>> WE HAVE A GREAT PHOTOGRAPHER,
AND IF YOU WANT TO TAKE SOME OF
YOUR OWN WITH YOUR OWN CAMERA,
THAT'S PERFECTLY ALL RIGHT,
OKAY?
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
[APPLAUSE]
>> WE CONTINUE OUR PROGRAMS ON
THE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES WITH
A ROUND TABLE DISCUSSION
FEATURING MARC FISHER AND
MICHAEL KRANISH ON THEIR BOOK,
"TRUMP REVEALED."
[INAUDIBLE CONVERSATIONS]
>> WHY DON'T WE GET STARTED.
MY NAME IS MARTY PAIR ON, I'M
THE -- BARON, I'M THE EXECUTIVE
EDITOR OF "THE WASHINGTON POST",
AND WE'RE REALLY DELIGHTED ALL
OF YOU CAME OUT THIS EVENING TO
THE POST.
WE'RE HAPPY TO WELCOME YOU HERE.
TONIGHT YOU'RE GOING TO GET THE
CHANCE TO MEET SOME OF THE
JOURNALISTS AND THE EDITORS
BEHIND THE POST'S BOOK "TRUMP REVEALED."
AS YOU KNOW.
THIS WAS AN EXHAUSTIVELY
RESEARCHED BOOK ABOUT THE LIFE
AND THE CAREER OF DONALD TRUMP.
YOU KNOW, THE POST HAS A LONG
TRADITION OF DELVING DEEPLY INTO
THE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEES OF
EACH MAJOR PARTY.
AND THIS YEAR GIVEN DONALD
TRUMP'S, SHALL WE SAY, NOVEL AND
OVERSIZED PRESENCE IN THE
POLITICAL ARENA, THERE WAS AN
OPPORTUNITY TO DO A BOOK.
AND WE WERE HAPPY TO SEIZE THAT
OPPORTUNITY.
AND WE'RE ESPECIALLY GRATEFUL TO
SCRIVENER, SO WE'RE HERE, ALL
THESE FOLKS WHO JUST CAME IN
JUST ON TIME FOR MAKING THAT
POSSIBLE.
I'M NOT GOING TO MENTION ALL OF
THEM, BUT I DO WANT TO MENTION
THAT WE HAVE PUBLISHER NAN
GRAHAM.
RAISE YOUR HAND, NAN.
THERE WE GO.
[APPLAUSE]
AND WE HAVE EDITOR-IN-CHIEF
COLIN HARRISON HERE.
THANK YOU FOR --
[APPLAUSE]
ALL YOU DID.
THEY WORKED INCRED WRITE FAST
AND INCREDIBLY HARD AND WITH
IMPRESSIVE SKILL THROUGHOUT, AND
WE'RE VERY GRATEFUL.
FROM THE POST THERE WERE TWO
DOZEN JOURNALISTS WHO WORKED ON
THIS BOOK.
THEY NEEDED TO BOTH WORK QUICKLY
AND TO GO VERY, VERY DEEP.
AND THAT'S WHY WE DEPLOYED SUCH
A LARGE TEAM.
SCOTT WILSON, OUR NATIONAL
EDITOR WHO, UNFORTUNATELY, COULD
NOT BE HERE THIS EVENING,
ASSEMBLED THAT TEAM DRAWING FROM
THROUGHOUT OUR NEWSROOM, FROM
EVERY DEPARTMENT IN OUR NEWSROOM.
AND ALL THIS CAME TOGETHER IN A
MATTER OF MONTHS.
THIS EVENING YOU'LL THAT HEAR
FROM FIVE OF PEOPLE WHO WORKED
ON THIS BOOK, AND, YOU KNOW,
WITH THE CO-AUTHORS WERE MICHAEL
KRANISH WHO IS HERE AND MARC
FISHER RIGHT BEHIND ME, AND I'LL
TRY TO STEP AWAY, THEY WERE THE
PRIMARY AUTHORS OF "TRUMP
REVEALED," BUT EVERYONE, THIS
ENTIRE TEAM, CONTRIBUTED TO IT.
AND THIS REPRESENTS A
COMPREHENSIVE EXAMINATION OF
DONALD TRUMP'S LIFE, HIS
PERSONAL I, HIS BUSINESS
DEALINGS AND HIS LONG-RUNNING
ENCOUNTERS WITH POLITICIANS AND
POLITICS.
WE BELIEVE THIS IS THE KIND OF
IN-DEPTH REPORTING THAT READERS
EXPECT FROM THE POST.
AND WITH THAT, IT'S A SPECIAL
PLEASURE FOR ME TO INTRODUCE
TONIGHT'S MODERATOR AND ONE OF
THE CO-AUTHORS OF THE BOOK,
"TRUMP REVEALED," SENIOR EDITOR
MARC FISHER.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THANK YOU, MARTY, AND AND
THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING OUT.
IT'S GREAT TO SEE SUCH A BIG CROWD.
I THINK I UNDERSTAND WHY SO MANY
OF YOU ARE HERE.
THERE'S ONE THING THAT AMERICANS
CAN'T JUST SEEM TO FIND ENOUGH
OF THESE DAYS, IT'S INFORMATION
ABOUT DONALD TRUMP.
[LAUGHTER]
BUT ACTUALLY, THAT'S KIND OF
TRUE BECAUSE HE IS THE FIRST
MAJOR PARTY CANDIDATE IN 60
YEARS, SINCE DWIGHT EISENHOWER,
WHO HAS NOT PREVIOUSLY HELD
ELECTIVE OFFICE, AND THAT MEANS
HE HAS NOT BEEN VETTED IN THE
WAY MOST POLITICIANS ARE AS A
MATTER OF COURSE AS THEY RUN FOR
VARIOUS OFFICES.
SO, OBVIOUSLY, HE'S HAD
CELEBRITY FOR DECADES, AND
CELEBRITY IS ACTUALLY A VERY
DIFFERENT KIND OF ATTENTION FROM
HAVING YOUR LIFE AND CAREER AND
BACKGROUND RIGOROUSLY EXAMINED
IN THE WAY THAT WOULD HELP
VOTERS UNDERSTAND HOW YOU THINK,
HOW YOU MAKE DECISIONS AND WHAT
YOU REALLY BELIEVE IN.
AS MICHAEL AND I HAVE BEEN
MAKING THE ROUNDS ON TV AND
RADIO APPEARANCES IN PROMOTION
OF THIS BOOK, WE'VE FOUND THAT
THE SINGLE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY TO
SELL THIS BOOK WAS ONE SINGLE
TWEET FROM A GUY NAMED DONALD J.
TRUMP OF JAMAICA ESTATES, NEW
YORK. THE NIGHT BEFORE THE BOOK WAS
ACTUALLY RELEASED -- SO HE
COULDN'T HAVE POSSIBLY SEEN
IT -- HE PUT OUT A TWEET SAYING,
CALLING THE BOOK A HIT JOB AND
SAYING THAT IT WAS BORING AND
SHOULDN'T BUY IT.
[LAUGHTER]
AND, OF COURSE, OUR NUMBERS WENT
SOARING AFTER THAT. SO WE'RE TREMENDOUSLY GRATEFUL
TO HIM -- [LAUGHTER]
SINCE HE INCOMED 11 MILLION --
INFORMED 11 MILLION OF HIS
CLOSEST FRIENDS ABOUT THE BOOK.
BUT WHAT WAS FASCINATING ABOUT
THAT WAS THAT HE, OBVIOUSLY,
COULDN'T HELP HIMSELF.
ANY RATIONAL CAMPAIGN ADVISER
WOULD HAVE TOLD HIM, JUST IGNORE
THE THING.
BUT HE COULDN'T HELP HIMSELF,
AND SO HE DID THIS.
AND IT WAS ALSO -- SO THIS WAS
CONFIRMATION OF A MAJOR THEME IN
THE BOOK WHICH IS THAT THIS IS A
MAN WHO DEEPLY BELIEVES THAT THE
PROPER RESPONSE, THE ONLY PROPER
RESPONSE TO ANYTHING THAT COULD
BE AT ALL CRITICAL IS TO ATTACK
AND TO ATTACK HARD.
AND WE TRACE IN THE BOOK THE
DERIVATION OF THAT
CHARACTERISTIC OF DONALD TRUMP
WHICH TRACES NOT ONLY TO HIS
CHILDHOOD AND HAVING A FATHER
WHO TAUGHT HIM TO BE A KILLER
AND WARNED HIM AGAINST BEING A
NOTHING, BUT ALSO TO HIS
RELATIONSHIP WITH ROY COHN, THE
INFAMOUS NEW YORK ATTORNEY WHO
WAS KIND OF HIS MENTOR IN HIS
20s WHEN HE WAS JUST STARTING
OUT ON HIS OWN IN BUSINESS.
MARTY MENTIONED THE ORIGINS OF
THIS BOOK, BUT I WANT TO GIVE
YOU A LITTLE MORE ON THAT BEFORE
WE GET GOING WITH THE
DISCUSSION.
THIS BOOK CAME TOGETHER IN LATE
MARCH, SO IF YOU RECALL BACK TO
THE PRIMARY SEASON, IT WAS
REALLY ONLY AROUND THAT TIME
THAT IT BECAME VERY CLEAR THAT
DONALD TRUMP WAS THE LIKELY NOMINEE.
AND SO AT THAT POINT, THIS TEAM
OF MORE THAN 20 REPORTERS WAS
PUT TOGETHER.
AND THE DEAL THAT WE STRUCK WITH
SCRIBNER, I THINK, CAME TO --
WAS FINALLY SIGNED ON A
THURSDAY.
AND THE PLAN WAS TO ANNOUNCE
THIS TO THE PUBLIC THE FOLLOWING
MONDAY.
SO THE NEXT DAY, FRIDAY, I
CALLED HOPE HICKS WHO WAS DONALD
TRUMP'S PRESS SECRETARY AS A
COURT I TO LET HER -- COURTESY
TO LET HER KNOW THAT THIS WOULD
BE ANNOUNCED ON THE FOLLOWING
MONDAY AND ALSO TO ASK HER, WE
WANTED TO HAVE A SERIES OF
INTERVIEWS WITH DONALD TRUMP.
WE WANTED TO GET AS MUCH OF HIS
TIME AS WE COULD BECAUSE
ALTHOUGH WE HAD THIS LARGE TEAM
OF REPORTERS WHO WOULD BE
DIGGING INTO EVERY ASPECT OF
TRUMP'S LIFE, LOOKING AT
RECORDS, DOCUMENTS, TALKING TO
EVERYONE FROM HIS FRIENDS AND
CLASSMATES AND NEIGHBORS AS HE
GREW UP ALL THE WAY THROUGH HIS
BUSINESS ASSOCIATES, PARTNERS,
COMPETITORS, VENDORS,
CONTRACTORS AND SO ON.
AND WE WANTED AS MUCH TIME AS WE
COULD GET WITH HIM.
SO I EXPLAINED THE DEAL THAT
WE'D MADE AND BOOK THAT WE'D BE
DOING AND HOW A LOT OF REPORTERS
WOULD BE CALLING THEM, AND
BEFORE I COULD GET THE FULL
EXPLANATION OUT HOPE HICKS SAID
YOU ARE PROFITEERING OFF
MR. TRUMP -- [LAUGHTER]
WHICH WAS KIND OF CURIOUS GIVEN
THAT HE SPENDS A GOOD CHUNK OF
HIS DAY TALKING TO REPORTERS,
NEARLY ALL OF THEM FROM
PROFIT-MAKING INSTITUTIONS, OR
IDEALLY PROFIT-MAKING
INSTITUTIONS.
[LAUGHTER] AND SHE WAS NOT OPEN TO THAT
LINE OF REASONING, AND SHE CUT
OFF THE CONVERSATION AND SAID WE
WILL NOT BE COOPERATING WITH
THIS BOOK. YOU'RE ON YOUR OWN.
AND SO WE HAD THOUGHT, WELL,
THAT WAS A FAIRLY LIKELY OUTCOME
ANYWAY.
THAT DIDN'T REALLY AFFECT OUR
PLAN FOR HOW TO REPORT OUT THIS BOOK.
