waterboarding is considered -- look, torture is terrible right? but when somebody is doing what they are doing, these horrible acts, we have to fight like we have to fight. we have no choice. we have to expand our laws. we want to knock them so fast and so furious. the isis guy eat dinner like we do. different locations, different people, we all have dinner. can you imagine them having dinner, in each one chopped off 3 heads and drowned 70 people. and they are talking about the u.s. not wanting to allowed waterboarding, which a lot of people don't consider torture.

i didn't use waterboarding. i was part of the administration when we took waterboarding off the table. that's because i different circumstances than george tenet do. i had more penetration than al-qaeda. i do better knowledge of their threat profile. i had more legal restrictions. congress had taken some steps. i removed it but that was no judgment on what had gone on before. let me finish with this. when people ask me what you have done it, my answer is, this is from the heart, i repeat this in the book, i said my aunt is i thank god i never had to make that decision. and for those who are quick to criticize, they may want to thank god, too. that someone else stepped up and made that tough call. >> host: which is kind of what some aspects of intelligence or about, making decisions that nobody else will make us make in an infinite great area as you know. >> host: let me ask you about khalid sheikh mohammed. there was a dispute, still ongoing i suppose about whether or not he being the only person who was waterbo

you know something about what the cia did after 9/11 engaging in waterboarding, other alleged torturet's your reaction to what you heard from mr. trump? >> wolf, i don't do politics, i do reality. i don't care if it's president trump, president clinton, president sanders, president cruz, two points, number one, torture is unconstitutional, and it violates federal law. you cannot be the president of the united states and ask a federal agency to commit an act of torture. number two and final -- >> let me interrupt for a moment, phil. the justice department during the bush administration authorized the cia to engage in waterboardin waterboarding. is that torture? >> they said in 2002 it was not, i can tell you from talking to my friends and from being in the chair, if you went back in 2017, if the president asked the question, the department of justice will say, waterboarding is torture. people in my business will not do it, wolf. >> go ahead, what's the second point you were going to make? >> my second point is it's unconstitutional but the final point was the department of justice, if

we had journalists waterboard so they could write better articles about waterboarding. journalists don't have their fingernails pulled out. i think you can get to a reasonable interrogation techniques in use water boarding in some circumstances without saying it's torture. some people say the is but i don't think that's correct. >> the soft approach we have taken all these years has resulted in beheading and people put in cages and drowned. >> he's taken a measured and intelligent approach. but my point is we have to play by very tough rules. we are at war. >> if we flop on this they will see this as precedent. we need to treat this guy with the utmost ferocity. put me in a room with him for four hours. >> this is not just a crime that should be treated as a crime of robbery or something like that. we are at warwith totalitarian genocidal imperialist maniacs. >> this thing has legs and it stems. it's okay to kind of take that into the circumstances when you are deciding what's reasonable here. this is not an isolated individual. this is somebody who is part of the syste

. >> we should go for waterboarding and we should go tougher than waterboarding. >> tonight donald trump reversing his stance on torture. the brash billionaire releasing a statement saying he understands that the united states is bound by laws and treaties and i will not order our military or other officials to violate those laws and will seek their advice on such matters. that after trump was pressed on his campaign promise to target not just terrorists but their families, in violation of international law. >> i'm a leader, i've always been a leader. i've never had any problem leading people. if i say do it, they're going to do it. >> on the trail today, trump not letting up in his criticism of his rivals. >> you know that in florida, they hate little marco rubio so much -- >> and not letting go of marco rubio's comment about the size of his hands. >> so when little marco spews this crap about the size of my hands, which are big, those hands can hit a golf ball 285 yards, right? >> after lacing thursday night's debate with locker room innuendo. >> he referred to my hands, if they're sma

