MEN COMING TO POWER IN THE UNITED STATES.
OF COURSE IT IS HORRIFYING, VERY
OPPRESSIVE, DICTATORIAL STATE SO
I WANTED TO SEE WHAT THERE WAS
PARTICULARLY IN THOSE BOOKS.
YOU HAVE TO WATCH THIS REALLY
WEIRD MOVIE IDIOTIC WITH THE --
YOU SEE GLIMMERS.
THE APPEAL, THERE WAS A FAMOUS
MOMENT I CAN'T REMEMBER WHICH
PRIMARY, ARIZONA AFTER ARIZONA. I LOVE THE POORLY EDUCATED
BECAUSE HE HAD DONE SO WELL IN
THAT DEMOGRAPHIC.
IN THOSE BOOKS THE LEADERS THAT
BECOME TOTALITARIAN FIGURES HAD
STRONG APPEAL AMONG WHAT WE NOW
CALL LOW INFORMATION VOTERS.
YOU SEE SOME PARALLELS, AND
EXPECTATION THAT THERE IS
SOMETHING WRONG IS THESE ARE
VERY DYSTOPIAN NOVEL TO GO MUCH
FURTHER THAN I THINK DONALD
TRUMP WOULD EVER GO.
THERE ARE THESE KIND OF
INTERLUDES IN HISTORY AND
SINCLAIR LEWIS, WHAT HAPPENED,
EXCUSE ME, IN THE PLOT AGAINST
AMERICA, CHARLES LINDBERGH COMES
TO POWER AND THE COUNTRY
HORRIBLY FOR TWO YEARS AND
DISAPPEARS AND ROOSEVELT COMES
BACK AND EVERYTHING PICKS UP AS
WE KNOW IT. WHICH CAN HAPPEN IN REAL LIFE.
I WAS LOOKING FOR INSPIRATION IN
FICTION AND I THINK THERE ARE
ELEMENTS THAT YOU RECOGNIZE IN
TRUMP'S PERSONAL STYLE AND
RHETORIC AND HIS APPEAL TO THE
AUDIENCE. >> THE MOST IMPORTANT THING I
LEARNED AT WORK, MISTER TRUMP
WRITES, IS NOT TO BE OVERLY
IMPRESSED BY ACADEMIC
CREDENTIALS. DIDN'T TAKE ME LONG TO REALIZE
THERE IS ANYTHING AWESOME OR
EXCEPTIONAL ABOUT MY CLASSMATES.
MICHAEL KRUSE, LET'S GO BACK TO
WHERE WE STARTED.
IS THIS CAMPAIGN PLAYBOOK?
>> IT CAN BE SEEN AS SUCH.
THERE ARE LOTS OF BOOKS HE HAS
WRITTEN OR COWRITTEN OR BEEN
WRITTEN FOR HIM THAT ALL ADDED
UP, THE CAMPAIGN PLAYBOOK FOR
DONALD TRUMP.
>> MONICA LANGLEY.
>> I SAY DEFINITIVELY YES.
IT IS CLASSIC DONALD TRUMP AND
ELEMENTS OF THE DEAL, THE
ELEMENTS OF HIS CAMPAIGN.
>> MONICA LANGLEY, MICHAEL
KRUSE, CARLOS LOZADA, THANK YOU
FOR BEING ON THIS ROUNDTABLE ON
BookTV.
>> NEXT UP ON OUR BLOCK OF
PROGRAMS ABOUT DONALD TRUMP,
TRUMP REVEALED, WITH AUTHORS
MARC FISHER AND MICHAEL KRANISH.
>> WHY DON'T WE GET STARTED?
MY NAME IS MARTY BARRON,
EXECUTIVE EDITOR OF THE WASHINGTON POST.
WE ARE EXCITED THAT ALL OF YOU
CAME OUT THIS EVENING, TO
WELCOME YOU HERE.
TONIGHT YOU ARE GOING TO GET THE
CHANCE TO MEET SOME OF THE
JOURNALISTS AND EDITORS OF
"TRUMP REVEALED: AN AMERICAN
JOURNEY OF AMBITION, EGO, MONEY AND POWER".
THIS WAS AN EXHAUSTIVELY
RESEARCHED BOOK ABOUT THE LIFE
AND CAREER OF DONALD TRUMP.
THE POST HAS A LONG TRADITION
WITH THE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEES
OF EACH MAJOR PARTY AND THIS
YEAR DONALD TRUMP'S SHALL WE SAY
NOVEL AND OVERSIZED PRESENCE IN
THE POLITICAL ARENA, AND
OPPORTUNITY TO DO A BOOK.
WE ARE ESPECIALLY GRATEFUL, ALL
THESE FOLKS WHO CAME IN ON TIME
FOR MAKING THAT POSSIBLE.
I WANT TO MENTION WE HAVE
PUBLISHER NAN BROWN, THERE WE
GO.
[APPLAUSE]
>> EDITOR IN CHIEF COLIN
HARRISON.
YOU ALL WORKED INCREDIBLY FAST
AND INCREDIBLY HARD AND WITH
SKILL THROUGHOUT AND WE ARE
GRATEFUL.
FROM THE POST THERE ARE TWO
DOESN'T JOURNALISTS WHO WORKED
ON THIS BOOK.
THEY NEEDED TO GO VERY DEEP.
THAT IS WHY WE DEPLOYED SUCH A
LARGE SCHEME. SCOTT WILSON, OUR NATIONAL
EDITOR WHO COULD NOT BE HERE
THIS EVENING ASSEMBLED THAT
TEAM, FLOWING FROM EVERY
DEPARTMENT IN OUR NEWSROOM.
ALL THAT CAME TOGETHER IN A
MATTER OF MONTHS.
THIS EVENING YOU WILL HEAR FROM
FIVE OF THE PEOPLE WHO WORKED ON
THIS BOOK AND WITH THE
CO-AUTHORS, MICHAEL KRANISH WHO
IS HERE AND MARC FISHER WHO IS
BEHIND ME AND I WILL STEP AWAY,
THE PRIMARY AUTHORS OF "TRUMP
REVEALED: AN AMERICAN JOURNEY OF AMBITION, EGO, MONEY AND POWER,"
EVERYONE CONTRIBUTED TO IT.
THIS IS A CONFERENCE OF
EXAMINATION OF DONALD TRUMP'S
LIFE, HIS PERSONALITY, HIS
PERSONAL FEELINGS AND
LONG-RUNNING ENCOUNTERS WITH
POLITICIANS.
WE BELIEVE THIS IS THE KIND OF
IN-DEPTH REPORTING WE EXPECT
FROM THE POST AND WITH THAT A
SPECIAL PLEASURE FOR ME TO
INTRODUCE TODAY'S MODERATOR AND
ONE OF THE CO-AUTHORS OF THE BOOK "TRUMP REVEALED: AN
AMERICAN JOURNEY OF AMBITION,
EGO, MONEY AND POWER," SENIOR EDITOR MARC FISHER.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING OUT,
A BIG CROWD BUT I UNDERSTAND
MANY OF YOU ARE HERE, ONE THING
WE CAN'T FIND ENOUGH OF THESE
DAYS IS INFORMATION ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP. THAT IS KIND OF TRUE BECAUSE HE
IS THE FIRST MAJOR PARTY
CANDIDATE IN 60 YEARS SINCE
DWIGHT EISENHOWER WHO HAS NOT PREVIOUSLY HELD ELECTED OFFICE.
THAT MEANS HE HAS NOT BEEN
VETTED IN THE WAY MOST POLITICIANS ARE AS A MATTER OF
COURSE AS THEY RUN FOR THEIR
OFFICE.
OBVIOUSLY HE HAS HAD CELEBRITY
FOR DECADES.
CELEBRITY IS A DIFFERENT KIND OF ATTENTION FROM HAVING YOUR LIFE
AND CAREER, BACKGROUND
RIGOROUSLY EXAMINED IN A WAY
THAT WOULD HELP VOTERS UNDERSTAND HOW YOU THINK, HOW
YOU MAKE DECISIONS, WHAT YOU
REALLY BELIEVE IN.
MAKING THE ROUNDS ON TV,
PROMOTION OF THIS BOOK, WE FOUND
THE SINGLE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY TO
SELL THIS BOOK WAS ONE SINGLE
TWEET FROM DONALD JADE TRUMP,
LATE OF JAMAICA ESTATES NEW
YORK, THE BOOK WAS ACTUALLY
RELEASED, HE PUT OUT A TWEET
SAYING, CALLING THE BOOK A JOB
SAYING IT WAS BORING AND YOU
SHOULDN'T BUY IT.
OUR NUMBERS WENT SOARING AFTER
THAT.
TREMENDOUSLY GRATEFUL TO HIM SINCE HE INFORMED THE MILLION --
11 MILLION OF HIS CLOSEST
FRIENDS ABOUT THE BOOK.
WHAT WAS FASCINATING ABOUT THAT
WAS HE COULD NOT HELP HIMSELF.
ANY RATIONAL CAMPAIGN ADVISOR
WOULD HAVE TOLD HIM TO IGNORE IT
BUT HE COULDN'T HELP HIMSELF SO
HE DID THIS.
THIS WAS CONFIRMATION OF
SOMETHING IN THE BOOK, THIS IS A
MAN WHO DEEPLY BELIEVES THE
PROPER RESPONSE, THE ONLY PROPER
RESPONSE TO ANYTHING THAT COULD
BE AT ALL CRITICAL IS TO ATTACK
AND ATTACK HARD.
THE DERIVATION OF THAT
CHARACTERISTIC OF DONALD TRUMP,
NOT ONLY TO HIS CHILDHOOD, A
FATHER TAUGHT HIM TO BE A KILLER
AND WARNED HIM AGAINST BEING
NOTHING BUT ALSO TO HIS
RELATIONSHIP WITH WORK, HOME,
THE INFAMOUS NEW YORK ATTORNEY
WHICH WAS HIS MENTOR WHEN HE WAS
JUST STARTING OUT ON HIS OWN IN
BUSINESS.
MARTY BARRON, THE ORIGINS OF
THIS BOOK, A LITTLE MORE ON THAT
BEFORE WE GET INTO THE DISCUSSION.
THIS BOOK CAME TOGETHER IN LATE
MARCH.
BACK TO THE PRIMARY SEASON, IT
BECAME VERY CLEAR DONALD TRUMP
WAS THE LIKELY NOMINEE.
AT THAT POINT THIS TEAM OF 20
REPORTERS WAS PUT TOGETHER.
THE DEAL WE STRUCK THAT CAME,
WAS SIGNED ON A THURSDAY, THE
PLAN WAS TO ANNOUNCE IT TO THE
PUBLIC THE FOLLOWING MONDAY. THE NEXT DAY, FRIDAY, I CALLED
HOPE HITS, DONALD TRUMP'S PRESS
SECRETARY, TO LET HER KNOW THIS
WOULD BE ON THE FOLLOWING MONDAY
AND ASKED HER, WE WANTED TO HAVE
A SERIES OF INTERVIEWS WITH
DONALD TRUMP, GET AS MUCH OF HIS
TIME AS WE COULD BECAUSE
ALTHOUGH WE HAD A LARGE GROUP OF
REPORTERS DIGGING INTO EVERY
ASPECT OF TRUMP'S LIFE, HE HAD DOCUMENTS, TALKING TO EVERYONE
FROM HIS FRIEND AND CLASSMATE
AND NEIGHBORS THROUGH HIS
BUSINESS ASSOCIATES, PARTNERS,
COMPETITORS, CONTRACTORS AND SO
ON.
WE WANTED AS MUCH TIME AS WE
COULD GET WITH THEM. I EXPLAINED THE DEAL WE MADE AND
THE BOOK WE WOULD BE DOING A LOT
OF REPORTERS WOULD BE CALLING
THEM AND SHE CUT ME OFF AND SAID
WE ARE PROFITEERING OFF OF
MISTER TRUMP.
WHICH WAS KIND OF CURIOUS GIVEN
THAT HE SPENT A LOT OF HIS TIME
TALKING TO REPORTERS,
PROFIT-MAKING INSTITUTIONS. SHE WAS NOT OPEN TO THAT LINE OF
REASONING AND CUT OFF THE
CONVERSATION AND THAT WE WILL NOT COOPERATE WITH THIS BOOK,
YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN.
IT WAS A FAIRLY LIKELY OUTCOME ANYWAY THAT DID NOT AFFECT OUR
PLAN HOW TO REPORT ON THIS BOOK
BUT LOW AND BEHOLD THE FOLLOWING
MONDAY SHE CALLED BACK AND SAID
SHE HAD A CHANCE TO AS SHE PUT
IT TELL MISTER TRUMP ABOUT YOUR
FABULOUS IDEA AND HE ACTUALLY
LIKED THE IDEA AND WANTED US TO
COME TO TRUMP TOWER AS OFTEN AS
WE LIKE AND AS LONG AS WE LIKE
TO SEE THE BOOK IS FAIR AND
ACCURATE AND GET THE REAL STORY
OUT ABOUT HIS LIFE WHEN INTERESTING CURIOSITY IS HIS OWN
PRESS SECRETARY WORKED WITH HIM
FOR A NUMBER OF MONTHS, HE WOULD
VERY MUCH LIKE THE OPPORTUNITY
TO TALK ABOUT HIS FAVORITE
SUBJECT, HIMSELF.
