on the scene and susan candiotti heading toward the scene. it appears that the security perimeter has been pushed out as a matter of caution to figure out where this gunman is right out where this gunman is right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com good evening, welcome to the on of the hour. we have breaking news at the top of the hour, shots fired at the garden state plaza, 25 minutes west of manhattan. bergen point, new jersey s.w.a.t. conducting a store by store sweep. mall workers, some of whom barricaded themselves inside say that the shots rang out at 9:20 p.m. a slow sequence of firing. 15 to 30 seconds between each shot. we can't give you an exact number of shots fired. no reports of any injuries.

one report from nic robertson is that the gunman may have left the mall. the bottom line on that, we just do not know where this gunman is. and it seems clear that law enforcement does not know. ally kosek is on the phone. she is still inside the mall. explain what you first heard. >> the first thing that we heard was just a loud bang. at first it almost sounded like someone droppeding in and then there was another one and then another one and people were yelling and just started to run and it was just very chaotic. and no one knew what was going on. and then it -- we figured out that it was gunshots and someone went past my store and closed one of our doors and a few seconds later i saw someone walking past my store carrying a

large gun and wearing all black. i didn't see their face. it looked like they were wearing a helmet or mask. when i saw the gun i really just ran, myself. and we locked ourselves in the back of our store and we've still just been on lockdown since then. >> we talked probably an hour ago. about 50 minutes ago. you are still in the same location with the same people. you have not moved, correct? >> the only time i walked out from the back was to peek out and see what was going on. i saw some police officers and dogs and it almost looked like a s.w.a.t. team people wearing all black. but i haven't seen any civilians or anyone else in the mall. just police officers and we're locked in. so i don't know. there is no one coming in our store as of right now. >> i just got some information. we are just hearing from police on the scene. they are saying that the shooter

is still inside the mall. whether or not they -- an active shooter, whether they have an exact bead on his location we do not know but that is in to us from police on the scene. they say the shooter is still inside the mall. how are the people -- how are you doing and how are the people you're with doing? >> we're all okay. i mean, i feel kind of calm but my body is shaking. it was just very scary and happened so fast that no one really knew what was going on. and i think once it kind of set in and hit us it's very scary. i never expected something like that to happen here. >> i'm going to ask you basic questions. only say what you know for sure. you said you didn't get a look at the shooters face. is that because you didn't look quickly because you wanted to get to safety or because the face was covered in some way?

>> honestly it looked like he was wearing something black over his head. but i -- as soon as i saw that gun, i turned and i wasn't really trying to get a good look. all i saw was all black and a large gun. >> and what appeared to be all black clothing and possibly a bullet proof vest or tactical vest? >> it could have been. i just saw all black. it -- i couldn't see any person or any kind of like figure of what just the clothes he was wearing and walked by almost like in slow motion walking calm by our store. >> that must have been so strange to see this person calmly or slowly walking around with a weapon. >> yeah, and everyone else was running. that's what was so scary. no one knew what was going on. it wasn't like -- like continuous firing. it was like a boom and then a

couple seconds and then boom. so at first it sounded like someone had popped a balloon or something like that. but as they started -- as we heard three or four and it got the be about eight and people were running in the stores across from us. luckily there was no customers in the store and no one else came in. just myself and the few girls i'm working with. >> i can also tell you more information we're getting in. according to the mayor of paramus, no injuries. he believes the shooter -- the shooter has left but that is contradictory to what the police have just -- we got the police saying they believe the shooter is inside the mall. the mayor of paramus staying no injuries which is good news in all this. this may be a stupid question but how soon after the last shot did you see this gunman? >> within seconds. it sounded to me like it was