they talked about waterboarding. you remember. waterboarding, are you in favor or against? he didn't want to answer because he doesn't like the question. he doesn't want to get involved. he liked it one way but he's politically correct. got to stop with this political correctness, folks. it's killing us. he didn't want to answer. he's a good debater but he's a bad talker. here's what happens. he didn't want to answer. then they look at me. what do you think of waterboarding, mr. trump? i didn't say it's good. in the middle east they're chopping off heads and drowning people in cages like animal. they're drowning 40, 50 people in cages. they're dumping them for one hour, pulling it up, everyone dead. i always loved history. i'd ready about different periods. i'm thinking medieval time, the chops of the heads. we only saw it with james foley. i got to know his parents. these are great people. the son was this beautiful person. that was the first we saw of it. then it happened with others. if you were christian, you were really in trouble. they're chopping off the heads of chr

we should go for waterboarding and tougher than waterboarding. >> targeting terrorist families? >> and -- and -- i'm a leader, i've always been a leader. i've never had any problem leading people. if i say do it, they're going to do it. that's what leadership is all about. >> even targeting terrorist families? >> well, look, when a family flies into the world trade center, a man flies into the the military just like ronald reagan did in 1981 coming out of the weak jimmy carter administration. he passed tax reform and regulatory reform. the economy took off. it generated millions in high-paying jobs, trillions in new revenue. he rebuilt the military. bankrupted the soviet union. and won the cold war. as president, i will do the exact same thing with radical islamic terrorism. we will rebuild this military so that it remains the mightiest fighting force on the face of the planet. and then when i am commander in chief, every militant on the face of the earth will understand that if they go and join isis, if they wage jihad against the united states of america, they are signing thei

so are you still in support of waterboarding and more? >> i'm in total support of waterboarding. it has to be within the law so i

they're chopping, chopping, chopping, we're worried about waterboarding. i just think it's -- i think our paul ryan this week said, quotef a person wants to be nominee of the republican party there can be no evasion and no games. they must reject any group or cause that is built on bigotry. >> but i have rejected. how many times do i have to reject. ivory corrected david duke. i have rejected the kkk, the ku klux klan from the time i'm five years old i rejected them. i put it on twitter last week. how many times -- amazing things with twitter i have more than six million, i have another six million with facebook like 14 million with instagram. when i put out a minor message, everybody picks it up. donald trump did -- let me explain. when i put out that i reject the kkk and david duke, nobody picks it up. you why they don't? they don't want. to you pick it up. everyoneless picks it up. you saw. practically at the same time. they don't want to pick it up. i have been asked this question it so many times, in fact -- >> dickerson: what do you think of ryan say

i would bring back waterboarding, and i would bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding.my: that was donald trump in an earlier debate zaid jilani. ? >> obviously, he cannot do that. making are he is flatly illegal. it may be that he is trying to get these applause lines at before an audience that apparently does not understand that the united states cannot torture, both international and domestic laws against torture -- and particularly, waterboarding. amy: it did not stop president bush. we don't know what happens at black sites, so it does matter what a president's view is. >> i think that is the wider problem. we've already had a president who basically disobeyed international law and disavowed international law on this issue. the question is, was a president that comes after obama, will they start utilizing waterboarding and other forms of torture? ted to be marco rubio and cruz as well. there been a number of people in republican party who are flatly refused to disavow this practice. amy: i think most all of them did. mychal denzel smith, how do you mesh what he is

he is talking about waterboarding, but not just waterboarding, waterboarding specifically muslims, mostecently racialized group will step banning muslims from entering into the country. is saying, he does not sit too far outside what marco rubio or ted cruz represent in that realm. the problem here is trump's rhetoric. it is that it is so vile and that it is reinvigorating the idea of racism as a legitimate political ideology that we should take seriously and it should be a part of our politics. it was going away from the southern strategy of richard nixon and lee atwater and ronald reagan and sort of the coded language, and now laying it all bear. trump is thrown the veil off. he's using the exact line which i think a lot of these republican candidates wish they could use, but because they been trained to be more savvy politicians, they have not been. it now trump is here and saying all of the things that they wish they could have said for years. that is why the rise of the tea party was such a phenomenon, because they were saying, "we don't want to hide this anymore. we would like to