BUT THEN, LO AND BEHOLD, THE
FOLLOWING MONDAY SHE CALLED BACK
AND SAID THAT SHE HAD HAD A
CHANCE TO, AS SHE PUT IT, TELL
MR. TRUMP ABOUT YOUR FABULOUS IDEA.
[LAUGHTER]
AND SHE SAID THAT HE ACTUALLY
LIKED THE IDEA AND THAT HE
WANTED US TO COME UP TO TRUMP
TOWER AS OFTEN AS WE LIKED FOR
AS LONG AS WE LIKED BECAUSE HE
WANTED THIS BOOK TO BE FAIR AND
ACCURATE, AND HE WANTED TO GET
THE REAL STORY OUT ABOUT HIS
LIFE.
SO ONE INTERESTING CURIOSITY
THERE WAS THAT HIS OWN PRESS
SECRETARY WHO'D WORKED WITH HIM
FOR A NUMBER OF MONTHS DIDN'T
REALIZE THAT HE WOULD VERY MUCH
LIKE THE OPPORTUNITY TO TALK
ABOUT HIS FAVORITE SUBJECT,
HIMSELF.
[LAUGHTER]
BUT, INDEED, AS WE TALKED TO
TRUMP IN THE WEEKS THAT
FOLLOWED, HE REGULARLY EXTENDED
OUR INTERVIEW TIME, DOUBLED AND
TRIPLED THE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT
HE PENT WITH US.
HE -- HE SPENT WITH US.
HE TOOK ALL QUESTIONS.
SOME OF THEM HE ANSWERED IN MORE
DETAIL THAN OTHERS BUT HE,
INDEED, HAD US BACK TIME AND AGAIN.
HE SPOKE WITH A NUMBER OF THE
REPORTERS IN THE FRONT ROW HERE
TONIGHT ON PHONE AND IN PERSON
AS THEY WENT INTO GREATER DEPTH
ON TOPICS THEY WERE DIGGING INTO.
WE HAD PEOPLE WORKING ON THIS
BOOK WHO WERE EXPERTS IN
REPORTING ON ATLANTIC CITY, ON
FINANCES, ON CASINO GAMING, ON
ORGANIZED CRIME CONNECTIONS.
WE HAD PEOPLE WHO LOOKED INTO
HIS BRIEF EXPERIENCE AS A SPORTS
FRANCHISE OWNER IN THE U.S. FOOTBALL LEAGUE.
AND SO ON ALL THROUGH EVERY
CHAPTER OF HIS LIFE.
AND ONE OF OUR GOALS HERE,
THEREFORE, WAS THAT KIND OF
COMPLETENESS AND ANOTHER WAS
TRANSPARENCY.
WE KNOW AND WE DOCUMENT IN THE
BOOK THAT DONALD TRUMP IS A
HIGHLY LITIGIOUS PERP.
IN FACT, HE -- PERSON.
IN FACT, HE HAS SUED THE AUTHOR
OF A PREVIOUS BIOGRAPHY FOR $5 BILLION --
[LAUGHTER]
AND WE ASKED HIM, MICHAEL AND I
HAD A CERTAIN CURIOSITY ABOUT
THAT WHEN WE WERE TALKING WITH
TRUMP, SO WE ASKED HIM ABOUT
THAT CASE, AND HE SAID THAT HE'D
ACTUALLY NEVER READ THE BOOK.
[LAUGHTER]
SO I WAS KIND OF PUZZLED BY
THAT.
I SAID, WELL, HOW DO YOU GO
ABOUT SUING SOMEBODY FOR $5
BILLION WHEN YOU'VE ACTUALLY
NEVER READ THE BOOK, AND HE
SAID, WELL, YOU COULD PROBABLY
SAY THIS ALONG WITH ME, PEOPLE
TOLD ME IT WAS A BAD BOOK.
[LAUGHTER]
THE CLASSIC TRUMPISM.
AND HE DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING
UNTOWARD ABOUT THAT.
HE WAS VERY GRACIOUS WITH HIS
TIME, VERY OPEN TO ANSWERING
QUESTIONS, AND YET EVERY ONCE IN
A WHILE HE WOULD SLIP P IN A
THREAT ABOUT HOW IF IT WAS A BAD
BOOK, AS HE PUT IT, HE WOULD
COME AFTER US, AND HE WOULD COME
AFTER THE POST.
SO THERE WAS THIS KIND OF
ALTERNATING GRACIOUS BENESS AND
TENSION -- GRACIOUSNESS AND
TENSION THROUGH THE WHOLE
RELATIONSHIP THAT WE HAD WITH HIM.
AND KIND OF BINARY APPROACH
WHERE IT'S EITHER A GOOD BOOK OR
A BAD BOOK, THAT'S SOMETHING
THAT'S ALSO SHOT THROUGH THE
BOOK, SHOT THROUGH HIS LIFE.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT MAKES HIM
DECIDE WHETHER A BOOK OR AN
ARTICLE IS GOOD OR BAD IS
WHETHER IT QUESTIONS THE EXTENT
OF HIS WEALTH.
AND THIS IS --
[LAUGHTER]
THIS IS, WE HAVE SEVERAL
ANECDOTES IN THE BOOK ABOUT HIS
SENSITIVITY TO THAT QUESTION.
WHEN HE SUED THE TIMOTHY
O'BRIEN, THE AUTHOR OF THE OTHER
BIOGRAPHY, TRUMP LOST TWICE MANY
THAT LAWSUIT -- IN THAT LAWSUIT,
AND WHAT TRIGGERED THE LAWSUIT
WAS, INDEED, A CHAPTER
QUESTIONING WHETHER DONALD TRUMP
IS AS WEALTHY AS HE CLAIMS TO
BE.
AND IF YOU'D BEEN WATCHING THE
CAMPAIGN CLOSELY, YOU'D KNOW
THAT THE NUMBER HE GIVES FOR HIS
WEALTH VARIES A LOT.
HE SOMETIMES SAYS 9 BILLION, 10
BILLION, $12 BILLION.
AND WE DON'T HAVE ANY WAY OF
GIVING YOU A DEFINITIVE NUMBER
OF WHAT HE'S REALLY WORTH
BECAUSE HE HASN'T RELEASED HIS
TAX RETURNS.
BUT WE DO HAVE WAYS OF COMING TO
THE CONCLUSION THAT HE'S
PROBABLY NOT WORTH NEARLY AS
MUCH AS HE SAYS HE IS.
IN FACT, A JUDGE IN THAT LIBEL
CASE CAME TO EXACTLY THAT
CONCLUSION IN ALMOST THOSE EXACT
WORDS.
AND, IN FACT, IN A DEPOSITION IN
THAT CASE WHICH WE HAVE AS PART
OF THE ARCHIVE THAT BACKS UP
THIS BOOK, TRUMP WAS ASKED
DIRECTLY HOW DO YOU COME UP WITH
THIS NUMBER THAT YOU BANDY ABOUT
ABOUT HOW MUCH YOU'RE WORTH.
AND HE SAID, QUOTE: IT DEPENDS
ON HOW I FEEL ON A GIVEN DAY.
[LAUGHTER]
NOW, THERE'S ACTUALLY SOMETHING
LEGITIMATE ABOUT THAT BECAUSE
HIS BRAND IS HIS NAME, AND HIS
NAME IS WHAT GIVES VALUE TO MANY
OF HIS PROPERTIES AND OTHER
BUSINESSES, AND SO PEOPLE DECIDE
TO STAY AT A TRUMP HOTEL OR GO
TO A TRUMP GOLF COURSE IN PART BECAUSE OF THAT NAME.
SO THERE'S A CLEAR VALUE TO IT.
AND PUTTING A NUMBER TO THAT
VALUE IS MORE AN ART THAN A
SCIENCE.
BUT HOW HE ASSESSES HIMSELF IS
HE TAKES THE ACTUAL ASSESSED
VALUE OF PROPERTIES THAT ANYONE
CAN LOOK UP ON THE TAX ROLLS,
AND HE ADDS THE VALUE THAT HE
CONNECTS FROM HIS NAME, HIS
REPUTATION AND HIS BRAND.
SO HE IS A TRICKY FIGURE TO
WRITE ABOUT IN THAT SENSE.
IN FACT, WHEN HE WAS -- COMEDY
CENTRAL, THE CABLE CHANNEL, WAS
GOING TO DO A ROAST OF DONALD
TRUMP SOME YEARS BACK, AND THE
DIRECTIONS WENT OUT TO THE
COMEDIANS WHO WERE GOING TO BE
ROASTING HIM THAT, UNLIKE MOST
OF THESE ROASTS, HIS FAMILY IS FAIR GAME.
YOU CAN JOKE ABOUT HIS KIDS, YOU
CAN JOKE ABOUT HIS BACKGROUND,
ANY OF THAT IS TOTALLY FAIR.
ONLY ONE THING THE COMEDIANS
WERE TOLD THEY MAY NOT JOKE
ABOUT, AND THAT WAS THE EXTEND
OF HIS WEALTH.
EXTENT OF HIS WEALTH.
[LAUGHTER]
SO HE'S A TRICKY CHARACTER TO
WRITE ABOUT.
BUT WE DID HAVE THIS GREAT TEAM
OF FOLKS WHO YOU'RE GOING TO
HEAR FROM TONIGHT AND WANT TO
TURN OVER TO MICHAEL KCANISH --
KRANISH, MY CO-WRITER, WHO WILL
GIVE YOU A COUPLE EXAMPLES OF
THE THINGS THAT MADE DONALD
TRUMP WHAT HE IS TODAY.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THANK YOU, MARC.
THANK EVERYBODY FOR COMING OUT
HERE.
IT'S A GREAT HONOR TO BE PART OF
THIS PROJECT.
I DON'T KNOW IF THE POST FOLKS
KNOW THIS, BUT WHEN I WAS
GROWING UP IN D.C., I WAS A
WASHINGTON POST PAPER BOY FOR
ABOUT FIVE YEARS.
[LAUGHTER]
THE INK HAS NOT WORN OFF, AND
I'M PROUD TO BE WORKING ON THIS PROJECT.
WE DO FANTASTIC STORIES AND
BIOGRAPHY IS SORT OF THE THREAD
OF ALL OF THOSE STORIES THAT WE
TRY TO PUT TOGETHER.
BECAUSE IN THE CASE OF DONALD
TRUMP, YOU HAVE A MAN WHO HAS
NEVER RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE OR
HELD PUBLIC OFFICE, SO THERE'S
AN AWFUL LOT THAT WE DON'T KNOW
ABOUT HIM EVEN THOUGH HE'S ONE
OF THE MOST COVERED FIGURES OF
OUR GENERATION.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT A PERP'S
LIFE -- AT A PERSON'S LIFE, HOW
THEY'VE DEALT WITH CRISIS, THAT,
TO ME, IS ONE OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT THINGS.
SOMEONE WHO HAS DEALT WITH DARK
MOMENTS IN THEIR LIFE, AND AND
CERTAINLY DONALD TRUMP FITS THAT
CATEGORY VERY WELL.
I WANT TO TAKE YOU TO OCTOBER
10, 1989, IN ATLANTIC CITY.
IT'S A BRIGHT, SUNNY DAY, AND
THREE OF DONALD TRUMP'S TOP
CASINO EXECUTIVES -- HE'S GOT
TWO AT THIS MOMENT, AND HE'S
ABOUT TO OPEN TAJ MAHAL.
AND THESE THREE EXECUTIVES ARE
ABOUT TO THE TAKE A HELICOPTER
RIDE TO NEW YORK CITY TO MEET
WITH DONALD TRUMP AND TO PROMOTE
A BOXING MATCH TO BE HELD AT ONE
OF HIS CASINOS.
SO THE THREE MEN GET ONBOARD A
SIKORSKY HELICOPTER AND HAVE A
PRESS CONFERENCE AT THE PLAZA
HOTEL IN NEW YORK.
THEY MEET WITH DONALD TRUMP AT
TRUMP TOWER ON THE 26TH FLOOR,
AND THE MEETING GOES A LITTLE
BIT LONG, AND THEY CAN NO LONGER
TAKE THE SIKORSKY BACK TO
ATLANTIC CITY, SO IS THEY BOOK A
CHARTER FLIGHT, AND THEY TAKE AN
ITALIAN-MADE AUGUSTA HELICOPTER.