right outside of nordstrom and the store i work at is very close to nordstrom. so it was almost like -- after he went past my store i heard two more shots. >> so once you saw him you heard more shots after that? >> mm hmm. i think it was two. and i had already grabbed the girls i work with and we had run to the back and that's what we heard. >> did it look like -- was he moving in one particular direction? was he walking aimlessly -- what he walking one direction or -- >> in a straight line down from nordstrom, the way our mall is set up. it was like he was walking toward macy's just straight down the hall way. it didn't look like he was going into any stores or going to a

different side. it was just a straight pass. >> allie, again, you are doing great. and just stay where you are and stay with the people you're with and wait until the police are able to come and get you. we have talked to a number of people who have been evacuated by s.w.a.t. teams. so clearly the police are trying to do that. and it seems like they are just going store to store. so just -- you're doing great and we'll continue to check in with you, allie. thank you very much. stay safe. >> i want to bring in jeanie barada. it's good to have you on again at this hour. >> thank you. >> what is the latest information you have? >> the latest information i have of 15 minutes ago is they believe the gunman is still in the mall. right now, bergen county s.w.a.t. team along with the canine unit and paramus and state law enforcement are going store by store. a lot of people hunkered down in

the stores and locked themselves in. that is a good thing. the police are going through the mall. it's a large mall with multiple levels. they are going store by store getting the people out. >> as far as you know, the mayor of paramus borough has said that a single shell casing was found and no injuries. is that your information as well? >> correct. thank god we have no fatalities or injuries at this time. we hope it stays that way. >> that's an extraordinary thing and a great thing. there had been a report from the new york state police that the gunman had allegedly shot at security cameras. can you confirm that in any way? >> i have heard it but cannot confirm it. >> and at this point, who is in charge -- do you know who's in charge from a law enforcement standpoint? is it the state police? >> i don't know exactly on the scene who is in charge. ieprese bergen county and i

know that s.w.a.t. was deployed immediately. >> i know you are incredibly busy. we'll let you go. we'll check in with you for all the latest information. again, headline right now, according to jeanne baratta, they believe that the gunman is still inside the mall. that is coming from her law enforcement sources and no reports of any injuries or fatalities as far as she is aware. that is the good news that we can report at this moment. kevin flanagan is joining us. he is with ride and security investigations. you know, i'm amazed how calm some of these young women are who have locked themselves in the stores. >> the one caller said she's calm but her body's trembling. is it a surreal experience. and that's pretty much the way is it for the law enforcement

folks there as well. they are walking and advancing, making sure that each area they go to is safe and secure knowing they may get into an adversarial confrontation. >> differing reports of the number of shots. allie said she got a glimpse of the shooter. this looks like a shot from outside from the helicopter of inside the mall. you clearly see a number of law enforcement personnel inside. clearly in an area that they feel pretty safe in because they are kind of standing around. you don't see a lot of heavy weaponry drawn. but elsewhere in the mall there are active searches going on right now. >> that looks like the front entrance right there. the main entrance there. there are barriers out on the curbside shape up point. >> something like this you and i were talking about before, the

tactical response. they have teams sort of multiagency teams. >> yeah. i have information that they do active shooting training out there in paramus with the new jersey state police, the paramus police department and interagency cooperation and practice these things. >> why would they do that? why have multiple agencies on one tactical team? it makes organization easier? radio communication? >> it is probably inclusive. and frankly if they didn't have that response you have multiple agencies being segregated and put in different parts of the facility. now you have people and communications to every agency involved and they are working together and trained together. you are not going to have a cross fire situation someone acting differently than someone else on the scene.

it is rehearsed and orchestrated. >> nic robertson is on the scene. explain these images. a heavy law enforcement presence outside the mall. >> at least 20 police vehicles where i am outside the nordstrom store. i was outside jcpenney's earlier. there were a dozen police vehicles as well. and circling overhead has been a police helicopter with its search light trained on the roof of the building, sweeping that light low across the roof of the building. it didn't seem to hold up in any one particular spot that gave you an indication that they were searching rather than they found something they were looking for on the roof. but the helicopter making a close inspection of the roof. in the car park outside, the atmosphere is a little relaxed would the wrong word to say.

