and there is wayne lapierre saying not one more law. >> of course they -- disagree with where lapierreecause most members of the nra when they go out and hunt never discharge more than two or three bulls at a time. the vast majority of nra members have never looked at a 30-round or 100-round clip that goes into one of these guns. listen, he is so fundamentally out of step with where the nra is, that those politicians in washington that have had their votes frankly for decades dictated by the nra need to free themselves from those chains. i don't think there is any political gain any longer to following wayne lapierre when the majority of gun owners absolutely believe that there is common sense gun legislation to take these military-style weapons off the table. to get these high capacity clips off of the table and allow them to get back to the sport that they enjoy. listen, this guy walked into sandy hook elementary school and within ten minutes, had killed 27 people. only two people escaped with injuries. there is absolutely no reason why gun owners and non gun owners can't come to the

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wayne lapierre took no argument. he called for armed guards in school and ripped the media for reporting misinformation and failing to nail the real culprits. >> in a race to the bottom, media conglomerates compete with one another to shock, violate and offend every standard of civilized society. by bringing in an even more toxic mix of reckless behavior and criminal cruelty right into our homes. >> so, is there any validity to these bombastic charges against the press. joining us now here in washington, terence smith, former correspondent for pbs news hour and cbs news and "new york times." and tom foreman who attended friday's nra event. tom, what was it like being at this nra event? i won't call it a press conference. are you surprised that not a single journalist got to ask a question? >> it was not a press conference. all of us expected to exchange questions and answers with wayne lapierre and the president of nra who was there. it didn't happen at all. it did not happen but adamantly did not happen. several of

wayne lapierre is going to speak, the head of the nra. we got a warning two minutes ago that it would be two minutes. we're waiting for him to show up. the nra is america's premiere gun rights lobby. it may be facing its biggest challenge in years as many americans shocked, they were shocked by newtown and they're calling for tougher restrictions on guns and ammunition, and while we wait for the group's executive director to appear, wayne lapierre, i want to bring in several of my colleagues now. first off, wolf blitzer is here, jessica yellin is at the white house, dana bash on capitol hill, and jeffrey toobin is in new york for us. as we wait, wolf, let's start with you. is this, in fact, a turning point for guns in america? do you think we'll hear anything like that in this press conference? >> i know a lot of attitudes have hardened as a result of what has happened over the past week in newtown, connecticut. you were there, i was there, and people all over the country and all over the world are outraged by the horrible nature of that

congressman, you heard wayne lapierre.s he reflect your views about how to approach any kind of remedy after a massacre like newtown, which is we should talk about everybody but guns? >> my wife and i, we have three kids. if there's something that we can do that will make sure that this never ever, ever, ever happens again, of course i'll support it, but i also -- >> come on, there's no standard likes that. that's why you try things. that's what public policy is about. >> i'm a concealed permit carrier, i have a glock 23, i have a shotgun. there are millions just like me. we're not the problem. i think there's common ground we should be attacking first and foremost is that mental health issue because there are maybe not the laws that we need. maybe there's not the reporting that we need. to say that's already been tackled -- >> has politics changed, harold? is wayne lapierre as you heard him to in sync with the political class on both sides of the aisle today? >> no, he's not in sync with the country. the argument i heard

. >> wayne lapierre came out after a week of silence. he talked about disdain for the media, violent video games and the lack of security at school was part of the problem but avoids guns being part of the problem. what's the reaction from this press conference? >> in washington the reaction was somewhat shocked by the news conference just because of the tone. it was so different from what we've been hearing from others in particular president omo bama who had called out on gun control. he's made this commission that vice president will lead that's supposed to report backy. and then wayne lapierre came forward and talked about putting armed officers in the nation. he was not aiming for the beltway crowd. that's important to remember. it will be interesting in the next few weeks and months how his comments played in other parts of the country outside the beltway. that's who he was talking to. >> he made the rounds in the morning talk shows and stood his ground despite the backlash. it would cost more than $2 billion to put security office

it seems like fear itself is the only thing that wayne lapierre has to offer. let's take a listen to this. >> violent crime is increasing again for the first time in 19 years. add another hurricane, terrorist attack, or some other natural or manmade disaster, and you've got a recipe for a national nightmare of violence and victimization. >> mark, can wayne lapierre get then ra out of the fix it's in by scaring people into thinking that all we need is guns, that guns are the answer to every particular catastrophe that we confront in this country? >> you know, i must admit, i have been a student of then ra for a long time. my dad was a gun dealer in colorado, knew lots of nra members. i have to say i was surprised by what happened today. his comments were, first of all, factually incoherent and struck me as being so politically tone deaf that it kind of left me wondering where this impression came from that the nra was a political powerhouse. i think they have a real problem on their hands, and part of the reason they have a problem on their hands is that, in fac

