we are looking forward to hear from her his love and finally william voegeli, senior editor of the claremont review of books and a visiting scholar at claremont mckenna college henry salvatori center. is the author of two books. he should fit in well, and his work has appeared in a wide number of newspapers and peer-reviewed journals across the country. again we expect to have a really lively discussions are just get out of the way and turned over to donna to start us off. >> thank you, michael. oh, shoot. sorry. okay. so what i want to do is i want to start with just a little bit of background from a so because i thinit's important to understand where i come from. i spent, been involved with look at welfare reform since it started. i have been mainly doing work in the field look at the implementation of welfare reform and particularly tanf since it started and i did work before. you heard conversations about the work that cathy eden did on how people make ends meet. i was one of the interviewers who did work on the above cited work on it and it will have continued that. one of my key focus

i think william voegeli was talking about, how they violated the strength of the family and the private community by substituting the role of the father or the extended family? >> i think there was some belief that that was what was going on when welfare was eliminated, but i think one of the things we do have a question for, institute, is thinking about, what happened with tanf, i often think if you look at the issue that michael raised about people being, males being out of the labor market, if elected opportunity youth, 16 to 24-year-olds out those our kids have grown up in this whole new world. they were not part of the old welfare system. and so haven't really missed an opportunity by designing that right? sorry, to help create better futures for our kids. i think we really don't have the evidence and to think of anything remain evidence in the other direction. >> i would love to jump into i'm glad you asked the question because i think often the quote welfare state gets described as the quote of the state and that something has been postulated or decades now and was one of the ser