we will at the van gogh home. we'll see what they do. >> or people watching this interview thinking if they are a death row they probably deserve to be or there's or there something better. >> actually, i wish that were the case. the truth is we've now got close to 150 nsm people that have been proved innocent. it's really hard to prove somebody hard to person by the msm. not because they are innocent, but we have a system we don't enable ear. you don't get the resources. we are very cynical and dismissive. in this case they are quite dramatic and quite overwhelming. i wish i could tell people this really isn't as bad as i am saying it is. i actually think it is much worse. because the prison population has gone adult think there's a time in american history where we had more innocent people in jail and prison, including on death row, that we do today. the procedures and they hate in the regard that we have for fair and reliable process is actually lower than it was in my opinion then when i started my career 30 y