yahoo! $250,000 per day if it did not turn over user data. apple's biggest iphone appears to be off to a hot start. to the apple website the device is on backorder and isn't expected ship -- expected to ship for another three weeks. in addition apple's website had some issues due to all the traffic. one user tweeted to me -- not everyone having problems. apple facing a supply chain problem or is it a way to drum up demand? joining me as cory johnson. is this a marketing stunt or do they have supply issues here? >> every time they come out with an iphone this happens. this is the way they probably wanted it to play out. would be a disaster if it were two or three months. >> is this an indication the six plus is going to be the most popular phone? them all without a doubt people want a larger phone. if you travel in asia you realize half the world is there. we are behind. of the people who left the ios for android did so for a bigger phone. there is clearly a hole in their product line. we tal

you bought yahoo! >> yeah. listen, i have -- i missed the run-up in yahoo! coming into the deal. but now that the deal's out there, and it was down 4%, 5% today, valuing yahoo!'s core business at a negative number, yahoo!'s core business may not be worth a lot but i went in, i was able to buy yahoo!. i think 40.50 was my price. you don't have to worry about corporate issues and -- >> and i leaned on art cashin because he said, they're going to hold this deal at $90. when it got down $90, i added to the call spreads i already had in yahoo!. don't have anything in alibaba. but i added more call spreads. i expect to see this mid-40s, up to 50. and because of that i added to it a lot better -- >> a lot more talk on "options action." shameless plug. for more on the stock, let's bring in rosenblatt securities martin. >> good to be here. >> i know you said alibaba is a good value, good deal. do you still feel that it surged in its opening day to $93.89? >> it's interesting when you look at the valuation, but where it was initially priced it was about fair value to amazon and facebook. i

yahoo! is going to become alibaba's big is investor in alibaba will take over yahoo!'s china operations. >> it was one of the biggest deals in internet history and set off a media frenzy. for the first time, a chinese in a company had taken over the local company. with a search engine in our portfolio, we boldly plant that -- >> ebay has been trying to build and be as successful as a lot of companies in china. this is really representing a big challenge for ebay in china. >> the mood was euphoric. mandarin]ng >> to make the partnership work it was critical to smooth and integrate yahoo! china under ali baba's management. we chartered a transfer to bring yahoo! china to visit their new national headquarters. it didn't take long before we realize that the two teams have very different cultures. seemedina's team weary of management changes and seem to think that getting taken over by a local company was a step down. the two teams didn't mix well. and other important challenges getting government support. jack that with local government leaders to explain the benefits they

that is why yahoo! to sell some of it. >> they should not feel any remorse if they gave back half of the stake? >> they had no choice. this, are firmly with there was this commitment made that alibaba would go public. that brings us to now. >> an ongoing relationship between yahoo! and alibaba could have a lot of sim biases. there could be complementary things that they bring to the table. >> alibaba could not get there on their own. they need yahoo! to help them. they know where to find one another. >> there is a lot more to it than just finding one another. there is an infrastructure that exists that they could use. try to get inbaba the commerce with some branding? we were talking about what if alibaba and amazon did a deal? i could see them partnering with yahoo! to do something that was creative and not just about advertising. is still a pretty good brand. for some of then these sitting at the table. >> do you know anybody with the yahoo! account? >> jack ma is going to have all this money to play

should yahoo! merge with aol? a former yahoo! officer with us on whether marissa mayer of yahoo! should consider a possible merger with tim armstrong's aol, even if it means she might lose the job? coming up on "after the bell," don't move! it's a great rally day. can you start tomorrow? yes sir. alright. let's share the news tomorrow. today we failrly busy. tomorrow we're booked solid. we close on the house tomorrow. i want one of these opened up. because tomorow we go live... it's a day full of promise. and often, that day arrives by train. big day today? even bigger one tomorrow. when csx trains move forward, so does the rest of the economy. csx. how tomorrow moves. you are gonna need a wingman. and my cash back keeps the party going. but my airline miles take it worldwide. [ male announcer ] it shouldn't be this hard. with creditcards.com, it's easy to search hundreds of cards and apply online. creditcards.com. to build something smarter. ♪ some come here to build something stronger. others come to build something faster... s

we all know yahoo is not. and that's why for me scott, yahoo was the sale and we slammed it out this morning. i think a lot of people did. i think a lot of hedges will continue to slam shares of yahoo because that is a derivative that still owns a significant piece. they will lift those hedges i believe scott next friday. why? because the options come on the following monday september 29th. as far as investor, whether they are hedge fund and fast money guys or joes and jane, a lot of folks just want access to china. i know -- and they know. they don't actually own that. jack ma owns that but they get the revenue stream from it through the cayman islands and i think they think that is going to continue to grow and be dramatic. we had i don't know how many million shares of demand at the firm. and obviously it could not be satisfied. >> well you mention ma and the model and his emphasis on really focussing on small and medium sized businesses in china and of course now in the u.s. here is what he told us earlier