. >> what about waterboarding, is that torture?> i don't think it's torture. >> would you support waterboarding? >> yes. it's not something you'd do for fun but if experienced and expert interrogators say this is a ticking time bomb situation and this is information that will help stop the attack, yes, that's a tough call. if you don't want to make tough calls, you shouldn't seek that job. but it's important to know that american soldiers volunteer to be waterboarded as a part of their training. we don't torture our own personnel in our military. >> under the law now it is consider editor tour, waterboarding. >> so techniques are limited to the army field manual which is widely available online. >> when you served, never did waterboarding, that was left to civilians at the cia. >> it was only done in the intelligence agencies in a very limited set of circumstances. the leadership said that it did elicit useful information. now, there is a practical debate. you can say it may not be effective or counterproductive but i don't think t

senator cruz, would you think about waterboarding?goes, oh man, uh, whitney go back and talk to my consultant. they are all afraid about being politically correct. then they go to meet, because he did not give an answer. he is a great debater but a lousy talker, does that make sense? [laughter] greatt know if he is a debater. i think i beat him in all of the debates. [cheering] ted cruz, it is from three debates ago, he gave a nonanswer, which is unlike him in all fairness. they came to me. i said in front of the audience. i have more money than all of them together. i don't have a pollster. i don't want a pollster. good, theye any would be doing what we are doing right? they spent hundreds of thousands on pollsters. they came to me, what do you think about waterboarding? east,, in the middle they are chopping off heads, they are drowning people, they are killing people. they would kill us so quickly if they had the capability. and they are trying to get that, which is why we have to kill them, just so you understand. [cheering] if th

go ahead. >> waterboarding is not something you should talk about flippantly.olicy is not only illegal but unconstitutional. their discussion, we should not be having a as a civilized -- >> the. see court never declared that. read the -- >> i want to say, one step further if we're going to stop this terror we're facing we can't isolate ourselves from the rest of the world and can't disrespect the largest religion in the entire world. >> what we can't do, when abdeslam stops talking can't say sorry, we're not going to inconvenience him -- >> so waterboard him? >> we're afraid to make him feel bad a few moments to save american lives, save brussels lives, parisian lives. 139 people died, if you need waterboarding to it protect them, by all means. >> wow. >> what difference would it have made if they waterboarded this guy? >> i can tell you this -- >> ask john mccain. >> somebody tortured. he said it doesn't work. >> go ahead, bill. >> i'll make it again. >> sheikh mohammed was not talking, waterboarded a number of times. we were able to identify the courier that

you not waterboarding didn't get us the information.o why not give it a shot. >> all right. where do you stand, pete? >> well, i don't have much of a problem with waterboarding if it's going to get us the intelligence we need in realtime. the problem is the incoherence of what donald trump talks about. he says he wants to torture but his advisers say no, that's not what he means. he's not grounded in a real understanding of what his rhetoric means. therefore, he overcomplicates the situation. for the most part, carl and i agree. we would unleash war fighters, let them go and find the enemy and kill them. but his rhetoric is unhelpful. >> i think he's been real clear on that. >> pete's pamaking the argument that it's more the delivery of the message. >> he wants to bomb the crap out of isis and if the laws permit, he wants to do much more than waterboarding. >> so donald trump and ted cruz appear to agree on at least one thing. donald trump said late yesterday he agreed with ted cruz's proposal to target muslim neighborhoods, calling it

waterboarding. i have been many discussions about this. i am curious as to your view is that you have made it clear although not precisely clear in the book. the navy s.e.a.l.s and the special forces, many of them are water boarded as part of their training. >> is our whole bunch of americans. my deputy was a former navy s.e.a.l. there is batman there is also the case of some journalists and authors. so the test for not torturing is simple and clear. but i don't know any other things called torture by anyone such as putting bamboo shoots under her fingernails that is done by journalists, to see what it's like and there has to be something a bit different which might put it in the same category. especially you put sleep deprivation into this. there is some difficult circumstances. >> you are right. i have treated this with some depth. not because i wanted to sell justified. but to try to create this historical record, i try to do that to the best of my ability. and i do notice a distinction but there are some things that everyone agrees on