it's a tense situation but you don't get the idea that the police officers by the door feel under threat. so if the sweep is going you get the impression it is moving away from the front doors behind us here. to the point that the police in this area feel or appear to feel reasonably secure about their situation. that helicopter coming in low overhead again. you can probably hear it. and i can see the search light on it again beginning to pick up some of the roof of the building there, anderson. >> we talked to jeanne beratta from burgen counergen county. she said that they believe that the shooter is still inside the building. couldn't confirm it or say 100% that is the case but that is the

belief according to jeanne beratta that as of 20 minutes ago the shooter was still inside and importantly in case you haven't heard, no injuries as far as they can tell at this moment. that is good news. it is obviously a very tense and trying situation. this all occurred if you are just joining us. this started at 9:20. let's listen to wabc. >> he was shooting up the cameras of the mall. >> sorry about that audio issue. you see the people walking out of the mall? those are customers. those are staff members finally being let out of the mall. imagine how scary it was to be locked down inside there. we are learning from officials here just outside the mall that these people were locked down in certain areas of the mall and they were completely safe because police officers were in there, locking down certain blocks of the mall as they continued to look for the

shooter. but, again, they are telling us, this is not an active shooting but right now they are still looking for the shooter and still look for the weapon as well as reviewing security cameras here at the mall. >> that's a live report from wabc. we were just talking to nic robertson before. the shooting began around 9:20. a number of shots rang out. no reports of any fatalities or injuries. that's good news. but believed as of 20 minutes ago according to officials from bergen county that the shooter is still inside the building. that search is underway and a search of the security cameras to try to see what path the shooter took. allie a young woman in a store currently said she saw the shooter walking calmly in a straight line away from the nordstroms where she believes that the shooting began.

i should point out for our viewers. we have talked to a number of eyewitnesss who have heard the shootings and are still in stores. and we do not want them to give their location or say what store they're in or where exactly they are, for obvious security reasons. we are just -- we're trying to be as cautious as we can and also not get down the road of any speculation. there are multiple different accounts of how many shots were fired. we cannot give you an accurate number. according to officials, no fatalities or injuries. they believe the shooter is still in the building. we saw what looked like a robot vehicle approaching one location. we're going to take a -- there you -- clearly. that's obviously some sort of -- obviously -- >> remote controlled camera device. >> we're going to take a short break. the coverage continues in just a moment.

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good evening, welcome back. a breaking news. massive police present at the garden state plaza outside program paramus, new jersey. some witnesses are still in the mall, hunkered down in locations we are not giving out. no reports of any injuries. it's unclear whether or not the gunman is still inside. we talked to an official from bergen county who said 30

minutes ago, it is their understanding that the shooter is still inside the mall moments ago, local officials spoke. here's what they had to say. >> county police, county sheriff, state police, fbi, i believe -- i believe that's all. there may be more. but right now, the mall is in a complete lockdown. no one is going in. no one is going out unless they are escorted by police personnel. as we get more information we will release that information to you. mayor? jim tedesco, deputy coordinator, office of emergency management. mayor? >> my name is rich.

as jim said we had a confirmed single shot. everyone is safe. no one has been injured. right now we have police agencies from all over the state who are going through the mall sweeping to ensure that whatever people are in the mall at this time, it is locked down, are evacuated in a safe and orderly way. i want to let everybody know that this is something that we trained for. every police agency is working hand in hand to evacuate the people in a safe and orderly way. i want to ensure that there has been no injuries. there has been no victims and we are now searching the mall and sweeping it. >> searching for shooter? >> searching for the shooter. >> and the other shooters? >> what we're doing is we're making sure that there are no other people that are tied to this inside the mall. the shooter, we believe, has been -- has left the mall.

