and when that show finished, last year he created his own media company, zeteo. in this edition we're going to hear all about the different i worked on thejonathan dimbleby programme, which ran for several years. you know, there was a tradition of long—form, set—piece sunday political interviews in the uk, which we've kind but i was very lucky to work with jonathan dimbleby. what was called "the document", ros. and this came from the peter jay days, even pre—brian walden, where the guest says x, you say y. if the guest says y, you say zed, or zee, as we now say in my new homeland. i also saw you giving an interview when you were launching your new media business when you said, "i like to fight on social media," and that's a direct quote. is it? 0h. does all ofjournalism have to be framed in winning arguments and fighting? no, not at all. not all ofjournalism. journalism that does need to be combative and adversarial and, i think we've allowed politicians, especially where i am, ros, in the united states, to get away with softball that the media has been so soft o

there are right—wing voices in all of those places. or dei for right—wing people at zeteo.question. we don't hide the fact that we are very mission—driven. is an activist. i wasn't saying that. and i didn't mean to say that about you. i'm just saying in general, this debate which you is then thrown around, ros, as a pejorative, right? "you're not a journalist, you're an activist." look, alljournalists have opinions, i'm just open people in public life. guests say genocide. around the language they're using, with reference to some politicians, and also with what's i appreciate it's your view that genocide has been committed. organisations around the world are going to have their own use certain words. yeah. oh, no, 100%. i agree with that. here's what i would say. international human rights lawyers. at international court ofjustice in a plausible way. view it that way and calling it that way yourself those are two different things. media organisations go out of their way to not even report how much coverage did the amnesty international report saying genocide get? that's why