hi there. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. thank you for being with me. good news for house republicans outraged at the closed door hearings taking place of the impeachment inquiry into president trump because soon all americans could only see what lawmakers have up to this point. they could begin holding public hearings by mid-november and the lineup, witnesses that poked serious holes in the white house's argument there was nothing wrong with president trump's ukrainian counter part. like marie yovanovitch and top u.s. diplomat bill taylor. that news coming a day after the u.s. government looked, you see this? more like a circus after about

two dozen republicans barged into this deposition. they argue, everything should be out in the open. even though republicans sit on every single one of the committees involved in those hearings. keep that in mind. while republicans are angry how democrats are handling this investigation they were totally fine with the process when it came to the former secreta state hillary clinton. you don't believe me? listen to this 2015 benghazi. >> i could just tell you that of the 50-some-odd interviews we've done thus far the vast majority have been private, and you don't see the bickering among the members of congress and private interviews. the private ones always produce better results. >> so it will be interesting to see if the former congressman holds firm to that belief. gowdy, resigned from congress in january is now serving as outside counsel to president trump on impeachment.

go to our senior congressional correspondent manu raju with me now. you've caught up with several republicans. what are they telling you today about bill taylor's testimony on ukraine? >> reporter: republicans calling on a new strategy to push back what bill taylor revealed, which is rather damning testimony about the president's commentary. according to bill taylor's testimony, the president, he had been told, that the president wanted to withhold that aid, that the country needed back against russia until the ukrainian government publicly announced investigations into the company that employed vice president joe biden's son hunter biden as well as investigations into the 2016 elections that could help the president politically. over the last couple days republicans have been side-stepping questions about it but today pushing back saying instead of being concerned about what bill stataylor said, said y

couldn't trust what he said because it was not firsthand. >> you don't just take pieces of the trial and take them out of context. >> reporter: you think this is out of context? >> yeah. >> there's a lot of secondhand information. a lot of sort of hearsay -- not hearsay, in the sense it was passed on not a direct conversation. >> you hear testimony, oh, that's the end of it, until you hear the other side. >> you give me 15 pages of testimony never subject to cross-examination and want me to comment on it? forget that. >> reporter: lindsey graham in a matter of moments will offer a resolution co-sponsored by mitch mcconnell to condemn the house democrats' impeachment process and continuing to focus on the process, downplaying this testimony as the president's allies are circling wagons here on capitol hill. if democrats hoped they could see republican defections they're getting few of them,

despite this testimony from earlier this week. brooke? >> manu, thank you very much. let's analyze. cnn political reporter is with us and cnn special correspondent jamie gangel. phrases i heard, oh, secondhand information. or hearsay. behind closed doors you're hearing a different story? >> absolutely. so they have to say that. president trump is watching, and the white house has been lobbying for them, but what's really going on is, i'm told from a senior republican source on capitol hill, that bill taylor's statement was a game-changer. that it is "reverberating" among members, because there was so much detail and nobody was saying it was secondhand. he was part of the process, and he is so well respected that

they are really worried about it, and you have to wonder, when you hear that something is reverberating, what does that mean? do they really want to carry water for the white house? how far are they going to go out to defend him? >> we don't know yet. >> we don't know yet, but they know there's a lineup of more witnesses to come, and bill taylor is very well respected. >> nia, to you. sources tell cnn president trump had a heads up about the house republicans plan yesterday. play the sound. what press secretary stephanie grisham said about all of this just this morning >> glad they did it. again, these demes doing everything behind closed doors and in secret. it's about time that somebody made a very bold stand which is i guess a sit-in, what they did and it was great, and the point was well taken. >> so stephanie grisham says the house republicans' action shows

full support of the president. last week trump said, republicans need to, his words were, get tougher and fight on impeachment. so is this just a little preview of what we can expect in the coming weeks? >> yeah. i think it is. certainly what we've seen in the preceding weeks as well. attacking process did it theatrically. somewhat dishonestly yesterday. right? the claim from grisham, somehow democrats are doing something in secret and republicans are in those it depositions as well and stephanie grisham knowing that. >> 48 of them. >> exactly. >> 48 republicans. >> staging a sit-in as she calls it could have been in there on their own because some of the folks are part of the committee. yes. this is theater. the president likes this, i'm sure. it gets them away from talking about 9 sthe substance, reverberating among house republicans and senate republicans because damaging in detail. what else is to come is public