and tougher than waterboarding. >> for us, waterboarding was the hardest question. and our view was, it was basically right at the line of what was legal or illegal. but you could not go beyond it. so for trump to say he would go beyond waterboarding. i have no idea what he has in mind. i think it would violate federal law. >> he's absolutely right. we've been tortured over the issue of waterboarding. we've drawn a fine line and donald doesn't seem to care about where lines are drawn. the other point about both donald trump and ted cruz is their comments about taking on the muslim community. banning muslims or going after them in a slightly indiscriminate way with more police action. right? >> the thing about europe, because of our political system and our security apparatus, that works with muslim leaders, we don't have the isolated, insulated communities that is dogging europe. there's one study that says most terrorists have been turned in by muslim leaders and government investigators to law enforcement. it is not in our national security to disrupt the relation

we should go with waterboarding and we should go tougher than wat waterboarding. >> the trump campaign said i will not order a military officer to disobey the law. it will be bound by laws like all americans and i will meet those responsibilities. the trump debate had many moments in it. that was probably a high point. it was a pretty low moment for trump and the other candidates filled with schoolyard taunts and subtle references to genitalia. sara murray is outfront tonight in new orleans at a rally. the reversal on torture is very significant. donald trump has doubled down, tripled down, on this issue. what's behind the about face? >> reporter: that's right. he has made it a regular talking point to talk about torture saying he would bring back waterboarding and things even worse than that. i think the reality is backlash has been stirring among national security experts, among foreign policy experts. i think that's why you're seeing him walk that back today. when he takes that stance saying he agrees with violating international law, it looks like he doesn't understand the geneva c

again, they did the waterboarding, the u.s. military was not thorauthorized to engag waterboarding after 9/11. cia personnel did. do you think they want to do it again? >> i don't think there are many people who would want to do that. there are a number of ways of collecting intelligence. the way to do this, figure out the motivation of why they would want to cooperate with us and these individuals know they're not seeing the light of day any time soon. so there are a number of tactics that you can use before even having to consider or think about that option. >> is security tight enough at u.s. airports? you're on the homeland security committee. what we saw at the major international airport in brussels today, guys apparently just walked in before they went through any security, they were there with their carts near the baggage -- at the arrivals and they just blew themselves up. >> i sat on a task force that looked at foreign fighters going to fight in iraq and syria and one of the things that we learned is that it's night a

and tougher than waterboarding. >> for us, waterboarding was the hardest question. and our view was, it was basically right at the line of what was legal or illegal. but you could not go beyond it. so for trump to say he would go beyond waterboarding. i have no idea what he has in mind. i think it would violate federal law. >> he's absolutely right. we've been tortured over the issue of waterboarding. we've drawn a fine line and donald doesn't seem to care about where lines are drawn. the other point about both donald trump and ted cruz is their comments about taking on the muslim community. banning muslims or going after them in a slightly indiscriminate way with more police action. right? >> the thing about europe, because of our political system and our security apparatus, that works with muslim leaders, we don't have the isolated, insulated communities that is dogging europe. there's one study that says most terrorists have been turned in by muslim leaders and government investigators to law enforcement. it is not in our national security to disrupt the relation

i would have waterboarding and i would go a step further. we could have probably cut this off if they used the right technique and used the right technique on him. >> reporter: but hillary clinton blasting trump's approach. >> i don't think they need to resort to torture. you know, that's like an on recruitment poster for more terrorists, and it's wrong and it doesn't work. >> reporter: senator ted cruz with his own solution -- patrols of muslims neighborhoods in the u.s. >> it is standard good policing to direct your resources to where the threat is coming from. we should do the exact same thing with radical islamic terrorism. >> reporter: senator bernie sanders calling that not only wrong, but unconstitutional. >> we are fighting a terrorist organization. we are not fighting a religion. >> reporter: and governor kasich agreeing. >> in our country, we don't want to create divisions where we say okay your religion, you're a muslim, so therefore we're going to keep an eye on you. donald trump saying he agrees 100% with senator ted cruz, that