we have found shell casings and that's what we're looking for, to try to understand and identify where the shooter actually went throughout the mall. >> that is correct. >> he has not been found here in the mall. >> are you saying -- >> single shell cagings -- >> a single shell casing right now. >> is it true the shooter's family member might be here? >> can't tell you. >> do you know that he was aiming at? >> no. >> the shooter is not apprehended at this time? >> correct. >> and no longer is it an active shooting scene. >> several people said they heard three or four pops. >> we have reports. there are thousands of people in this mall. and so, as this started to develop there are many people who said they heard a lot of things. we have detectives interviewing multiple people right now trying to determine exactly what the scenario was.

all we can confirm right now is we found one shell casing, which i believe was from a long-arm rifle. that's all i can tell you. >> are you recovered were video? >> we are going through right now. >> is it true a security cam are was shot at? >> i'm not aware that actually happened, no. but this mall is equipped with the most sophisticated technology in records to identification -- people identification. that's what we're going through frame by frame. and we are reviewing that right now. >> to make it clear for anyone at home, anybody hurt? >> no injuries. we want to assure any families at home whose friends are at the mall this evening, i want to ensure them there have been zero injuries at the mall this evening. >> what about folks who live

around here should they be concerned? >> i can't comment on that. >> i would say there is enough police presence in this area to make sure that people are safe. i wouldn't believe that should be an issue for people who live in the area, no. >> the one shot, do you know who or what the shooter was aiming at? >> no, i cannot comment on that, no. >> any bullet holes found? >> we have thousands of people inside this mall that we are trying to handle. that's our primary concern. once that happens we will take care of the rest of the investigation. >> that is mayor of paramus borough and the ems coordinator. now, the ems coordinator said they believe that the shooter is no longer inside the mall. that is contradicted by an official from bergen county said they believed as of 30 or 40

minutes ago. these are early reports as we always say and conflicting reports. that's part of the confusing thing for police on the scene. we do not know whether or not the shooter is inside the building or has left the building which would be a greater concern because then it becomes a much wider operation and a much different operation. an eyewitness who saw the shooter spoke with cnn affiliate wabc a short time ago. >> we started hearing shootings in the corridor of the mall. and i saw a guy walking calmly in a black suit having some kind of a backpack that contained -- looked like he had two red gas balloons on his back and he was having a rifle with a helmet, walking with a very dark black suit, five feet tall, something

like this. and he was walking very calmly and just shooting and people running all around. and i just went to the back of the store. >> was it a tactical suit? >> looked like he was very well equipped. he was just shooting up -- i think it was that he was shooting up the cameras of the mall. snrz. >> again, so you hear from the eyewitness saying she believes he was shooting at the cameras in the mall and the ems coordinator saying that they don't have confirmed reports of that. the ems coordinator say they have confirmed one shot. but people have said they heard anywhere from four to eight shots. there is still a lot we don't know. i don't want to give out any false reports. a lot of eyewitness testimony is very unreliable and people in panic and when adrenaline starts

pumping your hear and see things differently. mike brooks is joining us on the phone. we are here with kevin flanagan who is with ride and security investigations. mike, in terms of this operation, this is a huge mall. i was just looking up the stats. 311 different retailers inside this mall. over 2 million square feet of retail space. 10,774 parking spaces. this is a huge area for law enforcement to try to cover. >> is it. and one of the key things right now is the law enforcement who have -- i know they most likely have trained on this mall before for an active shooter. most law enforcement agencies do. but the main thing right now is to try to get the surveillance video of what happened inside. even though someone's shooting at the cameras, that doesn't

make any difference, law enforcement will have surveillance video of what happened inside and try to put together a time line, where the shooter, if he or she was by themselves, where they came in, exactly what their movement was. we heard someone say they found one shell casing from a rifle. okay. that's fine, but where did this person go? is this person still inside the mall? how did this person get there? they're going to have cameras outside, in the parking lot, anderson, and also inside. and that's what's very important. and you know, there is a lot of other technologies to have inside some of these malls that is very, very important to get right now to take a look at and find out, where is this person? has this active shooter left the mall? where this person went if they left the mall. that's one of the main things that law enforcement needs to get in touch with the security

