and now joining us on "the communicators" is representative zoe lofgren, democrat of california, who represents several of the big technology companies in her california district. want to talk to her about some pieces of legislation that she's working on. and i want to start with a topic that seems to be gaining a little bit of steam, and that's cell phone unblocking. >> guest: yes. >> host: what are you working on? >> guest: well, i have the cell phone unlocking bill that, basically, amends section 12 to 01 of the digital millennium copyright act that allows, weirdly enough, the registrar of copyrights to control technology relative to alleged copyright. i think most americans were really surprised when the library decided that they couldn't unlock the cell phone that they owned without going to their carrier. that's really not, it's not right, it doesn't respect property rights and, in fact, there's really no copyright involved. it's just a way for monopolies to exert their monopoly control in, after somebody has purchased a piece of equipment. if they want to enforce their contrac

it is a bipartisan bill, introduced by zoe lofgren and representative sensen brrvetion. proposals currently being considered by the house, we think there's strong support in the senate. there's a piece of aaron's law that was actually in a separate bill that was passed by the senate a couple of years ago by the senate judiciary committee. so the bill is i think fairly modest. it frankly doesn't go as far as i would like but it would make a huge step forward in terms of bringing the law into kind of what ordinary people would think ought to be illegal and not. and most importantly will really take the penalty scheme and make it a little less crazy. one of the problems that people have is that the law is really disproportionate in its penalties. >> you know i cannot help but think about the edward snowden disclosures and what that's taught us about the nsa and the kind of gathering there is. and i look at this sort of legislation and i wonder are we looking at the wrong side of the ledger? >> in what way? >> well, just in this, in this environment where the checks and bala

one bill introduced by zoe lofgren of california. >> aaron was arrested in january of 2011 but he was dieted on four and then they under it to 13 felony accounts. >> schwartz was charged under the cfaa for using an unauthorized computer downloading unauthorized articles. the government alleged he intented to distribute the articles to the public. >> then they upped the number of counts he was indicted on. he could have been in jail since until he was 76. the last time i saw aaron was the wednesday before he died on that friday. i got an instant message from terin. she said i'm really worried about aaron which was something she didn't usually say. >> later that evening, ben's phone rang. >> i got the call from her like 7:06. it was like the world fell apart. >> aaron are schwartz's suicide which many attribute to government prosecution, rocked the online community and created pressure on members of congress. >> we still need to pass aaron's law to stop this from happening. right now if this ends leer, you know, the system beat aaron in a way. we need to change the system now. >> for no

nd a champion of our laboratories, zoe lofgren. she's been a champion for our national laboratories, particularly for livermore and s sk andia, even though they're not in her district, i appreciate her support and know that she and i share a goal a succeedment e will yield do ms. lofgren. ms. lofgren: as my friend and colleague, representative swalwell, pointed out, the government shutdown is causing serious damage to our country. the shutdown is putting americans out of work and hurting the economy. not only the jobs of federal employees but the thousands of small businesses who provide fwoods an services to the government and government employee whors not spending money that they no longer are getting in paychecks. this harm is being felt across the country by millions of people, the closures impact thousands of people. we know the small business administration is not lending to the tune of $1 billion a month. federal business statistics are not being released, leaving us essentially flying behind when it comes to how the economy

zoe lofgren, thanks for your time. >> thank you. >>> immigration also the topic of today's big question. does immigration reform have any hope on the hill? weigh in on twitter and facebook. the conversation is always going there. i want to bring in karen finney, host of the msnbc show "disrupt with karen finny. " karen, good morning. >> good morning. >> we get the cook political report saying the shutdown and the debt crisis has made 14 house seats shift toward the democrats. do you think the democrats now have a viable shot at taking back the house over the shutdown? >> i do. >> we heard from the congresswoman there. they control the agenda. >> i do, but here's the thing, having -- thomas, as you know, i was at the dnc during the '05-06 cycle. the key is not just the level of dissatisfaction with republicans. that's important. but to get people to really make that change, you've got to make an argument about why what your vision is better than what they're offering. so what i think the democrats have is a brilliant opportunity to say that they're dysfunctional. that republicans cannot

>> i think zoe lofgren hit it on the market. there are conversations that if you were to hear them would be you to conclude there is bipartisan support for getting this done and i think just as we see with this situation with the shutdown of government we all have to figure out how to get to the point we feel comfortable. in the case of the republican leadership john boehner and the republican leaders in the house have to figure out a way to navigate this to bring along a sufficient number of republicans and keeps sufficient number of democrats to make this bipartisan. there is a tipping point. it becomes very difficult politically to sell the bill if it goes too far in one direction and the difficulty when you are in leadership is you have to figure out how to navigate this for your own party that you got elected to the speaker as a result of the that the same time you are speaker for the entire body so you have to reach across the aisle to the other side so i think the speaker has the toughest task of all of us. he has to figu

leadership in house of representatives and the decisions they make, but when xavier becerra and zoe lofgrenand i needed up partner, nancy pelosi made a wonderful decision. they brought somebody who wins among the eight, the nicest guy in the room and he is the one that really was glued to the group. thank you so much, please welcome a congressman from kentucky. [applause] >> i also brought the burden to the committee and i was pretty much the only one who drank it. it is an honor to be here with you and an honor to be here as mario mentioned, an honor to be part of this group, it is one of the most productive experiences in my seven years in the house and it has proven that we actually can come to agreement and make policy the way every american would expect it to be made which is you give and take and if you do it that way, lose these people, have it this way, i can work with that may be. as normal human interaction and again, the process did engender a great deal of trust. everybody asked me why in the world i am part of this group. kentucky is a border state. that was during the civil wa