AS WE TALKED TO TRUMP IN THE
WEEKS THAT FOLLOWED HE REGULARLY
EXTENDED OUR INTERVIEW TIME,
DOUBLED AND TRIPLED THE AMOUNT
OF TIME HE SPENT WITH US, SOME
HE ANSWERED IN MORE DETAIL THAN
OTHERS, BUT HE SPOKE WITH A
NUMBER OF REPORTERS ON THE
PHONE, AS THEY WENT INTO GREATER
DEPTH THAT THEY WERE DIGGING
INTO, WE HAD PEOPLE WORKING ON
THIS BOOK WHO WERE EXPERTS IN
REPORTING IN ATLANTIC CITY ON
FINANCES, ORGANIZED CRIME
CONNECTIONS, LOOKED INTO BRIEF
EXPERIENCE AS A SPORTS FRANCHISE
IN THE FOOTBALL LEAGUE.
EVERY CHAPTER OF HIS LIFE.
ONE OF THE GOALS IS COMPLETENESS
AND ANOTHER, TRANSPARENCY.
WE KNOW THE DOCUMENT IN THE BOOK
DONALD TRUMP IS HIGHLY LITIGIOUS
PERSON, HE HAS SUED THE AUTHOR
OF THE PREVIOUS BIOGRAPHY FOR
$5 BILLION.
WE ASKED, A CERTAIN CURIOSITY
ABOUT THAT, WE ASKED ABOUT THAT
CASE, HE SAID HE NEVER READ THE
BOOK. I WAS PUZZLED BY THAT. HOW DO YOU GO ABOUT SUING
SOMEBODY FOR $5 BILLION WHEN YOU
NEVER READ THE BOOK?
HE SAID PEOPLE TOLD ME IT WAS A
BAD BOOK.
A CLASSIC TRUMP IS HIM, HE
DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING UNTOWARD
ABOUT THAT.
HE WAS VERY GRACIOUS, VERY
GENEROUS WITH HIS TIME, ANSWERED
QUESTIONS BUT EVERY ONCE IN A
WHILE WOULD SLIP IN A THREAD
ABOUT HOW IF IT WAS A BAD BOOK
AS HE PUT IT HE WOULD COME AFTER
US AND COME AFTER THE POST.
THERE WAS THIS ALTERNATING GRACIOUSNESS AND TENSION THROUGH
THE WHOLE RELATIONSHIP WE HAD
WITH HIM.
THIS KIND OF APPROACH, A GOOD
BOOK OR A BAD BOOK, SOMETHING
SHOT THROUGH THE BOOK, SHOT
THROUGH HIS LIFE, ONE OF THE
THINGS THAT MAKES HIM DECIDE
WHETHER A BOOK OR ARTICLE IS
GOOD OR BAD IS WHETHER IT
QUESTIONS THE EXTENT OF HIS
WEALTH.
>> AWAY DO -- WE DO HAVE WAYS OF
COMING TO THE CONCLUSION THAT
HE'S NOT WORTH WHAT HE SAYS HE
IS.
AND, IN FACT, IN A DEPOSITION IN
THE CASE WHICH WE HAVE AS PART
OF THE ARCHIVE THAT BACKS UP
THIS BOOK, TRUMP WAS ASKED
DIRECTLY HOW DO YOU COME UP WITH
THIS NUMBER THAT YOU BANDY ABOUT
ABOUT HOW MUCH YOU'RE WORTH?
AND HE SAID, QUOTE: IT DEPENDS
ON HOW I FEELEN ON A GIVEN --
FEEL ON A GIVEN DAY.
[LAUGHTER]
NOW, THERE'S ACTUALLY SOMETHING
LEGITIMATE ABOUT THAT BECAUSE
HIS BRAND IS HIS NAME, AND HIS
NAME IS WHAT GIVES VALUE TO MANY
OF HIS PROPERTIES AND OTHER
BUSINESSES, AND SO PEOPLE DECIDE
TO STAY AT A TRUMP HOTEL OR GO
TO A TRUMP GOLF COURSE IN PART
BECAUSE OF THAT NAME.
SO THERE'S A CLEAR VALUE TO IT.
AND PUTTING A NUMBER TO THAT
VALUE IS MORE AN ART THAN A
SCIENCE.
BUT HOW HE ASSESSES HIMSELF,
TAKES THE ACTUAL ASSESSED VALUE
OF PROPERTIES THAT ANYONE CAN
LOOK UP ON THE TAX ROLLS, AND HE
ADDS THE VALUE THAT HE CONNECTS
FROM HIS NAME, HIS REPUTATION
AND HIS BRAND.
ISSO HE IS A TRICKY FIGURE TO
WRITE ABOUT IN THAT SENSE.
IN FACT, WHEN HE WAS -- COMEDY
CENTRAL, THE CABLE CHANNEL, WAS
GOING TO DO A ROAST OF DONALD
TRUMP SOME YEARS BACK, AND THE
DIRECTIONS WENT OUT TO THE
COMEDIANS WHO WERE GOING TO BE
ROASTING HIM THAT, UNLIKE MOST
OF THESE ROASTS, HIS FAMILY IS
FAIR GAME.
YOU CAN JOKE ABOUT HIS KIDS, HIS
BACKGROUND, ANY OF THAT IS
TOTALLY FAIR.
ONLY ONE THING THEY WERE TOLD
THEY MAY NOT JOKE ABOUT, AND
THAT WAS THE EXTENT OF HIS
WEALTH.
[LAUGHTER]
SO HE'S A TRICKY CHARACTER TO
WRITE ABOUT, BUT WE DID HAVE
THIS GREAT TEAM OF FOLKS WHO
YOU'RE GOING TO HEAR FROM
TONIGHT, AND I WANT TO TURN OVER
TO MICHAEL KRANISH, MY
CO-WRITER, WHO WILL GIVE YOU A
COUPLE EXAMPLES OF THE THINGS
THAT MADE DONALD TRUMP WHAT HE
ISED TODAY.
WHAT HE IS TODAY.
[APPLAUSE]
>> THANK YOU, MARC.
THANK EVERYBODY FOR COMING OUT HERE.
IT'S A GREAT HONOR TO BE PART OF THIS PROJECT.
I DON'T KNOW IF FOLKS KNOW THIS,
BUT WHEN I WAS A KID GROWING UP
IN D.C., I WAS A WASHINGTON POST
PAPER BOY FOR ABOUT FIFE YEARS.
[LAUGHTER]
-- FIVE YEARS.
I'M THRILLED TO BE HERE WORKING
ON THIS PROJECT.
I WANT TO TELL YOU A STORY THAT
EXPLAINS WHY I THINK BIOGRAPHY
IS SO IMPORTANT IN WRITING ABOUT
A PRESIDENTIAL BE CANDIDATE.
WE DO FANTASTIC STORIES, AND
BIOGRAPHY IS SORT OF THE THREAD
THAT WE TRY TO PUT TOGETHER.
BECAUSE IN THE CASE OF DONALD
TRUMP, YOU HAVE A MAN WHO HAS
NEVER RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE OR
HELD PUBLIC OFFICE, SO THERE'S
AN AWFUL LOT THAT WE DON'T KNOW
ABOUT HIM, EVEN THOUGH HE'S ONE
OF THE MOST COVERED FIGURES OF
OUR GENERATION.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT A PERSON'S
LIFE, HOW THEY'VE DEALT WITH
CRISES, THAT TO ME IS ONE OF THE
MOST IMPORTANT THINGS.
SOMEONE WHO HAS DEALT WITH DARK
MOMENTS IN THEIR LIFE AND,
CERTAINLY, DONALD TRUMP FITS
THAT CATEGORY VERY, VERY WELL.
SO I WANT TO TAKE YOU TO THE
MORNING OF OCTOBER 10TH OF 1989
IN ATLANTIC CITY.
IT'S A BRIGHT, SUNNY DAY, AND
THREE OF DONALD TRUMP'S TOP
CASINO EXECUTIVES -- HE'S GOT
TWO AT THIS MOMENT X HE'S ABOUT
TO OPEN A THIRD, THE TAJ MAHAL.
AND THESE THREE EXECUTIVES ARE
ABOUT TO TAKE A HELICOPTER RIDE
TO NEW YORK CITY TO MEET WITH
DONALD TRUMP AND TO PROMOTE A
BOXING MATCH TO BE HELD AT ONE
OF HIS CASINOS.
SO THE THREE MEN GET ONBOARD A
SIKORSKY HELICOPTER, THEY HAVE A
PRESS CONFERENCE AT THE PLAZA
HOTEL IN NEW YORK, THEY MEET
WITH DONALD TRUMP AT THE TRUMP
TOWER ON THE 26TH FLOOR.
THE MEETING GOES A LITTLE BIT
LONG, AND THEY CAN NO LONGER
TAKE THE SIKORSKY BACK TO
ATLANTIC CITY, SO THEY TAKE AN
ITALIAN-MADE AUGUSTA HELICOPTER.
THEY BOARD THE HELICOPTER, AND A
FEW MINUTES INTO THE FLIGHT
THEY'RE OVER THE GARDEN STATE
PARKWAY, AND WHAT THEY COULDN'T
HAVE KNOWN WAS THAT THERE WAS A
SMALL SCRATCH ON ONE OF THE
ROTOR BLADES AND THAT HELICOPTER
BASICALLY BURST APART, AND THE
THREE MEN AND THE TWO CREW WERE
KILLED.
IT IS ONE OF THE MOST TRAGIC
DAYS IN DONALD TRUMP'S LIFE ASK,
CERTAINLY, FOR THE PEOPLE KILLED
IN THAT TRAGEDY.
FOR DONALD TRUMP, I ASKED HIM
ABOUT THIS, I TALKED TO HIM
EXTENSIVELY ABOUT THIS INCIDENT,
AND HE DOES SAY ASIDE FROM THE
DEATHS OF HIS PARENTS AND HIS
BROTHER, FRED JR., THIS WAS THE
MOST DIFFICULT DAY OF HIS LIFE.
THESE MEN WERE IN CHARGE OF
MAKING SURE HE WOULD BE
SUCCESSFUL.
DONALD TRUMP HAD BUILT SOME
BUILDINGS IN NEW YORK CITY, AND
HE WAS TAKING A BIG GAMBLE IN
ATLANTIC CITY.
AT THAT TIME THIS WAS THE ONLY
LEGAL CASINO OPERATION ON THE
EAST COAST, SO HE HAD TWO
CASINOS, WAS ABOUT TO OPEN A
THIRD, AND SUDDENLY THE PEOPLE
WHO WERE IN CHARGE OF THAT HAD PERISHED.
DONALD TRUMP HAD NOT REALLY
FOCUSED HIMSELF ON THAT
BUSINESS.
IN FACT, AT THE TIME HE WAS
HAVING AN AFFAIR WITH MARLA
MAPLES, AND AS HE SAID IN
INTERVIEWS FOR THIS BOOK, HE HAD
TAKEN HIS EYE OFF THE BALL, AND
SUDDENLY HE REALIZED HE WAS IN
DEEP, DEEP TROUBLE.
SO THERE WAS ONE PERSON HE GOT A
PHONE CALL FROM SHORTLY AFTER THE ACCIDENT.
THAT MAN'S NAME WAS JOHN
O'DONNELL, AND O'DONNELL WAS
SUPPOSED TO HAVE BEEN ON THE
HELICOPTER RIDE, BUT INSTEAD HE
WAS IN HAWAII COMPETING IN AN
ATHLETIC EVENT, AND HE'D SENT A
JUNIOR EXECUTIVE.
DONALD NOW BASICALLY HAD ALL
THIS OPERATION ON HIS SHOULDERS,
AND DONALD TRUMP MET WITH HIM
WHEN HE CAME BACK FROM HAWAII,
AND HE SAID NOW IT'S YOUR TURN,
AND THEN HE SAID, DON'T LEAVE
ME.
AND O'DONNELL LATER SAID THIS
WAS THE FIRST TIME HE'D SEEN
SUCH FEAR AND UNCERTAINTY IN
DONALD TRUMP'S EYES AND VOICE.
AND LONG STORY SHORT BECAUSE I
WANT TO GIVE EVERYBODY A CHANCE
TO TALK AND QUESTIONS AND SO
FORTH.
WHAT HAPPENED NEXT WAS THINGS
HAD GOTTEN SO BAD, DONALD TRUMP
HAD GONE SO DEEPLY IN DEBT THAT
THERE WERE GREAT, GREAT PROBLEMS
DESPITE THE PUBLIC ACCLAIM FOR
THE OPENING OF THE TAJ MAHAL,
AND PRETTY SOON ALL THREE
CASINOS WENT INTO BANKRUPTCY,
AND A LOT OF PEOPLE WERE FIRED.
DONALD TRUMP SAID SOMEBODY WHO
WAS RUNNING THE CASINO BE HAD A
TYPE C PERSONALITY, AND HE BLAMED OTHERS.
BUT AS I MENTIONED, HE ALSO TOLD
US HE'D TAKEN HIS EYE OFF THE BALL.
WE TELL THE STORY ABOUT HOW HE
MANAGED TO SURVIVE THE ORDEAL OF
HIS CAREER IN ATLANTIC CITY, AND
THE FACT THAT HE DID SURVIVE
TELLS YOU SOMETHING.
HE BASICALLY HAD TO LOOK OUT FOR
HIMSELF, AND AS HE TOLD US, I
WAS LOOKING OUT FOR DONALD
TRUMP, I NEEDED TO SURVIVE, AND
THAT'S WHAT MATTERED AT THE MOMENT.
AND HE DID SURVIVE.