inside the mall and i'm sure they already have. you know, we see this all the time. but you know, it's closing time at the mall. right now it's 11:29 eastern. so it's at the end of the stores where they're closing. we see right here. you have triage areas with the red, yellow, and green in case there are injured people. they have practiced this numerous times. so they know what they're doing by what's going on. >> mike weir getting an interview from wpix. >> my height give or take? >> just looking like very similar to me in way. yeah. >> combat boots? what kind of shoes? >> like construction boots. i didn't care about -- if i would have known that those were the guys that were going to cause all this, i would have taken a mental picture. >> you are giving us a good

account. >> hopefully. so is there anything else? this one kind of trips me out a little bit. so we're in the at&t store and we come out. there are 30 people, employees and clients and people in the hallway. me and these guys are check out. i got to get home. and i'm like i got to get home. we creeped out a little bit and we don't see anything. it looks calm. we get to the window of the at&t store. we seen two guys, no guns. i didn't see any guns on them. >> they looked like they were with the gunman? >> they looked like the guys that could have been with the gunman. so at this point -- where was i in the story? i'm sorry. >> you saw the guys standing over against the wall. >> they cut the corner real quick and seconds after, a guy

dressed like the security people -- it may have been him. literally goes two gunmen get in the store. and we got in the store and waited 20 or 30 minutes. i don't know why we did the things we did? >> how many shots did you see? >> see or hear? >> see. >> two seen and three shotgun shots -- they were shotguns. they were boom and another boom and another boom right after the second one and then glass everywhere. >> you were able to differentiate the sound of a shotgun blast and the rifle fire? >> that is something you would have noticed. one is a boom and one is a loud spray. they were both ridiculously

loud. >> did you see anyone hurt? >> no. he didn't shoot anybody. didn't shoot a single person. >> did he aim the weapon at someone? >> no. not a i saw. >> what kind of helmet? >> black a visor and couldn't seen his eyes. >> a tinted visor. >> what color? >> black. >> all black? >> yeah. >> and i'm pretty sure he had gloves on too. baseball gloves, climbing gloves. i don't know. >> at some point you saw them when they didn't have the gloves or mask or helmet on and they suited up at some point -- >> one suited up. when i heard the shotguns i don't know if there was another guy with a helmet with a shotgun. but when i did see them i didn't know it but it's when i walk back on it that was a briefing or some sort of a briefing. >> were they walking toward a

specific direction? >> we went in through nordstrom. we are were at the kiosk on the apple store and went up to the apple store and went back down to the kiosk and cut the corner and by at&t. so by at&t and the apple store this is where it all happened. he was coming down from the apple store coming down, the guy who had my phone saw him. he was already shooting at this point. >> in the air. >> i asked the guy who fixed my phone. he said he was shooting the cameras. >> could you tell where he was headed? >> toward me. >> in what direction? >> i had nothing on me to protection myself and this is completely real. and it was mind boggling. >> say it again? >> mind blowing. >> this is not your first time at this mall? >> no. >> you know what it is like

here, busy, peaceful. >> you have nice people. it's honestly a nice area people just trying to do their shopping. i've never heard or seen or experienced anything like this. this is crazy. complete completely crazy. >> tell me your name again? >> johnny. >> johnny jimenez? >> yeah. >> that was a young man being interviewed by wpix. what he says this could change the situation or our knowledge of it. that's one eyewitness. but it -- according to that person from what we can make out. i want to rerack that tape. he seemed to be indicating that the alleged gunman was with a number of people -- i think he indicated at an apple store. and the alleged gunman suited up

i believe was his words, putting on some sort of a helmet with a tinted visor. that would seem to indicate a motorcycle helmet with some sort of a bullet proof clear visor. and some sort of climbing gloves and then he says he saw a person shooting up in the air, possibly at security cameras. but consciously not shooting directly at people. but if, in fact, the gunman was with other people, that adds a whole other dpengs into this, kevin. >> absolutely. even the psychology of how you approach this. we were initially thinking a guy who get himself up possibly for battle is different mind set on the search here. this sounds there were a couple of people in the mall.

