. >> you don't hear people say -- roger wilkins, who just said it, these were bad people. >> i know. >> did you ask him about why he said that? >> well, we had been talking about it, it was a long interview, a two-hour interview. he just thought at their heart they were segregationists and they were rists at their heart, a lot of them. he thought the people would never do anything good for african-americans, he just felt they were bad at the core in that way. morally, i guess. >> strom thurmond was he a governor of the state of south carolina? >> governor then. he became senator. >> when did he switch parties, do you remember? >> after the civil rights bill and then you'll see him later on, of course, at the 1968 republican convention standing next to richard nixon, walking out with him. >> one of the things in that first clip that we saw was reference to 60 million people were listening. i know that was on television but very few people could even see that. >> right. >> how important was radio in those days? >> it was the medium. and the fact there were 60 million, maybe, i don't kn