SO WITH THAT STORY, YOU
UNDERSTAND WHY THOSE WHO
UNDERESTIMATE HIM WOULD DO SO AT
THEIR PERIL. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
[APPLAUSE]
>> SO I'M GOING TO TURN TO SOME
OF THE OTHER REPORTERS WHO
WORKED ON THE BOOK.
BOB O'HARE ROW WAS A REPORTER IN
THE POST INVESTIGATIONS UNIT,
AND HE DID SOME OF THE VERY
DIFFICULT DOCUMENT WORK ON THIS
BOOK AS WELL AS FINDING SOME
PEOPLE WHO WOULD TALK ABOUT THAT
PERIOD THAT MICHAEL WAS JUST
TALKING ABOUT IN ATLANTIC CITY.
SOME VERY ROUGH TIMES FOR DONALD
TRUMP.
AND, BOB, YOU LEARNED A LOT
ABOUT TRUMP'S BUSINESS STYLE AND
ABOUT THE KINDS OF CHARACTERS HE
WAS WILLING TO ASSOCIATE HIMSELF
WITH IN ORDER TO GET A START IN
A VERY ROUGH AND TUMBLE OF
ATLANTIC CITY'S CASINO WORLD.
TALK TO US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.
>> IT'S ACTUALLY REMARKABLE
BECAUSE IT WAS A LONG TIME AGO,
BUT IT FEELS VERY FRESH.
AND I THINK PREDICTIVE IN SOME
WAYS ABOUT THE TYPE OF
PERSONALITY THAT HE IS.
PROBABLY THE MOST FORMIDABLE
CHARACTER THAT HE CONNECTED
HIMSELF WITH WAS ROY COHN, AND
IF PEOPLE DON'T REMEMBER ROY
COHN, HE'S WORTH LOOKING INTO.
HE WAS THE BRAINS BEHIND THE
McCARTHY HEARINGS IN THE '50s.
AND HE WAS A BRILLIANT,
SOMETHING OF A PRODIGY AS A
YOUNG MAN AND WAS PRETTY MUCH A
SAVAGE LEGAL MIND WHO FOCUSED ON
ATTACKING AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE
AND NEVER APOLOGIZING.
AND HE RAN INTO TRUMP IN EARLY
'70s, AND TRUMP EMBRACED HIM,
AND THEY BECAME, THEY DEVELOPED
AN INTERESTING RELATIONSHIP THAT
WAS BOTH LEGAL AND A FRIENDSHIP.
AND COHN SORT OF SQUIRED HIM
AROUND NEW YORK, INTRODUCED HIM
TO A LOT OF POWERFUL PEOPLE.
AND I THINK THAT THAT WAS
PROBABLY, SET THE TONE FOR MUCH
OF THE REST OF HIS CAREER.
COHN REPRESENTED HIM THROUGH THE
'80s, AND THERE ARE QUALITIES
THAT WE SEE IN DONALD TRUMP NOW,
SOME OF THE HARSHER QUALITIES
THAT ARE REMARKABLY SIMILAR TO
ROY COHN'S METHODS AND DEMEANOR.
>> AND JUST BRIEFLY, TELL US A
LITTLE BIT ABOUT ASSEMBLING THE
DOCUMENTS THAT GAVE US INSIGHTS
INTO TRUMP'S FINANCES IN THAT
PERIOD.
>> OH, THERE'S A MASSIVE TROVE
OF INFORMATION, AND WE PROBABLY
TAPPED, WELL, WE TAPPED A LOT OF
IT, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF
MATERIAL TO BE EXAMINED.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE FOUND
IS THAT DONALD TRUMP HAS
SURROUNDED HIMSELF IN COMPLEXITY
AND KIND OF A CLOUD OF OBSCURITY
THROUGHOUT HIS CAREER.
DEALS ARE COMPLEX, ANSWERS ARE
COMPLEX AND VAGUE OFTEN TIMES,
AND THE DOCUMENTS THAT WE WERE
ABLE THE COMPILE PARTICULARLY
FROM THE CASINO CONTROL
COMMISSION IN NEW JERSEY HELPED
US TO CUT THROUGH THE FOG OF
OBFUSCATION AND TO GET TO PARTICULARS.
AND THE ONE THAT WAS MOST
STRIKING TO ME -- AND IT WAS SO
STRIKING I ACTUALLY DID NOT
BELIEVE IT FOR A WHILE UNTIL I
REPORTED IT THOROUGHLY AND
REALIZED IT WAS TRUE, WAS THAT
WHEN DONALD TRUMP WAS TRYING TO
GET HIS THIRD CASINO, THE TAJ,
HE HAD TO SHOW THAT HE WAS
FINANCIALLY CAPABLE OF MANAGING
HIMSELF AND MAKING IT THRIVE.
AND HE PROMISED THE REGULATORS
THAT HE WAS NOT GOING TO USE
JUNK BONDS TO FINANCE THE TAJ.
AND IN THE, HIS TESTIMONY WHICH
IS IN BLACK AND WHITE, YOU CAN
ACTUALLY READ IT ONLINE, HE SAYS
THAT PEOPLE THAT USE JUNK BONDS
ARE LOSERS, IN EFFECT, AND THAT
THEY'RE STUPID, AND THAT
COMPANIES THAT USE JUNK BONDS
ARE, IN EFFECT, JUNK.
AND IT WAS ONLY -- AND THEY
APPROVED HIS MOVE TO GO FORWARD,
AND IT WAS ONLY A FEW MONTHS
LATER THAT HE COULD NOT RAISE
THE MONEY AT THE LOW PRIME RATES
THAT HE HAD PROMISED AND USED
JUNK BONDS.
AND IN MAKING THAT DECISION AND
ACTUALLY SIGNING OFF ON THOSE
JUNK BONDS, HE SEALED HIS FATE
AND HIS WHOLE EMPIRE WAS ALMOST
CERTAIN TO GO DOWN THE TUBES AS
WAS PREDICTED BY A FINANCIAL
ANALYST WHO WAS WATCHING
EVERYTHING VERY CLOSELY.
SO THAT'S THE KIND OF DETAIL WE
WERE ABLE TO MINE TO GET TO THE
PARTICULARS RATHER THAN THE
GENERALITIES THAT HAD SURROUNDED
HIM AND THAT HE SURROUNDED
HIMSELF WITH.
>> MARY JORDAN IS THE NATIONAL
REPORTER AT THE POST WHO LED THE
GROUP OF REPORTERS WHO LOOKED
INTO DONALD TRUMP'S FAMILY, HIS
RELATIONSHIPS WITH HIS WIVES,
THREE WIVES AND HIS FIVE
CHILDREN, AND AS PART OF THAT WE
MADE AN EFFORT TO TALK TO ALL OF
THOSE PEOPLE.
TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT
THAT WAS LIKE AND WHAT CAME OUT OF I IT.
>> SO I GOT THE WOMEN.
[LAUGHTER]
AND KAREN HELLER IS HERE,
ANOTHER GREAT REPORTER, AND BOY,
WAS THAT INTERESTING. OKAY.
THERES HAS NEVER BEEN A
PRESIDENT WHO HAS THREE WIVES
ALIVE WALKING AROUND.
[LAUGHTER]
THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED, RIGHT?
AND WHERE ARE THEY?
WE KNOW EVERYTHING.
THIS GUY IS ON THE AIR ALL THE
TIME.
WHERE IS HIS FIRST WIFE, IVANA,
THE FAMOUS ONE WHO WAS THE ONE,
IN FACT, FROM THE FORMER
CZECHOSLOVAKIA WHO COINED THE
TERM, THE DONALD.
SHE'S ALSO THE ONE WHEN THEY HAD
A WICKED, WICKED PUBLIC DIVORCE,
IT WAS ON THE COVER EVERY DAY OF
TABLOIDS, SAID DON'T GET MAD,
GET EVERYTHING.
[LAUGHTER] OKAY.
THIS WOMAN LIKES TO TALK, AND
SHE'S JUST DISAPPEARED.
NEVER SEE HER.
SECOND WIFE, SHE'S STILL ALIVE,
SHE'S BEEN MARRIED FOUR TIMES
AND DONALD WENT TO HER FOURTH WEDDING.
BUT MARLA MAPLES COMES ALONG,
AND HE'S STILL MARRIED
INCONVENIENTLY TO THE FIRST
WOMAN, AND SO THIS WAS HIDDEN
FOR A WHILE, BUT THEN THERE WAS
THIS BIG SCENE IN ASPEN AT
CHRISTMAS TIME, AND THE TWO
WOMEN WERE FIGHTING OVER DONALD.
HE LOVED IT.
IT WAS IN THE PAPER.
AT THAT TIME HE WASN'T RUNNING
FOR OFFICE X HE LOVED, LOVED
THAT WOMEN -- HE WAS ON PAGE 6
IN THE TABLOIDS IN NEW YORK.
IN FACT, MANY, MANY PEOPLE WE
TALKED TO SAID HE CULTIVATED
THIS.
HE LOVED BEING IN THE NEWSPAPER
ABOUT THIS, THIS WOMAN.
AND AND NOW ALONG CAME -- AND THAT WOMAN.
AND ALONG CAME MARLA MAPLES WITH
A GREAT NAME, FORMER BEAUTY
PAGEANT WINNER IN GEORGIA.
IT WASN'T EVEN, LIKE, MISS
GEORGIA, IT'S LIKE MISS PEACH.
[LAUGHTER]
BUT SHE WAS VERY, OBVIOUSLY,
VERY GOOD LOOKING AND YOUNGER,
AND IN THE END HE GOT DIVORCED
FROM IVANA, MARRIED MARLA.
WHERE IS SHE? SHE'S GONE.
YOU DON'T SEE HER AT ALL DURING
THIS CAMPAIGN.
IT IS REALLY STUNNING.
ESPECIALLY -- AND THE LAST THING
I JUST POSTED A STORY A COUPLE
HOURS AGO, TODAY, ABOUT HIS
CURRENT WIFE -- OR I SHOULD SAY
HIS THIRD WIFE, BECAUSE IF YOU
SAY CURRENT WIFE, SOMETIMES
PEOPLE THINK THERE'S MORE
COMING. [LAUGHTER]
BUT ANYWAY, SO HIS THIRD WIFE,
MELANIA TRUMP, SHE WAS MISS --
SHE HAS NOD BEEN HEARD OF SINCE
THE -- NOT BEEN HEARD OF SINCE
THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL
CONVENTION ON THE 21ST OF JULY.
WE'RE IN THE HOME STRETCH OF A
PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN WHERE IF
HE WINS, SHE IS THE FIRST LADY
OF THE UNITED STATES.
SHE HAS AN OFFICE IN THE WHITE
HOUSE, SHE HAS A PUBLIC
PLATFORM, AND SHE HAS LITERALLY GONE SILENT.
IT'S VERY, VERY UNUSUAL.
AS MANY THINGS IN THIS CAMPAIGN
ARE UNUSUAL.
OKAY.
SO THREE WIVES, ALL OF THEM ARE
NOT TALKING WHILE THE KIDS ARE.
BUT JUST IF I COULD FOR A
MINUTE, LET'S ROLL BACK, A BOOK
ON HIS LIFE ABOUT WHAT IT USED
TO BE ABOUT DONALD AND WOMEN.
HE USED TO GO ON HOWARD STERN,
FOR INSTANCE.
HE WAS THE SHOCK JOCK.
AND HE'D GO ON ALL THE TIME.
AND STERN WOULD SAY, DONALD,
WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT DIANE
SAWYER, WOULD YOU DO HER, YOU
KNOW? AND ALL THIS KIND OF TALK.
AND IT WAS MUCH MORE GRAPHIC
THAN THAT.
AND HE WAS ALWAYS TALKING ABOUT
WOMEN, HE WAS ALWAYS TALKING
ABOUT HOW PRINCESS DIANA GOT
AWAY FROM HIM, YOU KNOW, IF HE
ONLY HAD A CHANCE REALLY TO GO,
YOU KNOW?
BUT WOMEN DEFINED HIM.
AND I THINK WHEN WE TALK TO
PEOPLE WHO KNOW HIM, KNEW HIM IN
THE '80s, THE '90s, THEY
SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT?
THERE WERE A LOT OF RICH PEOPLE
IN NEW YORK.
THERE WERE A LOT OF RICH PEOPLE
WHO HAD BUILDINGS IN NEW YORK,
BUT THERE WAS ONLY ONE DONALD
TRUMP WHO WAS ALWAYS IN THE
PAPER WITH SOME OTHER BABE WHO
WANTED HIM, AND THAT WAS A
DIRECT QUOTE FROM SOMEONE WHO
KNEW HIM.
SO I THINK FOR A LONG TIME WOMEN
GOT ATTENTION FOR DONALD TRUMP.
AND FOR SOME REASON, I THINK HE
LIKED ATTENTION.
[LAUGHTER]
AND I THINK THAT HE, WHEN YOU GO
TO HIS OFFICE, I'VE INTERVIEWED
HIM IN HIS OFFICE, AND I'VE
TALKED TO MELANIA ON THE PHONE,
IT'S VERY STRIKING THAT THERE'S
ONLY REALLY GOOD LOOKING WOMEN
IN THE OFFICE.
HE TALKS ABOUT WOMEN'S
APPEARANCES NONSTOP.