they -- my take on it is they may have ducked into what they believed was a dead corner without camera sight and changed into their attire and took out the cameras on the way back which is a completely different mind set when you start doing this type of search. the first plern be entrenched and ready for battle. >> those are mannequins. you see an officer intact call gear and mannequins in the windows. we are going to try to reshow you that interview. it is just -- we only had one other eyewitness who saw a glimpse of the gunman and described the gunman, all allalli allie cozic. she said he was all in black. and the fact that he may have been with other people is

frankly new to us. it's one eyewitness. take that for what it's worth. we are trying to piece this together. but all eyewitness testimony early on and that's what police are going on. the information you are hearing is the same kind of information that the police are getting from all these eyewitnesss and they are trying to put together an accurate picture of what has occurred and the bottom line is the search is still on for this gunman and/or gunmen believed to be still inside the mall. but all bets are off. we don't know for sure. we're going to take a short break and our coverage continues in a moment. farmer: hello, i'm an idaho potato farmer.

and our giant idaho potato truck is still missing. so my dog and i we're going to go find it. it's out there somewhere spreading the good word about idaho potatoes and raising money for meals on wheels. but we'd really like our truck back, so if you see it, let us know, would you? thanks. what?

help the gulf when we made recover and learn the gulf, bp from what happened so we could be a better, safer energy company.

i can tell you - safety is at the heart of everything we do. we've added cutting-edge technology, like a new deepwater well cap and a state-of-the-art monitoring center, where experts watch over all drilling activity twenty-four-seven. and we're sharing what we've learned, so we can all produce energy more safely. our commitment has never been stronger. breaking news. shots fired at the largest shopping mall in the state of new jersey. a massive complex, 311 retailers inside this shopping mall. over 2 million square feet of retail space alone. so far no reports of any injuries. several reports that the gunman

was shooting at security cameras. we heard from someone who saw the gunman and said he may have had company and people with him before the shots rang out. we played a portion of what johnny jimenez said to wpix. we missed the top of it which gives you some context. i want to replay especially the beginning of that interview because if what he is saying is accurate and there were other people with this alleged gunmen this changes the situation for the law enforcement personnel. but i want to check in with nic robertson who is live on the scene. i know you have been talking to more people who have been getting out of the mall. >> that's right in the last few minutes we had a few people come out. one lady was ashen faced, shaken and clearly traumatized by the situation. she worked in the tumi store. she was in there alone when the

shooting started. she hid in the store by herself. a very scare where situation. i asked her how many shots could she count being fired. she thought about it for a moment and she said very carefully. she said five shots and she took cover. she was released by the police to come out of the shopping mall. i talked to a couple people who were in the gnc store. they also had been released by the police, found a secure way out of the building, walking across the car park here they didn't seem quite as shaken. there were at least two of them in the store. perhaps for them having people there with them, that gave them a little chance to talk about the situation and not to be so afraid. but for the lady in the tumi store by herself, clearly very, very shaken by the situation. she had heard five shots and she

was traumatized by what she had heard. but what we are seeing is that the police are slowly working through the mall, releasing people out of one side of the shopping mall, anderson. >> we have talked to a number of different people, some of whom are still inside the mall. and again these eyewitness reports, some -- one person had told us she heard four shots, another person said eight shots. the exact number we frankly do not know. but all of them -- all of the eyewitnesss and all of those who only heard the shots and didn't see any gunmen also report it was not shots in rapid sequence. it was one shot and a gap of 15 to 30 seconds and then another shot. we are getting pictures from inside the mall from the national reviews. katherine jean lopez. this is not particularly

