with carter wirth and on jeff kilberg with kkm. what do you say, carter?that we don't like one because it's been so good and don't like the other because it's been so bad. let a comparative chart over the last five years, and what you've got here is how, of course, good macy's has been basically 5 to 40 plus and how bad jv penny has been and they are compared in that chart to their industry group by the standard & poor's. let's look at them individually. macy's, you know, too much of a good thing and it's starting to roll from what we can see, exhibiting poor relative strength, underperforming the market and we don't like it. feels toppy. j.c. penney, the five-year chart, nothing short of atrocious, not moved and it's disastrous and looks like it's about to fall through the bottom. one too good, one too bad and just stay away from both. >> jeffrey? >> sure. >> looking at numbers and the charts pre-crisis, they are almost where they are, about i like j.c. penney. i know we're talking about martha stewart fighting it out. we are seeing j.c. penney with 1,100