so we're covering all angles and one angle is yahoo. why yahoo could be a takeout target. the take -- the acquirer, the potential acquirer will surprise you, guaranteed. >> stay tuned, over to you guys. >> thanks, kelly. "fast money" starts right now live from new york city's time square, i'm melissa lee. our traders tonight are pete najarian, dan nathan, john najarian and guy adami. >>> three key market events unfolding. scotland closing its polls right now. will it become an independent country? the latest as the numbers trickle in. oracle, meantime, getting hit after announcing larry ellison is stepping down as ceo. revenue coming in late in the first quarter. the call getting underway right now. we've got all the latest headlines, and any minute now, we will get the pricing on ali baba ahead of the first day of trade tomorrow. first, to the breaking news on larry ellison and oracle. live at headquarters with the latest on this. >> yeah. larry ellison still at the top of oracle despite stepping down as ceo. he's executive chairman. that's a title he didn't have before.

i don't think she can do much with yahoo! david: scott, when i look at yahoo!rt of what brian is saying, wonder if somebody like carl icahn, we mentioned him in the previous segment, bill ackman looking at it, gee an activist shareholder could do a lot with this company. do you sense somebody like one of those or somebody like them to get into the game? >> i don't any reason to get in the case. carl icahn was involved years ago when microsoft was pursuing acquisition of yahoo! and david einhorn was a coupled involved couple years ago. short answer we don't necessarily see that. i honestly don't answer people don't see the fact if you look at the value of publicly-traded shares held of alibaba and yahoo! japan and add the cash you're really almost getting the entire yahoo! business for free. and so that provide a lot of optionality we think. you know what? if the stock remains undervalued as we think it is currently -- cheryl: so sorry, scott, i need to interrupt for a moment. sorry, got breaking news on herbalife. i want to bring it to viewers attention. gettin

yahoo!acing a fine of $250,000 today if they did not turn over user data. what kind of issues were the government after? next on "bloomberg west." ♪ >> marissa meyer is naming christian baldwin. and kerry diamond of yahoo! food. new court filing shows they fought the government over nsa surveillance requests in 2007 in 2008. they waged a 10 month battle against the prison program in the foreign intelligence surveillance court but the government threatened yahoo with fines up to $250,000 a day if the company did not turn over user data. it turned over the data and was not find so what did the government want and what does it say about the relationship between tech companies and the nsa? i am bringing in our guest. >> the documents were made available. this is something that yahoo! pushed for. we are seeing a profile of the kinds of requests that were made early. this goes back a number of years. maybe one of the most interesting things, there is so much hyperbole about these far ranging, the

alibaba and shareholder yahoo!. while alibaba had a huge day, yahoo! dropped 3%.ord volumes in the options. what is going on here? let's get in the money. dan nathan, why the pressure on yahoo!? a little bit counter intuitive here. >> if you were in yahoo! you're late to the game. the stock's been up over 100% since 2013. it's well-known it's a way to play expanding value of alibaba over the last few years. just also mention, the stock was up 15% in the last month. heading into this event. you know, we hear talk all the time on the street, you know, traders say, buy the rumor, sell the news. that's what you got today. >> if you look at the options action going into today, yesterday for instance, very high volumes. mostly buying calls. >> that does not surprise me very much. what we can see, also, as yahoo! rose, every bit of that increase in price that we've seen recently was attributed to the rumors where the price for alibaba would be, and as that rose, so, too, did yahoo!. i also see this as an indictment of yahoo!'s strategy in general. clearly they're not pla

not just yahoo! doing acquisitions. the idea these guys from starboard in their letter talked about, hey, look, we are done with the acquisitions. we have had enough spending going on. why do you think they are thinking that? >> there are a lot of reasons why if somebody wanted to, yahoo! could be very attractive. >> as eric had mentioned, you have the up-side in terms of a bigger dividend to share holders. he says it is ride in terms of the checkbook being closed. that had been a huge wild card concern for investors. those are two big things. >> that's why i bought it when it was down 5%, 7% that day. it was probably somewhere around zero. it is worth something. not only that, now, you have it in play. the ceo of softbank has already said, he would like to own more of ali baba and wishes he did. >> this gets the guys involved in the stock. tax or not, efficiency or not with ali baba. no matter what you did, people had much higher evaluations. it had to attach to yahoo! after ali baba than they had. some of the parts ev

long yahoo! here, think alibaba -- >> now just buy it. >> you could do, but it's going to be volatile. be honest, this has a $225 billion market cap. not a lot of room for error. yahoo! is trading below core value. look to november, buy a call butterfly. when the stock was 40/60 today, priced up november, 45/50, cost a dollar, buy a november 40 call for $3.20, selling at $2.70 total and buy the far wing for 50 cents. cost a dollar. that's maximum risk. i try to -- if this stock is between 41 and 49 on november expiration, two months from now, i make up to $4. at 45, i make 4. that's 10 %. risk one to make 4 if i get back to the prior highs. >> the four to one pay out is interesting. you'll notice it's slightly in the money right now. this actually does -- you don't have to have a stock move a lot for this to pay off. what i said earlier is actually in yahoo!'s case, options are not expensive. i don't mind using these. >> 45, why center the fly there? that was, like, the high from bamgs back in th