>> well, wayne lapierre works for the gun manufacturers. he really doesn't represent the majority of the members who are far more sane and responsible than the leadership is. you know, if you -- there is 125,000 public schools in the country. a security guard at 50,000 with benefits per year, that's $6.25 billion. do you think the nra would be willing to tax its guns and ammunition in order to pay that? i doubt it. but more importantly, ed, do we really want our children to grow up into a world where the first thing they see when they cross the school threshold is a military-style assault weapon carried by somebody with a weapon, a vest and dressed in a s.w.a.t. uniform? i mean, it seems to me -- i know that's the world the nra envisions. but it seems to me we're so much better than that. that's not the world we want our children to grow up into. and it's time for this country to say no to the nra. the fact that you have 19 times greater likelihood of being killed by a firearm in the united states than any other industrialized nation in the

as we saw in the news conference by wayne lapierre today.banning any sorts of guns are the problem. they think there are monsters out there, as he said, but it's okay for the monsters to buy weapons as long as the good guys have weapons, too. that's the solution to their problem. so however many bullets you can fire at once, machine gun, submachine gun. that's all fine as long as the good guys have guns, we're saying. >> the more guns america has, the more gun murders occur. in japan where they have almost zero guns, they have almost zero gun murders. and the parallels are there all around the world. i don't get why the nra can get away with statements like this, and there isn't just a huge outcry. >> we'll see. i think things have changed somewhat. they remain a very powerful group. they're speaking to a constituency that really believes in their message, and historically, at least, that you cross the nra at your peril as a politician. they have a great deal of money. they have a great deal of influence. politicians care deeply about gettin

though it may not solve the problem, i expected wayne lapierre, i actually expected wayne lapierre tosay exactly what he said and then say oh by the way i have stuck to doom dogmatic positions for too long and it's time to ban the -- >> this is the importance. the nra is built on myths at this point in many ways much the nra has 4 million members. it is essentially a lobby for gun manufacturers. not for its members, who the majority of them according to a poll commissioned by a republican pollster do not agree with the in you're positions on background check, on ban on assault weapons. i think that's important bass the nra myth has put us in a stranglehold in this country. the other thing, i respect the noble sentiments about the need to treat mental illness and deal with the video games but other western industrialized countries have those problems and have video culture. japan is at the cutting edge and don't allow access to military assault-style -- this is not about freedom but tyranny and destruction. >> this is what frustrates -- [ all talking at one ] >> the mental illness argu

the head of the nra, wayne lapierre, said guns are not the problem. instead, he took aim what the he called the media machine in this country, a cracked system for dealing with mentally ill, and the federal government, whose enforcement of existing restrictions on guns he called pitiful. facing a barrage of tough questions for the first time since its deadly massacre in newtown, on meet the appreciation the nra's ceo, wayne lapierre, forcefully defended his call for armed officers in every school. >> if it's crazy to call for putting police and armed security in our school to protect our children, then call me crazy. i think the american people think it's crazy not to do it. it's the one thing that will keep americans safe the nra is going to do that. >> reporter: critics point to columbine and virginia tech, both of which had armed guards, unable to stop the carnage. but the leading voice disagrees for the gun lobby. >> say i'm mom or dad and dropping my child off at school, i feel a whole lot safe we are these great men and women on police forces. >

