but he also wrote about william tecumseh sherrman which is not new york at all. >> no. >> rose: so he could go far from new york but new york was where he always wanted to be. >> right. >> it was always a work of the imagination. so if you asked me as you did who how would he like to be remembered i mean i think it's in the world of melville. it's in the world of the great american writers who took a great big tapestry of american life and a of life in general. and took us into a story that just wouldn't quit. >> rose: and did he feel that he belonged there? >> i don't know whether he did or not. i would guess that most-- most writers that i know are restless. they're always trying to do better. to do something different. to surprise you, to surprise themselves. >> rose: so he was an experimenter as we always said but also a learner. >> i think he was pleased with his work. i don't know where he would place himself but i think i know where he would like to be placed. >> rose: he was an editor. >> he was an editor. >> rose: publishing works by people like normal mailer. >> yes, at the