dan nathan, why the pressure on yahoo!? a little counterintuitive here. >> if you were in yahoo!ay, you were late to the game. the stock has been up over 20% since the start of 2013. it's very well known this is a way to play the expanding value of alibaba over the last few years. i'll also mention, the stock was up 15% the last month heading into this event. we hear this sort of talk all the time on the street, you know, traders say, well, you know, you buy the rumor, you sell the news. that's what you got today. >> if you look at options action going into today, yesterday, for instance, very high volumes and mostly buying calls. >> that doesn't surprise me very much. one of the things we can see also as yahoo! rose, every bit of that increase in price we've seen recently was attributed to the rumors about where the price for alibaba would be. so too did alibaba. i see this as an indictment in yahoo! strategy in general. clearly, they're not placing any value other than the piece of alibaba that. it owns. one thing that's interesting is net of all of this, options in yahoo! have

. >>> yahoo under a hedgefund attack. one of the world's biggest investors quits his job and stocks on the rise t. is a huge news friday. all the developing stories ahead. melissa with us today. >> it is great to be here. let's get to the big yahoo news here. starboard upping pressure to buy aol. yahoo analyst gene munster great to have you with us. >> hello. >> 67 cent per share gap, is that what you see is potential here? >> we are not as optimistic in part because of the gas rate. what is the tax rate that yahoo will pay on existing shares? if it is 10% that gets to $8 more per share. starboard gives it a more optimi optimistic. i think that is the real core focus here as it gets down to the minutia of tax accounting. >> you are one of the most bullish out there with a $48 target. so it is still more bullish than where the stock is now. i imagine you don't fundamentally disagree with everything starboard is saying. >> we absolutely agree. it is the magnitude of the difference but the fact that yahoo is under valued and

they would buy yahoo!.> think of what that nothingness gets them in terms of proximity and access and a look-see into a lot of businesses. i'm with pete. i don't understand how we get into a place where downgrades are coming at a time when post-ipo, we own 15% of alibaba, the $275 billion market cap at 32 times 2016. that means basically right here without anything else, without yahoo! japan, this company is probably in the black. so it is puzzling to me that every analyst who's waiting for a valuation of alibaba. many of these guys had $140 billion. we have the valuation and we're post ipo and people are downgrading this stock. it makes no sense to me. >> what did you with your softbank? >> we sold some thursday and friday. i still have 40% left. which is very frustrating. the ipo valuation is much higher than we had expected. however it was just by a giant rumor. sentiments change. when you think about what is it that alibaba would want to buy? actually nothing. they're sellers. they want to sell. they ju

if this goes up and yahoo stake goes up, is it vindication for him not wanting to sell yahoo to microsoft way back when, seeing more value in it than investors. >> and they have always had the stake. i don't think he was thinking of alibaba at the time with that but it was one of the greatest trades in history for yahoo. yahoo right now is a alibaba investment company. that is really where most of the value of the company is in alibaba shares the ones they have to shell and the ones they get to keep. and they sold a bunch recently. at a very low price so not every trade has been perfect but they still hold a lot of shares and we'll see what happens. and they really don't have to do much business and they just have to hold alibaba's shares at this moment and then the focus will be on the core business. >> we asked ma this morning how investors are supposed to get their heads around the foreign aspects of regulation in china. >> yeah. >> the relationship to the government. his answer was trust. essentially his answer was trust me. and i just wonder how that rings where you are in the valley

i think the history of yahoo! and alibaba is well documented. i think yahoo! has been very practicing nattic over the last -- pragmatic over the last four years how it worked with its biggest investment and that bodes well for alibaba and bodes well for yahoo! right now. >> you say this is marisa myers' moment of truth. can you tell us why you say that and if you were still sitting in that top office, what you would do with the money that yahoo! is going to get? >> well look, i think you have to separate her time at the top of yahoo! in a couple buckets. if i could use a football analogy, first inning, first quarter, for marisa was absolutely astounding. she brought an energy to that company that it hadn't had in years. i think the enthusiasm in sunniville was tremendous. i think she made a lot of the right moves. dan loeb pushing to bring in somebody with real tech cred and a celebrity status did wonders for that business out of the gate. i think, you know, the second quarter, which would be her second year, which we're sort of in right now, maybe a little bu

yahoo shares spiking right now. starboard turning up pressure urging ceo to explore joining with aol, a good move for investors at yahoo at aol? shake waves through the bond world. another one that came out of nowhere this morning or out of somewhere if you are on the inside. bill gross resigning unexpectedly and moving to janice. many have funds in 401 ks or private accounts. should you take your money out now? september a volatile month. volatility going away. a lot of movement in the sectors. we break down winners and loseers since the start of the month. first to sue who is here at headquarters. >> i am on a very busy and wild week for the markets. triple digit rally on wednesday and triple digit selloff yesterday. today we are up again. let's take a look at where we sit right now. dow jones industrial average on the upside by 74 points. s&p 500 up just under six. russell and nasdaq in the green by 16.3 points. transports up 64 points. >> stocks rebounding. s&p is up today but it is still on track to close lower

