she wasn't as imviewed in the wonk policy, wonk inside the beltway stuff.an anothers all of that. i was just listening to your reporting with dana bash, and the guy's a machine, paul ryan is. he is -- he is ready to go. so it's going to be a very different debate. >> so, i want to talk a little about the deference. i think you were alluding to the derch deference factor. geraldine ferraro said don't patronize me, teach me about foreign history. going up against sarah palin. don't patronize her, make it rude, something where people will be offended. this time around he doesn't have to face that but has a female moderator. they both do. from the female, first female governor of michigan, i might add, do these two candidates need to watch their tone in way that perhaps the presidential debate candidates did not have to when dealing with jim lair? >> well, you know, i don't know they have to watch their tone relative to her. i think she's going to feel the pressure to take more control than jim lehrer apparently -- >> do you think they can walk over her and cut

this sheep was born with his head cadly wonked. >> cadly wonked?ical term for upside-down. veterinarians have looked at terry. they have decided that terry does not experience any kind of pain. he was born this way, is able to eat. is able to swallow his food and seems to be doing just fine, but terry, because of the way his head's placed -- always looking at his feet. >> a good shot. when you see terry kind of from behind and see his little tail. look between his legs and you see his nose on the bottom of his face, up against the grass. where whereas these sheep, right there. >> does he say stuff backwards, instead of baaaa, it's aaaab! >> and if he wants to see out in front of him, he has to -- >> yeah. it's weird. still looks like he's wearing socks. >>> this is a beautiful video of san francisco. beautiful landscape, but it's title, locals hate it when you call it san fran. i call it san fran all the time. >> you're a local. >> the great thing about this video, though, it really is how beautifully it was shot. it shows some of the places you re

is -- wonk is. neil: a ner d . >> i don't leak that, nobody. neil: you are talking to a nerd right now. >> i am not. neil: why do you think that businesses do have a tough time getting money. >> they have a hard time getting money people don't want to give up their money right now, and hard times. neil: even most compelling case, they can make big pay dirt. %-funded michael dell or billhat gates or zuckerberg, someone is missing these big opportunities. >> as many times as somebody may hit big pay dirt, they may also fall in the mud, there is never a guarantee? what was your biggest bomb. >> that was someone else's? neil: you invested in. of it a loser. >> oh, well,. neil: you don't have to give specifics. >> yeah. i don't want to say, i don't want to hurt that person down the road it was something that i thought i would give a chance. to and just won up not a home run. neil: really, you and the othe others, mark cuban has been here many times, he is a funny guy, but he does have an ego like the chrysler building but that is fine. do you play t

is that because they think ryan is going to go less wonk or biden more gaffe?the broad perception, biden underrated. showing him without his shirt on washing his transam in the white house driveway. he is a gaffe machine, a guy easy to make fun of. dave letterman, the jokes, joe biden is a goofy, slightly drunk, kind of dumb uncle, right? they think of paul ryan -- most people haven't been exposed to paul ryan. they hear paul ryan is that intellectual young whipper snapper and that's all people are reacting to there. two things that are important, one is -- >> really? >> wow. >> do not -- >> important to your mind. >> no. this will be important to all of our viewers. do not if you're going to have a drinking game at this debate do not make the drinking game based on the number of times biden says the word literally. everyone will have alcohol poisoning by the end. just as a piece of atmospherics i love about debate camp what happens at debate camp they have a debate stage, this is like -- the obama people are serious about this. the debate stage that biden is d

neil: do you think we'll hear a wonk fest discussion out of them, pro and cons, ryan likes numbers and joe biden, he too is a wonk about this stuff, that could be masterpiece theater. >> i am expecting they have been warned about that, keep it short. if i'm in paul ryan's shoes, the message is simple. what you want the american people to think about, is the question of whether you want 4 more years like the last 4 years. every answer he gives, i think is going to be judged through that prism. you know do we -- this is a decision about rehiring an incumbant for 4 more years, this is a hiring decision, if people are comfortable with where america is and has been taken over last 4 years, then the president has a leg up, if on the other hand, they are not happy, that gives us an edge. if i'm paul ryan that is the basic point i want to leave with people. neil: let's talk built format, it is economic and foreign affairs, it is at a table. you were mentioning before the show, that can make a psychological difference? how does a table change? >> it makes it more of a conversation, i like this

