. >> my name is bill wasko. commissioner jacobson is unable to be here today. i am going to address a couple of issues that were brought. this problem has been going on since 2001. the issue from the time the city gave mr. jacobson notice was about whether or not on the city side or on the property owner's side. i think that is clear. >> after mr. jacobsen -- we clearly it acknowledged there was a problem. you could see the sewage coming out of the trap. the question is why was it coming out? was a problem with the jacobsen's property or city property? when the jacobsen were notified about the problem, he had a plumber come out and he said that the problem was out in the city lines. there was discussion between jacobson and the city about that. the city said we decided it is on your property. there was a notice of violation that said there was a problem with the house trap, but did not specify the problem. how is it effective? it is my understanding that typically if there is a problem with the house trap, sewage will back up into the house, as opposed to the s