yahoo shares spiking right now. up pressure urging ceo to explore joining with aol, a good move for investors at yahoo at aol? shake waves through the bond world. another one that came out of nowhere this morning or out of somewhere if you are on the

yahoo! is down 3%. yahoo! owns 25% of ali baba. it is down 3%.. >> the nasdaq is down. yahoo! own good chunk of this i am out of it. what does yahoo! have? it was the purpose, part of the purpose is to take out monetize their investment. here is the thing. what does yahoo! have if they don't have ali baba for the future. it is kind of a lot of questions about this, lot of questions about where they go in terms of not competitive with google. >> the signal to hold on a second. we are on. ali baba all the time, here is the lineup for the rest of the hour. is seeking manuel, architect of obamacare, we are going to stray from yahoo! and ali baba, that guy is there, as each emanual says he hopes he dies at 75 years old. dr. siegel on that one at 12:25 and then home depot, 65 million credit card numbers generally compromise over 5 months period. we have a hacker, why did home depot not act sooner? we are on it all. plus this. coming up, new ad from governor scott walker, why the unions are calling him out for it. brian kilmeade coming up and also -- br

i've owned yahoo!. continue to own yahoo!. i'm going to own yahoo! up into the ipo and then i think it's time to take about half that position off, scott, to take something off the table. i continue to think their investment already they will continue to have in alibaba actually sends the stock higher. when i look at what they are doing and this road show hasn't changed my opinion. i've been bullish on this a long time. 160, i think we were looking originally 125 and then $150 billion. now we're looking at 160 plus billion dollars. i think that's something that's going to work for yahoo!. now yahoo! has made mistakes, scott. i'm not sugar coating the idea have they shown a lot of growth. to josh's point talking about areas, have they done enough in mobile, probably not enough. this investment has been huge for them and continue to ride the coat tails of that. >> stephanie, what do you think about the alibaba ipo? on average the ten largest ipos have risen less than 10% on their first day of trading. maybe the best strategy is to wait. >> well, for wh

yahoo! is a major stakeholder. josh lipton has a look at what yahoo! will do with its windfall and whether investors should buy alibaba on the first day. first, though, a look at how we got here. >> the road to an initial public offering, ipo, unfolds over months and includes banks, lawyers, accountants, the s.e.c. and finally investors. first step, the company finds a bank that will underwrite the deal and only sell the shares to the public. about six months before the actual ipo, those bankers start writing up legal documents that begin to outline the deal. three months or more before the ipo, lawyers and accountants are decided upon. and bankers will begin drafting an s1. it's the legal document required by the securities and exchange commission that will tell the world about the company. things like what it plans to do with the proceeds, the business model, the competition, corporate governance, risks, and compensation. for the largest ipos, the s-1 is made public immediately. but for most ipos, it's made public once it is approved by the s.e.c. tw

yahoo! is 16% of that. so that's taking no value into consideration for yahoo! japan or yahoo! in the united states so let's they alibaba if you're saying that yahoo! will goes down in value, alibaba will go down in value. i think they have a floor at $38. going down 20% at most, yahoo! has 3.5% to the downside and should be supportive and valuing yahoo! in the united states and japan at 0. they have a $1.15 in earnings per share. i don't understand why the company is trading at such a discount. i think this is a huge activist play. >> don't you think it's what max was talking about, just this fear that they just don't have a business model that can compete with other businesses that have been innovating where yahoo! is falling behind? >> they have revenue. they have brand recognition and a $1.15 of earnings. taking out the alibaba portion of it, that's valued at $39 a share for just yahoo!. the value of the rest of the company at zero. why -- what if they brought someone in. an activist play. if alibaba doesn't move at all, yahoo! is valued $39 just from the alibaba cash to ha

yahoo! is also in the red here. pete, you have been adamant -- >> yep. >> that yahoo!' 50 and the street is saying there's no more reasons, no more catalysts for yahoo! >> i disagree. we'll -- i can't wait to hear what mark mahani says today downgrading it. i don't want to touch alibaba. i think is there upside? absolutely could be. i don't want to trade into alibaba after the $68 pricing from the banks. i think it's a no touch right here. >> do you think there's a baba trade to have at this point? do you plan on entering options when they start trading on the 29th? >> for our customer that is have the stock from the ipo, melissa, those customers, many hedged with yahoo! like we said. many of them on monday will be instead hedging with these options that will be listed on baba. i think that position will give you -- i'll have more on it tomorrow but the volatility of those will be pretty attractive to somebody to be in one of the biggest companies in the world and catch some nice cash flow from the options. in other words, whether they want to collar that thing off with