hearings. right? a public sort of airing what they're learning behind closed doors, and that's going to put, i think, republicans in a very difficult position, and in that position when everything is aired these sort of sit-ins and theatrics will certainly be less welcome, i think. >> what about, let me stay with you, because manu gave us a heads up that senator graham will make a big announcement next hour expected to unveil a resolution condemning how the house is handling the ever impeachment inquirinquiry. last week sent a letter to speaker pelosi echoing the same. and now senator graham apparently and mitch mcconnell co-sponsoring this legislation? >> what's going on? >> this is an event, this impeachment inquiry that the president is watching on television. right? that's what he is doing. probably most of the day, seeing how it's playing and looking to

say who is talking on his behalf. it's one thing to have house republicans from trump districts talking for him and staging sit-ins but another to hear silence from a lot of the senior republicans. i imagine if you're mitch mcconnell, in the past couple of days, parted ways with dmnt wa s donald trump in ways saying listen, donald trump didn't know what he was talking about saying mitch mcconnell apparently said the phone call was fine. mitch mcconnell said, no. that's not exactly what happened. if you're mitch mcconnell you're thinking about this audience of one, a president who wants backing from more senior folks in the republican party on the senate side. that's what i think mitch mcconnell was doing. does it matter? i don't really think so in terms of what we'll continue to learn about the president's alleged behavior in regards to ukraine, speaking of this audience of one. >> yes. >> how could we forget last week? mick mulvaney's performance at the podium during the press avail. this is the acting chief of staff and basically the bomb he

dropped, which went against everything that trump and everyone at the white house said with quid pro quo. is he on thin ice? >> we are hearing on shaky ground and i want to read you exactly what i was told today. this is from a source familiar with white house thinking on the future of acting white house chief of staff mick mulvaney. this source said to me, "it's not imminent but it could happen. ultimately it's up to the president." the source went on to say, this is not one of those times when i could wave you off arnd say it' not true. what happens when we call the white house and say, look, we're hearing the chief of staff -- this is not the first time we've seen a chief of staff on shaky ground. they'll say, no. absolutely not. not true. that's not the answer that i heard today. it also speaks as was said, what is the white house impeachment strategy? up to now, it's been one person.

donald trump. now you see him pushing for the hill to come out, but he clearly was not happy with mick mulvaney's performance. >> can we just -- throw all of these conversation, through all of them, cut through what's happening in washington, through the partisanship and tension. i want to pause and take a moment to remember the life and legacy of congressman elijah cummings who is lying in state at the capitol today. >> our distinguished colleague truly has gone home. home to his father's house. >> those gathered here today have lost a dear friend, and our country has lost a giant. >> the man that -- the man that we will miss. >> may elijah rest in peace. >> nia, can you just remind us

what congressman elijah cummings meant for bipartisanship? >> you know, he was a giant of bipartisanship. he's someone who spoke with moral clarity. he got in the will of congress there and you listen, you wanted to hear from elijah cummings's he took seriously his role as someone who wanted to be kind of a caretaker of what congress is supposed to be about? right? about checks and balances, about the people he of course represented parts of baltimore. folks often on the sort of negative side of racial inequities and economic inequities as well. what a giant's . in watching this you tear up in members of the christian tradition. right? a man of faith. somebody who embodied the american dream. his parents were from the south and migrated up north, of course, and he became a graduate of howard university, a lawyer and of course a congressman and he was, is going to be so missed, i think, by this

country. what he meant to that institution on the hill there. just reminds us what it's about. he was in the michael cohen hearing and one of the things he said in his closing statements was you know, the country needs to get back to normal. right? be more bipartisan. really think about what the founding fathers meant for congress to be and sort of a reminding of the country there are better angels. glad we have been playing some of this. the real tradition there, the christian traditions and sort of going home traditions of the african-american faith as well. listen, he's going to be missed widely by his constituents, by folks on the hill and the country more generally. >> may his legacy live on. may he rest in peace. nia and jamie, thank you both very much. continue on. more on the republican fight against the impeachment inquiry. republican candidate joe walsh joins me next. we talk to him about how much more the party can take. plus, president trump says the u.s. is building a wall in

colorado. hmm. let's talk to the colorado governor and get his response, live. and new reporting today. how two businessmen hustled to profit from access to rudy giuliani and the trump administration. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. we'll be right back. ♪ everything your trip needs, for everyone you love. expedia.