the waterboarding would be fine.f they could expand the laws, i would do a lot more than waterboarding. you have to get information from these people and we have to be smart and we have to be tough and we cannot be soft and weak, which is what we are right now. amy: in fact, he said we have to torture them. donald trump said that this week. at least he called it what it was. a talk about the significance of what donald trump is calling for, the man who could be president trump, and cruz before him. >> first of all, i do get a little disturbed by this widespread notion on the part of a lot of well-intentioned people that donald trump is somehow so far outside of what we regard as what had been previously acceptable within an it can political discourse. i mean, if you look at what ted cruz has actually been saying and what he has been doing, you can subtly make the case -- and i would be someone who agrees with this -- that ted cruz is in many respects, maybe most respects, more dangerous than trump. ted cruz is this t

one of the arguments that i heard is if we waterboard, if we don't waterboard, they will treat hoursf what they do right now. >> today, after you? >> i'm sorry? come after me as far as waterboarding? >> as far as what you did. you shot bin laden. are they after you? >> are the isis guys after me? >> no. the left in general. we had the left and the right on the side of that. we had people on the right like secretary gates. they seem okay with it. >> they give very much for being with us. thank you, sir. erin andrews wins a $55 million peeping tom lawsuit. you can bet that she will only see a fraction of that. ♪ this just got interesting. why pause to take a pill? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use is approved to treat both erectile dysfunction and the urinary symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently, day or night. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, or adempas for pulmonary hypertension, as it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressu

we cannot waterboard anymore. waterboarding, nothing is nice about it, but it is a minimal form.e have to go much tougher. it is eating up the world now. a lot of the world is weak. what is happening in germany is unbelievable. what is happening in a small part of sweden is unbelievable. a lot of people are saying, donald trump is right. john: senator ted cruz came out to say we should have police patrols in muslim neighborhoods in the united states. you said this was a good idea. iraqd the former master to on ourssador on iraq show. he said, this is exactly what isis would want the united states to do. how do you respond? trump: i'm ok. we have to be vigilant, careful. theew york city, we had strongest police department, amazing people. if you talk love vigilance, we were watching closer than anybody else, an amazing group, and actually cut people. mayor who isby a .rossly incompetent, de blasio they ended it. we should bring it back. we have to be vigilant, and look, even if it is at the mosques. not: i think you are responding to the substance of the argument. you think the ma

so are you still in support of waterboarding and more? >> i'm in total support of waterboarding. be within the law so i have to expand the law. a lot of people think it's not within the law now because of this administration. so they are allowed to chop off heads and we aren't allowed to waterboard. somehow we're at a big disadvantage. and i was going to give you the analogy. so they are sitting around having dinner. they eat two, even though they chop off heads and drown people, and they are talking. can you imagine the conversation when they are talking about how weak and soft and pathetic we are and they go out and chop people's heads off. they can't believe it. the fact is, just in a nutshell, we have to be much tougher. if we're going to beat isis, we have to be much tougher than we are. when you have general hayden saying, oh, that's so terrible the way trump is talking. that's why we're losing. >> i have to ask you. i watched the press conference you gave last night. the victory speech. obviously huge night for you. just a couple factual things. thi the steaks you showed,

the waterboarding would be fine and if they could expand the laws, i would do a lot more than waterboarding. you have to get the information from these people and we have to be smart and we have to be tough and we can't be soft and weak, which is what we are right now. but i say we, i'm talking about other countries also. >> if you talk to experts who do these interrogations you often find a division. some people think that kind of harsh interrogation technique will work and deliver you the information and others say it doesn't work, you'll get false information. are you in the camp that harsh interrogation, shall we say, torture, works in a case like this? >> yes, i am in that camp. i don't believe the other people. i am in that camp. absolutely. they'll read him his rights. he'll sit there with a good lawyer and the lawyer and ten years will go bye-bye the time it goes by, the world will have moved on to an even worst place. i am in the camp where you have to get the information and you have to get it rapidly. >> keep in mind draw the extinction held by law enforcement not by some militar