yahoo is a company that is struggling to remain relevant. aol is -- everybody tells me they are great companies and they are just not now. >> they have kind of fallen by the way side, they have been eclipped by facebook, twitter, google. starbird says it makes sense to combine them. >> the only thing that makes sense of this is content. marissa meyer has been big about the fact they got katie couric, and is that where the game is for these companies? >> aol has huffington post, and yahoo has katie ceu couric, and david pogue. >> in a world where ads are being more commoditized, it is hard tore keep people around. some people have special sauce. do you see any special sauce coming from a mix like this? >> it's kind of tough. this kind of deal has been talked about for a while. people talk about it in new york and silicon valley. they don't think it makes enough sense for these two companies. >> yahoo has not been fantastic. it makes acquisitions, doesn't necessarily do the best ones. it has avoided and fought off mergers, microsoft made a bit

yahoo!st $44. >> holy cow. >> $33 stock in the middle of july. a couple of months now and gained 10 bucks as people looking forward to friday. >> get the numbers. >> jim, a question on this before you -- yahoo! was trading down when we thought it might be a $200 billion value and then started to come down from there a little bit. that being alibaba. why has it had an incredible rally of late? is it because people believe they'll do something positive with the cash? >> look. it's $70. gross proceeds for yahoo! 9.8 billion. post-tax and what you have taught me and to look at. it's 6.38. okay in they have 3.2. even if they -- >> 6.38 billion after taxes. >> right. >> from what they're selling. by the way, still own a good amount -- >> from china? >> alibaba. selling nine in the offering? >> here's what people are saying. enter prize value is worth zero and ridiculous. right? and then i'm putting together a list of companies that they could buy for 6 point -- grub hub. a home away. they could bu

what is your strategy on yahoo!volley -- the volatility is based on the ipo. i want to use next week's options, next friday's options. that expirecall next week. i can collect about $1.50 to $1.60. my break point is to the downside, an area i would love to be. on the upside, breakeven at $47.60. i want to take advantage of this extreme volatility we're seeing. quite frankly, is much higher than what we see going into the yahoo! earnings report. >> how much in general are options pricing in a move for with earnings, they tend to get quite active. you're looking at a much bigger move. >> exactly. the move just for tomorrow for options that expire to mark, the market is looking at about 4%, 4.5% and for next week, options that expire next week, about 9% move. prettyket is pricing a hefty move. i want to take advantage of the volatility. >> thank you so much, scott bauer. we are on the markets once again in 30 minutes. >> welcome to "money clip." i am adam johnson. here's the rundown. and nation, the topic of conversati

. >> what about yahoo!? yahoo! is tied into alibaba. what are the implications for yahoo!?> they did sell about a quarter of their shares. they are still a big shareholder, obviously. the stock has benefited massively. to some extent, it was traded as a proxy to alibaba. what do you do with yahoo! shares? take a look at the valuation. the market cap is about $41 billion. it is less than the value of its stake in ali baba and yahoo! japan. the value of yahoo!'s underlying core business, it was laid bare. it is negative. that is another topic altogether. it has lagged behind google and facebook. softbank, the biggest shareholder of alibaba. it is close to 800 million shares. 75 billion u.s. dollars. we also spoke with the chairman of softbank. he was also on the floor of the nyse. >> alibaba continues to grow grows china, but also [indiscernible] this ipo in new york makes a good entry to the growth or expansion. forecasting to book a $4.6 billion gain from the listing. they will be booking that for the six-month ending september 30. . windfall gain shares open and 56 minutes

if yahoo! had no alibaba it would be a different story. >> their display business is defining. >> thanks for coming by. >> thank you. >> what's the trade here? >> first i talked about on monday way boo my final trade, 25% since that point. here's the reason, alibaba owns 18% but they could own 30% of the company. we know they are looking to make biginvestments. weibo is starting to monetize mobile the twitter of china. in the same way twitter is moving and see what's been going on with twitter. some of that is the underlying value in the stock. i think it's a very exciting time to be looking at a bunch of the chinese internet names. look at china mobile the big company getting into mobile, jv with a lot of these companies. same things going on here going on in china. >> you took off of wb. >> i took off that position today after running 25%. i've owned the position outside rite since more or less -- outright since the ipo and then took some off and put more back on lathe last week in anticipati

that is embedded in yahoo today.buy yahoo or not is, do you feel that baba will trade at above $190 billion valuation? that's the once to the question. >> yahoo will get a lot of cash as a result of selling its shares in this ipo. do you have faith in marissa meyer she can use that cash well and implement her vision of yahoo? >> i think the company has said publically that they are going to return half the cash to shareholders. >> what about the other half? she'll be able to use that. >> of course. i think she will look for value-creating acquisitions. she certainly staked the future of the company on trying to get more present and mobile, which i think is a good idea. i wish her well in trying to invest that profitably. >> something that doesn't get talked about that often but was just referenced is that two years ago, of course, yahoo under pressure from activists did sell a significant portion of its stake in alibaba at a far lower valuation than we are here two years later. as one of the architects of the origina

