. >> okay, so heidi, some are like comparing that to that infamous willie horton ad, right. >> some, including apparently the rnc spokesman who had to delete his tweet last night comparing it to willie horton ad which of course lives in infamy as one of the all-time great smear ads of political campaigns. could i see why he would want to delete that. but ultimately this is not going to be effective. jackie and i were discussing this before the show. tim kaine's principled opposition to capital punishment is grounded in his faith, grounded in his catholicism which is something very much in line with the republican base actually as well as a lot of independent voters. i just don't think this is as well as an ad going after the number two on the ticket, so i just don't think this is going to have nearly the same effect as the willie horton ad will really became kind of the linchpin of waters' advertising campaign, effective advertising campaign against dukakis. >> what were republicans trying to do by releasing this ad? >> seems like they're trying to fire the first shot. if you look at

>> first of all, i don't think it compares to willie horton. as you pointed out, the folks in the ad are all -- three of the four are white. this just goes back to tim kaine's record. there are rapists and murderers he defended to keep out of prison that have done horrible things. part of this is tim kaine had previously said that someone should be judged by the totality of their record. this is the tim kaine part of the record that they don't want to discuss. his defense of people who went out and murdered and raped people. >> but he was a lawyer, sean. that's a what lawyer does, defend people's rights. >> no, no, no. i think everybody makes choices in their careers to what they do and don't do. he wants to talk about his record, he should be judged on the totality of his record. >> sean, i want to understand the criticism. we both agree, of course, you have the right to do whatever you want to do. you get judged for your choices. so are you saying that people who commit crimes and are facing the death penalty shouldn't have lawyers? >> no, th

the now infamous willy horton as ad. >> willy horton who murdered a boy. ? a robbery. 19 times. >> horton was a convicted murderer who got a weekend furlough under a program sponsored by michael dukakis. while out of jail, he committed a vicious rape. the sub text of the horton ad was race. >> what about this racism thing >> the oldest racial symbol in the book. a black man raping a white woman. the most liberal furlough program in america in 1988 was the furlough program under the reagan-bush administration. and i never said that. >> why? >> because i wasn't going to respond to the attack. which in retrospect sounds crazy, doesn't it? >> despite all of it, bush hadn't knocked dukakis out. as they entered the final presidential debate, bush was only slightly ahead in the polls. >> the first question goes to governor dukakis. >> right out of the gate, bernie shaw threw a grenade. >> governor, if kitty dukakis were raped and murdered. would you favor an irrevocable death penalty for the killer? >> no, i don't. and i think you know that i opposed the death penalty all of

. >> perhaps the toughest blow was the now infamous willy horton ad. >> willy horton, who murdered a horton was a convicted murderer who got a weekend furlough under a program sponsored by michael dukakis. while out of jail, he committed a vicious rape. the subtext of the horton ad was race. >> governor, what about this racism thing? >> the oldest racial symbol in the book. a black man raping a white woman. look, the most liberal furlough program in america in 1988 was the furlough program under the reagan-bush administration in the federal prison system. and i never said that. >> why? >> because i wasn't going to respond to the attack campaign. which in retrospect sounds crazy, doesn't it? >> despite all of it, bush hadn't knocked dukakis out. and as they entered the final presidential debate, bush was only slightly ahead in the polls. >> the first question goes to governor dukakis. >> right out of the gate, cnn's rnie shaw threw a grenade. >> governor, if kitty dukakis were raped and murdered, would you favor an irrevocable death penalty for the killer? >> no, i don't, bernard. and

sean spicer tweeted, exclusive, republicans launch willie horton-style attack on tim kaepg, linking tobing the crimes of men kaine worked to spare as a death penalty as a lawyer and later as governor of virginia. the republican party official account posted a near-identical tweet but drew a backlash for referencing the 1988 ad runs against michael dukakidukakis. the then-rnc chairman lee atwater apologized to dukakis for saying he would make willie horton his running mate because it makes him sound racist which i am not. spicer at first defended the twee writing that he and the party were only using roll call's headline. but later deleted the post saying he pushed the story about the ad. >>> a story that's dominating entertainment headlines, kim kardashian is back in new york city this morning after being robbed at gunpoint in paris over the weekend. the masked men made off with $10 million worth of jewels. as nbc reports the reality star may have inadvertently tipped off the thieves over social media. >> reporter: kim kardashian makes millions sharing her-. but this time she may have

i was very disappointed about the lee atwater and the willie horton situation. that comes to my memory but i'm just wondering if, in your view, him is a decent manation. participating in that says something about the nature of our politics within the context of the american democracy that it encourages decent people to do the wrong thing in order to achieve their objectives, or is this just, maybe you don't see it is that important, but i didn't yet the sense from your comments today, i haven't read your book unfortunately so i don't want to say that you don's cover it but i didn't get a sense that you felt that was important. thank you. >> what i tried to say, i talk about the 88 campaign and were talking about the furlough ads, the horton ads although that was an independent expenditure group and we can spend the next three hours on that. you said something quite brilliant there which is, politics is not appear undertaking. if you want to amass power, toch try to be in a position of influence when the crazies of the age comes, you are going to cut some corners