THEY BOARD THE HELICOPTER, AND A
FEW MINUTES INTO THE FLIGHT
THEY'RE OVER THE GARDEN STATE
PARKWAY, AND WHAT THEY COULDN'T
HAVE KNOWN IS THERE WAS A SMALL
SCRATCH ON ONE OF THE ROTOR
BLADES, AND AT 2200 FEET THAT
HELICOPTER BASICALLY BURST
APART, AND THE THREE MEN AND THE
TWO CREW ARE KILLED, AND IT IS
ONE OF THE MOST TRAGIC DAYS IN
DONALD TRUMP'S LIFE AND,
CERTAINLY, FOR THE PEOPLE WHO
WERE KILLED IN THAT TRAGEDY.
AND FOR DONALD TRUMP, I ASKED
HIM ABOUT THIS, WE HAD A
SEPARATE INTERVIEW WHERE I
TALKED TO HIM EXTENSIVELY ABOUT
THIS INCIDENT, AND HE DOES SAY
ASIDE FROM THE DEATHS OF HIS
PARENTS AND HIS BROTHER, FRED
JR., THIS WAS THE MOST DIFFICULT
DAY OF HIS LIFE.
BECAUSE THESE MEN WERE IN CHARGE
OF MAKING SURE HE WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL.
HE HAD BUILT TRUMP TOWER IN NEW
YORK CITY, AND HE WAS TAKING A
BIG GAMBLE IN ATLANTIC CITY.
AT THAT TIME, THIS WAS THE ONLY
LEGAL CASINO OPERATION ON THE
EAST COAST, AND DONALD TRUMP
WANTED TO BE THE BIGGEST AND
BEST OPERATOR.
SO HE HAD TWO CASINOS, WAS ABOUT
TO OPEN A THIRD, AND SUDDENLY
THE PEOPLE IN CHARGE OF THAT HAD PERISHED.
DONALD TRUMP HAD NOT REALLY
FOCUSED HIMSELF ON THAT BUSINESS.
IN FACT, AT THE TIME HE WAS
HAVING AN AFFAIR WITH MARLA
MAPLES, AND AS HE SAID IN
INTERVIEWS FOR THIS BOOK, HE HAD
TAKEN HIS EYE OFF THE BALL.
AND SUDDENLY HE REALIZED THAT HE
WAS IN DEEP, DEEP TROUBLE.
SO THERE WAS ONE PERSON HE GOT A
PHONE CALL FROM SHORTLY AFTER
THE ACCIDENT, THAT MAN'S NAME
WAS JOHN O'DONNELL, AND
O'DONNELL WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE
BEEN ON THE HELICOPTER, BUT
INSTEAD HE WAS IN HAWAII
COMPETING IN AN ATHLETIC EVENT,
AND HE'D SENT A JUNIOR
EXECUTIVE.
HE BASICALLY HAD NOW ALL THIS
OPERATION ON HIS SHOULDERS, AND
DONALD TRUMP MET WITH HIM WHEN
HE CAME BACK FROM HAWAII, AND HE
SAID NOW IT'S YOUR TURN, AND
THEN HE SAID DON'T LEAVE ME.
AND O'DONNELL LATER SAID THAT
THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME HE'D
SEEN SUCH FEAR AND UNCERTAINTY
IN DONALD TRUMP'S EYES AND IN HIS VOICE.
AND LONG STORY SHORT, BECAUSE I
WANT TO GIVE EVERYBODY A CHANCE
TO TALK AND QUESTION, SO FORTH,
WHAT HAPPENED NEXT WAS THAT
THINGS HAD GOTTEN SO BAD, DONALD
TRUMP HAD GONE SO DEEPLY IN DEBT
THAT THERE WERE GREAT, GREAT
PROBLEMS DESPITE THE PUBLIC
ACCLAIM FOR THE OPENING OF THE
TAJ MAHAL.
AND PRETTY SOON ALL THREE
CASINOS WENT INTO BANKRUPTCY,
AND THERE WERE THREE OTHER
CORPORATE BANKRUPTCIES, AND A
LOT OF PEOPLE WERE FIRED.
DONALD TRUMP SAID SOMEBODY WHO
WAS RUNNING THE CASINO HAD A
TYPE C PERSONALITY, AND HE BLAMED OTHERS.
BUT AS I MENTIONED, HE ALSO TOLD
US HE'D TAKEN HIS EYE OFF THE BALL.
WE TELL THE STORY ABOUT HOW HE
MANAGED TO SURVIVE THE NADIR OF
HIS CAREER IN ATLANTIC CITY.
HE BASICALLY HAD TO LOOK OUT FOR
HIMSELF, AND AS HE TOLD US, I
WAS LOOKING OUT FOR DONALD
TRUMP.
I NEEDED TO SURVIVE, AND THAT'S
WHAT MATTERED AT THE MOMENT.
AND BE HE DID SURVIVE.
SO WITH THAT STORY, YOU
UNDERSTAND WHY THOSE WHO
UNDERSTAND ESTIMATED HIM WOULD
DO SO AT THEIR PERIL.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
MS. .
>> SO WE'LL TURN TO SOME OF THE
OTHER REPORTERS.
BOB O'HARA WAS A REPORTER IN THE
POST INVESTIGATIONS UNIT, AND HE
DID SOME OF THE VERY DIFFICULT
DOCUMENT WORK ON THIS BOOK AS
WELL AS FINDING SOME PEOPLE WHO
WERE WILLING TO TALK ABOUT THAT
PERIOD THAT MICHAEL WAS JUST
TALKING ABOUT IN ATLANTIC CITY,
SOME VERY ROUGH TIME IFS FOR
DONALD TRUMP. -- TIMES FOR
DONALD TRUMP.
AND, BOB, YOU LEARNED A LOT
ABOUT TRUMP'S BUSINESS STYLE AND
ABOUT THE KIND OF CHARACTERS HE
WAS WILLING TO ASSOCIATE HIMSELF
WITH IN ORDER TO GET A START IN
THE VERY ROUGH AND TUMBLE OF
ATLANTIC CITY'S CASINO WORLD.
TALK TO US A LITTLE ABOUT THAT.
>> IT'S ACTUALLY REMARKABLE
BECAUSE IT WAS A LONG TIME AGO,
BUT IT FEELS VERY FRESH.
I THINK PREDICTIVE IN SOME WAYS
ABOUT THE TYPE OF PERSONALITY
THAT HE IS.
PROBABLY THE MOST FORMIDABLE
CHARACTER THAT HE CONNECTED
HIMSELF WITH WAS ROY COHN.
AND IF PEOPLE DON'T REMEMBER ROY
COHN, HE'S WORTH LOOKING INTO.
HE WAS BRAINS BEHIND THE
McCARTHY HEARINGS IN THE
'50s, AND HE WAS A BRILLIANT,
SOMETHING OF A PRODIGY AS A
YOUNG MAN AND WAS PRETTY MUCH A
SAVAGE LEGAL MIND WHO FOCUSED ON
ATTACKING AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE
AND NEVER APOLOGIZING.
AND HE RAN INTO TRUMP IN THE
EARLY '70s, AND TRUMP EMBRACED
HIM, AND THEY BECAME -- THEY
DEVELOPED AN INTERESTING
RELATIONSHIP THAT WAS BOTH LEGAL
AND A FRIENDSHIP, AND COHN SORT
OF SQUIRED HIM AROUND NEW YORK,
INTRODUCED HIM TO A LOT OF
POWERFUL PEOPLE.
AND I THINK THAT THAT WAS
PROBABLY SET THE TONE FOR MUCH
OF THE REST OF HIS CAREER.
COHN REPRESENTED HIM THROUGH THE
'80s, AND THERE ARE QUALITIES
THAT WE SEE IN DONALD TRUMP NOW,
SOME OF THE HARSHER QUALITIES
THAT ARE REMARKABLY SIMILAR TO
ROY COHN'S METHODS AND DEMEANOR.
>> AND JUST BRIEFLY, TELL US A
LITTLE BIT ABOUT ASSEMBLING THE
DOCUMENTS THAT GAVE US INSIGHTS
INTO TRUMP'S FINANCES IN THAT PERIOD.
>> OH, THERE'S A MASSIVE TROVE
OF INFORMATION, AND AND WE
PROBABLY TAPPED -- WELL, WE
TAPPED A LOT OF IT, BUT THERE'S
A LOT OF MATERIAL TO BE
EXAMINED.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE FOUND
IS THAT DONALD TRUMP HAS
SURROUNDED HIMSELF IN COMPLEXITY
AND KIND OF A CLOUD OF ON TO
SECURITY THROUGHOUT HIS --
OBSCURITY THROUGHOUT HIS CAREER.
DEALS ARE COMPLEX, ANSWERS ARE
COMPLEX AND VAGUE OFTEN TIMES.
AND THE DOCUMENTS THAT WE WERE
ABLE TO COMPILE PARTICULARLY
FROM THE CASINO CONTROL
COMMISSION IN NEW JERSEY HELPED
US TO CUT THROUGH THE FOG OF
OBFUSCATION AND TO GET TO
PARTICULARS.
AND THE ONE THAT WAS MOST
STRIKING TO ME, AND IT WAS SO
STRIKING I ACTUALLY DID NOT
BELIEVE IT FOR A WHILE UNTIL I
REPORTED IT THOROUGHLY AND
REALIZED IT WAS TRUE, WAS THAT
WHEN DONALD TRUMP WAS TRYING TO
GET HIS THIRD CASINO, THE TAJ,
HE HAD TO SHOW THAT HE WAS
FINANCIALLY CAPABLE OF MANAGING
HIMSELF AND MAKING IT THRIVE.
AND HE PROMISED THE REGULATORS
THAT HE WAS NOT GOING TO USE
JUNK BONDS TO FINANCE THE TAJ.
AND IN THE, IN HIS TESTIMONY
WHICH IS IN BLACK AND WHITE, YOU
CAN ACTUALLY READ IT ONLINE, HE
SAYS THAT PEOPLE THAT USE JUNK
BONDS ARE LOSERS, IN EFFECT, AND
THAT THEY'RE STUPID AND THAT
COMPANIES THAT USE JUNK BONDS
ARE, IN EFFECT, JUNK.
AND IT WAS ONLY -- AND THEY
APPROVED HIS MOVE TO GO FORWARD,
AND IT WAS ONLY A FEW MONTHS
LATER THAT HE COULD NOT RAISE
THE MONEY AT THE LOW PRIME RATES
THAT HE HAD PROMISED AND USED
JUNK BONDS.
AND IN MAKING THAT DECISION AND
ACTUALLY SIGNING OFF ON THOSE
JUNK BONDS, HE SEALED HIS FATE,
AND HIS WHOLE EMPIRE WAS ALMOST
CERTAIN TO GO DOWN THE TUBES AS
WAS PREDICTED BY A FINANCIAL
ANALYST WHO WAS WATCHING
EVERYTHING VERY CLOSELY.
SO THAT'S THE KIND OF DETAIL
THAT WE WERE ABLE TO MINE TO GET
TO THE PARTICULARS RATHER THAN
THE GENERALITIES THAT HAD
SURROUNDED HIM AND THAT HE
SURROUNDED HIMSELF WITH.
>> MARY JORDAN IS THE NATIONAL
REPORTER AT THE POST WHO LED A
GROUP OF REPORTERS WHO LOOKED
INTO DONALD TRUMP'S FAMILY, HIS
RELATIONSHIPS WITH HIS WIVES,
THREE WIVES AND HIS FIVE
CHILDREN.
AND AS PART OF THAT, WE MADE AN
EFFORT TO TALK TO ALL OF THOSE
PEOPLE.
TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT
THAT WAS LIKE AND WHAT CAME OUT
OF IT.
>> SO I GOT THE WOMEN.
[LAUGHTER]
AND KAREN HELLER IS HERE,
ANOTHER GREAT REPORTER, AND BOY,
WAS THAT INTERESTING. OKAY.
THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A PRESIDENT
WHO HAS THREE WIVES ALIVE
WALKING AROUND. [LAUGHTER]
THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED, RIGHT?
AND WHERE ARE THEY?
WE KNOW EVERYTHING.
THIS GUY IS ON THE AIR ALL THE
TIME.
WHERE IS HIS FIRST WIFE?
IVANA?
THE FAMOUS ONE WHO WAS THE ONE,
IN FACT, SHE'S FROM THE FORMER
CZECHOSLOVAKIA, WHO COINED THE
TERM "THE DONALD."
SHE'S ALSO THE ONE WHEN THEY HAD
A WICKED, WICKED PUBLIC DIVORCE
WAS ON THE COVER EVERY DAY OF
TABLOIDS SAID DON'T GET MAD, GET
EVERYTHING.
[LAUGHTER] OKAY.
THIS WOMAN LIKES TO TALK, AND
SHE'S JUST DISAPPEARED.
NEVER SEEN HER.
SECOND WIFE, IS SHE'S STILL
ALIVE.
SHE'S BEEN MARRIED FOUR TIMES,
AND DONALD WENT TO HER FOURTH
WEDDING. [LAUGHTER]
BUT MARLA MAPLES COMES ALONG,
AND HE'S STILL MARRIED --
INCONVENIENTLY -- TO THE FIRST WOMAN.
AND SO THIS WAS HIDDEN FOR A
WHILE, BUT THEN THERE WAS THIS
BIG SCENE IN ASPEN AT CHRISTMAS
TIME, AND THE TWO WOMEN WERE FIGHTING OVER DONALD.
HE LOVED IT.
IT WAS IN PAPER.
AT THAT TIME HE WASN'T RUNNING
FOR OFFICE, AND HE LOVED, LOVED
THAT WOMEN -- HE WAS ON PAGE 6
IN THE TABLOIDS IN NEW YORK.
IN FACT, MANY, MANY PEOPLE WE
TALKED TO SAID HE CULTIVATED
THIS.
HE LOVED BEING IN THE NEWSPAPER
ABOUT THIS WOMAN, AND NOW ALONG
CAME -- AND THAT WOMAN.
AND ALONG CAME MARLA MAPLES WITH
A GREAT NAME, FORMER BEAUTY
PAGEANT WINNER IN GEORGIA.
IT WASN'T EVEN, LIKE, MISS
GEORGIA, IT WAS LIKE MISS PEACH.
[LAUGHTER]
BUT SHE WAS, OBVIOUSLY, VERY
GOOD LOOKING AND YOUNGER, AND IN
THE END HE GOT DIVORCED FROM
IVANA, MARRIED MARLA. WHERE IS SHE?
SHE'S GONE.
YOU DON'T SEE HER AT ALL DURING
THIS CAMPAIGN.
IT IS REALLY STUNNING,
ESPECIALLY -- AND THE LAST THING
I JUST POSTED A STORY A COUPLE
HOURS AGO, TODAY, ABOUT HIS
CURRENT WIFE -- OR I SHOULD SAY
HIS THIRD WIFE, BECAUSE IF YOU
SAY HIS CURRENT WIFE, PEOPLE
THINK THERE'S MORE COMING.
[LAUGHTER]
BUT ANYWAY, SO HIS THIRD WIFE --
[LAUGHTER]
MELANIA TRUMP.
SHE WAS -- SHE HAS NOT BEEN
HEARD OF SINCE THE REPUBLICAN
NATIONAL CONVENTION ON THE 21ST
OF JULY.
WE'RE IN THE HOME STRETCH OF A
PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN WHERE IF
HE WINS, SHE IS THE FIRST LADY
OF THE UNITED STATES.
SHE HAS AN OFFICE IN THE WHITE
HOUSE, SHE HAS A PUBLIC
PLATFORM, AND SHE HAS LITERALLY
GONE SILENT.
IT'S VERY, VERY UNUSUAL.
AS MANY THINGS IN THIS CAMPAIGN
ARE UNUSUAL.
OKAY.
SO THREE WIVES, ALL OF THEM ARE
NOT TALKING WHILE THE KIDS ARE.
BUT JUST IF I COULD FOR A
MINUTE, LET'S GO BACK, ROLL
BACK.
SINCE WE'RE A BOOK ON HIS LIFE,
ABOUT WHAT IT USED TO BE ABOUT DONALD AND WOMEN.
HE USED TO GO ON HOWARD STERN,
FOR INSTANCE.
HE'S THE SHOCK JOCK.
AND HE WOULD GO ON ALL THE TIME,
AND STERN WOULD SAY, DONALD,
WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT DIANE
SAWYER, WOULD YOU DO HER, YOU
KNOW?
AND ALL THIS KIND OF TALK.
AND THEY WOULD -- AND WITH MUCH
MORE GRAPHIC THAN THAT.
AND HE WAS ALWAYS TALKING ABOUT
WOMEN, HE WAS ALWAYS TALKING
ABOUT HOW PRINCESS DIANA GOT
AWAY FROM HIM, YOU KNOW?
IF HE ONLY HAD A CHANCE REALLY
TO GO, YOU KNOW?
BUT WOMEN DEFINED HIM.
AND I THINK WHEN WE TALK TO
PEOPLE WHO KNOW HIM, WHO KNEW
HIM IN THE '80s, THE '90s,
THEY SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT?
THERE WERE A LOT OF RICH PEOPLE IN NEW YORK.
THERE WERE A LOT OF RICH PEOPLE
WHO HAD BUILDINGS IN NEW YORK,
BUT THERE WAS ONLY ONE DONALD
TRUMP WHO WAS ALWAYS IN THE
PAPER WITH SOME OTHER BABE WHO
WANTED HIM.
AND THAT WAS A DIRECT QUOTE FROM
SOMEONE WHO KNEW HIM.
SO I THINK FOR A LONG TIME WOMEN
GOT ATTENTION FOR DONALD TRUMP.
AND FOR SOME REASON, I THINK HE
LIKED ATTENTION.
[LAUGHTER]
AND I THINK THAT HE, WHEN YOU GO
TO HIS OFFICE, I'VE INTERVIEWED
HIM IN HIS OFFICE, AND I'VE
TALKED TO MELANIA ON THE PHONE,
IT'S VERY STRIKING THAT THERE'S
ONLY REALLY GOOD LOOKING WOMEN
IN THE OFFICE.
HE TALKS ABOUT WOMEN'S
APPEARANCES NONSTOP.
I MEAN, HE'S 70 YEARS OLD, AND I
KNOW A LOT OF OLDER PEOPLE
OFTEN, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY SEE
SOMEBODY, THEY SAY IT, BUT IT'S
VERY UNUSUAL TO HAVE A PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE -- AND
HE'S GETTING TRIPPED UP ON THIS
EVERY SO OFTEN BECAUSE
APPEARANCES DO MATTER.
SO IN CONTRAST TO THE OLD DAYS
WHERE HE JUST LOVED TALKING
ABOUT DONALD TRUMP ASK WOMEN --
AND WOMEN, WE DON'T HEAR FROM
THEM ANYMORE.
>> MARY HAD AN ESPECIALLY
REVEALING INTERVIEW WITH DONALD
TRUMP'S LAWYER ABOUT THIS
QUESTION OF HOW TRUMP HAD SPENT
YEARS AND YEARS CULTIVATING THIS
PLAYBOY IMAGE AND INVITING
REPORTERS TO COME OUT AND SEE
HIM AT A CLUB WHEN HE WOULD BE
THERE WITH THE PRETTIEST MODELS,
AND YET HIS LAWYER TOLD YOU THAT
WHEN THE CAMERAS WERE TURNED
OFF, IT WAS ACTUALLY A VERY
DIFFERENT KIND OF DYNAMIC.
>> WELL, HE WOULD GO TO ALL THE
NIGHTCLUB OPENINGS, STUDIO 54,
IN THE DAY.
YOU KNOW, ESPECIALLY DURING THIS
GAP WHEN HE WASN'T MARRIED.
THERE WAS A TIME AFTER MARLA
MAPLES AND BEFORE MELANIA THAT
HE WASN'T MARRIED, AND HE
BLITZED THE SCENE.
BUT HE WAS VERY CAREFUL ABOUT
HOW HE SPENT HIS TIME, BECAUSE
IT WAS WHERE THERE WERE CAMERAS.
AND HE WAS ALWAYS WITH MODELS.
HE WOULD CALL MODELING AGENCIES
UP AND, IN FACT, WHEN HE HAD
PARTIES, MAKE SURE THAT HIS OWN
PARTIES HAD A RATIO OF 5 TO 1
GORGEOUS WOMEN TO MEN.
AND HE WAS, YOU KNOW, CONSTANTLY
SURROUNDING HIMSELF WITH WOMEN
AND AT OPENINGS.
SO I SAID TO HIS LAWYER, DICK
GOLDBERG, I SAID, YOU KNOW, HOW
DID HE HAVE TIME FOR THIS?
HE'S ALWAYS TELLING ME THAT
WORK, HOW COULD I DO ALL THIS
STUFF, MARY?
I MEAN, I'M WORKING.
I HAVE ALL THIS MONEY AND
RESPONSIBILITY, I HAVE GREAT
BUILDINGS, HAVE YOU SEEN MY
GREAT BUILDINGS? [LAUGHTER]
YOU KNOW, THIS IS HOW HE TALKS.
HOW COULD I POSSIBLY HAVE BEEN
WITH ALL THESE WOMEN.
SO I ASKED GOLDBERG, AND HE
AGREED COMPLETELY.
ACTUALLY, HE'S ON TRUMP TOWER,
AND HE WORKS IN PART OF IT, HE
REALLY JUST LIKES TO TURN THE
ELEVATOR UP AND TURN ON THE TUBE
AND WATCH TV.
SO I SAID TO TRUMP, AND THEN
TRUMP SAID, WELL, YOU KNOW,
MAYBE IT WASN'T AS GLAMOROUS AS
IT'S ALL OUT TO BE.
SO, I MEAN, IMAGE, YOU KNOW, HE
WAS GREAT AT GETTING ATTENTION.
HOW MANY WOMEN DID HE REALLY
HAVE AND HOW MUCH TV DID HE
HAVE, I DON'T KNOW.
[LAUGHTER]
>> ROBERT SAMUELS IS A NATIONAL
POLITICAL REPORTER AT THE POST,
AND ROBERT LOOKED INTO THE
TRANSITION THAT DONALD TRUMP
MADE FROM CELEBRITY TO
POLITICIAN AND THE ROOTS OF HIS
INTEREST IN RUNNING FOR OFFICE.
AND TELL US A LITTLE BIT -- DID
HE SEE THIS AS A COMPLETELY
DIFFERENT KIND OF PURSUIT, OR
WAS IT KIND OF A NATURAL
PROGRESSION FOR HIM?
>> RIGHT.
WELL, ONE OF THE GOVERNING
QUESTIONS THAT I WAS REALLY
INTERESTED IN FINDING WAS WHY IS
THIS MAN DOING THIS?
AND IT WAS VERY CLEAR FROM
SPEAKING WITH PEOPLE WHO KNEW
HIM THAT AT SOME POINT HE DIDN'T
REALIZE THE PHENOMENA AND THE
MOVEMENT THAT WE'VE SEEN SWEEP
ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
WHAT WE KNOW THROUGH HIS
POLITICAL LIFE AND HIS
AFFILIATION IS THAT HE DIDN'T
REALLY HAVE MUCH STOMACH FOR
PARTISAN PRINCIPLES.
BETWEEN 1999 AND 2012, HE
CHANGED POLITICAL PARTIES SEVEN
TIMES.
[LAUGHTER]
HE'S DONATED BETWEEN 1995 AND
2012, HE DONATED $3.1 MILLION BY
HIMSELF WITHOUT LOOKING AT HIS
COMPANIES TO ALL SORTS OF
POLITICIANS.
HE DONATED TO CLINTON, HE DONATED TO CARTER.
HE LOVED RONALD REAGAN.
SO WHAT IS THIS ABOUT REALLY.
AND TO DO THAT, WE STARTED
LOOKING AT LOTS AND LOTS OF
FOOTAGE AND INTERVIEWS THAT HE'S DONE OVER THE YEARS.