what you need to know is that yahoo is a decent proxy for it.ore important the selling you saw all over the place, that's because people can buy stock in the after market. i promise to find it just for i promise to find it just for you right here >> narrator: in this episode of "american greed: the fugitives," flying high with jack utsick. this former pilot's living a $300-million dream. he's one of the top concert promoters in the world. >> jack utsick presents the rolling stones, jack utsick presents madonna, jack utsick presents elton john. it looked legitimate. it looked profitable. >> narrator: but when the securities and exchange commission investigates, utsick dumps his partners and disappears. >> it seemed like we got stuck holding the ball, and he goes off and escapes. >> narrator: and later, don't let his youth deceive you. david kaup is only in his 20s, but he's no child when it comes to running devastating loan and real-estate scams. >> i think he just believes he's superior to everybody else -- no one can touch him. >> narrator: in

yahoo!. think about this. state.already own the >> you can see the confusion. >> there is a lot of confusion. an interesting point. yahoo! currently owns a stake. they will delude themselves to 16%. theyey sell those shares, will have to pay taxes on that. all bob -- alibaba buys yahoo!, they do not have to pay tax. >> my question is, many people have been saying the most valuable thing at yahoo! is there stake in ali baba. alibaba,o! is without what is alibaba want with yahoo!? to sources talking in hong kong, they would say to me, the worst thing that happened to alibaba is that yahoo! invest in it. they do not like yahoo!. there has been a lot of confusion and debate within management that yahoo! was an investor. they want yahoo! out. this is an elegant way of alibaba buying back shares. >> it is an open question as to whether alibaba wants that. the market does not put a particularly high value on it. once alibaba succeeds in going public, what happens to alibaba and orissa meyer? they b

yahoo!e without its big state in -- its big stake in ali baba? ♪ >> you are watching "in the loop " on bloomberg television, streaming on mobile and bloomberg.com. i'm betty liu. is saying first-quarter results beat estimates. brought by a completion of record by back growth. the shipping giant announced plans to raise shipping rates by an average of 4.9 percent in january. sony forecasting a loss of $2 billion this year. the electronics giant widened its loss forecast from $467 million after bringing down the value of its struggling smartphone business. boeing and elon musk spacex will share a nasa contract for a space taxi. the two will help a man spaceman mission and end their dependence on the russian soyuz rocket. the spacecraft will shuttle asked for knots to and from the international space station. we willk hopes one day all head to mars. it is 26 minutes past the hour. equity futures are slightly lower. do not expect a lot of movement ahead of the fed statement at 2:00 p.m. janet ye

i think former aol and yahoo!while they are synergies, it does not solve the fundamental questions about where does yahoo! fit into the internet over the past decade? >> the pressure has not seem to have stopped at all. we have seen up -- ebay caving to the same kind of pressure. can yahoo! stand up to this? >> i don't know. i think they probably have. marissa probably has another couple of quarters to show some sort of life in the business. the core focus has been around alibaba. but she is going to have to be held to a higher standard around that. so i think if something does not happen in terms of improvement in underlying growth, shareholder activists will get louder and could cause some sort of change six or 12 months down the road. >> they just made a lot of money, what can they do with that? can they use that to help the situation? >> they definitely could. they said they will get more than half of it back to investors. if you look at acquisitions in the low single billion dollars, which may seem like a lot

and what are your thoughts on yahoo as well? >> well, there's no reason to own yahoo. we brought it this last time late july. we got rid of all of it on the 16th, i think it was a wednesday, before the ipo, around 42.60. and we started actually buying alibaba yesterday when it got below 90. because why would you own yahoo? the only reason to own it before was because they owned a big slug of alibaba. their core business at yahoo! has been getting worse for a year and a half. and now they've got all this money they can go spend. the only thing you can hope for is maybe you get a tax-free spin. but if you want to own alibaba, just go own alibaba. >> dan, i know you follow tech very closely. we had a huge headline out of oracle last week, so i'm not asking you to talk about the stock where it's going. i'm asking you to sort of -- the larry ellison move, then the two ceos. what do you make of that? i know pete and i talked about a potential for them to break the company up. is that a potential possible? >> yeah, i don't think so. i think that was more to keep both mark and

the same advertising stack that yahoo is interested in. >> now, after alibaba's ipo, yahoo is still going to have a 16% stake in the company which it can't sell for one year. >> thanks so much. we'll be watching yahoo shares certainly especially when alibaba opens tomorrow morning. >> let's bring in simon hams in u.k. and europe. we're seeing some mixed reaction. >> yes. yellen juice bounce. you'll notice grease is still in negative territory. ireland, up 1 1/2 percent. growing analyzed at 7.7%. who know. but the real shocker the fact that ecb only had -- dollars of cheap cash taken nut the first wave of ours it is supposed to pump into businesses. the december offering is probably more important. it is after the bank review and when a lot of other debts become liable. there is a rumor in france it could be downgraded by moody, the government is dee nighing it heard anything. with yields down, who cares. the big issue is the scottish referendum. be aware if you are going to play it through sterling you will get opinion poll, exit polls around 5:00 this afternoon. so sterling could b