i think it's certainly energizing people within the beltway the policy wonks people like us who really are passionate about this kind of thing but i think the average person based on the reactions i was reading on twitter last night they were saying oh yeah is there a reality show on somewhere out you know there is always going to be the same nothing's going to change them are which one of these guys is elected so the general public i think is still pretty cynical about the whole process that's not really sensing there one of my friends said on twitter you know you know we're all screwed anyway right whichever one of these guys gets. and i think that actually does capture the way the general public thinks right now well i wonder i mean so i want to i mean we're certainly energized punk peter i'm wondering if this is going to be remembered as the big bird debate what do you think about the. because that twitter that was a commie all debates. laws mitt romney was making the argument that although he wants to cut the budget for public broadcasting here he does like big bird obviously you

the self proclaimed young went of the republican party is a poll wonk.y likable guy. and coming to us tonight with a preview of romney versus ryan is kiki mcclain. welcome back inside "the war room." >> glad to be here governor. >> jennifer: all right. i am predicting we'll see a different strategy from joe biden in this debate, do you agree? >> yeah, i do, and i think it has to do with both personality and the role the vice president plays. the game is not to just beat up each other and see who coming outstanding, success will be the team that moves their candidate's message and that's joe biden's job. and feel free to drive that wedge between the truth and what mr. ryan has to say. >> jennifer: i think there are a lot of wedges or air that can be exposed between, for example, paul ryan and mitt romney. paul ryan's budget, huge opportunity, and of course the lies that paul ryan himself has uttered like in his convention speech. biden is not going to sit back and take that i assume. >> no, i don't think so. and i think people will be watching for dayligh

we have this tendency in the press towards the caricaturizing so we have this policy wonk on the rightthe left and they play these roles. if they make sense does not matter. they just have to walk the walk to make it on tv. >> cenk: and then saying wait a minute. name the loophole. >> and in the debate. >> eliot: now, did joe biden properly and effectively highlight the lack of arithmetic that under lies what they're claiming here. >> he got heavily criticized for laughing and bringing this whole presentation but i think that's what has been missing all along from the coverage of this campaign. you should bring contemptuous laughter to this whole thing because it is not serious. that's the problem with it. it's not only that it's cynical and nefarious, it's not serious. it's not big-league politics. >> eliot: now they do pretend to have historical metaphors. they talk about the kennedy tax rates. why is that historically not relevant? >> first of all, i think a lot of people, if the move was to make the top tax rate 71%, which is what happened after kennedy cut taxes, i think it would

he has had a lot of experience doing the sunday shows being a policy wonk in the committee room and committeek up, and on cable television news but he does not have experience in one-on-one debate situation. joe biden has more experience in this debate situation but he has not been doing it, he has not given a lot of interviews in four years. that said joe biden is a strong debater, and he'll probably be very aguess aggressive, but not nearly as aggressive the president is planning to be when he faces mitt romney again. >> eliot: i hope as we see him take apart the numbers of the paul ryan numbers and say it doesn't add up and be relentless and demanding and answers to paul ryan because we can fill 12 hours of debate and playing rope a dope and giveing answers. and it could make it clear that it's a bunch of swiss cheese flimflam and meaningless because it won't add up. i don't know if he'll be given the time and have the leeway to do that tomorrow night. i'm bringing a big bag of popcorn it will be fun to watch. >> it's not a copies dense that democrats have congressman chris van holen to be

as far as paul ryan is concerned, i think he is kind a policy wonk. his problem is he's a numbers guy, and he's up against frankly and i think both runs previous head of the republican party and michael nutter both said that joe biden is a very accessible politician. he tends to put things the way that people get it immediately. he's just got that kind of manner about him. i think that's the -- in some ways, you know, we look at the substance and style. as far as style is concerned, i think paul ryan's fear here is he's too much of a wonk sxort of throwing out numbers. you know, you can expect joe biden to say, gee, i took a look at your numbers and here's what they would do to george next door. ryan has to be careful about that kind of debate. >> the next presidential debate, you're moderating october 16th. likely these candidates, president obama, mitt romney are looking over the tapes, make they've exhausted it looking over the tapes, what went right and wrong. you have to wonder how they might be modifying their presentations ahead of that debate.