in a way, could wayne lapierre be crazy like a fox?be misdirecting everyone away from the obvious solution that even republicans are saying this is crazy, the idea of schools and meanwhile, we are talking mental health and video games, everything except gun control. i want to reiterate other countries have video games, by the way. >> they do? >> yes. i have said it before, it's my big thing. what i think is, it kind of goes back to bob's point, which is the nra membership has to stand-up to him. you know, we know that he represents the industry. you know, with childhood obesity, let's say, mcdonald's didn't say we are going to stop making french fries. they said we understand we have a high calorie food, so we are going to offer salads and post, you know, the nutritional content on our food. we are going to make concessions. we are not going to stop what we are doing but we realize that partially hydrogenated oils are part of the problem. he can't even see -- >> totally inflexible. >> i think people look at that and say wow. i think th

congressman, you heard wayne lapierre.s he reflect your views about how to approach any kind of remedy after a massacre like newtown which is we should talk about everything but guns? >> look, my wife and i, we have three kids, and i -- if there's something that we can do again, of course i'll support it, but i also -- >> come on, there's no standard likes that. that's why you try things. that's what public policy is about. >> i'm a concealed permit carrier, i have a glock 23, i have a shotgun. there are millions just like me. we're not the problem. i think there's common ground we should be attacking first and foremost is that mental health issue because there are maybe not the laws that we need. maybe there's not the reporting that we need. to say that's already been tackled -- >> has politics changed, harold? is wayne lapierre as you heard him to in sync with the political class on both sides of the aisle today? >> no, he's not in sync with the country. the argument i heard my friend lindsey graham make the argument i h

does wayne lapierre give up his $1.4 million a year salary? no.y have methodically gone from state legislature to state legislature chipping away at modest restrictions that most nra members support. so he has a huge problem, i think, based on that bizarre press conference, with the membership of the nra which is quite reasonable. >> ari, i want to get your reaction to the press conference the other day but as an attorney, to sort of talk about that turn because it is sort of a unique kind of feature of the idea of the constitution that you have this unique, you know, the individual right to bear arms. because historically, there's been lots of gun legislation. i was reading about sort of even the battle at the ok corral and these other fights in the wyatt earp days when you had to check your gun in at the sheriff's office. that was perfectly reasonable and it was sort of a novel turn in our idea of the constitution in the '80s and '90s that you had this individual right to bear arms. >> we've had what can only be described as a radical shift in t

. >> here's a bit what was he said from his news conference today, wayne lapierre.immediately to appropriate whatever is necessary to put armed police officers in every single school in this nation and to do it now to make sure that blanket safety is in place when our kids return to school in january. is there any research or evidence that in fact arming security guards, arming teachers, arming administrators, would be an effective solution here? >> no. there's no research that says that putting more firearms in the hands of trained or untrained professionals in a shoot-out is going to make anybody who's sitting around safer. but there's lots of evidence that it won't. let me tell you a couple things. first of all, in my home state of colorado, at columbine there was a deputy sheriff there, there was another security guard nearby, they were not able to stop what happened. i can tell you the international association of chiefs of police said earlier today they thought it was about impossible as a budgetary matter and unwise as a public safety matter to think the way

wayne lapierre was speaking to the constituency of the nra. he was careful not to say anything that would offend his own membership. secondly when he was speaking i was hoping that he would speak on behalf of the nra in a calm, constructive and sort of common ground way. but he missed his shot in this talk. instead of emphasizing some kind of positive proposal, he did towards the end of his talk mention this model school shield program which at least is an idea that can be discussed but instead of going right to that and offering it in constructive way he spends the first 15 minutes of his talk bashing the media, talking about the familiar whipping boys of violence in movies and in video games, et cetera and as you pointed out there's no particular correlation between those things and actual violence in society. >> professor, back to your point i want to flaws. you're pointing out research and michael brought thunder as well. our culture is not exclusive to video games and certainly not to mental illness and to repeatedly bring this up as the

senator schumer, your reaction to wayne lapierre.any attempt the president makes at gun control legislation is bound to fail because it won't work and it's just a bunch of old arguments. how do you react? >> i think he's so extreme and so tone deaf that he actually helps the cause of us passing sensible gun legislation in the congress. look, he blames everything but guns, movies, the media, president obama, gun-free school zones, you name it, the video games, he blames them. now, trying to prevent shootings in schools without talking about guns is like trying to prevent lung cancer without talking about cigarettes. he is so adamant that i believe gun owners turn against him as well. look, he says the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. what about trying to stop the bad guy from getting the gun in the first place. that's common sense, most americans agree with it and i just think he's turning people off. that's not where america is at and he's actually helping us. >> senator graham, there are nra supporters