>> well, yahoo!he last four years, has always been a story, you know, the core business and what we normally think about yahoo! is really the valuation of the company. in fact, probably at these levels, you know, there's still very little value that's being attached to the core business, so most of the value embedded in the stock prices of alibaba, so as the values, alibaba jump, there should be a corresponding jump in yahoo! shares. >> a lot of expectations, a lot of pressure on this. how do you think this goes, is this going to be as wildly successful an ipo as people expect? we felt the same about facebook. i don't want to paint it with the same brush at this point, but expectations are, obviously, incredibly high for this ipo right now, eric. >> yeah, i think a lot of people, including the bankers, learned a lot from the facebook experience, and i think probably twitter is the model that alibaba uses. [ inaudible question ] a scarcity, feeling out there among investors and get people to support t

yahoo! 250,000 for each day the internet giant refused to comply with official request to hand over communications by accusers, putting the thumb on yahoo! that was back in 2008 and part of the national security agency's attempt to force a lot of tech companies to participate in so-called prism program. such a nice title. yahoo! stock is not getting hit. up $1.29. fox business peter barnes on the case in washington, d.c. because this is a hot-button issue. >> that's right, another rare look between the secret battles over customer data and privacy rights in the wake of the terrorist attacks on 9/11, which we remembered yesterday. when yahoo! said no to a request back in 2007 and 2008. this case got so heated that the justice department threatened to slap yahoo! with a $250,000 a day fine. now in some cases government spy agencies can seek data on americans outside the u.s. without a warrant if they are suspected foreign agents. the tech companies worried the broad sweeps can capture informat

plus there is also something yahoo! can't control, real investors in yahoo! sell yahoo!raise money to buy alibaba, so there's a lot to think about. overall, we need to show you what's happening with the stocks. the major averaging snapped a five-week winning streak last week. dow jones bucking the tricep, it's up 53 -- trend, it's up 53 points, up about 64 at the high. the nasdaq seeing its steepest dr pepper in six weeks. the russell 2000 showing about a percent of a has at 1149, so down about 11 points. s&p 500 just straddling the flatline, so nothing to write home about there. now, many investors are licking their lips over the prospect of a new beer powerhouse. "the wall street journal" saying anheuser-busch inbev is talking about a bid for rival sav miller. this is massive. that's a major merger. any merger that would put the world's two largest brewing companies under one single roof. shares trading higher by about -- that's anheuser-busch, that's a decent move especially when you compare it to the previous session. so it's up $3.63 on that one. shares of miller ro

yahoo!holder. they want the company to explore a combination to unlock value. yahoo! should cut losses and in its display ad business, aol.iscuss a deal with brian, god who just issued a statement. what did they say about star board value? relatively not super aggressive, but definitely address the issue at hand statement out. they said we care about shareholder value, we care about our investors, they reference we will talk to the investors. and then they stood by the plan they have been putting in place since 2012. our products are better, we have brought back shares. they did address with a surprising headline. that there any coincidence this comes but a week after alibaba went public? >> no. a lot of people were expecting this. it laid bare what yo yahoo! is about. they sold some shares, and now we can value what did it really is in the markets. now know that yahoo! will have some sort of timeline of shelling the shares -- selling the shares, so what is that going to be and what is the t

but yahoo! today was second only to apple. 650,000 options. >> i tried to steer you away from yahoo! >> i know but it's incredible to me and i still say undervalued. undervalued at 18 and undervalued at 30. i think the stock deserves 50. >> times now for pops and drops. big mover. the ceo said it cannot keep one the growing customer demand for its product. >> is solar sector on a tear. having a big move back. it's also a stock that's got 30% short entrance. i am long and i am staying long. i think it goes higher. >> still up 3% after rumors google was looking to buy a stake in the company. no talks have taken place. >> it's interesting because when i heard this i didn't really think -- it didn't seem to me to be something that google would do. what was interesting was news came out right at $50. right where the support has been for the last month or so but i think you can shoot against $50 in this one. >> it is selling at a 44% stake. >> but i don't think that necessarily took it down. the whole

yahoo! has been successful.n you look at the way business works, do you see the alibaba guys doing things differently than yahoo!? >> i think that yahoo! and google and other companies in the u.s. are quite focused in the areas that they are in, but such a big are is land grab every company is in everything. for jackie will not be enough for e-commerce. also financial services and search. the ambition of the chinese internet giant has been more. their ambitions will not be limited only to china. i think over the next 10 years globalization will be a huge thing. >> what you expect jack to do and alibaba to do with the money that they make on the ipo? it has been suggested that they could by yahoo! on the balance sheet, they have a plethora of choices. what they have done over the last several months has been interesting. people would argue that it is not focused, but i would disagree. i think they have a plan. that want to be much bigger and china, i know that is hard to imagine. right now they are an e-commerce

yahoo!tnership. that story, next. ♪ >> you are watching "bloomberg west," where we focus on technology and the future of business. there is major news for software companies today. larry ellison stepping down as head of oracle. sap is paying a 20% premium over yesterday's closing price. concur makes software to help manage travel. a quick programming note, be sure to catch my interview with alibaba executive chairman jack ma tomorrow morning live from the new york stock exchange. 9 o'clock a.m. eastern right here on bloomberg television, i cannot wait to talk to him -- have you wonder just how this relationship started? with the initial conversations were like between jack ma and yahoo! founder jerry? hans, i know you know jack ma, you have been intricately involved with many of these chinese companies as they have gone from infancy to gigantic juggernauts. >> they became an investor in 2003, and then they played a role in connecting jack and jerry. i am on a board that has facilitated activ