I MEAN, HE'S 70 YEARS OLD, AND I
KNOW A LOT OF OLDER PEOPLE
OFTEN, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY SEE
SOMEBODY, THEY SAY IT, BUT IT'S
VERY UNUSUAL TO HAVE A PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE -- AND
HE'S GETTING TRIPPED UP ON THIS
EVERY SO OFTEN, BECAUSE
APPEARANCES DO MATTER.
SO IN CONTRAST TO THE OLD DAYS
WHERE HE JUST LOVED TALKING
ABOUT DONALD TRUMP AND WOMEN, WE
DON'T HEAR FROM THEM ANYMORE.
>> MARY HAD AN ESPECIALLY
REVEALING INTERVIEW WITH DONALD
TRUMP'S LAWYER ABOUT THIS
QUESTION OF HOW -- TRUMP HAD
SPENT YEARS AND YEARS
CULTIVATING THIS PLAYBOY IMAGE
AND INVITING REPORTERS TO COME
OUT AND SEE HIM AT A CLUB WHEN
HE WOULD BE THERE WITH THE
PRETTIEST MODELS.
AND YET HIS LAWYER TOLD YOU WHEN
THE CAMERAS WERE TURNED OFF, IT
WAS ACTUALLY A VERY DIFFERENT
KIND OF DYNAMIC.
>> WELL, HE WOULD GO TO ALL THE
NIGHTCLUB OPENINGS, STUDIO 54 IN
THE DAY.
ESPECIALLY DURING THIS GAP WHEN
HE WASN'T MARRIED, AFTER MARLA
MAPLES AND BEFORE MELANIA, THAT
HE WASN'T MARRIED.
AND HE BLITZED THE SCENE.
BUT HE WAS VERY CAREFUL ABOUT
HOW HE SPENT HIS TIME, BECAUSE
IT WAS WHERE THERE WERE CAMERAS.
AND HE WAS ALWAYS WITH MODELS.
HE WOULD CALL MODELING AGENCIES
UP AND, IN FACT, WHEN HE HAD
PARTIES, MAKE SURE THAT HIS OWN
PARTIES HAD A RATIO OF 5 TO 1,
GORGEOUS WOMEN TO MEN.
YOU KNOW, CONSTANTLY SURROUNDING
HIMSELF WITH WOMEN AND AT
OPENINGS.
SO I SAID TO HIS LAWYER, YOU
KNOW, HOW DID HE HAVE TIME FOR
THIS?
HE'S ALWAYS TELLING MANY ME THAT
HE'S WORK -- HOW COULD I DO ALL
THIS STUFF, MARY?
I MEAN, I'M WORKING.
I HAVE ALL THIS MONEY AND
RESPONSIBILITY, I HAVE GREAT
BUILDINGS, HAVE YOU SEEN MY
GREAT BUILDINGS?
[LAUGHTER]
THIS IS HOW HE TALKS, HOW COULD
I POSSIBLY HAVE BEEN WITH ALL
THESE WOMEN?
SO ASKED DICK GOLDBERG, AND HE
AGREED COMPLETELY.
HE SAID, ACTUALLY, HE'S ON THE
TRUMP TOWER AND HE WORKS IN PART
OF IT, HE REALLY JUST LIKES TO
TAKE THE ELEVATOR UP AND TURN ON
THE TUBE AND WATCH TV.
SO I SAID THIS TO TRUMP AND
TRUMP SAID, WELL, YOU KNOW,
MAYBE IT WASN'T AS GLAMOROUS AS
IT'S OUT TO BE.
I MEAN, IMAGE, YOU KNOW, HE WAS
GREAT AT GETTING ATTENTION.
I MEAN, HOW MANY WOMEN DID HE
REALLY IS HAVE AND HOW MUCH TV?
I DON'T KNOW.
[LAUGHTER]
>> ROBERT SAMUELS LOOKED INTO
THE TRANSITION DONALD TRUMP MADE
FROM CELEBRITY INTO POLITICIAN,
SO TELL US A LITTLE -- DID HE
SEE THIS AS A COMPLETELY
DIFFERENT KIND OF PURSUIT, OR
WAS IT KIND OF A NATURAL
PROGRESSION FOR HIM? >> RIGHT.
WELL, ONE OF THE GOVERNING
QUESTIONS THAT I WAS REALLY
INTERESTED IN FINDING WAS WHY IS
THIS MAN DOING THIS? [LAUGHTER]
AND IT WAS VERY CLEAR FROM
SPEAKING WITH PEOPLE WHO KNEW
HIM THAT AT SOME POINT HE DIDN'T
REALIZE THE PHENOMENON AND THE
MOVEMENT THAT THAT WE'VE SEEN
SWEEP ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
WHAT WE KNOW THROUGH HIS
POLITICAL LIFE AND AFFILIATION
IS THAT HE DIDN'T REALLY HAVE
MUCH STOMACH FOR PARTISAN
PRINCIPLES.
BETWEEN 1999 AND 2012, HE
CHANGED POLITICAL PARTIES SEVEN
TIMES. [LAUGHTER]
HE'S DONATED BETWEEN 1995 AND
2012, HE DONATED $3.1 MILLION BY
HIMSELF WITHOUT LOOKING AT HIS
COMPANIES TO ALL SORTS OF OLD
DECISIONS.
HE DONATED TO CLINTON, HE
DONATED TO CARTER.
HE LOVED RONALD REAGAN.
SO WHAT IS THIS ABOUT REALLY?
AND TO DO THAT, WE STARTED
LOOKING AT LOTS AND LOTS OF
FOOTAGE AND INTERVIEWS THAT HE'S
DONE OVER THE YEARS, AND WE
TALKED SOME PEOPLE INTO SHOWING
US THE UNAIRED, UNEDITED
VERSIONS OF THESE TAPES.
AND EARLY ON FROM HIS VERY FIRST
MAJOR NETWORK TELEVISION
INTERVIEW THIS 1980 -- IN 1980,
WE SEE A THEME THAT STARTS TO
EMERGE.
HE'S TALKING ABOUT A BUILDING,
AND THEN HE BEGINS TO RAIL ON
THE IDEA THAT AMERICA'S BEING
LAUGHED AT, THAT THERE'S
SOMETHING THAT'S HAPPENING IN
THE POLITICAL SYSTEM WHERE
LEADERS AREN'T STRONG ENOUGH
LIKE THEY USED TO BE.
AND HE BEGINS TO PONDER WHETHER
OR NOT POLITICIANS TODAY CAN BE
LIKE AN ABRAHAM LINCOLN, ASK HE
SAYS ABRAHAM LINCOLN COULD NEVER
WIN THIS 1980 BECAUSE HE WAS TOO
UGLY, HE DID NOT LOOK GOOD ON
TV, AND HE DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO
MASTER THE MEDIA.
AND THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES IN THIS MODERN ERA NEEDS
TO KNOW HOW TO DO THESE SKILLS.
AND SO WHAT WE SEE OVER THE
COURSE OF TIME IS DONALD TRUMP
ASSESSING POLITICIANS AND
PRESIDENTS ON THEIR ABILITY TO
AFFECT MESSAGES, TO COMMUNICATE
MESSAGES EFFECTIVELY AND TO
FIGURE OUT WHETHER OR NOT THEY
MAKE THE COUNTRY FEEL GREAT
AGAIN.
AND EVERYONE DOES A PRETTY OKAY
JOB UNTIL OBAMA WHO HE CONSIDERS
A TOTAL DISASTER.
BY THIS POINT IN 2012, DONALD
TRUMP HAS MASTERED THE CELEBRITY
THAT HE SAID THOSE GREAT MINDS
IN 1980 DID NOT MASTER.
HE'S BECOME THE STAR OF "THE
APPRENTICE," HE HAS THIS TWITTER
FOLLOWING THAT EVERYONE ENJOYS BECAUSE HE'S TALKING ABOUT
EVERYTHING FROM WHETHER OR NOT
BARACK OBAMA'S FROM THE UNITED
STATES TO WHETHER OR NOT KATY
PERRY'S MARRIAGES ARE GOING TO
WORK OUT.
[LAUGHTER]
AND HE DECIDES THAT HE IS, IN
FACT, THE PERSON WHO COULD BEST
SYMBOLIZE THE GREATNESS AND
TOUGH LEADERSHIP OF AMERICA.
AND SO THERE'S A LOT OF --
THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF SKEPTICISM
ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT DONALD
TRUMP WANTED TO DO THIS, WHETHER
HE WANTED TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT.
BUT IT IS TRUE THAT DAYS AFTER
ROMNEY LOST THAT ELECTION, HE
WAS THE ONE WHO FILED AN
APPLICATION TO THE PATENT
OFFICE, AND HE COPYRIGHTED ONE
PHRASE, AND THAT PHRASE WAS
"MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN."
9 AND SO YOU SEE THE THEMATICS
OF HIS CAMPAIGN STARTING EARLY
ON IN HIS PUBLIC PERSONA, BUT IT
HAD BEEN SOMETHING HE HAD BEEN
THINKING ABOUT AND TOYING AROUND
WITH FOR SEVERAL DECADES.
>> GREAT.
THERE'S ONE PIECE OF VIDEO THAT
YOU GOT FROM, IT WAS AN OLD RONA
BARRETT CELEBRITY INTERVIEW FROM
THE 1980s WHICH HAD NEVER
AIRED, YOU GOT PARTS THAT HAD
NEVER AIRED, AND HE WAS
REMARKABLY SIMILAR IN THE WAY HE
TALKED ABOUT POLITICAL ISSUES,
BUT HE WAS ALSO VERY FRANK ABOUT
THE SORT OF DYNAMIC ABOUT WHAT
WAS MAKING HIM DECIDE TO RUN OR
NOT TO RUN. WAS THAT --
>> IT'S INTERESTING, AND MAYBE
IT WAS BECAUSE IT WAS SO EARLY
IN DONALD TRUMP'S POLITICAL
CAREER, BUT RONA BARRETT REALLY
GOT PROBABLY THE BEST
INFORMATION OUT OF DONALD TRUMP
THAN ANY INTERVIEW THAT I HAD
SEEN, US NOTWITHSTANDING. [LAUGHTER]
AND YOU SEE, YOU SEE HIM GOING
THROUGH -- HE -- RONA BARRETT
ASKED HIM, DO YOU WANT TO BE
PRESIDENT?
HE SAID, NO, I LOVE BUILDING,
I'M AN AROUND THE U.S., I LOVE
BUILDING -- ARTIST, I LOVE
BUILDING MY BUILDINGS, AND OVER
IT REALLY AFFECTS HIM.
HE STARTS TO TAKE TO THIS IDEA
THAT, HUH, MAYBE ONE DAY I COULD
BE PRESIDENT.
PARTICULARLY BECAUSE PEOPLE
CONTINUOUSLY ASK HIM WHETHER OR
NOT HE WANTS TO BE THE PRESIDENT
OF THE UNITED STATES.
>> AND HE SHOWS UP IN POLLS
THROUGH THE DECADES AGAIN AND
AGAIN NOT BECAUSE HE WAS RUNNING
FOR ANYTHING, BUT BECAUSE OF HIS
NAME RECOGNITION, PEOPLE PUT HIM
ON POLLS, AND HE DID VERY WELL.
SO IT KIND OF BUILT.
WELL, WE WANT TO TURN IT OVER TO
ALL OF YOU TO TAKE YOUR
QUESTIONS, SO IF YOU WANT TO
RAISE YOUR HAND, WE'LL HAVE THE
FOLKS WITH THE MICROPHONES COME
BY AND START -- GO AHEAD.
YEP.
>> COULD YOU DISCUSS HIS PERSONALITY?
WAS HE WARM?
DID HE LOOK YOU IN THE IDEA?
WAS HE RESERVED?
DID YOU SEE HIM WITH MELANIA?
A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HIS PERSONALITY.
>> SURE.
IN OUR INTERVIEWS AT TRUMP
TOWER, THEY WERE IN HIS OFFICE
ON THE 26TH FLOOR WITH THIS
GLORIOUS VIEW OF CENTRAL PARK
AND FIFTH EAVE, AND HE WAS --
FIFTH AVENUE, AND HE WAS VERY
COURTEOUS AND WAS, YOU KNOW, AS
I SAID BEFORE, QUITE GENEROUS
WITH HIS TIME.
WE NEVER SAW MELANIA.
HIS KIDS WOULD WANDER IN, IVANKA
AND ERIC WOULD WANDER IN FROM
TIME TO TIME.
AND TALK WITH HIM ABOUT A
BUSINESS TRIP HE WERE GOING ON
OR A PROBLEM AT THE PROPERTY IN
MIAMI.
BUT HE'S VERY SOFT SPOKEN IN
THAT SETTING.
YOU GET NONE OF THE BLUSTER THAT
WE'RE FAMILIAR WITH FROM THE RALLIES.
AND HE -- ON THE OTHER HAND, IT
IS DIFFICULT TO HAVE A LINEAR
CONVERSATION WITH HIM.
YOU CAN ASK HIM ABOUT STUFF, AND
HE KNOWS HIS FIELD
EXTRAORDINARILY WELL.
IF YOU ASK HIM ABOUT BUSINESS
DEALS HE MADE IN 1978, HE WILL
REMEMBER BUILDING MATERIALS AND
SUBCONTRACTORS' NAMES AND THE
WHOLE PROCESS OF MAKING, OF
WORKING THROUGH A NEGOTIATION.
BUT IF YOU ASK HIM ANYTHING THAT
VEERS OFF OF WHAT HE KNOWS BEST,
THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS VERY THIN,
AND HE TENDS TO CHANGE THE TOPIC
VERY QUICKLY, A SENTENCE OR TWO
AND HE'S OFF ON TO SOMETHING
ELSE.
