we got a couple new names, natalia veselnitskaya, working with the russian prosecutor general, yury chaikarussian american operative lobbying against russian sanctions, a top priority of the government. even before you get to the russian ambassador who met with all of those people in the trump campaign, all of those other people that i just listed are known now to have met with or communicated with senior people on the trump campaign during the campaign or in the case of sergey gorkov, during the transition. having worked where you have worked and seen what you have seen, is that list normal? is that amount of contact by that list of those types of folks, is that the kind of thing that you would see typically in a u.s. campaign or is that very far out of the norm. >> i would say it's out of the norm in the united states. is that amount of contact by that list of those types of folks, is that the kind of thing that you would see typically in the u.s. political campaign or is that very far out of the norm? >> well, i would say it's very far out of the norm in the united states. i would say i

as you mentioned, the prosecutor general, yury chaika. >> why would -- from your perspective having observeda for all of these years in your professional capacity, why would all of those people be meeting with one political campaign? >> well, they're trying to establish relationships so that they can then influence members of that campaign. sometimes it's through the accumulation of compromising material that can then later be used for blackmail. in other cases, it's through a series of business ties so that some of these individuals will then be sympathetic to the cause that's being espoused by these russians. and there's a whole variety of other tactics that are employed. by the way, viktor medvedchuk is the primary intermediary that putin uses in ukraine, on the ukraine crisis. his daughter -- putin is godfather to his daughter. these are people who are all linked, some of them to the inner circle, to putin himself, and some of them to some of the outer concentric rings around putin. >> one last question for you, mr. carpenter, and i thank you for coming back and doing this longer intervi

this week we got a couple new names, natalia sky ya, working with the russian prosecutor general, yury chaika, a russian american operative lobbying against russian sanctions, a top priority of the government. even bf you get to the rsian ambassador who met with all of those people in the trump campaign, all of those other people that i just listed are known now to have met with or communicated with senior people on the trump campaign during the campaign or in the case of sergey gorkov, during the transition. having worked where you have worked and seen what you have seen, is that list normal? is that amount of contact by that list of those types of folks, is that the kind of thing that you would see typically in a u.s. campaign or is that very far out of the norm. >> i would say it's out of the norm in the united states. i would say it's typical in ukraine or georgia or moldova. i got to say when you read that list of names, the one thing i kind of laughed about when i hear former military intelligence officer, i mentally scratch out the former. i mean, that goes without saying. so a lot of

street journal" reported yesterday that she has a relationship with russia's prosecutor-general, yuri chaika. >> we're talking about different investigative and legal roads for son donald junior and son-in-law, jared kushner, both of them in the room. the camp has said, perhaps they were naive. they didn't realize they should have gone to higher authorities, that's a very tough explanation for anyone to digest. >> right. >> but as you look at them, in legal terms, where might legal jeopardy lie with respect to each. you have to distinguish who is a government employee. and under certain obligations and who is not. so kushner is a government employee. and he has an obligation to be truthful and all the submissions he makes to the government with respect to his security clearances or otherwise. and the absence of this meeting and other meetings on his security application form, the sf-86 form potentially puts him in danger of being charged with being untruthful to a government agent. and that's a five-year felony. trump junior is not a government employee. and so he has no forms to fill out an