AND WE TALKED SOME PEOPLE INTO
SHOWING US THE UNAIRED, UNEDITED
VERSIONS OF THIS, OF THESE TAPES.
AND AND EARLY ON FROM HIS VERY
FIRST MAJOR NETWORK TELEVISION
INTERVIEW IN 1980, WE SEE A
THEME THAT STARTS TO EMERGE.
HE'S TALKING ABOUT A BUILDING,
AND THEN HE BEGINS TO RAIL ON
THE IDEA THAT AMERICA'S BEING
LAUGHED AT.
THAT THERE'S SOMETHING THAT'S
HAPPENING IN THE POLITICAL
SYSTEM WHERE LEADERS AREN'T
STRONG ENOUGH LIKE THEY USED TO BE.
AND HE BEGINS TO PONDER WHETHER
OR NOT POLITICIANS TODAY CAN BE
LIKE AN ABRAHAM LINCOLN.
AND HE SAYS ABRAHAM LINCOLN
COULD NEVER WIN IN 1980 BECAUSE
HE WAS TOO UGLY, HE DID NOT LOOK
GOOD ON TV, AND HE DIDN'T KNOW
HOW TO MASTER THE MEDIA.
AND THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES IN THIS MODERN ERA NEEDS
TO KNOW HOW TO DO THESE SKILLS.
AND AND SO WHAT WE SEE OVER THE
COURSE OF TIME IS DONALD TRUMP
ASSESSING POLITICSES AND
PRESIDENTS ON -- POLITICIANS AND
PRESIDENTS ON THEIR ABILITY TO
AFFECT MESSAGES, TO COMMUNICATE
MESSAGES EFFECTIVELY AND TO
FIGURE OUT WHETHER OR NOT THEY
MAKE THE COUNTRY FEEL GREAT
AGAIN AND EVERYONE DOES A PRETTY
GREAT JOB UNTIL OBAMA WHO HE
CONSIDERS A TOTAL DISASTER.
BY THIS POINT IN 2012, DONALD
TRUMP HAS MASTERED THE CELEBRITY
THAT HE SAYS THOSE GREAT MINDS
IN 1980 DID NOT MASTER.
HE'S BECOME THE STAR OF "THE
APPRENTICE," HE HAS THIS TWITTER
FOLLOWING THAT EVERYONE ENJOYS BECAUSE HE'S TALKING ABOUT
EVERYTHING FROM WHETHER OR NOT
BARACK OBAMA'S FROM THE UNITED
STATES TO WHETHER OR NOT KATY
PERRY'S MARRIAGES ARE GOING TO
WORK OUT.
AND HE DECIDES THAT HE IS, IN
FACT, THE PERSON WHO COULD BEST
SYMBOLIZE THE GREATNESS AND
TOUGH LEADERSHIP OF AMERICA.
AND SO THERE'S A LOT OF, THERE'S
BEEN A LOT OF SKEPTICISM ABOUT
WHETHER OR NOT DONALD TRUMP
WANTED TO DO THIS, WHETHER HE
WANTED TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT.
BUT IT IS TRUE THAT DAYS AFTER
ROMNEY LOST THAT ELECTION, HE
WAS THE ONE WHO FILED AN
APPLICATION TO THE PATENT
OFFICE, AND HE COPYRIGHTED ONE
PHRASE, AND THAT PHRASE WAS MAKE
AMERICA GREAT AGAIN.
AND SO YOU SEE THE THEMATICS OF
HIS CAMPAIGN STARTING FROM EARLY
ON IN HIS PUBLIC PERSONA, BUT IT
HAD BEEN SOMETHING HE HAD BEEN
THINKING ABOUT AND TOYING AROUND
WITH FOR SEVERAL DECADES.
>> GREAT.
THERE'S ONE PIECE OF VIDEO THAT
YOU GOT FROM IT WAS AN OLD RONA
BARRETT CELEBRITY INTERVIEW FROM
THE 1980s WHICH HAD NEVER AIRED.
YOU GOT PARTS THAT HAD NEVER
AIRED, AND HE WAS REMARKABLY
SIMILAR IN THE WAY HE TALKED
ABOUT POLITICAL ISSUES, BUT HE
WAS ALSO VERY FRANK ABOUT THE
SORT OF DYNAMIC OF WHAT WAS
MAKING HIM DECIDE TO RUN OR NOT
TO RUN.
>> IT'S INTERESTING, AND MAYBE
IT'S BECAUSE IT WAS SO EARLY IN
DONALD TRUMP'S POLITICAL CAREER,
BUT RONA BARRETT REALLY GOT
PROBABLY THE BEST INFORMATION
OUT OF DONALD TRUMP THAN ANY
INTERVIEW THAT I HAD SEEN, US
NOTWITHSTANDING.
[LAUGHTER]
AND YOU SEE, YOU SEE HIM GOING
THROUGH -- HE SAID -- RONA
BARRETT ASKS HIM, DO YOU WANT TO
BE PRESIDENT?
HE SAID, NO, I LOVE BUILDING.
I'M AN ARTIST, I LOVE BUILDING MY BUILDINGS.
AND OVER TIME IT REALLY AFFECTS
HIM.
AND HE STARTS TO TAKE TO THIS
IDEA THAT, HUH, MAYBE ONE DAY I
COULD BE PRESIDENT.
PARTICULARLY BECAUSE PEOPLE
CONTINUOUSLY ASK HIM WHETHER OR
NOT HE WANTS TO BE THE PRESIDENT
OF THE UNITED STATES.
>> AND HE SHOWS UP IN POLLS
THROUGH THE DECADES AGAIN AND
AGAIN NOT BECAUSE HE WAS RUNNING
FOR ANYTHING, BUT BECAUSE OF HIS
NAME RECOGNITION PEOPLE PUT HIM
ON POLLS AND HE DID VERY WELL.
SO IT KIND OF BUILT.
BUT WE WANT TO TURN IT OVER TO
ALL OF YOU TO TAKE YOUR
QUESTIONS, SO IF YOU WANT TO
RAISE YOUR HAND, ONE OF THE
FOLKS WITH THE MICROPHONES WILL
COME BY AND START -- MA'AM?
GO AHEAD, YEP.
>> COULD YOU DISCUSS HIS
PERSONALITY?
WAS HE WARM?
DID HE LOOK YOU IN THE EYE?
WAS HE RESERVED?
DID YOU SEE HIM WITH MELANIA?
A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HIS
PERSONALITY. >> SURE.
IN OUR INTERVIEWS AT TRUMP
TOWER, THEY WERE IN HIS OFFICE
ON THE 26TH FLOOR WITH THIS
GLORIOUS VIEW OF CENTRAL PARK
AND FIFTH AVENUE, AND HE WAS
VERY COURTEOUS AND WAS, YOU
KNOW, AS I SAID BEFORE, QUITE
GENEROUS WITH HIS TIME.
WE NEVER SAW MELANIA.
HIS KIDS WOULD WANDER IN.
IVANKA AND ERIC WOULD WANDER IN
FROM TIME TO
FROM TIME TO TIME AND TALK WITH
HIM ABOUT A BUSINESS TRIP THEY
WERE GOING ON OR A PROBLEM AT
THE PROPERTY IN MIAMI.
BUT HE'S VERY SOFT SPOKEN IN
THAT SETTING.
YOU GET NONE OF THE BLUSTER THAT
WE'RE FAMILIAR WITH FROM THE
RALLIES.
AND HE, ON THE OTHER HAND, IT IS
DIFFICULT TO HAVE A LINEAR
CONVERSATION WITH HIM.
YOU CAN ASK HIM ABOUT STUFF, AND
HE KNOWS HIS FIELD
EXTRAORDINARILY WELL.
IF YOU ASK HIM ABOUT BUSINESS
DEALS HE MADE IN 1978, HE WILL
REMEMBER BUILDING MATERIALS AND
SUBCONTRACTORS' NAMES AND THE
WHOLE PROCESS OF MAKING, OF
WORKING THROUGH A NEGOTIATION.
BUT IF YOU ASK HIM ANYTHING THAT
VEERS OFF OF WHAT HE KNOWS BEST,
THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS VERY THIN,
AND HE TENDS TO CHANGE THE TOPIC
VERY QUICKLY, A SENTENCE OR TWO,
AND HE'S OFF ON TO SOMETHING
ELSE.
HE HAS HIS SORT OF BASE TOPICS
THAT HE GOES BACK TO WHEN HE'S A
LITTLE BIT FLUSTERED ABOUT NOT KNOWING SOMETHING.
HE'LL ALL OF A SUDDEN START
TALKING ABOUT HIS TV RATINGS.
>> HE'S --
>> THERE WAS ANOTHER THING THAT
HE WOULD DO, I SPOKE TO HIM ONLY
ON THE PHONE SEVERAL TIMES.
IF HE WAS PRESSED ON SOMETHING,
HE WOULD ALMOST SEEM TO GET
CAUGHT IN A GROOVE, AND HE WOULD
REPEAT THE SAME THING OVER AND
OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
AND SOMETIMES ONE OF MY
COLLEAGUES, DREW, WAS ESPECIALLY
ADEPT AT THIS, HE WOULD SORT OF
SAY, MR. TRUMP, MR. TRUMP, AND
KIND OF BRING HIM BACK -- [LAUGHTER]
ON COURSE, AND THEN WE'D MOVE
ON.
BUT SORT OF JOKING ASIDE, IT WAS
REALLY A PRONOUNCED THING TO BE
TALKING WITH SOMEONE WHO SEEMED
TO VEER OFF AND GET CAUGHT MANY
A GROOVE.
>> HE'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT
PERSON, I THINK, IN PERSON.
HE'S REALLY CHARMING, HE'S VERY
NICE, HE KNOWS YOUR NAME, HE
LOOKS AT YOU.
I MEAN, EVERYONE SAYS THAT.
IT'S NOT THIS BOMBASTIC GUY THAT
YOU SEE ON TV.
AND EVERYBODY THAT'S WORKED WITH
HIM OVER THE YEARS SAY I TURN ON
THE TV -- I WORKED WITH THIS GUY
FOR 20 YEARS, TURN ON THE TV, I
DON'T KNOW WHO THIS IS.
>> THIS GENTLEMAN HERE.
YEP.
>> MOST OF -- I'M COURTEOUS --
CURIOUS OF THE ASPECTS OF
TRUMP'S LIFE AND THE EXPERIENCES
THAT YOU RESEARCHED, WHAT OF THE
CHALLENGES OR SITUATIONS WERE
MOST ANALOGOUS TO THE KINDS OF
CHALLENGES A PRESIDENT FACES?
AND WHAT CAN WE LEARN FROM
THOSE?
I MEAN, YOU'VE, YOUR BOOK HAS
RESEARCHED, AND I'M LOOKING
FORWARD TO THE CHANCE TO READ
IT, HOW HE DEALT WITH WOMEN, HOW
HE DEALT WITH CELEBRITY, YOU
KNOW, AND BUSINESS DEALS, BUT
THIS IS CLEARLY NOT A DIRECT
ANALOGY TO WHAT A PRESIDENT
WOULD FACE. >> RIGHT.
>> AND SO WHAT CAN WE LEARN ARE,
WHAT IS MOST INSTRUCTIVE IN THIS
IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT HE WOULD
BE ACTUALLY LIKE AS A PRESIDENT?
>> MICHAEL?
>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S A GREAT
QUESTION.
AND THE PARALLEL IS WHAT HE DID
RUNNING HIS BUSINESSES.
AND NEARLY ALL THE BUSINESSES
THAT HE RAN WERE PRIVATE BUSINESSES.
SO THEY'RE DIFFICULT TO EXAMINE
UNTIL YOU GO THROUGH ANCILLARY
SOURCES LIKE SAKE KNOW -- CASINO
CONTROL COMMISSION RECORDS WHICH
BOB AND OTHER REPORTERS DID, FOR
EXAMPLE.
HE DID HAVE SIX CORPORATE BANKRUPTCIES.
HE HAS OFTEN SAID FOUR CORPORATE
BANKRUPTCIES, THIS IS
INSTRUCTIVE TO UNDERSTAND HOW HE
THINKS. CLEARLY, THERE WERE SIX.
