the plan they worked with, wyden calls it the wyden/ryan plan.talked about the misrepresentations because you still can do regular medicare or have a choice. >> exactly. >> you only have that other choice if you decide to go to that other type and it's not a voucher. what it is, it's -- they can have that debate, but that's for the younger workers and it's saying, you can have choice the way the federal employees do. if you don't want choice, you don't have to have choice. >> won't it be the case that it will be cherry picked, that the younger healthier people will go for the other options and the old fashioned medicare program will dissipate? >> look at the federal employees health care plan. withdr you have people, janitors, up to the agency heads that choose a plan and choose a plan and have good health care. it's something that's worked for federal employees for years and something federal employees like so much. everybody in the private sector and the public sector have agreed it's a success. we're just saying, let's use that for younger wor

. >> the latest iteration is the ryan/wyden plan. there was a ryan ryan plan but then he co-authored this plan with the senator from oregon, ron wyden. basically, the best way to describe this is for people who are 55 and younger, this is who it's going to impact. ten years from now, when those people start getting to retirement age, there's going to be a different sort of option. people can opt to get a stipend, which right now is projected to be about $8,000, and use that money to buy into the private health care industry. so they can say look, i want to do medicare, instead, i want to use this money and buy my own insurance. before, there was no medicare option as part of that. now you can still opt to stay in medicare. so that's an important point. because they're not saying they're getting rid of medicare. they're just making other options available, believing that that competition will drive down prices. people talk a lot about these cuts. what they're really talking about is capping the amount that medicare can grow over the n

we don't see that in the ryan/wyden plan. you don't see where that money goes.ut the idea that that money would go back into medicare back into the safety net. back into the federal entitlement to protect people 65 and older, there's no evidence right now in the ryan/wyden plan. >> sanjay, thank you. appreciate it greatly. >> you got it, soledad, anytime, thank you. >>> getting to some breaking news now, we've gotten some tape of paul ryan's first one on one interview. he's appearing tonight on fox. he got a question about mitt romney's budget plan. and here's how he handled it. >> budget plan that you're now supporting would get to balance when? >> well, there's different -- the budget plan that mitt romney's supporting gets us down to 20% of gdp government spending by 2016. that means get the size of government back to where it historically has been. what president obama has done is he has brought the size of government to as high as it hasn't been since world war ii. we want to reduce the size of government so we can have more economic freedom. >> i get that.

it's the ryan/wyden plan. everyone likes to leave out congressman wyden. a liberal from oregon who worked very responsibly in an adult way with congressman ryen to come up with an option. so younger people like you and i, and our kids, will have a future where we can still have the same medicare that's in place. but if you'd like to choose, if you want to look at things and choose a different option, we will have different choices. younger workers. 55 and over, it stays the same. younger workers, we get a choice. what's wrong with a choice? that's why, when you had ben lebolt on here earlier, he couldn't answer that, and he couldn't answer that wyden supported this very sensible plan for young workers. >> here's what ron wyden said who voted against his own plan. >> no, no -- the whole budget -- >> it was a policy proposal. he said, i did -- this is a quote from him in a statement from his office. i did not co-lead a piece of legislation. i wrote a policy paper on options for medicare several months after the paper came out, i spoke and voted against the m

input if we don't know what's actually being negotiated and that is the same position that senator wyden the ranking member of the chair of the subcommittee in the senate deals with trade has said to us t.r. and said this is been common practice throughout the years for members of congress to have access and you're not giving giving me access to this text and so this is not and outrageous position in any way and it's been disappointing to see us see our dig in that position certainly the transparency or lack thereof surrounding this one of the major issues but i know a lot of people tout the benefits of this and some of the benefits i know listed today at the conference a better relations with pacific rim countries setting global standards benefiting working americans do you think these are fair assessments well i don't think that they're fair because i think there are many ways that you can create global partnerships and one way is one way that we don't think is the correct approach is to allow six hundred corporate advisers to write to have access to the text to write it and to not let

still a lot of concerns areas of concerns within this legislation i mean it's great to see senator wyden doing that and he's brought a lot of attention to this issue which basically is that the government claims they can spy on all of our location without a word because it's just our location and it's not anything private of it's an absolutely ridiculous argument that the argument. so ridiculous they refuse to make it publicly and we've only been able to hear about it because senator wyden i was with the classified information and he continues to push the used legislation to fix the loophole that the government has simply invented out of the net now and as we had mentioned earlier what this bill does it transfers power out of the national security agency to a civilian agency and a lot of controversy surrounding what exactly the n.s.a. has done in the past and if they did compromise people's privacy and constitutional rights want to break up a general keith alexander he came out recently and said that the n.s.a. did not maintain files on americans he says if that happened that it wasn't i