>> i do have to ask you about this willy horton story. i think it was. for folks who may have not followed this, role call reported this week that rnc was preparing to unleash a willie horton style attack. you retweeted that story. was that a mistake? >> yes. >> how did it happen? >> the story came out and i quickly hit tweet because the thing there. i hit it. it was stupid. i shouldn't have done it. i should have read the story more who a thoroughly. not friendly and came to the defense and said, this was an inaccurate portrayal but absolutely a mistake. >> bwhen the book is written after this election is over, there'll be a chapter on rnc and tweeting. seanspi spicer will be in the chapter. >> i hope it's a good chapter. >>> we have breaking news right now to report out of the caribbean. hurricane matthew. hurricane matthew is now a monster category 4 storm. direct hit in the caribbean this morning and now a life-threatening storm. it is actually picking up speed as it swirls north. it's taking a track east towards the u.s. coast. hurricane watches exp

this is ridiculous to equate this to willy horton. the folks in that ad are white.re no racial overtones, there was no furlough program or weekend pass. this is an example of. what is his job tonight. >> to draw a contrast. he lowered taxes, created jobs in indiana. he needs to draw the contrast both in terms of the record of the two and the if i lossly him and donald trump have. they are the agents of change. hillary clinton and tim kaine are the epitome of the establishment and status question. if you are happy with washington, that's your ticket. bill: what's the state of the race of people in virginia. >> it's very tight. bill: it shows she is up by several points. >> it shows she is up by a point or two. but we have an amazing ground game. this state closes quick and the people of the commonwealth of virginia are ready for change. they are ready for change and i think virginia will come into our column. bill: thank you for your time. from farmville, back to manhattan, martha? martha: breaking news overseas this morning. wikileaks julian assange promising a stea

one was willie horton, put in prison for stabbing a boy 18 times. >>> joining me now is neal oxman. he is head of a campaign group that has performed tv spots for more than 700 races around the country. oxman's clients have included michael nutter and al gore. thank you for joining us. how are you? >> doing well, thank you. >> this is the home stretch for the candidates now, and i think a lot of people are wondering, can the political ads still have an impact at this point? >> absolutely. pennsylvania happens to be at the epicenter of the presidential campaign this year. four years ago, we hadded alm ao presidential advertising because the romney and obama campaigns considered pennsylvania as a safe state. these ads will make a big difference over the next five yeex a weeks and couple days. >> one thing that's interesting is the way these ads need to speak to voters at the moment of time we're in right now. 'hea i've heard you say, define yourself, define your opponent and then define the stakes. in broad terms, as you're thi g thinking about defining the stakes, what comes to mind

>> well, i think it was shameful that the rnc was touting the fact that it was a willie horton styleht that was pretty -- >> they say what they -- >> when you're tweeting out -- >> sean spicer said -- >> when you tweet out the title, you know exactly what you're saying -- >> willie horton aside. >> look, i think here's where the distortion about that ad, you know, tim kaine is a man of deep faith, he is opposed to the death penalty. during his time as a lawyer, he did have a couple cases where he was court appointed. in those instances, he did -- because of his objection to the death penalty, he did try to seek, you know, life in prison for some of these folks. in some instances, there may have been issues with the actual process. it wasn't necessarily that the person may not have been guilty but processwise, as we know, in a legal proceeding, that can make the difference between a death penalty or life in prison. they tried this against him once before when he ran in virginia. and, you know, again this comes from a place of deep faith. when he ran for governor, he made it very clear

have any brains or money left, they're going to make him hillary's running mate like they did willy hortongoing to find this guy and put him up there and say you want to vote for wiener, go ahead. >> whether there's any there there doesn't matter because it's going to bury a lot of headlines. >> here's donald trump back in july going after secretary clinton because her top haid was still married to anthony weiner. let's watch. >> why are they giving hillary clinton briefings? because it's going to get revealed. i mean, her number one person, huma abedin, is married to anthony weiner. who is a sleazeball and a pervert. and i'm not saying that -- i mean, that's recorded history, right? i don't like huma going home at night and telling anthony weiner all of these secrets. okay? >> well, there was a lead. did he get the heads-up on this fbi report or what? this is a while ago. >> that's the thing about trump. so often the things he says that seem crazy end up having this ke kernel of truth to him later and that gives him the authenticity, and that's what his gut seems to be right -- >> pillow