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we're back. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. today the white house press secretary said never trumpers, those republicans who don't support the president deserve to be called human scum. that's what the president recently tweeted. stephanie grisham said the president should have no regrets for using the term. >> no. no, he shouldn't. the people who are against him and who have been against him and working against him since the day they took office are just that. it is horrible that people are working against a president who's delivering results for this country and has been since day one and the fact people continue to try to negate anything he's doing and take away from the good work he's doing on behalf of the american people they deserve strong language like that. >> as the president tries to rein in outliers in his party appears pressure on republican supporters is working. just two days after he said they

need to be "tougher" in fighting against impeachments, you saw the scene on capitol hill about two dozen house republicans stormed this closed-door, secure testimony to protest what they called secret hearings. former congressman joe walsh is challenging president trump for the 2020 republican nomination. congressman good to see you in person. >> great to be here, brooke. >> talk about this republican stunt up on capitol hill, because that's what it was led by matt gates, republican of florida. these are some of the quotes we've seen from him in the last 24 hours. we were like the 300, you know? standing in the briefs to try to stop the radical left from storming over our democracy and he said, i love the president so much i may never love another president again. what's your reaction to that? >> good god. look how trump corrodes. that kind of silliness, brooke is what you do when you cannot defend a president who's betrayed this country. you pull stunts like this.

it's going to get worse. i mean, trump -- >> define worse. >> trump's going to get worse. he called me and republicans who oppose him human scum. stephanie grisham called you, anybody who opposes his agenda, anybody, brooke, as human scum. it's going to get worse. not only is trump a child and a coward and a traitor, brooke, here's the thing. he's a monster. he doesn't care about anything but trump. i wish my fellow republicans got this. >> one thing for you to sit here on national television and say that, but where are the other prshs on this? >> they're afraid but will start poking their heads out, i think. once they realize, this president will tear down and destroy the republican party. tear down and destroy congress, the executive branch and democracy because he only cares about himself. republicans, brooke, told you this before, they don't like him up on capitol hill, they can't

stand him. so when republican voters keep moving away from the president, i think you'll see more mitt romneys. >> maybe we will, and we'll replay this clip when and if that happens and sade you were right. meantime, you have matt gaetz and the house republicans storming the, this skiff, this secure room. by the way, foreign governments would love to target and there they are with electronic devices breaking the rules and tweeting. 48 republicans sit on those committees. if they maintain that it's, you know, private, it's not. because members of their own parties are behind closed doors and their argument is all about process. notice that? it's not about substance. where are they on substance? >> they can't defend what the president did. the president betrayed this country, colluded with another foreign government to interfere in our elections. brooke, they don't want to go near there or touch that so they go after the process. think about this. in another couple weeks these

hearings will be open. so now they're condemning the closed-door hearings. are they going to condemn the open-door hearings in another couple weeks? they have nothing to stand on right now. >> you mentioned the human scum tweet from the president. >> yes. >> what does that tell you about his mindset? >> he's a -- he's a horrible human being. and we've talked about nixon and clinton and some of the other presidents who at least when they were caught doing something wrong or bad they exhibited some human shame. we've got a guy in the white house, brooke, who is incapable of shame, and that's why, again, a warning to my fellow republicans, this is going to get uglier and worse. brooke, it's human scum today. republicans, he's going to turn on you. he'll turn on you, he'll turn on anybody to save "his skin." i hope republicans wake up to

that. >> congressman joe walsh, former congressman. great to have you on. >> thanks. president trump make as surprise claim about building a big, beautiful wall, but in colorado? we'll talk to the state's governor about the tweets. one zinger of a geography lesson. a confusing follow-up from president trump today suggesting the kurds should just leave their homelands. response to the surprise moves in syria from senator tammy duckworth. we'll be right back. ok everyone!