AND WE ASKED HIM TO EXPLAIN WHEN
YOU SAY FOUR, WHAT DO YOU MEAN?
AND HE SAID, WELL, I THINK OF
THE THREE CASINOS AS ONE
BANKRUPTCY.
IN FACT, THERE WERE THREE
SEPARATE COURT ACTIONS FOR
PREPACKAGED BANKRUPTCIES AS
THEY'RE CALLED, AND THERE
CLEARLY WERE THREE SEPARATE
ONES, BUT TO HIM, IT'S ONE.
PARTLY, HE WANTS TO THE PUT THE
BEST IMAGE OUT THIS.
THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION, HE
WAS TOLD BY HIS FATHER DON'T GO
DEEPLY IN DEBT, AND HE ENDED UP
GOING INTO JUNK BONDS.
HE WAS HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OR
EVEN BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN
DEBT. TIME AND AGAIN HE THOUGHT HE WAS
NOT GOING TO SURVIVE.
WE TALKED TO A PERSON WHO WAS,
BASICALLY, GIVEN THE JOB OF
NEGOTIATING WITH BONDHOLDERS AND
BANKS, AND THAT PERSON TOLD US
THAT HE WAS VERY CONCERNED.
THIS WAS SOMEONE WHO KNEW DONALD
TRUMP AS WELL AS ANYBODY, AND HE
WAS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP AT THIS MOMENT.
HE SAID I'M LOOKING AT HIM, IT'S
BANKRUPTCY AFTER BANKRUPTCY.
HE'S IN THE MIDST OF A HUGE DIVORCE.
HE'S BEING HUMILIATED DAY AFTER
DAY ON THE FRONT PAGES OF THE
NEWSPAPERS, AND I WORRY THAT,
YOU KNOW, HE MIGHT TAKE HIS OWN LIFE.
IT'S A VERY STRIKING STATEMENT
FOR SOMEONE WHO ACTUALLY FEELS
AFFECTIONATELY ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP.
AND WHAT HE SAID WAS BUT WHEN I
WALKED INTO THE OFFICE OF DONALD
TRUMP, THERE HE WAS.
HIS SUIT LOOKED PERFECT, HIS TIE
WAS PERFECT AS WELL.
AND HE WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW,
WHAT'S NEXT?
WHAT DO WE DO NEXT?
AND HE HAD THIS ABILITY FOR
WHATEVER REASON TO, INSTEAD OF
LOOKING AT, OH, MY GOSH, ALL
THESE TERRIBLE PROBLEMS, TO TRY
TO BE THINKING POSITIVELY.
ONE OF HIS MENTORS WAS THE POWER
OF POSITIVE THINKING.
THAT COULD EITHER MEAN HE'S
DETACHED FROM REALITY IF YOU
LOOK AT IT THAT WAY, OR THAT HE
JUST IS SO POSITIVE-ORIENTED
THAT HE DOESN'T WANT TO THINK
ABOUT SOME OF THE DEEP PROBLEMS
HE HAD.
BUT THE REALITY IS, IS THAT
WHILE HE CERTAINLY SAYS HE'S A
GREAT BUSINESS PERSON, THAT HIS
BUSINESSES HAD TROUBLE TIME AND
TIME AGAIN.
DREW CAN TALK MORE, HE'S HERE IN
THE AUDIENCE, A REPORTER WHO
WORKED ON THIS.
BUT HE HAD A PUBLIC COMPANY AT
ONE POINT, ONE TIME ONLY,
BECAUSE HE HAD TO RAISE A LOT OF
CAPITAL.
AND THAT COMPANY DID DO WELL AT
FIRST, IT PAID DONALD TRUMP
MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, DJT FOR HIS
INITIALS.
BUT THE STOCK PRICE WENT FROM
SOMETHING LIKE $35 TO 17 CENTS,
AND THE SHAREHOLDERS WERE VERY
ANGRY, THERE WERE LAWSUITS FILED
THAT WE WRITE ABOUT.
BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT
TRUMP WAS ABLE TO SURVIVE.
IT'S ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF BEING AT
THE ABSOLUTE DEPTHS AND FINDING
A WAY FOR HIMSELF TO SURVIVE.
AND THIS IS INSTRUCTIVE.
THIS IS, YOU KNOW, DONALD TRUMP
VIEWS IT AS, YOU KNOW, I AM
THERE.
HIS WORDS ARE I'M A ONE-MAN ARMY.
AND HE TALKED IN ONE OF HIS
BOOKS ABOUT THE POWER OF
NARCISSISM, FOR EXAMPLE.
HE CITED A BOOK BY THAT NAME,
AND HE SAID IT'S A VERY POWERFUL THING.
IF YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL,
YOU HAVE TO THINK IN THAT SORT
OF TUNNEL VISION WAY ONLY ABOUT
MAKING SURE THAT YOU DO SURVIVE.
AND ANOTHER ONE OF HIS POINTS IN
THE BOOK, THINK LIKE A
BILLIONAIRE, HE ADVISE ARES THAT
YOU HAVE A, QUOTE, SHORT
ATTENTION SPAN, UNQUOTE.
SO EITHER HE SEES THAT AS AN
ATTRIBUTE OR HE KNOWS HE HAS
THIS PARTICULAR DISPOSITION, AND
HE TRIES TO PUT IT IN THE MOST
POSITIVE WAY.
BUT EXAMINING THAT BUSINESS
CAREER AND SEEING, YOU KNOW, AS
WE TRY TO DO IN BOOK, YOU KNOW,
THE PEAKS AND THE VALLEYS AND
EXACT ARELY HOW HE'S OPERATED,
IT SEEMS TO BE THE BEST GUIDE
FOR HOW HE MIGHT TRY TO OPERATE
AS --
>> ONE HUGE QUESTION COMES UP
THERE. HE IS THE FIRST PRESIDENT WHO
HAS A LOT OF FOREIGN HOLDINGS AS
PEOPLE LOOK AT HIS FOREIGN
POLICY, YOU KNOW?
HE'S EXPANDING ABROAD.
KEVIN SULLIVAN IS HERE, WENT TO
ASKER AZERBAIJAN.
WE HAD REPORTERS LOOKING AT HIS
DEALINGS IN MOSCOW, IN PANAMA,
AND WE'VE NEVER HAD ANYBODY WHO
WOULD BE IN THE WHITE HOUSE WHO
HAS THEIR GLOBAL BUSINESS EMPIRE.
AND SO YOUR GOOD QUESTION IS HOW
WOULD THIS WORK?
IS HE GOING TO DIVEST, AND IS IT
ENOUGH TO DIVEST HIMSELF?
IS THE TRUMP ORGANIZATION WITH THE KIDS?
I MEAN, THE VALUE GOES UP OF HIS
HOLDINGS ALL AROUND THE WORLD.
AND HE IS INCREASING HIS
WORLDWIDE HOLDINGS.
IT GOES UP IF HE'S IN THE WHITE
HOUSE.
>> YOU KNOW, IF YOU THINK ABOUT
WHAT DO PRESIDENTS DO, THEY
SYNTHESIZE INFORMATION AND COME
TO DECISIONS.
THEY PERSUADE PEOPLE OF THEIR
POSITIONS, AND THEY HAVE A
PROGRAM OF SOME KIND.
WELL, DONALD TRUMP IS NOT
SOMEONE WHO TAKES IN INFORMATION
VERY DEEPLY.
WE ASKED HIM ABOUT HOW HE MAKES
DECISIONS, WHAT HE READS, AND HE
SAYS HE DOESN'T READ REPORTS OR
BRIEFINGS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
HE DOESN'T LIKE TO READ ANYTHING
OF ANY LENGTH.
HE BELIEVES THAT HE COMES TO
DECISIONS BY GUT, BY STINT. INSTINCT.
SO HE VERY MUCH WANTS PEOPLE TO
COME IN AND TELL HIM ABOUT
SOMETHING ORALLY, AND HE
BELIEVES THAT HE WILL GET THE
NUB OF IT IN A MATTER OF SECONDS.
HE'S, OBVIOUSLY, VERY GOOD AT
PERSUADING PEOPLE THAT HE KNOWS
A WAY FORWARD.
BUT WHEN ET COMES TO PERSUADING
PEOPLE INDIVIDUALLY IN THE WAY
THAT A PRESIDENT HAS TO TO FORM
COALITIONS AND ACHIEVE
COMPROMISES, THAT'S SOMETHING
THAT HE'S DONE VERY LITTLE OF IN
HIS CAREER.
HE TALKS ABOUT BEING A GREAT
NEGOTIATOR, AND WE'VE CERTAINLY
SPOKEN TO SOME OF HIS BUSINESS
ASSOCIATES WHO CREDIT HIM FOR
THAT, BUT WE'VE ALSO SPOKEN TO A
LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WORKED WITH
HIM WHO SAY THAT HE'S ALL ABOUT
GETTING HIS WAY, AND HE'S NOT
ONE TO REACH COMPROMISES.
YES, OVER HERE.
GO AHEAD.
NO, RIGHT HERE.
>> I JUST WONDER, HIS STRONG
ANTI-MEXICAN NARRATIVE IN THIS
CAMPAIGN WHICH HAS PRETTY MUCH
DEFINED THE CAMPAIGN, WHERE DOES
IT COME FROM?
AND DID YOU HAVE PEOPLE IN
MEXICO RESEARCHING OR LOOKING
INTO HIS DEALS THERE?
COULD IT COME FROM HIS
FRUSTRATION?
APPARENTLY, HE DIDN'T DO VERY
WELL DOWN THERE?
>> WELL, I WAS THE BUREAU CHIEF
IN MEXICO FOR FIVE YEARS WITH MY
HUSBAND, KEN SULLIVAN, AND WE
WENT TO INTERVIEW THE LAST TWO
PRESIDENTS TO TALK ABOUT THIS.
PRESIDENTS FOX AND CALDERON.
AND AS FAR AS WE CAN TELL -- AND
ESPECIALLY HAVING BEEN AT
RALLIES, IT COMES FROM A LOT OF
PEOPLE IN AMERICA LIKE WHAT HE
HAS TO SAY, AND HE KNOWS THAT.
HE GETS REINFORCED EVERY DAY.
IT MAY BE THE MOST POPULIST
THING THAT HE SAYS.
THERE'S NO HINT THAT HE'S
ALWAYS, YOU KNOW, NOT LIKED
MEXICO OR ANYTHING.
HIS GIFT IS THAT HE IS SAYING --
THIS IS WHAT WE KEEP HEARING AT
RALLIES AND TALKING TO MILLIONS
OF AMERICANS, THEY'RE FED UP.
AND HE SAYS, AND HE'LL TELL YOU
THAT IN INTERVIEWS, THAT HE'S A
REFLECTION OF WHAT PEOPLE WANT.
YOU KNOW, HE THINKS THAT OUR
IMMIGRATION POLICIES HAVE BEEN
WRONG.
>> TO AMPLIFY THAT, I THINK ONE
THING THAT'S A SAFE BET WITH
DONALD TRUMP -- ALTHOUGH WE
CAN'T BE SURE OF IT -- IS THAT
HE'S ACTUALLY THE EMBODIMENT OF
A POPULIST POLITICIAN, AND WE'VE
HAD A HISTORY OF THOSE GOING
BACK 200-PLUS YEARS.
AND THEY EMERGE PERIOD CREATE,
AND THE PATTERNS ARE VERY
SIMILAR.
THEY SAY WHAT PEOPLE WANT TO HEAR.
THEY TRY TO, THEY TRY TO APPEAL
TO PEOPLE'S ANGER AND
FRUSTRATION, AND IT'S POSSIBLE
THAT DONALD TRUMP DOESN'T HAVE
ANY ANIMUS TOWARDS MEXICANS AND
THAT HE'S ONLY PLAYING THE CARDS
THAT HE SEES ARE OUT THERE FOR
HIM TO PLAY WITH.
..
HE WAS CONSIDERING RUNNING AS A
THIRD-PARTY CANDIDATE AGAINST
PAT BUCHANAN.
THE REASON HE DID BETTER IS HE
WAS ALL ABOUT INCLUSIVENESS.
