two-click purchases of goods that will be on their way to my home. this is correct. the question i think one has to ask, not necessarily in this case is whether the attempt to collect so much information on people, so as to market them doesn't create a larger pool of information to collect than companies can reasonably expect to do given the technology and cyber security. so, really, they don't have to know as about me in order to process my transactions? >> no, they don't really have to know as much about you as some of the companies take in, when they deal with you. for instance, amazon not only knows my credit card information because i shop with them, but they keep a record of every book i look at to make remedieses. it becomes part of a database that may be accessible to hackers. >> so what about that. adam l

that is that you become an unwitting coconspirator in the theft of your own identity. where as it was a credit card breach. you change a credit card number and it's over then the issue is between the retailer and the financial institution. now you have to look over your shoulder. because at any moment, you could be receiving an e-mail or phone message or a text which directs you to go to a specific site and that site will ask you for information and it will be done in an emergency context like your account has been frozen. you have to call the bank immediately and that's the problem. >> yeah. and the fact this was done through chase online jpmorgan chase accounts, the mobile apps. does that make sense to you? are these things not secure enough yet? >> well, you know, again the question -- because breaches have become the uncertainty in life. is anything really secure in and for years financial institutions have really been the role model for security developments when it comes to cybersecurity and all sorts of other security. the problem now is they're under constant a