>> we're wonking along. >> we're pretty wonky. >> do you think that wonk spelled backwards is know? >> excellent. you just blew my mind. >> as is k-n-o-w. were you trying to figure out whether i meant it was n-o. >> you're burning up the time. he wants to talk about the president's great numbers. >> you have to love the 7.8% number. talk about that. >> there's two ways to bring the unemployment rate down. in august the unemployment rate ticked down by 0.2% because a bunch of people left the job market. in september it was the opposite. lots of people got jobs, the unemployment rate fell 0.3%. one, you have a little momentum but the monthly numbers are volatile and jump about. one point on that. you mentioned 114,000 jobs on the payrolls. that's an okay number. there were upward revisions to the prior two months. over the past three third, which is the third quarter of the year, payrolls grew about 150,000 per month. the second quarter of this year they only grew about 70,000 per month. faster momentum on the payroll growth side as well. >> peter, romney's talking point for months no

wonk. >> what's that? >> b.s. wonk. >> mitt romney was floating policies out there -- >> united states has the best health outcomes in the world? >> it was not -- that's it, it was not a lot of one-liners and zingers. >> a couple of good one-liners. people forgot. i've been in business for 25 years, i have no idea what you're talking about, that's pretty good. >> i need to consult with my accountant is not -- >> another softball. >> i want to know what you think. in terms of moving voters, does the american public watch that? there were half an hour of referencing dodd/frank, some people don't know what dodd/frank is. some people may think that's a guy named dodd frank. >> i thought the same thing. there were a couple -- the same with bowles-simpson. long discussions were, i guess, music to ears of dorks like us. if you're a regular person -- >> not music to my ears. >> -- living your wife, a persuadable voter do you know what the conversation is? that's why the style points matter. >> look what happens, every tim

. >> from real baseball to a brand new fantasy league for wonks.ews is putting down a page where you can assemble an economic team you can do one for obama and the other guy, romney. we have five categories, budgeting, finance, job creation, legislation and international. i put together a dream team for obama and another one for the other guy for whatever reason. there was little less dreamy. maybe i'm not quite doing it right. luckily we have the man behind the game to help us. friend of the show, rob cox. america's editor. and apparently reuters breaking views. let me break down the team that i put together with is all nepotism all the time because that's how hiring should be. i picked bloomberg. i've met him a number of times to be the treasury secretary. i picked austin gould to be a brilliant guy. national economic council. we went to high school. jared bernstein for fed reserve chair, he, like you, friend of the show. and cheryl sandberg because she seems like a super woman and facebook is awesome. >> did you pick one for the other guy that y

the wonk from wisconsin. the mathematician from -- madison's general vicente fox cindy. lay it on us, numbers guy. how do we know the romney/ryan fiscal plan will work? >> i've run the numbers in congress, they do. >> jon: okay. (laughter) so what are the numbers? >> how much would it cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> you haven't given me math. >> well, i don't have the -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> jon: how about this? you busy? leave it with us, we'll look it over. (laughter) unless it's all bull (bleep). (laughter) this reminds me of something. reminds me of a simpler time when the country was also emerging from a gigantic financial crisis and a bold young man running for his second presidential term was asserting the need for wealthier americans to sacrifice to help pay for popular social programs. i remember it like it was yesterday. >> let me warn you and let me warn the nation against the invasion that says "of course we believe these things. we believe in social security. we bel

i want to do the folksy stuff in janesville and nobody wants him to be a policy wonk and if he fallske that stuff but -- >> i like that myself too but that's just me. paul has to have a strong message and part of the message has to be economic growth. he has to do what mitt romney did a week ago which is relate to people who are in trouble. i mean, we've had some better unemployment numbers by some measures but by broader measures the unemployment rate is still around 15%. and ryan's got to address tax reform and entitlement reform, spending reform, and most of all, growth, growth, growth. >>. >> [ inaudible ]. >> on growth one strong point that the vice president can make is that we really do have some momentum. we're not where we need to be by any stretch of the imagination but we're moving in that direction and the last jobs reports may have suggested a little bit more momentum than we thought we had. >> what did you get scolded fo

wonk and qi and leeyong are charged with marijuana cultivation. they had a street value of more than $2 million. >>> the slow moving shuttle show continues to wow spectators in los angeles. it's being moved along tight city streets to its new home at the california science center and these are live pictures near bald win hills a los angeles suburb where the endeavour is now running some three hours behind schedule. the truck is being hampered by the many obstacles along the road from trees to power lines to buildings. but you can see there are still crowds lining the streets. cbs reporter louie is a hodge on the intricate maneuvering required. >> like a kid in a candy store. >> i to see it going down the middle of the city street in los angeles. >> reporter: as soon as the shuttle endeavour appeared along neighborhood streets the excitement erupted. >> it's really awesome and i'm kind of like oh my god. >> right there the wing is so close. >> reporter: but authorities are actually pushing back onlookers who are trying to reach up and touch it. cre