the group's ceo wayne lapierre blamed laws banning guns at schools for violence. position, more guns. the nra called for putting an armed guard at every school in the country. >> the only way to stop a monster from killing our kids is to be personally involved and invested in a plan of absolute protection. the only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. i call on congress today to act immediately to appropriate whatever is necessary to put armed police officers in every single school in this nation and to do it now. >> training thousands of armed guards and what would it accomplish? would one armed person have really been able to stop last week's killer with his semiautomatic rifle and body armor? msnbc political analyst david corn is the washington bureau chief for "mother jones" magazine. are you comfortable with what the nra put forward today? >> absolutely. this is the only answer. more guns equals less crime. if we don't arm the teachers and have guards, this is going to happen again. >> do i understand your view that it would be a re

what did you think of wayne lapierre's statement? >> you could hear the collective gasps. stylistically and substantively what wayne said. i think the larger conversation you began and i thought it was a terrific interview with rick warren is what families are talking about this holiday season. enjoying time with the families but thinking of the connecticut families. i'm from connecticut and grew up not far from newtown. i personally as a mom am thinking about those mothers and fathers and i get teared up when i teen talk about it. i do believe that this rush to if we only had the assault weapons ban and the ban on the high capacity magazines we wouldn't have the problems. i think it is wrong headed. we could pass those laws tomorrow. and if we did, i think we would still have a significant problem. your scowls not withstanding. i love one but he scowls. i love you and i love your are tie. we would still have violence. the assault weapons ban did not demonstrably reduce violence in the united states. >> chris: thank you and we will continue the conversation on panel plus as

wayne lapierre will be speaking.eo of the national rifle association. he began working for the group in 1978, took over the top post in '91. lapierre has been a hardliner on gun rights once saying bill clinton had blood on his hands for supporting gun control measures. tom foreman, cnn's tom foreman, covering the news conference. he's on the phone because they just went through a security sweep in the room before people entered the room where wayne lapierre will begin speaking. tom, tell us what that's like. >> reporter: hi, carol. we just had a security sweep here. we're all getting re-established in the room and we're expecting not only wayne lapierre but a business of a surprise guest, the nra won't say who. i will note a short while ago the president of the nra, dave keen, who is one of the most astute and involved political players for the nra and has been for many, many years with top players in washington, he's one of the point men on any sort of political debate about new gun legislation, he came out promptly

but you've got wayne lapierre saying precisely the opposite. >> gun prosecutions have tracked the up and down ticks. the real doozy is that lapierre said on friday and again on sunday kind of fall into three categories. first is all of these questions, these policies that we're talking about, these new laws we're talking about whether they be clips or semiautomatics. whether they be background checks, somehow violate the second amendment. there are probably hundreds of challenges to in the federal courts on these laws that exist in many states. and they have all been vol dated. so gun restrictions, gun violence laws have been v validated in 99%. the second argument is he makes we need more prosecution of gun crimes under existing crimes. the fact of the matter is the nra has consistently opposed giving law enforcement the tools that they need. if you ask law enforcement, they will tell you they need things like a national registry of gun sales tracing technology. so when crimes occur, they're able to trace them back. law enforcement says they need background checks and the nra has opp

lynn, we had heard from the nra not for a week before yesterday and in fact, this is what wayne lapierrein his call to action from yesterday. take a listen to this. >> i call on congress today to appropriate whatever is necessary to put armed police officers in every single school in this nation and to do it now to make sure that blanket safety is in place when our kids return to school in january. >> lynn, you wrote about his speech during that news conference and you call his performance, you were very clear in saying, quote, it was cringe worthy. basically saying he was tone deaf. what were you expecting here? >> well, i expected that they said that they would have a meaningful suggestion to come forth on friday and even if you take seriously and no, you know, there's no -- nothing wrong with discussing if schools need beefed-up security and knowing that there's such a debate over the fiscal cliff did wayne lapierre think that with the few days left in congress they could get a report that no one would know what it would cost? it's mind-boggling. so i think if you're going to suggest