HE HAS SORT OF BASE TOPICS THAT
HE GOES BACK TO WHEN HE'S A
LITTLE BIT FLUSTERED ABOUT NOT
KNOWING SOMETHING.
HE'LL ALL OF A SUDDEN TALK ABOUT
HIS TV RATINGS.
>> THERE'S ANOTHER THING THAT HE WOULD DO.
I SPOKE TO HIM ONLY ON THE PHONE
SEVERAL TIMES.
IF HE WAS PRESSED ON SOMETHING,
HE WOULD ALMOST SEEM TO GET
CAUGHT IN A GROOVE, AND HE WOULD
REPEAT THE SAME THING OVER AND
OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
AND SOMETIMES ONE OF MY
COLLEAGUES, DREW, WAS ESPECIALLY
ADEPT AT THIS, HE WOULD SORT OF
SAY, MR. TRUMP, MR. TRUMP, AND
KIND OF BRING HIM BACK --
[LAUGHTER] ON COURSE.
AND BE THEN WE'D MOVE ON.
BUT SORT OF JOKING ASIDE, IT WAS
REALLY A PRONOUNCED THING TO BE
TALKING WITH SOMEONE WHO SEEMED
TO VEER OFF AND GET CAUGHT IN A
GROOVE.
>> HE'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT
PERSON, I THINK, IN PERSON.
HE'S VERY CHARMING, HE'S VERY
NICE, HE KNOWS YOUR NAME, HE
LOOKS AT YOU.
I MEAN, EVERYONE SAYS THAT.
IT'S NOT THIS BOMBASTIC GUY THAT
YOU SEE ON TV, AND EVERYBODY
THAT'S WORKED WITH HIM OVER THE
YEARS SAY I WORKED WITH THIS GUY
FOR 20 YEARS, TURN ON THE TV, I
DON'T KNOW WHO THIS IS.
>> THIS GENTLEMAN HERE.
YEP.
>> I'M CURIOUS OF THE ASPECTS OF
TRUMP'S LIFE AND HIS EXPERIENCES
THAT YOU RESEARCHED, WHAT OF THE
CHALLENGES OR SITUATIONS WERE
MOST ANALOGOUS TO THE KINDS OF
CHALLENGES A PRESIDENT FACES?
AND WHAT CAN WE LEARN FROM THOSE?
I MEAN, YOU'VE, YOUR BOOK HAS
RESEARCHED AND I'M LOOKING
FORWARD TO THE CHANCE TO READ IT
HOW HE DEALT WITH WOMEN, HOW HE
DEALT WITH CELEBRITY, YOU KNOW,
AND BUSINESS DEALS, BUT THIS IS
CLEARLY NOT A DIRECT ANALOGY TO
WHAT A PRESIDENT WOULD FACE.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND SO WHAT CAN WE LEARN,
WHAT IS MOST INSTRUCTIVE IN THIS
IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT HE WOULD
BE ACTUALLY LIKE AS A PRESIDENT? >> MICHAEL?
>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S A GREAT
QUESTION.
AND THE PARALLEL IS WHAT HE DID
RUNNING HIS BUSINESSES.
AND NEARLY ALL THE BUSINESSES
THAT HE RAN WERE PRIVATE
BUSINESSES.
SO THEY'RE DIFFICULT TO EXAMINE
TIL YOU GO THROUGH ANCILLARY
SOURCES LIKE CASINO CONTROL
COMMISSION RECORDS WHICH BOB AND
OTHER REPORTERS DID, FOR
EXAMPLE.
HE DID HAVE SIX CORPORATE
BANKRUPTCIES.
HE HAS OFTEN SAID HE HAD FOUR CORPORATE BANKRUPTCIES.
THIS IS INSTRUCTIVE TO
UNDERSTAND HOW HE SORT OF THINKS.
AND, CLEARLY, THERE WERE SIX.
WE ASKED HIM TO EXPLAIN WHEN YOU
SAY FOUR, WHAT DO YOU MEAN?
HE SAID, WELL, I THINK OF THE
THREE CASINOS AS ONE BANKRUPTCY.
IN FACT, THERE WERE THREE
SEPARATE CORPORATIONS FOR PRE-PACKAGED BANKRUPTCIES AS
THEY'RE CALLED, AND THERE
CLEARLY WERE THREE SEPARATE
ONES, BUT TO HIM IT'S ONE.
PART OF IT, HE WANTS TO PUT THE
BEST IMAGE OUT THERE.
BUT THE ANSWER DIRECTLY TO YOUR
QUESTION IS THAT HE WAS TOLD BY
HIS FATHER, DON'T GO DEEPLY INTO
DEBT.
AND AS BOB MENTIONED, HE ENDS UP
GOING INTO JUNK BONDS.
HE WAS HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OR
EVEN BILLIONS IN DEBT.
TIME ANDEN AGAIN HE THOUGHT THAT
HE WAS NOT GOING TO SURVIVE.
WE TALKED TO A PERSON WHO WAS
BASICALLY GIVEN THE JOB OF
NEGOTIATING WITH BONDHOLDERS OR
AND BANKS, AND AND THAT PERSON
TOLD US HE WAS VERY CONCERNED.
THIS WAS SOMEONE WHO KNEW DONALD
TRUMP AS WELL AS ANYBODY, AND HE
WAS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP AT THIS MOMENT.
HE SAID, I'M LOOKING AT HIM,
IT'S BANKRUPTCY AFTER BANKRUPTCY.
HE'S IN THE MIDST OF A HUGE
DIVORCE, HE'S BEING HUMILIATED
DAY AFTER DAY ON THE FRONT PAGES
OF THE NEWSPAPERS, AND I WORRY
THAT, YOU KNOW, HE MIGHT TAKE HIS OWN LIFE.
IT'S A VERY STRIKING STATEMENT
FOR SOMEONE WHO ACTUALLY FEELS
AFFECTIONATELY ABOUT DONALD
TRUMPMENT AND WHAT HE SAID WAS
BUT WHEN I WALKED INTO THE
OFFICE OF DONALD TRUMP, THERE HE
WAS.
HIS SUIT LOOKED PERFECT, HIS TIE
WAS PERFECT AS WELL, AND HE
WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S
NEXT, WHAT DO WE DO NEXTING?
AND HE HAD THIS ABILITY TO TRY
TO BE THINKING POSITIVELY, ONE
OF HIS MENTORS WAS NORMAN
VINCENT PEALE, THE POWER OF
POSITIVE THINKING.
THAT COULD MEAN HE'S DETACHED
FROM REAL ESTATE OR HE'S JUST SO
POSITIVE-ORIENTED THAT HE
DOESN'T WANT TO THINK ABOUT SOME
OF THE DEEP PROBLEMS HE HAD.
BUT THE REALITY IS WHILE HE
CERTAINLY SAYS HE'S A GREAT
BUSINESS PERSON, HIS BUSINESSES
HAD TROUBLE TIME AND TIME AGAIN.
DREW CAN TALK MORE, HE'S A
REPORTER HERE IN THE AUDIENCE
WHO WORKED ON THIS.
HE HAD A PUBLIC COMPANY AT ONE
POINT, ONE TIME ONLY, BECAUSE HE
HAD TO RAISE A LOT OF CAPITA.
THAT -- CAPITAL.
THAT COMPANY DID DO WELL AT
FIRST, BUT THE STOCK PRICE WENT
FROM SOMETHING LIKE $35 TO 17
CENTS.
AND THE SHAREHOLDERS WERE VERY
ANGRY, THIS WERE LAWSUITS FILED
THAT WE WRITE ABOUT, BUT THE
BOTTOM LINE IS THAT TRUMP WAS
ABLE TO SURVIVE.
ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF BEING AT THE
ABSOLUTE DEPTHS ASK AND FINDING
A WAY FOR HIMSELF TO SURVIVE.
AND THIS IS INSTRUCTIVE.
THIS IS, YOU KNOW, DONALD TRUMP
VIEWS IT AS, YOU KNOW, HIS WORDS
ARE IT'S A ONE-MAN ARMY.
AND HE TALKED IN ONE OF HIS
BOOKS ABOUT THE POWER OF
NARCISSISM, FOR EXAMPLE.
HE STARTED A BOOK BY THAT NAME,
AND HE SAID IT'S A VERY POWERFUL
THING.
THE YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL,
YOU HAVE TO THINK IN THAT TUNNEL
VISION WAY ONLY ABOUT MAKING
SURE YOU DO SURVIVE.
AND ANOTHER ONE OF HIS POINTS IN
THE BOOK THINK LIKE A
BILLIONAIRE, HE ADVISE ARES THAT
YOU HAVE A, QUOTE, SHORT
ATTENTION SPAN, UNQUOTE.
SO EITHER HE SEES THAT AS AN
ATTRIBUTE OR HE KNOWS HE HAS
THIS PARTICULAR DISPOSITION, AND
HE TRIES TO PUT IT IN THE MOST
POSITIVE WAY.
BUT EXAMINING THAT BUSINESS
CAREER AND SEEING, YOU KNOW, AS
WE TRY TO DO IN THE BOOK, YOU
KNOW, THE PEAKS AND THE VALLEYS
AND ACTUALLY HOW HE'S OPERATED,
IT SEEMS TO BE THE BEST GUIDE
FOR HOW HE MIGHT TRY TO
OPERATE --
>> ONE HUGE QUESTION COMES UP
THERE IS THAT HE IS THE FIRST
PRESIDENT WHO HAS A LOT OF
FOREIGN HOLDINGS AS PEOPLE LOOK
AT HIS FOREIGN POLICY, YOU KNOW?
HE'S EXPANDING ABROAD.
KEVIN SULLIVAN IS HERE, WENT TO
AZERBAIJAN, WE HAD REPORTERS IN
MOSCOW LOOKING AT HIS DEALINGS,
THEY'RE IN PANAMA, AND WE'VE
NEVER HAD ANYBODY WHO WOULD BE
IN THE WHITE HOUSE WHO HAS A
GLOBAL BUSINESS EMPIRE.
SO YOUR GOOD QUESTION IS, HOW
WOULD THIS WORK?
IS HE GOING TO DIVEST, AND IS IT
ENOUGH TO DIVEST HIMSELF?
IS THE TRUMP ORGANIZATION WITH
THE KIDS?
I MEAN, THE VALUE GOES UP OF HIS
HOLDINGS ALL AROUND THE WORLD.
AND HE IS INCREASING HIS
WORLDWIDE HOLDINGS.
IT GOES UP IF HE'S IN THE WHITE HOUSE.
>> I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE IF YOU
THINK ABOUT WHAT DO PRESIDENTS
DO, THEY SYNTHESIZE INFORMATION
AND COME TO DECISIONS, THEY
PERSUADE PEOPLE OF THEIR
POSITIONS, AND THEY HAVE A RAM A
OF SOME KIND. -- A PROGRAM OF
SOME KIND.
WELL, DONALD TRUMP IS NOT
SOMEONE WHO TAKES IN INFORMATION VERY DEEPLY.
WE ASKED HIM ABOUT HOW HE MAKES
DECISIONS, WHAT HE READS, AND HE
SAYS HE DOESN'T READ REPORTS OR
BRIEFINGS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
HE DOESN'T LIKE TO READ ANYTHING OF ANY LENGTH.
HE BELIEVES THAT HE COMES TO
DECISIONS BY GUT, BY INSTINCT.
AND SO HE VERY MUCH WANTS PEOPLE
TO COME IN AND TELL HIM ABOUT
SOMETHING ORALLY, AND HE
BELIEVES THAT HE WILL GET THE
NUB OF IT IN A MATTER OF
SECONDS.
HE'S, OBVIOUSLY OR, VERY GOOD AT
PERSUADING PEOPLE THAT HE KNOWS
A WAY FORWARD, BUT WHEN IT COMES
TO PERSUADING PEOPLE
INDIVIDUALLY IN THE WAY THAT THE
PRESIDENT HAS TO TO FORM
COALITIONS AND ACHIEVE
COMPROMISES, THAT'S SOMETHING
THAT HE'S DONE VERY LITTLE OF IN
HIS CAREER.
HE TALKS ABOUT BEING A GREAT
NEGOTIATOR, AND WE'VE CERTAINLY
SPOKEN TO SOME OF HIS BUSINESS
ASSOCIATIONS WHO CREDIT HIM FOR
THAT, OR BUT WE'VE ALSO SOAKEN
TO A LOT OF PEOPLE -- SPOKEN TO
A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WORK WITH
HIM WHO SAY THAT HE'S ALL ABOUT
GETTING HIS WAY, AND HE'S NOT
ONE TO REACH COMPROMISES.
YES, OVER HERE.
GO AHEAD.
[INAUDIBLE CONVERSATIONS]
>> NO, RIGHT HERE.
>> I JUST WONDER, HIS STRONG
ANTI-MEXICAN NARRATIVE IN THIS
CAMPAIGN WHICH HAS PRETTY MUCH
DEFINED THE CAMPAIGN, WHERE DOES
IT COME FROM?
AND DID YOU HAVE PEOPLE IN
MEXICO RESEARCHING OR LOOKING
INTO HIS DEALS THERE?
COULD IT COME FROM HIS
FRUSTRATION?
APPARENTLY, HE DIDN'T DO VERY
WELL DOWN THERE?