someone who worked with ron wyden to put this entitlement reform forward, someone who has been willing over the years to do the hard number crunching and put out specifics on what to do. and now you get what i consider a very hypocritical and self-indicting response particularly from the liberals who are saying this is a gamble or condemn this as a silly move instead of recognizing that this is an attempt to make the debate in the campaign worthwhile and to give the public a solid choice. there's even one very credible commentator who i think embarrassed herself by saying this created a death wish ticket. >> well, you're taking me out of context, so i know you will go back, sir, and look at that because it's not what i said. >> oh, come on. >> listen, you know, the fact of the matter is, this is either going to put it the way i put it, this is either, as seen by conservatives, going to be what begins the march to the white house or it might be what ends the march to the white house, and we can all talk about it on the 7th. and the truth of the matter is that one way or the other, we're

>> i think paul ryan listened carefully and he worked with ron wyden and they have introduced a medicarelan that allows you the choice, you can stay in the current system if you want or go to the new system. but it's your choice. and i felt in our conversations over a period of months that paul was listening very carefully and was contemplating exactly how to do the right thing the right way. we're operating in a world where barack obama has ended medicare as we know it. by taking $700 billion out of the program. i mean, for democrats to run pretending they're going to defend a program that they have gutted is the ultimate hypocrisy. >> because a lot of people probably don't remember that after ryan -- paul ryan came out with the original plan he worked together with democratic senator ron wyden of oregon to come up with an alternative of that plan which is what you're talking about. medicare. but even a lot of republicans -- you remember donald trump, he was very critical of republicans for even talking about medicare because he thought politically that would be -- that would be destruc

>> well, ron wyden will say, i love this plan. i'm going to go sponsor it now.rty line thing. i can't do that anymore. you know, the real problem that we've got in washington is that people aren't going to talk honestly about the problems and aren't going to talk about getting together as americans to work on solutions. it's, let's take the party line. whatever it is. so you'll have chris van hollen here, you'll have newt here and all of a sudden all they can talk about is the other guys are bad, my guys are right. if we're going to solve any problems in this country, we have to do it as americans and get past this, my party first and -- >> well, what pick would have been in the middle? >> it's not a matter of who the pick is. if we change the system, we have a system in the way we elect people, the way we get guys like mike castle or dick luger get knocked off in primaries. joe lieberman was almost knocked off in a primary. we created a system that says you've got to stick to the party line or you're going to get knocked off. >> there's too much power with acti

and what paul ryan and senator wyden have done is said, no, we need to restore and retain and protecticare and that is what our party will do. [cheers and applause]. >> jamie: you heard the boos and the applause and joining me now, steve moore, senior economic writer for the "wall street journal." great to have you here. >> hi, jamie. >> jamie: i want to look at fox polls with you to talk about where the american people are and how confident they are about the economy. let me put up the first one. they were asked whether they saw signs the economy has started to turn the corner. is the worst over? and 58% say the worst isn't over. now, you have tracked this every day, are they right or wrong and do they have reason for concern? >> yes, this economy is in really poor shape now, we saw that both with the overall economic growth numbers, a few weeks ago, and we saw it with another lousy jobs number that came out, just two weeks ago. it has been three-and-a-half years, jamie, of 8% unemployment or higher. that is a pretty dismal record and president obama will have a hard time defending i

as being one of the co-writers of this bill on why is it as ron wyden really made the mistake of attaching his name to to a small piece a small piece of this legislation at that time on the air i called him out and i said and i know ron white he was my is my senator for years and i said he's playing the role of useful idiot he has no idea how badly he's going to be used for this one democrat in all of america got on board with ryan in a partial way and you're reciting his name but don't put up with tom but tom how do you explain that obamacare is still a very much despised by the american people nearly sixty percent of the people want to repeal not true when you look at when you when you talk about right now names we all don't like gail right which america when you talk about them and it gets people love it. anyhow neal i would deal with certainly not showing up in the polls ok i don't think we have to wrap it up well we will find out yeah come november we'll definitely know neal asper thanks so much for being with us i think that tom thanks for having me whether medicare is a winning deba