wayne lapierre wants to put guns in every school. of course we know they had an armed guard at columbine on that want day who traded fire with those killers. some people on the right don't understand why the left is unhappy about this idea of putting guns in every single school. do you think that's a good idea? >> i don't consider myself to be on the left or right. i have very i diediosyncratic i. yes personally i would put a cop who knows how to use guns i would. is it practical? no. i don't see the serious argument against doing that. >> putting more guns around kids, no serious argument around that? >> not in the hands of trained law enforcement officers. thousands of schools do that. a cop in front of a school might see the guy in black camouflage with the automatic, semiautomatic coming towards him. it's worth the cost of his salary. >> good stuff. straight ahead our next guest puts the gop in full meltdown mode. how can leadership handle the party with republicans all wanting to beat to their own drummer and it may be friday bu

the head of the national rival association, wayne lapierre joins me.ebt deal before we reach the fiscal cliff on january 1? and the political roundtable on the president's priorities for the new year. that's all coming up on "meet the press" this morning. >>> and now, the state's biggest casino in national harbor will begin 24 hour operations, and the expansion is part of the bill maryland voters approved last month. >>> and then tomorrow is the holiday spectacle. the water skiing santa and his knee boarding reindeer. he will step on to some water skis and jet up and down the potomac. rain or shine it's going to happen, and the best view is from national harbor. this is the 27th year for the event. >> we know santa will be a little busy for his trip around the world, so he spent his saturday taking a quick swim. kids got to see st. nick in the water with fish and sea turtles and all the other ocean creatures out there. hopefully the reindeer don't get jealous seeing santa with the wish. >> what can this guy not do? he water skis. he runs the sleigh, an

wayne lapierre's message is basically we are all arg targets and we need to have a gun on us at all times and need to have our schools with armed security guards, basically the same message he reiterated five years ago after the tragedy we witnessed at virginia tech and joining me beau biden and representative yarmouth from kentucky and and michael steel and the former rnc chairman and then karen finney, contributor writing for the hill. it is great to have you here and i know we were listening together. michael, i want to start with you on this. the right has been instin at. did the nra help seal the message that we really need to talk about this more than we ever thought before because if their meaningful contribution is all of us have a target on our back and all of us need to carry a gun, we have big problems. >> we do. you know, i don't know where to begin. as a supporter of the second amendment and a supporter of the nra, even though i am not a member of the nra, i just found it very haunting and very disturbing that we are country talking about arming our teachers and principals in

left and i want to go on, and we'll go on at length in the panel plus, what did you think of wayne lapierre'sou heard the collective gasp when he got up there, stylistically and substantively what wayne said and i think the larger conversation, that he began, i thought it was a terrific interview with rick warren is what families are talking about. this holiday season. they are enjoying their time with their families but thinking of the connecticut families and i'm from connecticut and i grew up not far from newtown and i personally as a mom, am thinking about the mothers and fathers and get teared up when i talk about it. the rush -- if we had the assault weapons ban and only the ban on the high capacity magazines, we wouldn' have the problems. i think it is wrong headed. we could pass those laws tomorrow. and, if we did, i think we still have a significant problem, your scowls notwithstanding. i love juan but he scowls sometime someone speaks -- and i love you and i love your tie. pass those laws, chris and we'll have people doing all sorts of things with a mixture of chemicals, bomb-making

schools. >> i want you to listen to wayne lapierre, talking about the high-capacity magazines that ias just discussing with ilya. isn't it just possibility keck redeuce the carnage? >> i don't believe that's going to make one difference. even if you had that, you had that for ten years when dianne feinstein passed that ban in '94, it was on the books. column buy occurred right in the middle of it. it doesn't make any difference. i know this town wants to argue about gun control. i don't think that's what will work. >> what's your reaction? >> we don't deal with gun control specifically, but i can tell you we do a lot of work on incarceration. we know we as a society pay to incarcerate people who perpetrate gun violence. there are plenty of people in prison who are not criminals, who were caught up in emotion and the only crime they ever committed was a crime of passion. you know, if there hadn't been a gun present, if they weren't able to have access to a gun, it's hard to say. to say that it's an individual right is to ignore there's a huge social cost for all of us, not just in ter