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we're building the wall. not anything president trump but where it's being built has a whole new take. >> and we're building a wall on the border of new mexico and we're building a wall in colorado. we're building a beautiful wall, a big one that really works, that you can't get over. you can't get under. >> the great state of colorado for a brief time was apparently getting a wall. where? you might ask. most certainly isn't a wall with mexico. maybe colorado is trying to stop new mexicans from coming in? even democratic senator patrick leahy tried to lend the president a hand with those pecky state lines. the president attempted to clarify his statement later he was kidding. "kiddingly, we're building a

wall in colorado." then stated, "we're not building a wall in kansas but they get the benefit of the wall we're building on the border referring to people in the very packed auditorium in colorado and kansas getting the benefit of the border wall. all right. here now to discuss, the governor of colorado, jared polis, governor, welcome. >> pleasure to be here. >> now, why do you think that the president of the united states mentioned your state when talking about the wall? >> well, it could be a matter of poor geographic knowledge. it could be a gaffe. colorado's a very welcoming state. there is no wall constructed here. we don't want a wall between kansas or oklahoma or new mexico. we are very welcoming of the people across the world and country and hope people come here to ski and enjoy the great outdoors. >> love skiing in colorado. indeed a welcome place. hang on. because take me back to when you first heard i imagine your phone

blew up. what was your first reaction when you heard the president say that? >> when the president says something, even this president, your first reaction, take it seriously. make sure there's not a wall built in colorado and confirmed and of course, there is no wall being built here. the president's plan actually pulled money out of colorado from our military bases to construct a wall on the southern border. we have lost tens of millions of funding for the wall and glad it's not here. we don't want the wall here in colorado and welcome our friends from other states and countries. >> got it. don't want a wall. copy that. what did you make of the president's response he was just kidding? >> i don't think kidding deliberately. obviously a gaffe. with people in public life, they say the wrong thing from time to time. it's not something that is easy to make a mistake over. i think even first graders know that colorado's in the middle of the country surrounded by other states. it's really a gaffe that he made and i think it shouldn't detract

from the fact that this wall is a boondoggle and waste of money and they're taking some of that money out of our military construction funds in colorado that support our military bases in colorado springs. >> first graders know that your state isn't bordered by mexico, but the president -- okay. seriously, governor, you are a former member of congress. you are missing our current situation op capitol hill for better or for worse with regard to this impeachment inquiry. what do you think of the state of bipartisanship or lack thereof? >> well, in ways i'm glad i'm not there. it's really, really a difficult and challenging time in washington. i prefer to work on the issues and improving education. funded full-day kindergarten in colorado reduce health care costs by 22% and i hope the president's gaffes, joking, whatever you call it, doesn't detract from the serious allegations that he politicized our foreign policy, held foreign aid to a strategic ally hostage for them to investigate one of

his political opponents. that is a risk to the republic and integrity of the system and i have confidence that it will be fully investigated. >> colorado governor jared polis. sir, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> thank you. right now, we are waiting for a news conference from republican senator lindsey graham. what could expect, stand by for that. also president trump and the situation in syria and what it means for the credibility of our country. army veteran senator tammy duckworth joins me next, live. the new $3 little john from jimmy john's

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therefore a small number of u.s. troops will remain in the area. where they have the oil. >> we've secured the oil. >> i always said going in, keep the oil. same thing here. keep the oil. >> we've taken control of the oil in the middle east. the oil that we're talking about. the oil everybody was worried about. >> cnn pentagon correspondent barbara starr is with me and this plan confirmed to cnn by u.s. defense officials but details are scars. what what's the details? >> reporter: officials are trying to figure out exactly how this might look, but it is our understanding from multiple officials they are talking about sending a number of tanks, and that means dozens if not r hundreds of additional forces to man the tanks and provide support to them. they need fuel, logistics, repairs, spare parts. they need to have a secure route in and out of syria and all of that means they also need air