government uses it that's a strategy but bound to fail i do want to you know senator ron wyden he has kind of been at the forefront of all of this and trying to advocate legislation that would protect internet freedoms and he plans to introduce an amendment to this bill that would prevent warrantless g.p.s. tracking so aaron i mean it looks like there is still a lot of concerns areas of concerns within this legislation yeah i mean it's great to see senator one doing that and he's brought a lot of attention to this issue which basically is that the government claims they can spy on all of our location without a word because it's just our location and it's not anything private of us it's an absolutely ridiculous argument it's an argument. it's so ridiculous they refuse to make it publicly and instead we've only been able to hear about it because senator wyden has access to classified information and he continues to push legislation to fix the loophole that the government has simply invented out of the now as we had mentioned earlier what this bill does it transfers power out of the nati

he came back with ron wyden. he listened-- one of the things i give paul a lot of credit for is he really listenes, and he came back with an approved medicare plan that ron wyden-- the only bipartisan plan-- and it basically allows people to stay in the current system. he met my only objection. the bigger debate is simple-- you have an obama administration that represents government as usual, slow economic growth as usual, the worst economy since the great depression, and their answer is to do nothing. it's like all these mayors of cities going bankrupt, they're sitting here saying protect everything. well, stephanie just talked about the problem with student loans. the problem today under the obama plan, even if you can get through college, you can't find a job. so i think this will be a straightforward debate. do you want a more dynamic economy, more jobs, a fast or growing country, and a smaller government. or do you want a much bigger government with a much bigger deficit with fewer jobs and a much smaller ec

>> well, i just disagree with senator wyden on this, and congressman ryan and so have most of the expertsho have looked at this and said that the way that the thing is construct ed that medicare would be in a death spiral under this plan, and ultimately it would raise costs on seniors by thousands of dollars. so, you know, that -- and the truth is, candy, that this is the second it rati iter ration congressman ryan's wanting to do away with medicare, and it was called right-wing socitactics. he is out to promote fraud and abuse and promoting better ways of reviving medicare and not dispell tdi dispel the demise. >> if you look at the savings and if you could name me the one thing that president obama has done over the course of the first three and half years that you think that will save medicare in the years ahead knowing that the baby boom is aging, what has he done? >> well, candy, first of all, you and i should not, and we should leave it to the experts to say that the congressional budget office said what president obama has done is to add eight years to the life of medicare, and wha

i think i have worked with many people on the democrat side with internet freedom like ron wyden bet to civil libertarian issues we see eye-to-eye. i have tsai amd letters encouraging the president to end of the war. 60 or 70% is ready for the war to be over. diss 10 years of this. we disrupted the terrorist base but we cannot keep creating nations. >> host: what do you think sometimes democrats use to as the evil bogyman? >> that you are being effective that they make you a target. i am not easily identifiable. average been on an air force one with the president to suggest we bring home board aid and to repatriate corporate capital, home to reduce the tax rates and build the bridges. the pipeline regulation bill to exempt the old pipelines i made them take that out. they were exploding. i have them take that out. i am proud of the fact were i find like minded people who have been to be democrats. >> host: talking with senator rand paul officer of the tea party goes to washington and his new book called government believes believes -- bullies. this is c-span2. >> joining us now is do

it included a lot of things that ron wyden does not lighke.e effort references to paul ryan and ron wyden and how -- this is a demonstration where they can now of some agreement in some areas. host: one point of difference between the ron wyden plan and the ryan plan was a cap on spending increases at half a point percentage point higher than gdp. explain what that means. guest: paul ryan would say the contribution that medicare would provide would grow every year at the rate of gross domestic product of half a percentage point. the plan with senator widen would be if full percentage point. the wyden-ryan proposal was a more generous increase each year, which would mean less cost shifting to the beneficiary. host: sue is waiting on the democratic line. good morning . caller: good morning. i think the american people are not getting the full story of the $719 billion that is being cut from medicare. that was a subsidy to sign-on to the program and provide coverage. if these changes go through to a voucher program, imagine the windfall to the pr

. >> the first ryan budget, the budget that he worked out with congressman wyden, senator wyden, is a >> you talk about the budget. the only thing we really know about the budget is obama has never had a vote, a positive vote on the budget. the only thing we know about obama bringing people together is in three successful budgets he submitted it was defeated 99-nothing. >> that's the debate. we have to leave it there. the counter is the republic caps have blocked lot of these votes. in fact, all of these votes. to be continued. fred malek, michael steele, ed rendell. thank you very much, all. >>> up next, tom brokaw talking about condoleezza rice's political future and conventions past and future. crashes ] [ male announcer ] if you think all batteries are the same... consider this: when the unexpected happens, there's one brand of battery more emergency workers trust in their maglites: duracell. one reason: duralock power preserve. it locks in power for up to 10 years in storage. guaranteed. so, whether it's 10 years' of life's sunny days... or... the occasional stormy one... trust g