i was very disappointed about lee atwater and willie horton situation. so that comes to my memory. i am just wondering if in your view, have as a decent man participating and not said the nature of our politics in the context of american democracy that it encourages decent people to do the wrong thing in order to achieve their objectives or is this just maybe you don't see it that important. i don't get the sense from yourr comments today. i haven't read the book unfortunately so i don't want to say that you don't cover it, but i want to get a sense from your comments today that he felt that was important. >> right. but i try to say when i talk on the 88 campaign, we were talking about the furlough ad from the horton ads although the horton ad for an independent expenditure group and we canig spend the next three hours on that. but you said something quite early in air, which is politics is not a pure undertaking. if you want to amass power to try to be in a position of is no influence when the crises of the age column, you are going to cut some corners. you are going to have some

daisy girl, morning in america, willie horton, the 3:00 a.m. call. some are hopeful, some are downright apocalyptic. who is dreaming up the ideas that shape the campaigns? hallie jackson went to find out. >> for all the hands they shake and selfies they take, bumped fi merges will meet the next president in their living room. >> i'm hillary clinton. >> i'm donald trump. >> and i approved. >> this message. >> reporter: political ads, a long-standing american tradition. >> vote for president johnson. >> reporter: part of an air war played out ad nauseam. some do get through. this was a winner back in the primaries. so what does work? sometimes a candidate's own words. for better and for worse. >> does she have a good body no? does shall he have a fat ass? absolutely. >> does donald trump really speak for you? >> that's grace, and that's dennis steele. >> we can go there tao. >> reporter: both hired guns and masters of the dark arts. >> make your voice go as low as you can. he us. >> poor old washington. >> reporter: but they're equal opportunity insult

the rnc fired a shot across the bow with a new online ad that has been from pair to the famous willie horton ad in 1988 to cost michael dukakis the white house because he gave the impression he was soft on crime. the response from an eight to 10 k. to 10 k. in the ads in the ads may have already backfired because rnc spokesman sean spicer had to delete a tweet about it. both candidates know this debate is not about them. it is about the top of the ticket. lauren, nicole. lauren: fox business will have live coverage of tonight's vice presidential debate at unit 7:00 p.m. eastern with lou dobbs tonight and 8:00 p.m. to midnight, kudo coast-to-coast. nicole: stepping up military support or steering president bush r. al-assad. officials told fox news russia has deployed an event missile system to syria for the first time. the latest atonement comes after russia's actions led to the collapse of a cease-fire into account the united states that the weapon system could be used against an american cruise missile attack in syria. vladimir putin has also suspended a rush a u.s. deal on the disposal of

unfortunately in one of the situations, a man named william horton, his name was never willie, the ad called him that because it sounded like a slave name. he escaped and raped the wife and killed the husband. the victims were white. mr. horton was african- american. the ad was denounced as racist but had a huge impact on the campaign. this ad is similar to that. coming on the eve of the debate was designed to raise questions under the guise of under criminal justice and the righteousness of the death penalty it injects race back into the campaign that will not be positive. >> you're saying that the ad features a criminal who happens to be african-american and that's what jumped out at you. >> if you go back, you can find this on youtube. it is called the turnstill ad, the original ad. the construction is similar to what you're watching here. african-american voters and most people in 1988 were revolted by what they saw in that. the bush campaign said that the ad in 1988 never mentions willie horton. but the only person who makes contact with the camera in that ad was african-american

in michigan, running mate lloyd benson said the republicans had exploited the case of willy horton. >> there were racist overtones in that commercial. >> he dismissed all of the charges as a sign of desperation. >> it's desperation, insidious and outrageous. >> negotiators for president carter and ronald reagan met for several long hours today but were not able to reach a formal agreement on where the presidential debate will be held or when. >> president carter wants his confrontation with reagan as he can get. they want an indirect faceoff. carter wants the debate next sunday, october 26th, believing more people watch tv on sunday night. reagan has not responded to the league's suggestion, tuesday the 28th. also unsettled, how long the debate should be and what they will talk about. >> kennedy called for a greater student exchange program. he left at 11:40 and students trying to touch him. kennedy produced several effects on people. one of them is jumping. reporters started categorizing such things and called such types jumpers. after a pause for lunch, kennedy went to the tractor p