seemed to be you were advising him to not be afraid to let his wonk out.'t be afraid that he shouldn't be afraid to talk numbers and specifics. you said essentially he has suffered politically when he's tried to avoid his true wonky self. why do you think that could work even in a big broad brushed setting like this debate tonight? >> well, maybe i just want something to talk about later. but broadly speaking there's been reporting that paul ryan is trying to make sure he's not a guy who comes out and argues cbo baselines, doesn't get too wonky, doesn't get lost in the weeds. paul ryan went from being a back bench politician to being a vice presidential candidate in about two years on the strength of the fact he's good and persuasive at arguing about numbers. that he's good and persuasive making a policy debate that the very least republicans find convincing or policy argument republicans find convincing against president obama. since he got picked by mitt romney to be the vice president, though, they've kind of muzzled that. they haven't wanted to get too

he's a policy wonk. he is not lacking in confidence. in fact, this afternoon, he released his own photo on the debate stage on a walk-through saying, "let's get this done." so even though he hasn't done this kind of debate, scott, d member, he's done hundreds of and towws and town halls and meetings, all defending that complex budget plan of his for year the better of the last two years. cb pelley: jan, thank you. cbs news live coverage of the easteresidential debate begins right here at 9:00 eastern time come dat is 6:00 in the west. e stelection will come down, of -uurse, to nine states that are toss-ups today and will tip the balance on election night. tonight, we have new polling from three of them. in virginia, our quinnipiac university/cbs news/"new york times" poll finds the president's lead up a point, 51% to 46%. .n colorado, the lead has flipped. consin, ney now ahead 48% to 47. and in wisconsin, home state of paul ryan, the president's lead has been cut in half. it is now 50% to 47%. dean reynolds is in another of the swing s

. >> wonk one thing's clear, the vice-president had more energy than the president in his first debate. let's go down to "on the record with greta van susteren" in washington for what she thought. and she has what is coming up. >> i have brit hume here. in watching the show, what do you think that the independentss and undecideds saw. >> it depends on what they think of joe biden and his demeanor. if you read the transcript, you might conclude that the vice-president had a very strong debate, that high -- he had a lot to say and he was strongly critical of governor romney and his program and he held his own. but that's not all there is to it. we had the split screen, much as we did during the presidential debate. while paul ryan was talking, was smirking, laughing, miling, mugging by the vice-president. my sense was that it was so compelling that people probably couldn't take their eyes off of t. tell come down to whether or not people thought that was attractive. i thought it was unattractive and rude. i have a feeling it will come across to a lot of people, it looked like a cranky ol

>> you're right about the wonk trap here. actually avoid getting into the weeds? >> yeah. i mean, paul ryan is a self-described numbers guy. when he asked him about politics, he says, no, i'm a policy guy. his whole career has been in washington, like joe biden. he has been a hill staffer. he has worked as a think tank. he has been on the hill. americans are still learning about paul ryan. google released some data today saying, you know, the difference in the number of google searches between ryan and biden is pretty wide. paul ryan is by far -- has more google interest. as he is introducing himself to americans, he has to, you know, talk about the romney campaign and their program and their issues without sounding too much like a policy wonk because he does have a tendency to do that tonight. he has done a good job of that so far on the xaen trail, but, suzanne, this is a much, much bigger audience tonight. >> we'll see if he brings out the white board like he usually does in congress. talk about social security. could be a

he is seen as a policy wonk, a numbers guy. his positions on social security and medicare, while perhaps outside the mainstream, have resonated very well with the far right of the party who has never been too trusting of mitt romney, the moderate. on the other hand, part of paul ryan's presence has been that it has been a distraction and the democrats have been making fair game by saying this is a guy who has pushed vouchers for social security, a guy with a pretty extreme position on abortion rights. anytime a vice president becomes the topic of conversation like that, it is not good for the presidential ticket. the best example of that is, much like was the case with mccain and sarah palin, when she started making mistakes and trying to go broke, as everyone called it, mccain had to put her on a short lease -- trying to go rogue, as everyone called it. mitt romney had to put paul ryan on a relatively short leash where he has backed off some of his early comments. i think we're going to see a very safe position by paul ryan be