i'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding. >> seth: so what is worse than waterboarding, you ask? well, trump gave a hint when discussing his skill at deal making. >> with congress, you have to get everybody in a room, and you have to get them to agree. but you have to get them to agree with what you want, and that's part of being a deal maker. you have to get people in, grab 'em, hug 'em, kiss 'em -- [ laughter ] >> seth: incidentally, "grab the title of trump's book on dating. [ laughter ] the new hampshire primary is, of course, tomorrow. for trump, rubio, and cruz, it's a chance to emerge as a frontrunner. for kasich, christie, and bush, it's a last stand. and for ben carson, it is, like all things for ben carson, a waiting game. [ applause ] [ cheers and applause ] we'll be right back with more "late night." [ cheers and applause ] ot ath onei an orc-o-am an "the. youd hi sty drew. sheants to ch theworld withou. he crogramnginto td such heriggestkneshe too ch ank you. frienly w jobat ge. ne too a wisf from ire. aanjay tel is wou ld hir you sh give r a sh. saay's aea

they were the big ones. [ inaudible ] so the question was asked about waterboarding, and waterboarding is a very, very touchy subject. it was originally asked two debates ago to ted cruz. and he sort of didn't want any part of that question, and i watched and i said wow. then they said how do you feel? and i said, i am totally in favor of waterboarding. and if we can, i would like to do much more than that, okay? [ applause ] just so you understand, we're playing by a different set of rules than isis and others. so we have laws and rules and regulations and all of these things, and they have nothing. they chop off people's heads. they drown people in massive steel cages. they drop the cage for one hour, they lift it up and there are 30 dead people. here we are worried about waterboarding. i will obey the laws, but i will try and get the laws extended. i will try and get the laws broadened, because we should be allowed -- because it's very hard to be successful in beating someone when your rules are very soft and they have unlimited rules and they can do whatever way want to do. [ appla

i mean, his language on waterboarding was so bad that it actually gave waterboarding a bad name. [laughter] okay? and i recognize it, but a lot of language in the book that -- i give that the greatest respect for all i argue, and you know this, all i argued is that we did based upon how out of duty, not enthusiasm. we did it is one legal judgment we had at the time. and it did, in fact, lead to information but i still get it. my really honorable opinion don't do it, ever. that's all. and by the way, right now, u.s. law says it's off. you can't do it. i also make the point, i made the point of the book tour and actually make it in the book that is a future president decides that he was going to return to this end he someone creates the legal framework where it is no longer unlawful, i say quite specifically, he better bring his own pocket it has the cia is not going to do it again. because as i explained in about two or three chapters of the book, the people who did this in good faith the leaving they were covered by their government and by their governments legal opinion, failed

we should go for waterboarding and tougher than waterboarding. >> targeting terrorist families?i'm a leader, i've always been a leader. i've never had any problem leading people. if i say do it, they're going to do it. that's what leadership is all about. >> even targeting terrorist families? >> well, look, when a family flies into the world trade center, a man flies into the the military just like ronald reagan did in 1981 coming out of the weak jimmy carter administration. he passed tax reform and regulatory reform. the economy took off. it generated millions in high-paying jobs, trillions in new revenue. he rebuilt the military. bankrupted the soviet union. and won the cold war. as president, i will do the exact same thing with radical islamic terrorism. we will rebuild this military so that it remains the mightiest fighting force on the face of the planet. and then when i am commander in chief, every militant on the face of the earth will understand that if they go and join isis, if they wage jihad against the united states of america, they are signing their death warrant. >

so, the question was asked about waterboarding. waterboarding is a very touchy subject. it was originally asked two decades ago to ted cruz. he sort of didn't want any part of that question. i watched and i said wow. they look at me and said, how do you feel. i said, i'm totally in favor of waterboarding. and if we can, i'd like to do much more than that. just so you understand, we are playing by a different set of rules than isis and others in the middle east. we have laws and rules and regulations and all of these things, and they have nothing. they chop off people's heads. they drown people in massive steel cages. they dropped the case for one hour, they lift it up and there are 30 dead people. here we are worried about waterboarding. here is the story. i will obey the laws, but i will try and get the laws extended. i will try and get the laws broadened. because we should be allowed -- because it's very hard to be successful in beating someone when you're rules are very soft and their rules are unlimited. they can do whatever they want to do. and i want to play -- [ap