HE DID NOT LIKE THE WAY PAT
BUCHANAN SPOKE ABOUT PEOPLE
INCLUDING JEWS, BLACKS, GAYS AND
MEXICANS.
WHAT WE ARE SEEING NOW WHEN YOU
GO TO THE RALLIES AND YOU
EXPERIENCE THAT, AND HE SAID IT
HIMSELF, WHEN THE CROWD GETS
LOW, HE LOVES TO BRING OUT THE
ISSUE OF WHO'S GOING TO BUILD
THE WALL BECAUSE THE CROWDS GO
NUTS.
IT'S A WAY TO ADD SOMETHING TO
THE POLITICAL PERSPECTIVE THAT
SOMETHING CAN UNDERSTAND.
FOR HIM THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT.
IN FACT, HE SPOKE TO A NUMBER OF
PEOPLE WHO ARE TALKING TO HIM
ABOUT THE DECISION TO RUN FOR
PRESIDENT.
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE ISSUES
THAT WERE REALLY IMPORTANT TO
HIM, THE RELATIONSHIP WITH
MEXICO DIDN'T REALLY COME UP.
IN FACT, A A NUMBER OF THEM WERE
A SURPRISE.
HE MADE ALLUSIONS TO RACIST AND
CRIMINAL TALKS IN THE FIRST
SPEECH.
>> ONE OF THE PEOPLE WE SPOKE TO
WHO IS CLOSEST WITH TRUMP GAVE
US SOME GUIDANCE AND SAID WHEN
YOU'RE TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HIS
MOTIVES, ALWAYS GO FIRST TO THE
FACT THAT HE THINKS OF HIMSELF
AS A SHOWMAN AND HE WANTS TO GET
AFFIRMATION FROM THE CROWD.
>> AND WHEN ASKED ABOUT
SOMETHING THAT'S IMPORTANT WITH
THE PRESIDENT AND THAT IS HIS
TEMPER.
I WANT TO LET YOU KNOW, IN THE
80s AND EARLY '90s I WAS IN
CHARGE OF PROMOTING ATLANTIC CITY SO I HAVE SOME KNOWLEDGE
ABOUT THIS.
WHEN DONALD TRUMP SAW AN ARTICLE
IN THE ATLANTIC CITY PRESS OR AN
EDITORIAL, HE PULLED THE
NEWSPAPER OFF THE NEWSSTAND AND
ALL OF HIS HOTELS AND ATLANTIC
CITY MAGAZINE WHICH HE OWNED.
HE STOPPED PAYING THE DUES WHICH
WAS 25% OF THE BUDGET.
I ALWAYS THINK OF HIM IS
PETULANT.
I WAS WONDERING IF YOU FOUND IN YOUR RESEARCH ANYTHING THAT
WOULD GIVE YOU SOME GUIDANCE AS
TO WHAT HIS TEMPER WILL BE LIKE
IF HE GETS ELECTED.
>> HE HAS SAID MANY TIMES, I CAN
BE A SCREAMER.
I WAS TALKING ABOUT JOHN
O'DONNELL WHO WROTE A BOOK ABOUT
TRUMP AND HE CITES THESE TEMPER
ISSUES AND TEMPERAMENT ISSUES.
DONALD GOT SO FRUSTRATED WITH
THIS THAT HE ENDED UP QUITTING.
I ASKED TRUMP ABOUT THIS AND HE
SAID JACK O'DONNELL DIDN'T QUIT,
I FIRED HIM SO WE WENT BACK AND
FORTH BREAD YOU HEAR THAT FROM A
NUMBER OF PEOPLE AND TRUMP
HIMSELF SAID HE WAS A SCREAMER.
THOSE ARE HIS OWN WORDS.
HOW WOULD THAT REFLECT, DONALD
TRUMP AND HIS FATHER FRED TRUMP
IN 1973, THEY ADVISED DONALD
TRUMP, WHEN YOU'RE HIT, HIT BACK
HARDER.
THAT IS THE ROOT OF HIS
PERSONALITY TO A GREAT DEGREE HE
SETTLED THAT CASE EVENTUALLY BUT
HE HAS ENDUED THAT PHILOSOPHY.
>> HE SETTLED THE CASE ONLY
AFTER DRAGGING IT OUT AND
ATTACKING VICIOUSLY THE
PROSECUTOR AND THAT'S AN ASPECT
THAT HE IS VERY OPEN ABOUT
WANTING TO PUNISH PEOPLE WHO, AS
HE SAYS, VICIOUSLY ATTACKED ME.
A LOT OF POLITICIANS WANT
PAYBACK TO COME NOW OR LATER SO
HE IS FIXING TO THAT MOLD.
>> IT'S WORTH NOTING THAT A LOT OF AMERICANS FIND THIS
APPEALING.
AGAIN, I THINK THERE ARE A LOT
OF PEOPLE THAT THINK WHEN HE'S
HIT, HE'S GOING TO HIT TENS
TIMES HARDER AND THAT'S WHAT
HE'S GOING TO DO OUT THERE, THEY
LIKE HIS CONFIDENCE AND HE IS
CLEARLY FEEDING OFF AN ENORMOUS
AMOUNT OF AMERICANS WHO LIKE
WHAT THEY SEE ON TV.
>> THAT AUDACIOUS ATTITUDE IS
SOMETHING THAT WE TRACE IN THE
BOOK ALL THE WAY BACK TO HIS CHILDHOOD.
THERE'S A NUMBER OF EXAMPLES
GOING BACK TO ELEMENTARY SCHOOL
OF THAT BEHAVIOR.
[INAUDIBLE]
MY QUESTION IS, WHICH IS VERY
SCARY TO ME, AFTER 2000 THE
PRESS SAID THEY WENT DOWN ON THE
JOB, NOT GOING AFTER BUSH'S
MOTIVES FOR GOING INTO IRAQ.
IT WASN'T UNTIL A DAY OR TWO AGO
I HAVE SEEN THE PRESS BEGIN TO
SAY THIS ISN'T TRUE.
NOT REALLY REPORT ON WHAT HE IS
SAYING BUT SOME JUST ABYSS
DISPOSITION OF IT.
AFTER HE CONFRONTED, I'M VERY
SCARED ABOUT VOTERS WHO, AS YOU
SAID, BUT THEIR PASSION, THEY
LIKE THAT WHAT THEY HEAR BUT MY
CREDO IS, LET'S GET THE FACTS
ARGUE ABOUT CONCLUSION.
WHAT IS THE PRESS TO HOLD HIM
ACCOUNTABLE.
I'M NOT TO TALK ABOUT THE
WASHINGTON POST, TO HOLD HIM
ACCOUNTABLE AND SAY YOU CAN'T
MAKE THESE ALLEGATIONS.
>> I'D SAY EVERY WACO WE GET A
QUESTION ABOUT THE SENSE THAT
MANY PEOPLE HAVE THAT THERE IS
NONE AGGRESSIVE COVERAGE DONALD
TRUMP.
ASK A QUESTION ABOUT HILLARY
CLINTON.
YES I THINK THE RECORDING THAT
WENT INTO THIS BOOK ALSO SAID
SOME OF THE 30 MAJOR STORIES
THAT APPEARED AND THERE IS GREAT
DETAIL AND PUSHING BACK AGAINST
HIS OWN NARRATIVE AND VERSION OF
HIS LIFE AND SUCCESSES AND CAREER.
YOU'RE RIGHT, THERE ARE OTHER
ASPECTS THAT HAVE NOT BEEN AS
AGGRESSIVE IN DOING THE
REPORTING THAT WE THINK IS OUR
OBLIGATION IN THE PRESIDENTIAL
CAMPAIGN SO, THERE ARE REAL
QUESTIONS TO BE ASKED ABOUT
GETTING OVER VAST STRETCHES OF
TIME TO RUNNING HIS VALLEYS AND
SO ON, MORE TIME WAS GIVEN TO
OTHER CANDIDATES.
WE CAN'T CONTROL WHAT THEY DO,
THIS WAS OUR OBLIGATION TO
REPORT AND COMMIT THEM ENORMOUS
RESOURCES TO THIS BOOK AND THE
STORIES THAT APPEAR THE PAPER
WILL CONTINUE TO APPEAR IN THE
POST.
>> TRUMP HATES WHAT WE WRITE, WE
HAVE A FACT FACT CHECKER
FULL-TIME, WE'VE HAD ALL THESE
BIG STORIES, BUT IT IS A KEY
QUESTION.
I THINK THE DEBATE AND STRONG
MODERATING IN THE UPCOMING
DEBATE IS ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT EVERYBODY'S
WATCHING.
PEOPLE LOOK AT ONE STORY AND
THEN I'LL SAY WHY ENERGY GOING
AFTER DONALD TRUMP.
THEN I'LL SAY THIS.
THE DEBATES ARE BOTH THERE AND
IT'S GOING TO DEPEND A LOT ON
THE MODERATOR.
>> JUST BE CLEAR, HE, HE MADE
THE IDEA THAT HASN'T BEEN TALKED
ABOUT IN THE LAST COUPLE DAYS.
MANY TIMES THE FACT CHECKER,
THEY DO EXTRAORDINARY WORK AND
CHECK EVERYTHING IN ALMOST
REAL-TIME AND THERE'S A STORY UP
TODAY THAT BASICALLY THEY WENT
OVER AGAIN WHAT DONALD TRUMP
SAID.
HE SAID I WAS AGAINST THE WAR
FROM THE BEGINNING WHEN IN FACT
EVERY FACT CHECK HAS SHOWN
THAT'S NOT THE CASE.
EVERY TIME THAT STATEMENT IS
MADE, THE FACT FACT CHECKER PUTS
THINGS OUT, THEY KNOW THAT'S NOT
ACTUALLY CORRECT.
>> DO YOU THINK HE MEANS WHAT HE
SAYS OR IS THAT ALL PART THE
SHOW.
>> IT DEPENDS WHAT HE'S SAYING.
IT'S HARD TO BELIEVE IN TALKING
TO HIM THAT HE MEANS WHAT HE SAYS.
>> I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO
NOTE THAT THERE IS AN ACCURACY
QUESTION AND THERE'S AN HONESTY
QUESTION AND SO MANY PEOPLE WHO
SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP, IT'S NOT
SO MUCH THE FACT THAT THE
GENUINE PASSION THAT HE ELICITS
WHEN HE SPEAKING.
I THINK IT'S A IMPORTANT
DISTINCTION TO MAKE MAKE AND
ACKNOWLEDGE.
THE FACT THAT HE GETS UP THERE
AND HE SAYS SOMETHING THAT
ALIGNS WITH PEOPLE.
FOR THOSE WHO FEEL THAT THEY
HAVE DISENFRANCHISED THEIR IDEA
OF HOW A POLITICAL LEADER SHOULD
OPERATE AND WHAT THEIR IDEAS
SHOULD BE.
ONE THING THAT'S BEEN SO
IMPORTANT FOR HIS CANDIDACY IS
THAT SKILL IS ONE SKILL THAT
HILLARY CLINTON REALLY STRUGGLES
WITH.
I THINK WE NEED TALK ABOUT THIS
GENUINE QUESTION, A LOT OF
VOTERS ARE WONDERING IF THERE
GENUINELY LISTENING.
>> I AM IMPRESSED WITH HOW MANY
OF OUR INSTITUTIONS ARE BEING
PRIVATIZED AND I SEE THIS AS
POTENTIALLY GIVING OTHER PEOPLE
ASPIRATIONS TO ENTER INTO A
POWER STRUCTURE AND GIVE THEM THE CHANCE.
ARE WE TALKING TO A DAY WHERE WE
ARE GOING TO PROFIT FROM MANY IN
OUR POLITICAL SYSTEM.
>> I'M OUT THERE AND TALKING TO
VOTERS A LOT.
I THINK IN SOME SENSE, YES,
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN DRAWN, IT SEEMS
SO FAR AGO BUT THEY WERE TALKING
ABOUT BERNIE SANDERS AND THE
IMPACT HE WAS HAVING ON THE
DEMOCRATIC PARTY IN THAT PROCESS.
