joining me once again former nsa official thomas drake, kirk weibe, and william dinney. mr.tart with you. this new lawsuit that appears to be moving forward threatens traps that's the wrong word, gives us the opportunity to open up this pandora's box of what the nsa is doing. do you think finally a court of law will force the nsa to be open with the public about what it has done? >> we hope so, but historically in these type of cases the government has hidden behind the state secrets clause. >> eliot: it's being challenged, and people are saying that interest is a court system designed for this, use that instead of claiming state secret. remind us what is the magnitude that we're talking about here? who has been the subject of this unconstitution surveillance, how fast do you think it is? >> essentially the entire country. i mean, this was decisions key decisions made shortly after 9/11 which began to rapidly turn the united states the equivalent of a foreign nation for electronic surveillance. >> eliot: enormous amounts of e-mail traffic was being absorbed recorded listened