policy, so he had to treat her in a different way than you would say someone like paul ryan who is a wonk knows policy very well. i think he's going to really enjoy this debate because he'll be able to go toe-to-toe, head-to-head really no holds bar. it will be fun to watch and we're going to be watching together on thursday night. i can't wait. >> eliot: interestingly you didn't mention one thing that makes it hard, that's gender. make i can raise it more easily. it's more hard for a man to debate a woman and be aggressive without appearing overly aggressive and that was part of the dance with sarah palin whereas with paul ryan he can throw a left hook and no one is going to think the worst of him for it. >> and i think with paul ryan too, there is such a great opportunity to talk about the contrasts between the tickets. with paul ryan and ayn rand there is just a ripe opportunity for joe biden to come out swinging. you're right with sarah palin it was a little bit different. that issue about a man debating a woman is less and less as baby boomers get a little bit older but it definitely

when the narrative was before paul ryan is this gifted wonk and he's going to go out and make mince meatn. >> eliot: if i'm paul ryan the first words out of my mouth is mr. vice president i want to quote you directly. the middle class has been buried for four years. you gave us your own score card on your own term. you have graded yourself as a failure. how does joe biden dig himself out of that hole. >> he says it was not just four years and the last four years the result of policies the same that mitt romney and paul ryan are trying to propose will bury the middle class. i think-- >> eliot: i think bill clinton was part of the failure too. nobody would satisfy you. time to change the captain at the helm. ryan, what is your answer if you're joe biden. >> i think something to that effect. he could joke how he doesn't always say exactly what he's trying to say or put it in the most politics terms but that's basically what you want to say. you want to say eight years of deregulation and policies that expended the inequality gap and that led to this public that led to the crisis, which led

. >> you have policy wonk in paul ryan, and joe biden, everyone's uncle. >> ama: president obama wille in the bay area next week for another fundraiser, taking part in a concert and rally monday at san francisco's bill graham auditorium. tickets start at $100 and go as high as $5,700. >> cal berkeley used tonight's homecoming football game to rededicate memorial stadium. ♪ >> since 1923 the stadium had been dedicated to all californiaons who died in world war 124e678 stadium recently re-opened after a $321 million renovation and is now dedicated to all californians who subray identifiesed their lives in service to the nags. leigh glaser has a look at the forecast. >> leigh: i'm so confused. what am i doing tomorrow. giants, 49ers. we're starting to see a little low cloudiness, fog near the coast, but the live shot here from our mt. tam cam showing you clear sky towards the bay, and the background, san francisco. let's get to live doppler 7hd. these are high and mid-level clouds near the coast, starting to push in. the low clouds will filter in later this evening as well, and we're als

. >> you have policy wonk in paul ryan, and joe biden, everyone's uncle. >> ama: president obama willthe bay area next week for another fundraiser, taking part in a concert and rally monday at san francisco's bill graham auditorium. tickets start at $100 and go as high as $5,700. >> cal berkeley used tonight's homecoming football game to rededicate memorial stadium. ♪ >> since 1923 the stadium had been dedicated to all californiaons who died in world war 124e678 stadium recently re-opened after a $321 million renovation and is now dedicated to all californians who subray identifiesed their lives in service to the nags. leigh glaser has a look at the forecast. >> leigh: i'm so confused. what am i doing tomorrow. giants, 49ers. we're starting to see a little low cloudiness, fog near the coast, but the live shot here bay, towards the bay, andng you the background, san francisco. let's get to live doppler 7hd. these are high and mid-level clouds near the coast, starting to push in. the low clouds will filter in later this evening as well, and we're also looking for pockets of dense fog ne

what are you thinking we will see thursday in >> i think a contest between the wonk and the whacko. >> could you be more subtle. >> the vice president can't go through a day without putting the foot in mouth and contrast is clear. paul ryan is articulate and smart guy that exsudes youth and has a command of the facts and knows the budget and understands the economy and i think he is going to do extremely well and a repeat of the presidential debate. >> alice, do you think that paul ryan can be too wonkish. he can go deep in the weed a deblate is it not where you want to lull people into a deep thoughtful discussion; is that a danger for paul ryan. >> i think the romney team is smart and understand what his strengths are and you know very, very few weaknesses if there are any. he is a book worm and knows the numbers. but so much attention is it paid to biden's gaffe. middle class is buried and we will raise taxings and i agree we can't underestimate he is strong and can relate to the people and that will resonate with the audience and he will engage in a good debate. ryan knows he is a