WE'VE SEEN A LOT OF PEOPLE ENTER
INTO THE TWO-PARTY SYSTEM AND
THAT WILL CHANGE WHO PEOPLE PICK
AND HOW THEY PERFORM IN THEIR
VOTE.
>> A LOT OF PEOPLE SEEM TO SAY,
THERE'S CHECKS AND BALANCES,
HE'S NOT REALLY GOING TO DO WHAT
HE SAYS HE'S GOING TO DO, WHAT
REASON DO WE THINK, WITH THE
FORCES THAT HE HAS UNLEASHED AND
THE LEGITIMACY BY THE ATTENTION
GIVEN TO THE RACE AND BIGOTRY
AND THINGS LIKE THAT THAT FORCES
HAVE BEEN UNLEASHED AND THE
CHECKS AND BALANCES WE THINK
EXIST MAYBE WON'T EXIST.
I SAW THEM GETTING INVOLVED, AT
WHAT POINT DO WE BECOME CLOSE TO
A BANANA REPUBLIC?
AT WHAT POINT ARE WE GONNA SAY
HE REALLY DOESN'T MEAN IT.
DOESN'T MATTER IF HE REALLY
DOESN'T MEAN IT IF HE IS REALLY
ABOUT POWER AND THE FORCES THAT
HE HAS UNLEASHED BECOME BIGGER
THAN HIM AND YOU HAVE THE ESSAY
OUT THERE.
>> I'VE HEARD THIS SO MANY TIMES
IT'S REALLY JUST A PRESIDENCY.
THEY'RE NOT KIDDING.
THEY SAY LOOK AT WASHINGTON.
LOOK AT CONGRESS.
REALLY NOT MUCH GET DONE.
IT'S AN IMAGE BUT HE'S A STRONG
GUY AND HE'S NOT THE SAME OLD
THING.
THAT'S WHAT THEY ARE ELECTING IN
FOR SOME AMAZING REASON, WE
STARTED READING OF STORY ABOUT
THE PRESIDENT DOES HAVE A LOT OF
POWER.
IT SEEMS SO OBVIOUS BUT THEY CAN
GET US INTO A LOT OF TROUBLE
VERY QUICKLY.
WE SHOULD KEEP WRITING THAT BECAUSE THAT SEDIMENT IS OUT
THERE.
EVEN MORE THAN THAT, THEY WILL
TALK TO PEOPLE AND THEY'LL SAY
YOU SUPPORT THE MUSLIM BAN, BUT
HOW WOULD THAT WORK EXACTLY.
THEN YOU START TALKING ABOUT THE
MONEY AND HOW IT WORKS AND THEY
SAY WELL WE DON'T THINK HE'S
REALLY GONNA DO THAT.
IT'S IT'S JUST LIKE HE'S GOING
TO BE STRONG AGAINST IT AND
HE'LL BE THINKING ABOUT HOW HE
WANTS TO KEEP THAT.
>> SEEM AT THE WALL.
YOU'RE LIKELY TO MINUTE, IT'S
2000 MILES.
HOW MUCH MONEY WITH THAT COST.
HE'S GETTING THE BENEFIT BECAUSE
PEOPLE WANT HIM TO SAY IT AND
THEY SHOUT AT THE RALLIES.
IT'S THE SENTIMENT, IT'S THAT HE
WANTS TO.
HE IS TELLING US, I HEAR YOU,
YOU'RE FED UP WITH ALL THE
IMMIGRATION AND A LOT OF PEOPLE
WHO THINK THAT NAFTA WAS BAD AND
TOOK THEIR JOBS SO HE'S JUST
BETTER THAN HIS OPPONENTS KIND
OF CONNECTING WITH PEOPLE
THROUGH TV.
>> THERE'S ANOTHER ASPECT TO YOUR QUESTION.
IT COMES FROM THE WORD UNLEASHED
I'VE HAD THIS IN THE BACK OF MY
MIND FOR A LONG TIME, BEFORE THE
ELECTION, BUT IT'S REALLY COMING
TO A PLAY IN THE LAST SEVERAL
MONTHS WHICH IS, I THINK WHAT WE
ARE SAYING HAS BEEN DEVELOPING
AN UNFOLDING AND I'M PACKING
ITSELF FOR 15 OR 20 YEARS.
MAYBE 25 YEARS.
THE SEPARATION, THE RISE OF THE
INTERNET, WE HAVE SEEN A SURGE
IN DEEPENING OF ANTI-
INTELLECTUAL BEHAVIOR AND I SORT
OF FEEL LIKE IT'S COMING TO
PLAY, ALMOST CRESTING WITH THE
ELECTION.
TO ME, THOSE ARE THE
UNDERCURRENTS THAT ARE MORE
TROUBLING BECAUSE IT'S NOT WHO
GETS ELECTED PRESIDENT, IT'S
DEEPER TRENDS IN OUR SOCIETY
WHICH I SUSPECT WILL BE
EXPLORING AFTER THE ELECTION
BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GO
AWAY IMMEDIATELY.
>> I WOULD JUST ADD ONE
CAUTIONARY NOTE.
THERE IS AN ASSUMPTION OFTEN
ABOUT TRUMP'S OPPONENTS THAT THE
RALLIES ARE THESE GATHERINGS OF
EXTREMISTS AND RACES AND SO ON
AND THAT'S JUST NOT THE CASE.
THERE ARE CRAZIES AT HIS RALLY,
TO BE SURE, BUT THERE ARE ALSO A
LOT OF OBAMA TRUMP VOTERS.
THESE ARE THE HOPE AND CHANGE
VOTERS.
WE HAVE PEOPLE WHO SAW SOMEONE
WHO HEARD EXACTLY THE KIND OF
THINGS THAT BOB MENTIONED AND
TOOK THAT TO HEART AND REFLECTED
WHAT FRUSTRATION AND TROUBLES
PEOPLE WERE GOING THROUGH PEOPLE
SEE THAT AND DONALD TRUMP.
>> ONE MUST QUESTION.
[INAUDIBLE]
DOES HE THINK ABOUT HIS OWN
SKILLS.
>> HE KNOWS HE'S GOOD AT
EVERYTHING.
[LAUGHTER]
>> THAT'S WHAT HE WOULD SAY.
PEOPLE RESPOND TO HIS CONFIDENCE
HE HAS SAID HE WILL GET REALLY
SMART PEOPLE AROUND HIM AND IT'S
ALL ABOUT THE CONFIDENCE.
HE HAS NOT SAID WHAT IS ALEPPO
BUT WE DID LEARN HE WOULD'VE
CAUGHT OSAMA BIN LADEN FOR.
I THINK THE UNDERCUT OF YOUR
QUESTION IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO
EXPLORE.
THROUGHOUT THIS COUNTRY, WHAT IS
THE REQUIREMENT FOR PRESIDENT.
FOR DONALD TRUMP HE SAID WHAT
THE REQUIREMENT WAS 30 YEARS AGO
AND HE REITERATED IT 20 YEARS
AGO AND THAT WAS THE PERSON WHO
COULD REINVIGORATE THE SPIRIT OF
AMERICA WHO HAS BOLDNESS AND
POMPOSITY.
THOSE ARE HIS WORD.
DOES HE THINK HE FITS THE
REQUIREMENT?
ABSOLUTELY.
THE QUESTION IS SORT OF A VALUES
QUESTION AND THAT'S WHERE THINGS
GET INTERESTING.
HE HAS ALWAYS HAD THIS VERY
SMALL CIRCLE OF PEOPLE HE CAN
REALLY RELY ON.
THEY'RE USUALLY CORE FAMILY MEMBERS.
AT THE CASINOS THERE WAS ONE OR
TWO PEOPLE WHO DIED IN A
HELICOPTER CRASH AND TIME AND
TIME AGAIN YOU SEE THERE IS ONE
TO VITAL PEOPLE WHO CAN TELL HIM
WHAT TO DO.
HE DOESN'T LIKE TO BE TOLD HE'S
WRONG.
OFTEN TIMES YOU SEE PEOPLE BEING
FIRED.
YOU SEE IT AGAIN IN THIS
CAMPAIGN.
HE'S GONE THROUGH TO CAMPAIGN
MANAGERS ALREADY IN THIS
CAMPAIGN.
HE WOULD HAVE TO TACKLE MANY
ISSUES THAT HE DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT.
HOW WOULD HE ORGANIZE THAT AND
EMPHASIZE THAT.
>> HE TALKS ABOUT GETTING THINGS
DONE.
HE THINKS THE BEST WAY IS AN
ARMY OF ONE AND IT'S HARD TO RUN
A COUNTRY WITH ONE PERSON.
I THINK THIS WOULD BE A KEY
THING BECAUSE HILLARY CLINTON,
IT'S POLAR OPERA SITE.
SHE'S HAD ALL THIS EXPERIENCE IN
GOVERNMENT AND HE IS CERTAINLY
GOING TO ANSWER THIS AND SAY HE
HAS THE TEMPERAMENT, HE IS SHOWN
THROUGH HIS BUSINESSES AND HAS
THE CONFIDENCE TO GET THE RIGHT
PEOPLE. >> IF HE'S RIGHT HE WILL
COMPLETELY REDEFINE WHAT IT
MEANS TO BE PRESIDENT GIVEN HIS
BIOGRAPHY, HIS TRACK RECORD, HIS
LACK OF EXPERIENCE IN THE PUBLIC
LIFE.
IF HE'S RIGHT, HE WILL BE THE
FIRST PERSON TO COME THIS FAR IN
AN ELECTION CAMPAIGN. IF HE'S ELECTED, HE WILL BREAK
ALL THE MOTES.
>> HE HAS AN ANSWER FOR
QUESTION.
WHEN THINGS GO RIGHT, HE KNEW
WHAT TO DO AND HE TAKES ALL THE
CREDIT.
WHEN THINGS GO WRONG AND HE
SHOWED THIS IN VARIOUS STAGES
THROUGHOUT THE CAREER, BUT THEN
THE SYSTEM IS RIGGED.
WE'VE HEARD THESE WORDS FROM HIM
AND THAT IS EXACTLY THE PHRASE
HE USES THROUGHOUT HIS LIFE
WHETHER HE'S FACING TROUBLE OR FAILURE.
WHEN WE SEE THAT NOW YOU CAN
SORT OF SEE THAT HE'S NOT
OBLIVIOUS TO THE POSITION IN THE
POOL AND HE'S PREPARING HIMSELF
AND ALL OF US FOR THE MESSAGE
THAT HE WILL HAVE IF HE LOSES.
I THINK WE HAVE TO LEAVE IT
THERE, BUT THANK YOU FOR COMING
OUT.
[APPLAUSE]
[INAUDIBLE CONVERSATION]
>> NOW THE LAST PROGRAM ON A
BLOCK OF PROGRAMS ABOUT HILLARY
CLINTON AND DONALD TRUMP.
THE AUTHORS OF CLINTON CASH,
CLEAN CLEAN HOUSE AND PARTNERS
IN CRIME GOOD MORNING, I'M
PRESIDENT OF JUDICIAL WATCH,
WELCOME TO OUR EDUCATIONAL PANEL
ON THE CLINTON SCANDAL UPDATE.
JOINING US IS AN EXPERT PANEL OF
CLINTON WATCHERS WHO HAVE
EXAMINED HER CAREER OVER THE
DECADES AND HAVE MADE SOME, HAS
SOME PRETTY STARTLING
INFORMATION FOR YOU AS WE BEGIN
THIS PANEL.
JUDICIAL WATCH IS A NINE
PARTISAN EDUCATIONAL FOUNDATION.
WE PROSECUTE GOVERNMENT
CORRUPTION WHEREVER WE FIND IT
WHETHER IT IS REPUBLICAN OR
DEMOCRAT AND JUDICIAL WATCH IS PLEASED TO BE ABLE TO PRESENT
YOU THE SPECIAL PANEL ON
FACEBOOK LIFE, THE Y AMERICAN
NEWS NETWORK AND C-SPAN. WELCOME.
TO PROVIDE YOU SOME CONTEXT
BEFORE I INTRODUCE OUR PANELIST,
I THOUGHT I WOULD GIVE YOU A
BRIEF UPDATE ON THE CLINTON
E-MAIL MATTER