>> WELL, I WAS THE BUREAU CHIEF
IN MEXICO FOR FIVE YEARS WITH MY
HUSBAND, KEVIN SULLIVAN, AND WE
WENT TO INTERVIEW THE LAST TWO
PRESIDENTS ABOUT THIS, VICENTE
FOX AND PHILIPPE CALDERON, AND
AS FAR AS WE CAN TELL -- AND
ESPECIALLY HAVING BEEN AT
RALLIES -- IT COMES FROM A LOT
OF PEOPLE IN AMERICA LIKE WHAT
HE HAS TO SAY, AND HE KNOWS
THAT.
HE GETS REINFORCED EVERY DAY.
IT MAY BE THE MOST POPULAR THING HE SAYS.
THERE'S NO HINT THAT HE'S
ALWAYS, I MEAN, NOT LIKED MEXICO
OR ANYTHING.
HE, HIS GIFT IS THAT HE IS
SAYING -- THIS IS WHAT WE KEEP
HEARING AT RALLIES AND TALKING
TO MILLIONS OF AMERICANS,
THEY'RE FED UP, AND HE SAYS, AND
HE'LL TELL YOU THAT IN
INTERVIEWS TOO, IS THAT HE'S A
REFLECTION OF WHAT PEOPLE WANT, YOU KNOW?
HE THINKS THAT OUR IMMIGRATION
POLICIES HAVE BEEN WRONG.
>> TO AMPLIFY THAT, I THINK ONE
THING THAT'S A SAFE BET WITH
DONALD TRUMP ALTHOUGH WE CAN'T
BE SURE OF IT, IS THAT HE'S
ACTUALLY THE EMBODIMENT OF A
POPULIST POLITICIAN, AND WE'VE
HAD A HISTORY OF THOSE GOING
BACK 200-PLUS YEARS.
AND THEY EMERGE PERIODICALLY,
AND THE PATTERNS ARE VERY SIMILAR.
THEY SAY WHAT PEOPLE WANT TO
HEAR, THEY TRY TO APPEAL TO
PEOPLE'S ANGER AND FRUSTRATION,
AND IT'S POSSIBLE THAT DONALD
TRUMP DOESN'T HAVE ANY ANIMUS
TOWARDS MEXICANS AND THAT HE'S
ONLY PLAYING THE CARDS THAT HE
SEES ARE OUT THERE FOR HIM TO
PLAY WITH.
AND IF THAT'S THE CASE, WE
SHOULD BE TROUBLED BECAUSE WHAT
WE NEED TO SOME DEGREE IN OUR
LEADERS, I SUPPOSE, IS A GENERAL
SENSE THAT THEY'RE TELLING US
WHAT THEY REALLY FEEL AND THE
TRUTH AND AT LEAST PURSUING
POLICIES THAT ARE SORT OF
GENERALLY IN THE INTERESTS OF
THE COUNTRY.
>> TO ADD TO WHAT BOB'S SAYING,
I'D LIKE TO CONTRAST THIS --
WELL, HIS CURRENT POSITION ON
MEXICANS WITH WHAT HE SAID IN
THE PREVIOUS TIME WHEN HE WAS
REALLY CLOSE TO RUNNING FOR
PRESIDENT IN 1999 AND 2000.
UP TO THAT POINT, HE WAS
CONSIDERING RUNNING AS A THIRD
PARTY CANDIDATE AGAINST PAT
BUCHANAN, REMEMBER HIM?
AND DONALD TRUMP SAID THAT THE
REASON -- HE'D BE A BETTER
REFORM PARTY CANDIDATE THAN PAT
BUY CANNA BECAUSE HE WAS ALL
ABOUT INCLUSIVENESS, AND HE DID
NOT LIKE THE WAY PAT BUCHANAN
SPOKE ABOUT NUMBERS OF PEOPLE
INCLUDING JEWS, BLACKS, GAYS AND
MEXICANS.
WHAT YOU'RE SEEING NOW WHEN YOU
GO TO THE RALLIES AND YOU
EXPERIENCE THAT -- AND HE'S SAID
IT HIMSELF -- IS THAT WHEN THE
CROWD GETS LOW, HE LOVES TO
BRING OUT THE ISSUE OF WHO'S
GOING TO BUILD THE WALL, BECAUSE
THE CROWD GOES NUTS.
IT'S A WAY TO ADD SOMETHING TO
THE POLITICAL PERSPECTIVE THAT
PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND AND THAT
THEY HAVE A VERY VISCERAL
RESPONSE ABOUT.
AND FOR HIM, THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT.
IN FACT, WE SPOKE TO A NUMBER OF
PEOPLE WHO WERE TALKING TO HIM
ABOUT THE DECISION TO RUN FOR
PRESIDENT, AND WHEN HE TALKED
ABOUT THE ISSUES THAT WERE
REALLY IMPORTANT TO HIM, THE
RELATIONSHIP WITH MEXICO DIDN'T
REALLY COME UP.
IN FACT, A NUMBER OF THEM WERE
SURPRISED WHEN HE TALKED, HE
MADE THE ALLUSIONS TO RAPISTS
AND CRIMINALS CROSSING THE
BORDER IN THE FIRST SPEECH.
>> ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO WE
SPOKE TO WHO WAS CLOSEST TO
TRUMP GAVE US SOME GUIDANCE AND
SAID WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO
UNDERSTAND HIS MOTIVES, ALWAYS
GO FIRST TO THE IDEA THAT HE
THINKS OF HIMSELF FOREMOST AS A
SHOWMAN.
AND HE WILL ALWAYS CHOOSE THE
MOST PROVOCATIVE LINE OF ATTACK
BECAUSE HE WANTS TO GET THE
RESPONSE, THE AFFIRMATION FROM
THE CROWD.
YES, SIR, OVER HERE. >> YEAH.
I WANT TO ASK ABOUT SOMETHING
THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT IN A
PRESIDENT, AND THAT'S HIS
TEMPER.
I WANT TO LET YOU KNOW THAT IN
THE '80s AND EARLY '90s I
WAS IN CHARGE OF PROMOTING
ATLANTIC CITY, SO I HAVE A
LITTLE BIT OF KNOWLEDGE ABOUT
THIS.
WHEN DONALD TRUMP SAW AN ARTICLE
IN THE ATLANTIC CITY PRESS OR
WORSE, AN EDITORIAL, HE PULLED
THE NEWSPAPER OFF THE NEWSSTANDS
IN ALL OF HIS HOTELS AND
ATLANTIC CITY MAGAZINE, WHICH
THEY ALSO OWNED.
HE DIDN'T LIKE WHAT THE CASINO
ASSOCIATION DID, HE STOPPED
PAYING THE DUES WHICH WAS 25% OF
THE BUDGET.
SO I ALWAYS THINK OF HIM AT
PETULANT.
I WAS WONDERING IF YOU FOUND IN
YOUR RESEARCH ANYTHING THAT
WOULD GIVE YOU SOME GUIDANCE AS
TO WHAT HIS TEMPER WILL BE LIKE
IF HE GETS ELECTED?
>> HE'S SAID, YOU KNOW, MANY
TIMES I CAN BE A SCREAMER,
QUOTE-UNQUOTE.
AND I'M FAMILIAR WITH THE
ANECDOTE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IN
ATLANTIC CITY.
AND THE PERSON I REFERENCED WHEN
I STARTED TALKING THIS EVENING
WAS JOHN O'DONNELL WHO WROTE A
BOOK CALLED TRUMPED, EXCLAMATION
POINT, AND HE REPEATEDLY CITES
THESE TEMPERAMENT ISSUE.
AND, IN FACT, DONALD TRUMP, HE
GOT SO FRUSTRATED, HE ENDED UP
QUITTING.
I ASKED TRUMP ABOUT THIS, HE
SAID, NO, I FIRED HIM. [LAUGHTER]
BUT YOU DO HEAR THAT FROM A
NUMBER OF PEOPLE, AND TRUMP
HIMSELF HAS SAID HE IS A
SCREAMER, THOSE WERE HIS OWN WORDS.
AS TO HOW THAT WOULD REFLECT,
YOU KNOW, BOB MENTIONED ROY
COHN.
ROY COHN WAS THE LAWYER FOR
DONALD TRUMP WHEN THE U.S.
GOVERNMENT SUED DONALD TRUMP AND
HIS FATHER FRED TRUMP FOR RACE
BIAS IN 1973.
AND ROY COHN ADVISED DONALD
TRUMP WHEN YOU'RE HIT, HIT BACK
TEN TIMES HARDER OR A HUNDRED
TIMES HARDER AND THAT, YOU KNOW,
IS THE ROOT OF HIS PERSONALITY.
THEY ACTUALLY SETTLED THAT CASE EVENTUALLY.
BUT TIME AND TIME AGAIN WE SEE A
LOT OF LAWSUITS, AND HE HAS, YOU
KNOW, INDEED THAT PHILOSOPHY,
HIT HIMSELF.
AND THAT CASE GAVE HIM AN ANIMUS
TOWARDS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
>> HE SETTLED THE CASE ONLY
AFTER DRAGGING IT OUT AND
ATTACKING VICIOUSLY THE
PROSECUTORS THROUGH ROY COHN X.
THAT'S AN ASPECT THAT HE'S MORE
THAN A SCREAMER, HE IS VERY OPEN
ABOUT WANTING TO PUNISH PEOPLE
WHO -- HE OFTEN USES THE PHRASE
VICIOUSLY ATTACK ME.
AND, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF
POLITICIANS WANT PAYBACK CAN
COME NOW OR LATER, SO HE FITS INTO THAT MOLD.
>> AND IT'S WORTH NOTING THAT A
LOT OF AMERICANS FIND THIS
APPEALING.
AGAIN, I THINK THAT THERE'S A
LOT OF PEOPLE WHO THINK THIS
GUY, WHEN HE'S HIT, SAYS HE'S
GOING TO HIT TEN TIMES HARDER,
AND THAT'S WHAT HE'S GOING TO DO
OUT THERE.
THEY LIKE HIS, YOU KNOW,
CONFIDENCE, AND HE IS CLEARLY
FEEDING OFF OF AN ENORMOUS
AMOUNT OF AMERICANS WHO LIKE
WHAT THEY SEE ON TV.
>> AND THAT PUGNACIOUS ATTITUDE
IS SOMETHING THAT WE TRACE IN
THE BOOK ALL THE WAY BACK TO HIS CHILDHOOD.
A NUMBER OF EXAMPLES OF STORIES
GOING BACK TO ELEMENT
RESCHOOL -- ELEMENTARY SCHOOL OF
REALLY KIND OF RUFFIAN BEHAVIOR,
AS HE CALLS IT.
YES, SIR.
>> YOU GUYS ARE REALLY AMAZING.
[LAUGHTER]
[INAUDIBLE]
[LAUGHTER] >> THANK YOU.
[APPLAUSE]
>> [INAUDIBLE]
MY QUESTION, MY QUESTION IS
WHICH IS VERY SCARY TO ME, IS
THAT AFTER 2000 THE PRESS SAID
THEY FELL DOWN ON THE JOB IN NOT
GOING AFTER BUSH'S MOTIVES FOR
GOING INTO IRAQ.
AND IT WASN'T UNTIL A DAY OR TWO
AGO I HAVE SEEN THE PRESS BEGIN
TO SAY THIS ISN'T TRUE.
AND NOT MERELY REPORT ON WHAT HE
IS SAYING, BUT SOME
JUXTAPOSITION OF IT.
HE SAID IN THIS THIS DAY AND SAD
THAT THAT DAY AND ACTUALLY CONFRONT IT.
BECAUSE I'M VERY SCARED ABOUT
VOTERS WHO, AS YOU SAID, THEIR
PASSIONS, THEY LIKE WHAT THEY
HEAR.
BUT MY CREDO IS, LET'S GET THE
FACTS AND ARGUE ABOUT CONCLUSIONS.
WHAT DO YOU EXPECT THE PRESS TO
DO, WHAT IS THE OBLIGATION OF
THE PRESS TO HOLD HIM
ACCOUNTABLE?
I'M NOT NECESSARILY TALKING
ABOUT "THE WASHINGTON POST," BUT
JUST IN GENERAL, TO HOLD HIM
ACCOUNTABLE AND SAY YOU CAN'T,
YOU CAN'T MAKE THESE ALLEGATIONS
WHEN THE FACTS BELIE IT.
>> ALL RIGHT.
WE'VE ACTUALLY, I'D SAY
EVERYWHERE WE GO WE GET A
QUESTION ABOUT THIS SENSE THAT
MANY PEOPLE HAVE THAT THERE'S
BEEN LATE OR NOT AGGRESSIVE
COVERAGE OF DONALD TRUMP.
WE ALSO GET THE SAME QUESTION
ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON.
AND, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE
REPORTING THAT WENT INTO THIS
BOOK ALSO FED MORE THAN 30 MAJOR
STORIES THAT APPEARED IN THE
POST OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS
THAT GO INTO GREAT DETAIL IN
PUSHING BACK EXISTENCE TRUMP'S
OWN NARRATIVE -- AGAINST TRUMP'S
OWN NARRATIVE, OWN VERSION OF
HIS LIFE AND SUCCESSES AND CAREER.
BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, THERE ARE
OTHER ASPECTS OF THE NEWS MEDIA
THAT HAVE NOT BEEN AS AGGRESSIVE
IN DOING THE REPORTING THAT WE
THINK IS OUR OBLIGATION IN ANY
PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN, IN ANY CAMPAIGN.
SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK
PARTICULARLY IN TELEVISION THERE
ARE QUESTIONS TO BE ASKED ABOUT,
YOU KNOW, GIVING OVER VAST
STRETCHES OF TIME TO RUNNING HIS
RALLIES AND SO ON, YOU KNOW,
GREATLY MORE TIME THAN WAS GIVEN
TO OTHER CANDIDATES.
BUT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T CONTROL
WHAT THEY DO.
WE DECIDED THAT THIS WAS OUR
OBLIGATION TO DO THIS DEEP
REPORTING AND COMMIT ENORMOUS
RESOURCES TO THIS BOOK AND AND
THE STORIES THAT HAVE APPEARED
IN THE PAPER AND WILL CONTINUE
TO APPEAR IN THE POST.
>> AND THE POST HAS BEEN BANNED
BY TRUMP, YOU KNOW?
I MEAN, HE HATES WHAT WE WRITE.
WE HAVE A FACT CHECKER FULL
TIME, WE'VE HAD ALL THESE BIG
STORIES.
BUT, YOU KNOW, IT IS A KEY QUESTION.
I THINK THE DEBATES AND STRONG
MODERATING IN THE UPCOMING
DEBATES IS ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL
BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN EVERYONE'S WATCHING.
BECAUSE PEOPLE LOOK AT ONE
STORY, AND THEN THEY CALL -- ONE
STORY ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON, AND
THEY'LL SAY WHYEN AREN'T YOU
GOING -- WHY AREN'T YOU GOING
AFTER DONALD TRUMP, AND THEN
THEY'LL SEE ONE THING ABOUT
DONALD TRUMP AND WHY THIS?
THE DEBATE IS GOING TO DEPEND A
LOT ON THE MODERATORS.
>> AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, HE MADE
THE IDEA THAT HASN'T BEEN TALKED
ABOUT THE LAST COUPLE OF DAYS.
THIS HAS BEEN WRITTEN ABOUT FOR
MONTHS BY OTHER ORGANIZATIONS,
BY OUR ORGANIZATION.
MANY TIMES THE FACT CHECKER THAT
MARY MENTIONED, I MEAN, THEY DO
EXTRAORDINARY WORK WHERE THEY
CHECK EVERYTHING IN ALMOST
REALTIME, AND THERE'S A STORY UP
TODAY THAT, BASICALLY, THEY WENT
OVER AGAIN WHAT DONALD TRUMP SAID.
HE SAID THAT I WAS AGAINST THE
WAR FROM THE BEGINNING BUT, IN
FACT, EVERY FACT CHECK HAS SAID
THAT'S NOT THE CASE, THAT HE
SAID ON HOWARD STERN THAT -- HE
DIDN'T SAY HE WAS AGAINST THE
WAR AT THAT TIME.
SO EVERYTHING TIME THAT
STATEMENT'S MADE -- EVERY TIME
THE STATEMENT'S MADE, THE FACT
CHECKER PUTS SOMETHING OUT TO
SAY, NO, THAT'S NOT THE CASE.
>> ALL THE WAY IN THE BACK.
>> DO YOU THINK HE MEANS WHAT HE
SAYS, OR IS IT ALL JUST PART OF
THE SHOW?
>> IT DEPENDS WHAT HE'S SAYING.
[LAUGHTER]
I MEAN, IT'S HARD TO BELIEVE
SOMETIMES WHEN TALKING TO HIM
THAT HE ACTUALLY MEANS WHAT HE SAYS.
>> I THINK IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT
TO NOTE THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S
AN ACCURACY QUESTION, AND
THERE'S AN HONESTY QUESTION FOR
PEOPLE.
AND SO MANY PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT
DONALD TRUMP, IT'S NOT SO MUCH
THE FACTS, BUT IT'S THE GENUINE
PASSION THAT HE ELICITS WHEN
HE'S SPEAKING.
AND BE I THINK THAT'S A VERY
IMPORTANT DISTINCTION TO MAKE,
AND IT'S AN IMPORTANT
DISTINCTION TO ACKNOWLEDGE, THE
FACT THAT HE GETS UP THERE AND
HE SAYS SOMETHING THAT ALIGNS
WITH PEOPLE.
IT'S AN EMPOWERING FEELING.
FOR THOSE WHO FEEL THAT THE
OBAMA YEARS HAVE DISENFRANCHISED
THEIR IDEAS OF HOW THE COUNTRY
SHOULD OPERATE AND WHAT A
POLITICAL LEADER SHOULD BE.
AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAS
BEEN SO IMPORTANT FOR HIS
CANDIDACY IS THAT SKILL IS ONE
SKILL THAT HILLARY CLINTON HAS
ACKNOWLEDGED THAT SHE REALLY
STRUGGLES WITH.
AND SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, WHEN
WE TALK ABOUT THIS GENUINE
QUESTION, I THINK A LOT OF
VOTERS ARE WONDERING WHETHER OR
NOT THE PERSON IS, THE
CANDIDATES ARE GENUINELY
LISTENING TO THEM.
AND ON THAT FRONT, DONALD TRUMP
IS.
>> YES.
>> I AM, I AM IMRESTED WITH HOW
MANY OF OUR INSTITUTIONS ARE
BEING PRIVATIZED.
AND I SEE THIS AS POTENTIALLY
GIVING OTHER PEOPLE WHO HAVE
ASPIRATIONS TO ENTER INTO A
POWER STRUCTURE THE CHANCE.
ARE WE, ARE WE LOOKING TO A DAY
WHEN WE'RE GOING TO PROFIT FROM
MANY OF TRUMP'S SPAWN IN OUR
POLITICAL SYSTEM?
[LAUGHTER]
>> I DON'T KNOW WHERE TO START.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, I'M OUT
THERE, I'M TALKING TO VOTERS A
LOT.
AND I THINK IN SOME SENSES, YES.
I MEAN, I THINK PEOPLE HAVE BEEN
DRAWN, I MEAN, IT SEEMS SO FAR
AGO BUT, YOU KNOW, SIX MONTHS
AGO EVERYONE WAS TALKING ABOUT
BERNIE SANDERS AND THE IMPACT
THAT HE WAS HAVING ON THE
DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND THAT PROCESS.
AND WE'RE SEEING A LOT OF
DIFFERENT TYPES OF VOICES ENTER
INTO THE STANDARD TWO-PARTY
SYSTEM.
AND THAT WILL INEVITABLY CHANGE
WHO PEOPLE PICK AND HOW THEY
PERFORM IN TERMS OF WHEN THEY'RE
TRYING TO WIN VOTES.
>> YES, SIR.
>> HOW DID -- THE THING THAT
I'VE BEEN PONDERING IS, BUILDING
ON THIS OTHER QUESTION, A LOT OF
PEOPLE SEEM TO SAY, WELL,
HE'S -- THERE'S CHECKS AND
BALANCES, HE'S NOT REALLY GOING
TO DO WHAT HE SAYS HE'S GOING TO
DO.
WHAT REASON DO WE REALLY THINK
WITH THE FORCES THAT HE'S
UNLEASHED AND THE LEGITIMACY BY
THE ATTENTION GIVEN TO SOME OF
THE RACISM AND BIGOTRY AND
THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT FORCES
HAVE BEEN UNLEASHED IN OUR
SOCIETY THAT THE CHECKS AND
BALANCES WE THINK EXIST MAYBE
WON'T EXIST?
AND I GET REALLY TROUBLED, FOR
INSTANCE, WHEN YOU SEE FORMER
MEMBERS OF SENIOR OFFICERS ON
BOTH SIDES GETTING INVOLVED, AND
IT JUST -- I WONDER WHAT KIND
OF, AT WHAT POINT DO WE BECOME
CLOSE TO A BANANA REPUBLIC?
YOU KNOW?
AT WHAT POINT DO, ARE WE BEING
TOO -- SAY, WELL, HE REALLY
DOESN'T MEAN IT.
DOES IT REALLY MATTER IF HE
DOESN'T REALLY MEAN IT IF HE'S
REALLY ABOUT POWER AND THE
FORCES THAT HE'S UNLEASHED
BECOME BIGGER THAN HIM AND YOU
HAVE LIKE THE ESSAY OR OUT THERE
OR --
>> I'VE HEARD THIS SO MANY TIMES.
YOU KNOW, IT'S REALLY JUST THE
PRESIDENCY.
[LAUGHTER]
I MEAN, AND THEY'RE NOT KIDDING.
THEY SAY LOOK AT WASHINGTON.
I MEAN, THERE'S CONGRESS, REALLY
NOT MUCH GETS DONE.
IT'S THE IMAGE.
HE'S A STRONG GUY AND, NUMBER
TWO, HE'S NOT THE SAME OLD THING.
SO THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE ELECTING.
AND FOR SOME AMAZING REASON, SO
WE STARTED WRITING A STORY
ABOUT, ACTUALLY, THE PRESIDENT
HAS A LOT OF POWER.
I MEAN, IT SEEMS SO OBVIOUS TO.
[LAUGHTER]
YOU COULD GET US INTO A LOT OF
TROUBLE VERY QUICKLY.
[LAUGHTER]
AND WE SHOULD KEEP WRITING THAT,
BECAUSE THAT SENTIMENT IS OUT
THERE.
AND EVEN MORE THAN THAT, YOU
KNOW, YOU'LL TALK TO PEOPLE AND
YOU'LL SAY, WELL, YOU SUPPORT
THE MUSLIM BAN.
BUT DO -- HOW DOES THAT WORK
EXACTLY?
AND THEN YOU STARTED TALKING
ABOUT MONEY AND THE WORK.
YOU KNOW, WE DON'T REALLY THINK
HE'S GOING TO DO THAT, IT'S MORE
LIKE HE'S GOING TO BE STRONG
AGAINST IT, AND HE'LL BE
THINKING ABOUT HE WANTS TO KEEP
THAT.
THE SAME WITH THE WALL.
WAIT A MINUTE, IT'S 2,000 MILES.
HOW MUCH MONEY WOULD THAT COST?
AND AGAIN -- SO HE'S GETTING THE
BENEFIT OF IT BECAUSE PEOPLE
WANT HIM TO SAY IT, THEY SHOUT
IT AT RAFTERS, AND YET THEY'RE
LIKE, OH, WE DON'T REALLY EXPECT
HE'S GOING TO BUILD IT.
IT'S THE SENTIMENT.
IT'S THAT HE WANTS TO.
IT'S THAT HE'S TELLING US I HEAR
YOU, YOU'RE FED UP WITH ALL THE
IMMIGRATION AND A LOT OF PEOPLE
WHO THINK THAT NAFTA WAS BAD,
TOOK THEIR JOBS.
SO HE'S JUST BETTER THAN HIS TO
OBJECT KIND OF CONNECTING WITH
PEOPLE THROUGH TV.
>> THERE'S ANOTHER ASPECT TO
YOUR QUESTION, AND IT COMES FROM
THE WORD "UNLEASHED."
I'VE HAD THIS IN THE BACK OF MY
MIND FOR A LONG TIME BEFORE THE
ELECTION, BUT IT'S REALLY COME
INTO PLAY IN THE LAST SEVERAL
MONTHS WHICH IS I THINK WHAT
WE'RE SEEING NOW HAS BEEN IN
PLAY, HAS BEEN DEVELOPING AND
UNFOLDING AND UNPACKING ITSELF
FOR ABOUT 15 OR 20 YEARS, MAYBE
25 YEARS.
AND THE SEPARATION, THE LACK OF
COMITY IN CONGRESS, THE --
IRONICALLY WITH THE RISE OF THE
INTERNET, WE'VE SEEN A SURGE, A
DEEPENING OF ANTI-INTELLECTUAL
BEHAVIOR.
AND I SORT OF FEEL LIKE IT'S
COME INTO PLAY ALMOST CRESTING
NOW WITH THIS ELECTION.
AND TO ME, THAT'S THE MORE --
THOSE ARE THE UNDERCURRENTS THAT
ARE MORE TROUBLING BECAUSE IT'S
NOT WHO GETS ELECTED PRESIDENT
NECESSARILY, IT'S DEEPER TRENDS
IN OUR SOCIETY WHICH I SUSPECT
WE'LL BE EXPLORING AFTER THE
ELECTION, BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT
GOING TO GO AWAY IMMEDIATELY.
>> I WOULD JUST ADD ONE
CAUTIONARY NOTE BECAUSE THERE'S
AN ASSUMPTION OFTEN AMONG TRUMP
OPPONENTS THAT THE RALLIES ARE
THESE GATHERINGS OF EXTREMISTS
AND RACISTS AND SO ON, AND IT'S
JUST NOT THE CASE.
THERE ARE CRAZIES AT HIS
RALLIES, TO BE SURE.
THERE ARE EXTREMISTS.
BUT THERE ARE ALSO A LOT OF -- I
DID A STORY A FEW WEEKS AGO
ABOUT OBAMA/TRUMP VOTERS, AND
THERE ARE A LOT OF THEM.
AND THESE ARE THE HOPE AND
CHANGE VOTERS, AND THESE ARE
PEOPLE WHO SAW IN BARACK OBAMA
SOMEONE WHO HEARD EXACTLY THE
KINDS OF THINGS THAT ROBERT AND
BOB MENTIONED AND TOOK THAT TO
HEART AND REFLECTED WHAT THE
FRUSTRATIONS AND TROUBLES THAT
PEOPLE WERE GOING THROUGH.
AND A LOT OF THOSE SAME PEOPLE
SEE THAT IN DONALD TRUMP, AND
THOSE ARE NOT EXTREMISTS.