cover overhead. the mission. what would they do? the idea as we're talking about it is, they would be used to provide security for the u.s. forces already there in that oil field region guarding the oil fields, taking control of the oil on behalf of the united states and the kurds as the president has described. but -- and this is the huge "but" -- battlegrounds toned shift and facts on the ground change moop has armored vehicle out there right now that could pose a threat? that is turkish and russian forces and the forces of bashar al assad. isis doesn't have tanks, functional tanks right now. it is stheez other elements that have these heavy armored forces's the real question is, at hand, if those forces, the russians, syrian regime even the turks move into the oil field area, are u.s. troops going to be under orders to fire at them? and that is going to make this battlefield very complicated.

brooke? >> that's a huge question. let me add to your reporting, barbara, thank you very much. we also just learned vice president mike pence is meeting with house minority leader kevin mccarthy and other republicans to talk through this situation regarding turkey and syria on the senate side, senator tammy duckworth is well familiar with the precarious conflicts in the middle east, flew combat missions in iraq in 2004 when a rocket propelled grenade hit the helicopter she was copiloting's whip me now, senator duckworth, welcome. >> thank you for having me on. >> we just heard from a spokesperson calling president trump's speech mind-boggling and, you know, believable, but when you listen to president trump he sees it as a victory. so i just wanted to ask you. is it a victory? what are your thoughts on where u.s. policy is right now? >> what victory? all that president trump has

done is made america less secure than 14 day s when he invaded erdogan to invade northern syria. we've now allowed isis fighters to go free as a result of turkey's attack on the kurds. we have let down a decades-old ally in the kurds now being slaughtered. russia now moved into the territory that u.s. forces have held, the kurds held with our advisers helping them hold ta territory. that strip of land now is held by the russians who have now managed to open a land bridge which they've always wanted to do also now benefits iranians who always want add land bridge to help them lead and create a pathway directly to our only true friend in the middle east which is israel. now we have put israel under pressure and on top of that driven the kurds our allies to start working with bashar al assad, the murderous dictator. we're not any better off are than we 14 days ago. we are worse off and this policy that the president has done nothing but endangered americans

and our friends, and lost our position as a global leader. >> well, the secretary of state, mike pompeo is on the road actually asked, the key question, how can the u.s. be trusted in this interview with the paper "the wichita eagle" read this back and forth. question from this reporter was, what good really is the word of the u.s. in light of the president's treatment of the kurds? has that undercut u.s. credibility? the secretary responding "the predicate of your question is insane. the word the united states is much more respected today than it was just two and a half years ago." senator duckworth, i mean, what was the question to use his word insane and i mean, how can the u.s. be trusted moving forward? >> well, what we have done, what president trump has done, has made the u.s. and our nation a nation cannot be trusted to keep its word. ask the kurds being slaughtered now and ask the israelis, asked

us not to do this. don't pull out. ask other allies, please, don't pull out. president trump handed turkey, syria iran with exactly what they wanted. biggest winner in this is isis. we lost kurdish allies in the reachened aour standing with neighbor allies lost our intelligence assets. no one will tell us what's going on there who will stick out their neck when they know we might abandon them like we did the kurds. and we can't fly drones there any more because the russians have capability of knocking down our drones. >> questions on future relationship with allies, questions on relationships with intelligence. i don't know if you saw one of the president's tweets was basically suggesting the kurds relocate to the oil. wrap he tweeted. i really enjoyed my conversation with general mazloum, appreciates what we've done. head of the kurds. i appreciate what the kurds have done.

perhaps it is time for the kurds to start heading to the oil region, and, senator, we were -- i was, in touch with one of our pentagon correspondents, ryan brown, who basically saw it like the commander in chief is saying that the kurds should essentially ethnically cleanse themselves. how do you see it? >> right. that's exactly how i see it. this is territory that is this historic territory to the kurds and they've always lived in this area. essentially the president is helping erdogan and turkey ethnically cleanse and that is not acceptable. america has nerver been on a sie of people who commit atrocities and the way they're going after the kurds now and it's absolutely wrong. if i were in the military still, if i were a division commander or special forces commander, i would be dusting off my boots know i'd be going right back in. sent this two days ago. right now president trump is talking about sending more

troops back into syria. as the isis fighters flowed free and the kurds leave and no longer there to do a lot of the work on the ground for us, you have to understand. >> we'll end up back in? >> oh, yes. if not into syria into turkey will the kurds are coming in and isis fighters are headed right now. >> congresswoman tammy duckworth. keep the conversation going. appreciate your service to the country and expertise in the region. thank you very, very much. >> thanks for having me on. new details now in the ukraine investigation and a revealing tweet from rudy giuliani, who's been pretty quiet for a while. what is might reveal about the president's role here. ♪