distinct. you see two people on the ground, it looks like in this. and it looks like they are on some sort of mobile devices. looks like people perhaps hiding or just trying to stay down. that image we got off twitter. i do want to go back to that interview with a man by the name of johnny jimenez given to wpix. the reason we want to replay it because this is the first suggestion that there may have been people with the shooter before the shots rang out. not -- i believe -- multiple gunmen, but people who were with the shooter before shots rang out. exactly -- we didn't hear the top of the interview. we have rewound it all the way to the beginning. we're going to replay it. >> jimenez. >> you were in the navy, you were telling me. tell me what you saw and heard. >> i came to get my phone -- you

mean the one who fixed my phone. >> tell me what you saw and heard? >> i came to the mall to get a phone fixed and the guy who fixed my phone also saw this guy. i was just with him. so i saw five guys together. i noticed them for whatever reason. i didn't think anything of it. they were wearing coats. one was wearing a double hoodie. i'm like he has two hoodies on like me. they looked determined, whatever. i just kept walking and i was exiting the mall at at&t -- yeah, we stopped at at&t real quick. is there anything specific you want to know? >> tell it all. >> okay. so at this point -- okay, so, the moment -- we ran into at&t. my friend is like let's go to at&t. i'm like i'm going to wait out here. go see if you have an upgrade or whatever. this guy comes around the

corner, so sleek just footsteps, element, looked in my direction and i'm like that is the guy with the other guys and this guy has an assault rifle in his hands. >> you clearly -- >> i was in the navy. i don't know it if was fully automatic or semiautomatic. he was trying to take out cameras. i saw him shoot it and try to take out cameras. he wasn't shooting anyone around me. he looked determined. he looked like his motives were very serious. >> like he knew what he wanted to do. >> it was not a killing spree. he would have killed me. he would have sprayed me. it was done. and after, that the women got scared and not everyone had a place to run. some people went to the back of the store. some people were running -- >> please watch your language. >> honestly, you know, like, i

thank god i'm out here and not in there. >> let me back up. you saw more than one gunman? >> i saw more than one person with him. and there was multiple guns. i say pieces of metal. at the time -- i have seen a gun and there is no way i would accept the fact that there were people holding guns in front of me and just huddled together. it was the guys. there was a motorcycle helmet, a free hand in this one, no gun. that was the same guy who had a gun later. >> you saw what he looked like before he put on the helmet. >> they were all looking like me. like a lighter brown skin color. could have passed for italian or hispanic. all of them. >> all short facial hair. >> my height give or take. >> 5'8"? >> just looking like very similar to me in a we, yeah. >> combat boots? what kind of shoes?

>> maybe construction boots. i didn't care about them -- if i would have known that those were the guys that were going to cause all this, i would have told you everything. >> you are giving us a good account. >> hopefully. is there anything else? this one trips me out a little bit. all right. so we're in the at&t store and we come out. this is by we, i mean three people. so we go out, me and these three guys, people were making jokes like i got to get home. and i'm like i got to get home. and we don't see anything. it looks calm. we get to the window of the at&t store and we see two dudes over there. no guns. i didn't see any guns on them. >> they looked like they were with the gunman? >> they looked like they could have been the guys with the

gunman. >> at this point -- okay, where was i in the story? >> you saw the guys standing over against the wall. >> they cut the corner real quick and seconds later a guy like the security people just here -- it may have been him literally goes two gunman, get in the store. so we literally got in the store and we waited for another 20 or 30 minutes. >> that's the interview with johnny jimenez. we already played the tail end of it there. but significant information there and i'm here with kevin flanagan former wily with the n york police department. >> this is the only eyewitness besides the girl we talked to in the store who said she saw a gunman dressed in black calmly walking past her store in a

straight line. this man said he saw the person he believes to be that gunman earlier on in the store with a group of five people together. so five guys, including the alleged gunman. one guy had on a double hoodie with a look determined and with a helmet under his arm. and then later on saw the person wearing that same motorcycle helmet dressed in black with what he described as an assault rifle. he didn't know if it was semior fully automatic. he said he was in the navy and is familiar with weaponry. but very pointedly said it was not a killing spree. he was shooting at security cameras and if it was a killing spree he would be dead. what do you make of this? it certainly -- it's unclear, frankly what the situation is. >> no, you would look for a purpose.