>> how must have given ron wyden all sorts. >> he has you agreeing with him. >> no. the fact is medicare, as we know it today is the nation's number one worst possible threat for a national government insolvency and ruination of the company. >> say it to everybody. that will make sure the republicans lose. >> the do-nothing democrats have done nothing but -- >> that's not correct. the affordable care act extended the life of medicare. >> we'll continue to search for common ground. thanks to bob and dick. we hope you will come back soon. >>> let's switch gears to look at politics. wisconsin has traditionally been a democratic strong hold in presidential elections going back to ronald reagan in 1984. for an election which is going to come down to a crucial few swing states, will paul ryan now put wisconsin in play for republicans in november? let's talk to an expert wisconsin republican senator and romney campaign supporter, senator ron johnson. thank you. ron johnson, you won as a republican. the governor ran twice as a republican. can paul ryan carry it for romney? >

i endorsed it in september of last year when ron wyden and paul ryan brought it out. let me also point out, it is obama who took $716 billion out of medicare to pay for obama care. it is obama who created a 15-person bureaucratic board to end medicare as we've known it and put bureaucrats between doctors and their patients. i think if we want to have a debate on medicare, republicans and conservatives ought to lean forward and say let's get it the on, this is going to be a great debate because the fact is, it's obama who's been taking the money away from our senior citizens and it's ryan and romney who protect senior citizens and offer reform only for people under 55. >> but is it one of the big problems with the ryan plan in terms of perception, the fact that he's looking after the very wealthy in america. indisputably. someone like mitt romney would pay hardly any tax under this plan at all. and there is a genuine concern about the lower end of american society. the reason i say that is you're a catholic. paul ryan iscatholic. the u.s. conference of catholics said i

ron wyden is an open minded guy who agrees on economic issues and civil libertarian issues we see eye to eye on issues of trying to end the war in afghanistan. and three publican's have signed a letter is with many democrats encouraging the president to end board afghanistan and the public is coming around and 67% are ready for the war to be over. even republicans it is 50/50 and much more lopsided. we have been through ten years of this. we won the war and killed osama bin laden and disrupted the terrorist base but we keep creating and trying to create nations. >> host: one more question. what do you think about the fact the sometimes democrats use you as that evil bogeyman of the campaign. >> guest: that means you're being effective in the sense that you are allowed on a voice that they make a target for you but i am not easily identifiable as just be a partisan. i don't believe in empty partisanship. i have ridden on air force one to find money for building a bridges and suggested we bring home some foreign aid and some of that money that foreign welfare can be used for bridges her

you know, with both these plans, whether it's the obama care plan or this wyden plan, there's very little evidence to say what would happen, if they would work, if they would lower costs, because it's brand-new. but it's different philosophies. wants to do more private sector competition and one wants to lower costs to providers, such as insurance companies and hospitals. >> okay, sanjay, thank you. >> thanks, brooke. >>> isaac still causing problems, mandatory evacuations underway right this minute. we'll get you an update on that jam we've been talking about. and we are told there is still very much so that possibility that it could break. mom: ready to go to work? ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ every mom needs a little helper. that's why i got a subaru. announcer: love. it's what makes a subaru, a subaru. they're whole grain good... and yummy good. real fruit pieces. 12 grams of whole grains and a creamy yogurt flavored coating. quaker yogurt granola bars. treat yourself good. quaker yogurt granola bars. ♪ (train horn) vo: wherever our trains go, the economy comes to life. norfolk southern. one line, infinit

>> ultimately senator wyden's made it clear that he disagrees with the ryan budget at large.k that that's the approach we should take. the president's got a balanced approach on the table. and that's one that he supports. but ultimately this really does restructure what the nature of medicare is. it turns it into a voucher program. increases the out-of-pocket cost for seniors by thousands of dollars each year. and the president is committed to its preservation, the affordable care act extends the solvency of medicare by eight years. the president's budget finds additional medicare and medicaid savings and would extend its solvency by another two years. the president has been working towards solutions to promote medicare solvency. but what this does is it radically restructures medicare. >> final question, david axelrod, your boss, this morning compared sarah palin to paul ryan, seemingly trying to draw a link between them in the voters' minds. but let's be honest, paul ryan is very different from sarah palin. he's a policy and intellectual leader of his party. and sarah palin