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"everything i did was to discover evidence to defend my client against false charges." start there. with me, cnn senior reporter, and cnn legal analyst and former u.s. assistant attorney for the southern district of new york and start with the tweet. he says he did everything for his client. why is that not the best argument. it's a perfect example why rudy needs to shut up and lawyer up, because i think he thinks he's helping himself and donald trump, really he's making the exact point against donald trump. the big question with ukraine was donald trump and rudy giuliani trying to promote the best national and foreign policy interests of the united states of america? which is okay, or were they trying to promote donald trump's personal and political interests, which is impeachable and that tweet tells us it's the latter. >> by the way, your point shus up and lawyer up. you got a phone call from him what would you say? >> i like a good challenge, one

condition nap phone condition. that phone's going in the river. >> the hudson. and knew the two associates parnas and fruman, how did these two use their giuliani connection to make money? >> so giuliani was their trump card, to use a bad pun. >> yes. >> they used his name showed endless photographs of themselves with him including on private planes, and they basically promised access to him and to other influential republicans if they could be paid. one particularly, one particular instance desperately needed, parnas needed to desperately pay for his son's circumcision and in exchange a loan for $100,000 promising on the back of that loan access to giuliani and others. the man had to sue to get his money back. >> wow. >> and one lawyer you talked to said the two tried to sell access to the trump

administration as well map did you learn? >> he did. he went to a supporter of the new ukrainian president, zelensky, he said he could broker a meeting between zelensky and vice president pence, and energy secretary rick perry. in other words, they were a new state department. the meeting happened but not because of them. it happened through official government channels. >> it's a wow. all a wow. you are an alum of sdny. talked to a reporter last week how rudy giuliani, this is the first that rudy giuliani once led sdny and now being investigated by sdny. what's the chatter ayong your circles on that notion? >> shocking and jarring. sdny is insular, we all stay in touch. the people rudy giuliaudy giuli supervisened and his own conduct

put him in this conversation. even close in line, clearly he's close to the line, see whether he crossed over the criminal line's even being in this position is rudy giuliani's own fault. a first. he led the office. his portrait son the wall. gets indicted by the office, an incredible thing to see but really his own doing. >> thank you both very much. >> thank you. >> thank you. coming up here waiting for word from senate leadership. republican senator lindsey graham about to announce a new move in the republicans' fight against impeachment. wow!

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we continue on. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. thank you for being here. just a heads up. any moment now senator lindsey graham will step before cameras taking aim at house democrats over this impeachment inquiry into president trump. the south carolina republican is expected to do what many other allies of the president had done in recent weeks. condemn the process. what's key here, they're not condemning the allegations leveled against trump by multiple career diplomats, people wildly respected on both sides of the aisle. so senator graham's resolution comes as cnn learned democrats could take those impeachment hearings public as early as next month. potentially with some of the witnesses who provided the most damns testimony so far.

start on capitol hill with phil mattingly all over this. we've got a lot of white house yauch reach toda outreach today. the vice president meeting with representatives from syria. what's going on, phil? >> reporter: it's important to contextualize what's going on. meeting with vice president and house leader including liz cheney, mr. mccarthy about turkey and the cease-fire that the vice president and secretary of state worked through. meeting at the white house with ten republican senators in the situation room also a briefing about turkey. way to connects together in some way, shape or form. the white house doesn't need enemies now. it needs allies, people like lindsey graham introducing a resolution at this moment. just sent out the text willing to fight for the president when it comes to impeachment. fight against democrats whether on process or eventually get to substance to be there for him and why i think the