a statement, something -- it's just bizarre. frankly, johnny there is very lucky he wasn't shot. but the purpose or what the culpability in someone's head. >> we don't know if there was a group of five people and this alleged gunman was one of them. if there were multiple people or if this person just mistakenly thought he saw this person with a group of people and assumed they were all together. but again, this is the kind of information. this is the kind of chaotic situation that the police are dealing with. police trying to interview each of these people as they leave to get a sense of what they're dealing with. at this late hour, we are now two plus hours into this. two and a half hours since shots began ringing out in that mall just outside the nordstrom and it is not clear what police are

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coming up at the top of the hour there are no reports of injuries from the garden state plaza the scene of a shooting at 9:20. now with us is the mayor of the paramus borough. what is the latest information you have about what occurred inside that mall? >> all right, well, first of all let me get across the most important message i can deliver right now is everybody in the mall is well. there have been no injuries. what we know is there was a single shot fired.

a single shell has been recovered. they do not believe that the person that fired that shot is in the mall any longer. we have locked down the mall and have police officers from all agencies in the area working together to evacuate everybody in an orderly way. >> you say one casing has been recovered. multiple people inside the mall said they heard anywhere from four eight shots. i assume you have heard that as well. you just can't confirm for sure whether there has been more than one. >> i have heard two or three pops. but they have only recovered a single casing. >> there was just an eyewitness who was on wpix who insists that he saw an alleged gunman earlier in the mall with several other people with four other people and he put on a motorcycle

helmet and fired some shots. do you have any information about who the alleged shooter is and whether he was alone or with other people? >> we have no details that can be released at this time. is it an active investigation. is it no longer an active shooting scene but is it an active investigation and they are putting together the bits and pieces. they are interviewing several people and have heard similar type stories to what you just said. >> you are saying that it's the belief the shooter is no longer inside that mall. >> that is what the belief is at this point. that is correct. >> is that more worrying to you? >> i'm sorry? >> is it is more worrying that the shooter is no longer inside the mall? >> that's what the police officers and people believe at this time, that he did get out a door. that is correct. >> do you know if law enforcement has a sense of who the alleged gunman is? >> there are no details a that

time is it an active case and there are details unfolding. i would not have been out here if not for wanting to let everybody know that if you have people working at a store or visiting that they are fine and everyone is okay. they might be here for a while because the mall is locked down. we have hundreds of police officers. this is something that we train for quite often and i want to ensure that their family members and friends are in good hands. >> i don't want to put you on the spot. i don't want to draw anything out of you. i appreciate you time. >> i appreciate that. i appreciate that. >> we'll continue to stay on it and take care and all the best to your law enforcement officers. again, no injuries. that's the bottom line number sign the shooter is still in the mall. as the mayor said is it no longer an active shooting scene but it is an active crime scene.

massive police presence still on scene. the fbi has also arrived. we will continue to follow developments. that's all for our coverage at this hour. i want to thank kevin flanagan for his experience and joining us as well as mike brooks. cnn will be live all night as needed following developments as this is "piers morgan live." big one is of course in 2016. all the smart money is now saying that chris christie will run, especially if he does what people expect tomorrow. but his tough talk is raising some eyebrows. did chris christie call newt gingrich a joke that couldn't be taken seriously? >> well, tonight for the first time you will be live with me to fire back. look at him, looking angry, i can promise it will be lively and absolutely no holds barred.