SO WE HAVE TIME FOR JUST ONE
LAST QUESTION.
YES, MA'AM.
>> [INAUDIBLE]
DO YOU THINK TRUMP
APPRECIATES -- [INAUDIBLE]
THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE
PRESIDENCY AND THINKS ABOUT HIS
OWN SKILLS VIS-A-VIS THOSE
REQUIREMENTS?
>> HE KNOWS HE'S GOOD AT
EVERYTHING.
[LAUGHER] >> YEAH.
>> I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT HE WAS --
I MEAN, HE WOULD SAY THAT.
AND PEOPLE RESPOND TO HIS
CONFIDENCE.
HE HAS SAID THAT HE WILL GET
REALLY SMART PEOPLE AROUND HIM
AND, I MEAN, IT'S ALL ABOUT THE
CONFIDENCE.
AND HE IS NOT, I MEAN, HE HAS
NOT SAID, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS
ALEPPO YET. [LAUGHTER]
>> BUT WE DID LEARN THAT HE
WOULD HAVE CAUGHT OSAMA bin
LADEN BEFORE 9/11 TODAY.
[LAUGHTER]
>> I THINK, I THINK THE UNDERCUT
OF YOUR QUESTION'S A REALLY
IMPORTANT THING TO EXPLORE.
AND THROUGHOUT THIS COUNTRY I
THINK THERE'S A BIG DEBATE OVER
WHAT IS THE REQUIREMENT FOR A
PRESIDENT, RIGHT?
AND FOR DONALD TRUMP, HE SAID
WHAT THE REQUIREMENT WAS 30
YEARS AGO, AND HE REITERATED IT
20 YEARS AGO.
AND THAT WAS A PERSON WHO COULD
REINVIGORATE THE SPIRIT OF
AMERICA WHO HAS BOLDNESS AND
POMPOSITY. THOSE ARE HIS WORDS.
AND SO DOES HE FIT, THINK HE
FITS THE REQUIREMENT?
ABSOLUTELY.
I THINK, I MEAN, THE QUESTION IS
A SORT OF VALUES QUESTION ON
WHAT THE PRESIDENCY SHOULD BE.
AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THAT'S
WHERE THINGS GET INTERESTING.
>> I THINK IT'S REMARKABLE WITH
TRUMP, HE'S ALWAYS HAD THIS VERY
SMALL CIRCLE OF PEOPLE HE CAN
REALLY RELY ON.
THERE ARE USUALLY A COUPLE
FAMILY MEMBERS W. THE CASINO
THERE WERE ONE OR TWO PEOPLE,
LIKE I MENTIONED, WHO DIED THIS
THAT HELICOPTER CRASH.
AND TIME AND TIME AGAIN YOU SEE
THERE'S ONE OR TWO VITAL PERSONS
WHO CAN REALLY TELL HIM WHAT TO
DO.
HE DOES PREFER HAVING AN ACT
LITE.
HE DOESN'T LIKE TO BE TOLD HE'S
WRONG, SO OFTEN TIMES YOU SEE PEOPLE BEING FIRED.
HE'S GONE THROUGH TWO CAMPAIGN
MANAGERS ALREADY.
SO THAT WOULD BE A BIG QUESTION
FOR HIM.
AS PRESIDENT, HE WOULD HAVE TO
TACKLE MANY, MANY ISSUES THAT HE
DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT.
AND WOULD HE RELY ON THAT
ADVICE?
HOW WOULD HE ORGANIZE AND
SYNTHESIZE THAT?
I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE BIG
QUESTIONS.
>> HE TALKS ABOUT GETTING THINGS
DONE THE BEST WAY IS AN ARMY OF ONE.
AND IT'S VERY HARD TO RUN THE
COUNTRY WITH JUST ONE PERSON:
HILLARY CLINTON HAS, I MEAN,
IT'S POLAR OPPOSITE.
SHE'S HAD ALL THIS EXPERIENCE IN
GOVERNMENT, AND HE IS CERTAINLY
GOING TO ANSWER THIS AND SAY
THAT HE HAS THE TEMPERAMENT,
HE'S SHOWN THROUGH HIS
BUSINESSES AND HE HAS THE
CONFIDENCE TO GET THE RIGHT PEOPLE AROUND HIM.
>> IF HE'S RIGHT, HE'LL
COMPLETELY REDEFINE WHAT IT
MEANS TO BE PRESIDENT GIVEN HIS
BIOGRAPHY, HIS TRACK RECORD, HIS
LACK OF EXPERIENCE IN THE PUBLIC
LIFE.
IF HE'S RIGHT, HE'LL BE THE
FIRST PERSON TO COME THIS FAR IN
AN ELECTION -- HE IS FIRST
PERSON TO COME THIS FAR IN AN
ELECTION CAMPAIGN.
AND IF HE'S ELECTED, HE'LL BREAK
ALL THE MOLDS.
>> AND HE HAS A READY ANSWER FOR
YOUR QUESTION WHICH IS WHEN
THINGS GO RIGHT, HE WAS FULLY
PREPARED, HE KNEW WHAT TO DO,
AND HE TAKES ALL THE CREDIT.
AND WHEN THINGS GO WRONG -- AND
WE SHOW THIS IN VARIOUS STAGES
THROUGHOUT HIS CAREER -- WHEN
THINGS GO WRONG, THE SYSTEM IS
RIGGED.
AND WE'VE HEARD THESE WORDS FROM
HIM IN RECENT WEEKS X. THAT IS
EXACTLY THE FRAYS THAT HE USE --
PHRASE THAT HE USES THROUGHOUT
HIS LIFE WHEN HE'S FACED WITH TROUBLES OR FAILURE.
SO WHEN WE HEAR THAT NOW, YOU
CAN SORT OF SEE THE GEARS MOVING
AND, YOU KNOW, HE'S NOT
OBLIVIOUS TO HIS POSITION IN THE
POLLS, AND SO HE'S PREPARING
HIMSELF AND ALL OF US FOR THE
MESSAGE THAT HE WILL HAVE IF HE
LOSES.
SO I THINK WE HAVE TO LEAVE IT
THERE, BUT THANKS SO MUCH FOR
COMING OUT --
[APPLAUSE]
[INAUDIBLE CONVERSATIONS]
>> PRESIDENT-ELECT DONALD TRUMP
WILL SOON BEGIN THE TRANSITION
OF POWER BETWEEN HIS
ADMINISTRATION AND PRESIDENT
OBAMA'S.
IN "BEFORE THE OATH," MARTHA
KUMAR REPORTS ON THE TRANSFER OF
POWER BETWEEN PRESIDENTS BUSH
AND OBAMA.
>> Host: PROFESSOR KUMAR,
WELCOME TO "AFTER WORDS."
I'M DELIGHTED TO BE HERE WITH
YOU AND ANXIOUS TO HEAR MUCH
MORE ABOUT YOUR BOOK, "BEFORE
THE OATH: TRANSITION OF GEORGE
W. BUSH AND BARACK OBAMA AND HOW
THEY MANAGED A TRANSITION TO
POWER."
CERTAINLY, THIS TRANSITION
PERIOD IS AN IMPORTANT PERIOD
NOT REAL WELL KNOWN BY THE BROAD
PUBLIC, AND YOU PULL BACK THE
CURTAIN ON THE INNER WORKINGS OF
THIS PARTICULAR TRANSITION AND
REFER TO IT AS A MODEL AND A
TEMPLATE.
AND I WAS STRUCK BY A NUMBER OF
REVELATIONS WHICH WE'LL GET INTO
INCLUDING THE LEVEL OF
COOPERATION AND TRUST.
>> Guest: YEAH.
>> Host: BUT BEFORE WE DO THAT,
LET'S START WITH KIND OF A
HOLLYWOOD THRILLER.
[LAUGHTER]
LET'S GO STRAIGHT TO THE
INAUGURAL THAT WAS ALMOST
COMPLICATED OR MAYBE EVEN
POSTPONED WITH THE TERRORIST
THREAT.
SO JUST WHAT WAS THAT THREAT AND
HOW DID THE BUSH AND OBAMA TEAMS
DEAL WITH IT?
>> Guest: OKAY.
WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR
BEING HERE AND FOR TALKING WITH
ME ABOUT THE BOOK.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE FRONT OF
THE COVER OF THE BOOK HERE AND
YOU SEE BUSH AND OBAMA, BOTH OF
THEM ACTUALLY LOOKING PRETTY
SERIOUS AND GRIM --
>> Host: THEY ARE.
>> Guest: AND THEY HAD WALKED
OUT OF THE BLUE ROOM WHERE THEY
HAD HAD THE TRADITIONAL COFFEE
WHERE THE PRESIDENT-ELECT AND
FIRST LADY TO BE COME IN TO BE
HOSTED BY THE SITTING PRESIDENT.
AND THE VICE PRESIDENTS ON BOTH
SIDES TOO.
SO WHILE THEY WERE THERE
DISCUSSING WHATEVER OF THE DAY'S
ACTIVITIES AHEAD, THEY WERE
TALKING ABOUT IN THE SITUATION
ROOM THERE WAS A MEETING ABOUT A
THREAT ON THE INAUGURATION THAT
HAD COME UP OVER THE WEEKEND.
THERE WAS A THREAT OF A
TERRORIST ATTACK ON THE
INAUGURATION.
PROBABLY NOT CLOSE TO THE PODIUM
ITSELF, BUT FARTHER BACK AND THE
ASSUMPTION WAS THAT THERE WOULD
BE POSSIBLY PEOPLE KILLED.
AND SO IT WAS SOMETHING OF GREAT
CONCERN.
>> Host: VERY SERIOUS.
>> Guest: TO THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY, THE SECURITY
COMMUNITY.
AND SO WHAT THEY, AND WHAT THEY
DID WAS BRING EVERYONE TOGETHER
WHO WAS INVOLVED IN SECURITY.
SO YOU HAD THE CABINET
SECRETARIES OUTGOING, INCOMING
LIKE HOMELAND SECURITY AND STATE
AND DEFENSE, AND THEN NATIONAL
SECURITY ADVISER AND THEN THE
INCOMING TERRORISM ADVISER FOR
PRESIDENT OBAMA.
AND THEY DISCUSSED THE THREAT
AND WHAT KINDS OF THINGS SHOULD
BE DONE.
AND ONE PERSON WHO WAS IN THE
MEETING WHO TOLD ME ABOUT IT
SAID THAT HILLARY CLINTON ASKED --
>> Host: FAMILIAR WITH THE
INAUGURAL CEREMONY --
[LAUGHTER] >> Guest: YEAH.
AND WITH POLITICS AND WITH
PRESIDENTIAL IMAGE THAT SHE HAD
THE BEST QUESTION WHICH WAS IS
THE PRESIDENT GOING TO BE PULLED
OFF THE PODIUM, I DON'T THINK SO.
BECAUSE THE OPTICS OF THAT WOULD
HAVE JUST BEEN TERRIBLE TO
SHOW --
>> Host: YEAH, COULD DISRUPT.
>>
>> Guest: -- WHAT A FRAGILE
SYSTEM WE HAVE THAT WE COULDN'T
INAUGURATE A PRESIDENT.
SO THE OBAMA PEOPLE TALKED TO
HIM.
BUT THEY HAD FOUND OUT ABOUT IT
OVER THE WEEKEND.
AND ONE OF THE -- AN ARTICLE
THAT I READ, DAVID AXLEROD
TALKED ABOUT HAVING TALKED TO
OBAMA ABOUT IT ON SATURDAY.
AND THAT THEY HAD DECIDED NOT TO
DO A FINAL RUN-THROUGH OF HIS
INAUGURAL ADDRESS.
BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT MADE
THAT WORK WAS THAT BOTH SIDES
WERE COMFORTABLE --
>> Host: YEAH.
KEY POINT.
>> Guest: THEY HAD BEEN DEALING
WITH ONE ANOTHER FOR MONTHS AT A
A LOWER LEVEL WHERE YOU HAD
TRANSITION PEOPLE DEALING WITH
WHITE HOUSE STAFF ON A VARIETY
OF ISSUES.
AND THEN PRESIDENT OBAMA,
PRESIDENT-ELECT NAMED HIS PEOPLE
EARLY ENOUGH THAT THEY COULD
WORK TOGETHER WITH THE PEOPLE
WHO WERE SITTING IN THE OFFICES
BEFORE THEY LEFT.
AND SO THEY COULD GET
INFORMATION ABOUT HOW THINGS
WORKED.
AND THAT WAS A REALLY, I THINK,
AN EXCELLENT PART OF THE
TRANSITION.
YOU KNOW, YOU CAN GIVE PEOPLE
PAPER, GIVE THEM MEMORANDA, BUT
SITTING DOWN AND TALKING TO THEM
IS A DIFFERENT THING.
AND THAT HAPPENED, LIKE, IN THE
NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL, FOR
EXAMPLE, AFTER GENERAL JONES --
>> Host: GENERAL JIM JONES.
>> Guest: WAS SELECTED AS
NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER, AND
HE APPOINTED THE PEOPLE WHO WERE
THE DIRECTORATES IN THE NATIONAL
SECURITY COUNCIL, AND THEY
WORKED TOGETHER WITH THE PEOPLE,
SIDE BY SIDE WITH THE PEOPLE WHO
WERE THE OUTGOING.
AND SO THEY WORKED THERE FOR
SEVERAL WEEKS.
AND THE ADVANTAGE THAT HAS IS,
WELL, YOU CAN TALK ABOUT WHAT'S