and yahoo!onfirms it still holds a 15% stake in ali baba after selling 140 million shares in the ipo. in a filing, yahoo! indicates they have a one-your lockup period before it can sell the remaining shares and also agreed to vote for alibaba and softbank. to our lead story, apple is supposed to be shining brightly after its record 10 million iphones in the opening weekend. but the glow is starting to rub off dues to some technical difficulties. today, apple had to pull its ios 8 update after some customers could not make phone calls. this came after reports that apps work washing -- were 7,shing more than with ios and adding to the problems, a number of users complaining the new ones bend when in your pocket. there was this video showing an iphone 6 plus getting very badly bent. joining me is cory johnson and research analyst, and the man behind that viral bending ipod video. lewis, i am going to start with you, because we spoke to you about the iphone 6 plus which did not fare well after the b

bought byd of tumblr, yahoo!. what are you bringing to circa?d you will learn -- you learn their you are applying in the new experience? >> there were many learnings. i spent almost five years at tumblr. we raised five years of funding. we kept the team very small over the course of the time and focused intensely on products, much like a small team. the network emerged, we learned a lot of stuff and had to scale it into significant network. >> i will ask you the same thing, which is what do you see in circa compared to other newsreaders out there from twitter to facebook to google news, linkedin and influencers? why should people use circa? full disclosure, i was one of the early angel investors in circa. i have been closely paying attention every day. jumped and i jumped in about four months ago. they really have done transformative work in form -- in terms of creating news consumption in a mobile futurele and pioneering in following the story feature. how do you see habits changing? how will my news reading habits change in how i want to consu

yahoo! and fining a 250,000 a day, it's raising concerns this is getting too much? >> privacy is a thing of the past quite frankly just from the private sector. look what google has, the information they have on all of us. any time you go into a department store. neil: it's one thing for google but another thing for google to tell them to give it to them. >> there's a process for that, you go to the fisa court, depending the information. neil: it's intimidating. the government said we want this, it's like getting a letter from the irs. >> again, in that sense, these are some of the realities that we're facing these days, again, i don't think it's a huge sacrifice, we're a threat, no question about it, the world has changed, dangerous place and the extent we gave up some of the information, i go along with that. in the context that hey, the rest of the world is getting information on us. privacy is a very difficult thing to hold on to in this day and age. neil: i wonder, and i think you are o

yahoo! investigat yahoo! investors got jealous.ced him out because they wanted google. >> so much to get through. could i throw mine in the hopper as well? >> it's your show. >> inflation expectations. there's never a good place to mention them but the way the commodities have been dropping here, but i wonder, mike, if the fed, wonder if, strong enough growth, decent job growth even, and they still sister to go another qe program to support inflation here. >> that's -- i think it's a long way out before we get to that point. in europe, that's what we're looking at over there because that's global deflation in play all the time. >> that's my homework for the weekend. "fast money" is coming up in a minute with melissa -- i mean, sara, what is on tap? >> filling in. we're going to speak to grasso, who was asked a question by mah on the stock florida. "fast money" starts right now from new york's time square. a very big day on alibaba, opening $92.70 a share. well above the expected pricing, ending up 38% with a market cap

maybe yahoo will be able to monetize a little bit. they're selling fewer shares than they had expected, but at a higher valuation, makes you think there could be a further upside for yahoo down the road. >> yahoo is trading at a levels not seen since 2005 you. say you like yahoo. >> it's going to $50 a share. >> i'm convinced of it. i see is option activities. this story was playing out when it was 28 and $20 a share. no one wanted to embrace it because they said there is no growth in this company. the longer people stare at alibaba, now that it's finally on the cusp of being an ipo and they have pulled back, people are more excited about it. >> there is no growth in this company. but there is no growth in this company. >> i will show you one thing. >> a million dollar investment in jerry yang. >> he gets the credit. >> of course. but there is no growth in this company. when they had this cash pile on their balance sheet, it will not trade. >> i will challenge you with this. if you take away what they've got in al a baba and yahoo jap

yahoo!'ight with the u.s. government, details about protecting customer information and its overreaching surveillance program. that's coming up next on "worldwide exchange." and that became our passion. to always build something better, airplanes that fly cleaner and farther on less fuel. that redefine comfort and connect the world like never before. after all, you can't turn dreams into airplanes unless your passion for innovation is nonstop. ♪ unless your passion for innovatbig day?onstop. ah, the usual. moved some new cars. hauled a bunch of steel. kept the supermarket shelves stocked. made sure everyone got their latest gadgets. what's up for the next shift? ah, nothing much. just keeping the lights on. (laugh) nice. doing the big things that move an economy. see you tomorrow, mac. see you tomorrow, sam. just another day at norfolk southern. >>> welcome back the the white house is set to unveil fresh sanctions against russia. >>> oscar pistorius is found guilty of call punishable homicide