the rnc tweeting out the line of willi horton-style attack. >> and even the creator of that pad whichng about how michael furloughing and went on a killing spree ended up kind of racializing politics and people ended up condemning that ad later on. it was effective at the time of george bush and his campaign. it is really odd to see someone wanting to highlight that and promote that the way the rnc did this morning. as you mentioned, they deleted the tweet. >> mark, thank you, appreciate it. we are interested to see how the states coming back on that polling based on the debate last week. mark, thank you, we'll have all day coverage for that have t presidential debate of the vice president. coming up, former trump adviser, roger stone, he's a major announcement for wednesday, they cla they -- a major october surprise. a long time clinton's friend and adviser joins me next. >>> our entrepreneur of the week comes from remote places. chris dale paul and amia have traveled here to sell their homemade products to the american markets. they are killing it. what do they know about our market

the republican national committee pulled it off yesterday by sending out a tweet announcing a willie hortonatic vice presidential nominee tim kaine with this ad. >> long before tim kaine was in office, he consistently protected the worst kinds of people. lem tuggle, raped, sodomized and murdered jesse havens. tim kaine defended him. >> now willie horton ever since he figured in a 1988 campaign ad has become associated with racial appeals, so the republican national committee aide who sent out that tweet later deleted it. on the other hand, democrats have their own wedge issues to use against mike pence, the governor of indiana. in particular, his opposition to abortion and gay rights. >> cities and states are joining businesses this morning in boycotting indiana over its controversial religious freedom law. protesters say it allows businesses to discriminate against gay people. the indianapolis star newspaper urges governor mike pence to fix this now. at least nine top indiana business executives have criticized the legislation. >> now, as sexy as those issues are, it is likely that we will

-- a legal defender of rapists and murderers, some critics say that's equivalent of the famous willie hortond there's a lot of attention but may give some clues as to how pence and the trump campaign plan to come after tim kaine, who has described himself in the past as being, quote, boring. >> how else is tim kaine preparing? >> reporter: well, he is doing -- taking a page from hillary clinton's book and doing a lot of mock debates and has been off the campaign trail for four days and in fact, bob barnett, the famous washington lawyer is, standing in. he is his sparring partner. in the past bob barnet has served the role for hillary clinton but hillary clinton felt he needed someone meaner so he she opts for her aide who knows her vulnerabilities and hey have the been working together on the next debate. so they have been preparing. kaine is prepared. one thing i doubt you'll see, early on in the campaign you saw tim kaine doing impressions of donald trump. he was told it wasn't a good impression and he has dropped that in recent weeks and months. >> jennifer, thank you. more than two years

have any brains or money left, they're going to make him hillary's running mate, like they did willie horton. they're going to put up this thing and say, do you want to vote for weiner? >> whether there's any there doesn't matter because it's going to bury a lot of these other headlines. >> here's donald trump back in july going after secretary clinton because her top aide was married to -- still married to anthony weiner. let's watch. >> why are they giving hillary clinton briefings? because it's going to get revealed, i mean, her number one person, huma abedin, is married to anthony weiner who's a sleazeball and a pervert. and i'm not saying that -- i mean, that's recorded history, right? i don't like huma going home at night and telling anthony weiner all of these secrets, okay? >> well there's a lead. did he get the heads up with this fbi report or what? this was a while ago. >> that's the thing about trump, so often the things that he says that seem crazy end up having this kernel of truth to them later and that's what his gut seems to be right. >> between huma and -- i mean, it's e-mai

have any brains or money left, they're going to make him hillary's running mate, like they did willie hortonthey're going to put up this thing and say, do you want to vote for weiner? >> whether there's any there doesn't matter because it's going to bury a lot of these other headlines. >> here's donald trump back in july going after secretary clinton because her top aide was married to -- still married to anthony weiner. let's watch. >> why are they giving hillary clinton briefings? because it's going to get revealed, i mean, her number one person, huma abedin, is married to anthony weiner who's a sleazeball and a pervert. and i'm not saying that -- i mean, that's recorded history, right? i don't like huma going home at night and telling anthony weiner all of these secrets, okay? >> well there's a lead. did he get the heads up with this fbi report or what? this was a while ago. >> that's the thing about trump, so often the things that he says that seem crazy end up having this kernel of truth to them later and that's what his gut seems to be right. >> between huma and -- i mean, it's e-mail

let's also understand the fear mongering, the willie horton is not going to get it. the o.c.'s, the people in your backyard just yesterday said rime rates have plummeted. your own report, 90% increase gun murders, homicide and a 15% increase on assaults with guns. oh. and did i tell you a 33% increase in sexual assaults? you said that was your report card. well, guess what? that is a report card you do not want to show to your dad. marc: we will begin our lightning round. again, we have adrienne alpert for a question for ms. harris. >> would you support a constitutional amendment for term limits stand so, what would be the appropriate length of that term? atty. gen. harris: i think the voters need to work on that term. there is no question that we need accountability. i have respect for our election processes that require candidates to debate and talk about their position on issues and let the voters make a decision and if they have not done a good job, elect them out. the bottom line is they are going to be voted out if they don't have a track record for getting things done.

. >> i know i'm knocking it, but he was the guy who infamously, notoriously said he would make willie hortone guy who got charged with rape and everything after he got out on his pardon or whatever, his furlough, he said, i'm going to make dukakis's running mate. i'm amazed they haven't made anthony weiner hillary's running mate at this point. >> i thought it was amazing the man had to say it. what are we, blaming the women for the men? >> i know, it's not huma's fault. >> a lot of women have married the wrong guy. >> he wasn't sexting her. >> unfortunately. >> the fbi's announcement, friday, could further threaten t retaking the chances of taking the senate. todd young has overcome evan bayh's former six-point lead in indiana's senate race. they're now tied 45-all. in florida, marco rubio is widening his lead over patrick murphy. a couple things. people feel like they've given the guy a whooping, like they gave marco rubio in the presidential primary. all right, he's had his whooping, i can let him back in the house. but if you show any lack of interest in being a senator youb leave for a w

have any brains or money left, they'll make him hillary clinton's running mate, the way they did willie horton. they'll find this guy and say, you want to vote for weiner? vote for weiner. >> it doesn't matter because it will bury these other headlines. >> here's donald trump back in july going after secretary clinton because her top aide was married to -- well, still married to anthony weiner. let's watch. >> why are they giving hillary clinton briefings? because it's going to get revealed. i mean, her number one person, human huma abedin is married to anthony weiner who is a sleazeball and a pervert. i'm not saying that -- i mean, that's recorded history. right? i don't like huma going home at night and telling anthony weiner all of these secrets, okay? >> well, there's a lead. did he get the heads up on this fbi report or what? that's a while ago. >> that's the thing about trump. so often the things that he says that seem crazy end up having this kernel of truth to them later and that gives him this authenticity. and that's what his gut seems to be -- >> pillow talk between huma and -- now

they are not willie hortonized. they are people with people just like any other group of people. and police are there to protect and serve these people. we understand their job in the context, all lot of good things get done. >> you talked about colin kaepernick's protest during the playing of the national anthem. that's extended to some of the professional, college and high school athletes. do you believe this is a good thing? what do you believe they should give to push more tangible solutions to the problem they are drawing attention to the? >> the only way you can do that is to get involved in the political process. i'm coding president obama. so times i've seen it and he says don't get mad, boat. so we have to participate. we have to people from minority communities that are willing to run for public office and become lawyers and district attorneys and police officers or serve on the police commission. people from minority communities have to be involved that way. if they can't be involved in that way bad things will continue to happen. when they are involved that way, their

saying, "a new ad recalls the willie horton attack, the republican national committee is talking abouto clients when he was a defense attorney." that is available online. here it is. [video clip] >> when you want to know somebody -- something about the character of somebody in public life, look to see if they have a passion long before they were in office and that they have consistently held throughout their career. >> long before tim kaine was in office, he consistently protected the worst kinds of people. sodomized, and murder a woman after being a role for murdering -- paroled for murdering a 17-year-old girl. tim kaine defended him. kainee and execution, tim said something personal and me will die with him. murdered threely people. as governor, tim kaine committed -- commuted his sentence. stabbing them to death in their home. on his last day as governor, tim kaine tried to have the man sent to germany where a role would have been possible in just two years. tim kaine has a passion for defending the wrong people. america deserves better. we are asking you if you are making a crosso

a resume to fall back on and what's there she has lied about, you know, that's the daughter of willie hortondebate. >> richard, if what happened with a beauty queen more than a decade ago is fair game, what about that? >> again, ed, this was litigated. ask rick lazio how effective that line of attack is, the one that matt is suggesting. >> was it right? was it the right thing to do? >> ask senator rick lazio -- the fact of the matter is there is this view of the world that somehow if republicans speak just the right things to african-americans or hispanics or whatnot that somehow they will -- you know, unleash the fact that they really should have been hostile to democrats all these years, look, the fact of the matter is what donald trump is doing is reveling in this dispute with a former beauty queen 38 days before a presidential election. every republican has to be horrified. and i hope matt's right and he persuades him to go down this one. >> richard, the last word, that's going to have to be there. donald trump told "new york times" today hillary clinton's nasty, i can be even nastier. i